Pound falls as Brexit sell-off gathers pace

Post by MM
"The pound has fallen below $1.29 for the first time in almost a year
on continuing worries Britain will leave the EU without a trade deal.
"Sterling also hit a nine-month low against the euro, and was down
against the yen and Swiss franc.
"Bank of England governor Mark Carney said on Friday the chances of a
no-deal Brexit were 'uncomfortably high'.
"On Sunday, international trade secretary Liam Fox put the odds at
'certainly not much more than 60-40'.
"The falls come despite a rise in UK interest rates, which usually
pushes up the value of sterling.
"Since the beginning of the month, the pound has fallen 1.7% against
the dollar and 0.8% against the euro."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-45113862
But hey, Brexiters! This is all fake news, right?
(But why then does my Google for "sterling v euro" return €1.11?)

I remember when you were gleefully forecasting parity with the Euro as a
result of the Brexit referendum.

Didn't happen, did it?

Anyway, a lower pound is a great boon to all our exporters. It's only
willy-waving to want it higher.

BurfordTJustice

2018-08-08 19:43:25 UTC

"Norman Wells" <***@unseen.ac.am> wrote in message news:***@mid.individual.net...
: On 08/08/2018 17:57, MM wrote:
: > "The pound has fallen below $1.29 for the first time in almost a year
: > on continuing worries Britain will leave the EU without a trade deal.
: >
: > "Sterling also hit a nine-month low against the euro, and was down
: > against the yen and Swiss franc.
: >
: > "Bank of England governor Mark Carney said on Friday the chances of a
: > no-deal Brexit were 'uncomfortably high'.
: >
: > "On Sunday, international trade secretary Liam Fox put the odds at
: > 'certainly not much more than 60-40'.
: >
: > "The falls come despite a rise in UK interest rates, which usually
: > pushes up the value of sterling.
: >
: > "Since the beginning of the month, the pound has fallen 1.7% against
: > the dollar and 0.8% against the euro."
: > https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-45113862
: >
: > But hey, Brexiters! This is all fake news, right?
: >
: > (But why then does my Google for "sterling v euro" return ?1.11?)
:
: I remember when you were gleefully forecasting parity with the Euro as a
: result of the Brexit referendum.
:
: Didn't happen, did it?
:
: Anyway, a lower pound is a great boon to all our exporters. It's only
: willy-waving to want it higher.
:

Yellow

2018-08-08 20:30:54 UTC

I remember when you were gleefully forecasting parity with the Euro as a
result of the Brexit referendum.
Didn't happen, did it?
Anyway, a lower pound is a great boon to all our exporters. It's only
willy-waving to want it higher.

I have relative visiting the UK in a couple of weeks and they are as
pleased as punch as they will be able to spend more.

abelard

2018-08-08 20:35:08 UTC

I remember when you were gleefully forecasting parity with the Euro as a
result of the Brexit referendum.
Didn't happen, did it?
Anyway, a lower pound is a great boon to all our exporters. It's only
willy-waving to want it higher.

I have relative visiting the UK in a couple of weeks and they are as
pleased as punch as they will be able to spend more.

the pound has been lower...one day it will be higher...
then is will be lower again...

it's lose to irrelevant

--
www.abelard.org

Yellow

2018-08-08 20:39:48 UTC

In article <***@4ax.com>, abelard3
@abelard.org says...

Post by abelard

I remember when you were gleefully forecasting parity with the Euro as a
result of the Brexit referendum.
Didn't happen, did it?
Anyway, a lower pound is a great boon to all our exporters. It's only
willy-waving to want it higher.

I have relative visiting the UK in a couple of weeks and they are as
pleased as punch as they will be able to spend more.

the pound has been lower...one day it will be higher...
then is will be lower again...
it's lose to irrelevant

I agree.

BurfordTJustice

2018-08-08 21:10:47 UTC

Righto!

"Yellow" <***@none.com.invalid> wrote in message news:***@News.Individual.NET...
: In article <***@mid.individual.net>, ***@unseen.ac.am says...
: >
: > On 08/08/2018 17:57, MM wrote:
: > > "The pound has fallen below $1.29 for the first time in almost a year
: > > on continuing worries Britain will leave the EU without a trade deal.
: > >
: > > "Sterling also hit a nine-month low against the euro, and was down
: > > against the yen and Swiss franc.
: > >
: > > "Bank of England governor Mark Carney said on Friday the chances of a
: > > no-deal Brexit were 'uncomfortably high'.
: > >
: > > "On Sunday, international trade secretary Liam Fox put the odds at
: > > 'certainly not much more than 60-40'.
: > >
: > > "The falls come despite a rise in UK interest rates, which usually
: > > pushes up the value of sterling.
: > >
: > > "Since the beginning of the month, the pound has fallen 1.7% against
: > > the dollar and 0.8% against the euro."
: > > https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-45113862
: > >
: > > But hey, Brexiters! This is all fake news, right?
: > >
: > > (But why then does my Google for "sterling v euro" return €1.11?)
: >
: > I remember when you were gleefully forecasting parity with the Euro as a
: > result of the Brexit referendum.
: >
: > Didn't happen, did it?
: >
: > Anyway, a lower pound is a great boon to all our exporters. It's only
: > willy-waving to want it higher.
:
: I have relative visiting the UK in a couple of weeks and they are as
: pleased as punch as they will be able to spend more.

R. Mark Clayton

2018-08-09 17:37:01 UTC

I remember when you were gleefully forecasting parity with the Euro as a
result of the Brexit referendum.
Didn't happen, did it?
Anyway, a lower pound is a great boon to all our exporters. It's only
willy-waving to want it higher.

I have relative visiting the UK in a couple of weeks and they are as
pleased as punch as they will be able to spend more.

Why don't you go and visit them? Then you will HAVE to spend more.

Yellow

2018-08-10 02:05:43 UTC

I remember when you were gleefully forecasting parity with the Euro as a
result of the Brexit referendum.
Didn't happen, did it?
Anyway, a lower pound is a great boon to all our exporters. It's only
willy-waving to want it higher.

I have relative visiting the UK in a couple of weeks and they are as
pleased as punch as they will be able to spend more.

Why don't you go and visit them? Then you will HAVE to spend more.

Why would you prefer a Brit to take their money to the USA and spend it
there than have a couple of yanks bring their money here and spend a
couple of weeks supporting UK hotels, restaurants and visitor
attractions?

R. Mark Clayton

2018-08-11 09:26:17 UTC

I remember when you were gleefully forecasting parity with the Euro as a
result of the Brexit referendum.
Didn't happen, did it?
Anyway, a lower pound is a great boon to all our exporters. It's only
willy-waving to want it higher.

I have relative visiting the UK in a couple of weeks and they are as
pleased as punch as they will be able to spend more.

Why don't you go and visit them? Then you will HAVE to spend more.

That depends, as I am a Brit obviously I want to enjoy foreign holidays and not get ripped off. You seem to want Yanks to be able to visit the UK on the cheap.

As this is a UK group I think you will find most posters are Brit's and don't want to pay £££ more for holidays and imported items for the sake of racial purity. That said I would not welcome hoards of US tourists in my locale...

Norman Wells

2018-08-11 10:03:20 UTC

Post by Yellow
Why would you prefer a Brit to take their money to the USA and spend it
there than have a couple of yanks bring their money here and spend a
couple of weeks supporting UK hotels, restaurants and visitor
attractions?

That depends, as I am a Brit obviously I want to enjoy foreign holidays and not get ripped off.

That's very selfish of you.

Post by R. Mark Clayton
You seem to want Yanks to be able to visit the UK on the cheap.

Yes, it's good for the economy.

Post by R. Mark Clayton
As this is a UK group I think you will find most posters are Brit's and don't want to pay £££ more for holidays and imported items for the sake of racial purity. That said I would not welcome hoards of US tourists in my locale...

How about Romanians, Bulgarians, Lithuanians and Poles?

What are you doing to cut down their numbers?

R. Mark Clayton

2018-08-11 10:22:47 UTC

That depends, as I am a Brit obviously I want to enjoy foreign holidays and not get ripped off.

That's very selfish of you.

Self interested maybe, hardly "very selfish".

Post by R. Mark Clayton
You seem to want Yanks to be able to visit the UK on the cheap.

Yes, it's good for the economy.

It is good if they visit. Less so if they do so on the cheap.

How about Romanians, Bulgarians, Lithuanians and Poles?
What are you doing to cut down their numbers?

Nothing - what do you want - Aktion Rheinard all over again?

Norman Wells

2018-08-11 11:16:43 UTC

That depends, as I am a Brit obviously I want to enjoy foreign holidays and not get ripped off.

That's very selfish of you.

Self interested maybe, hardly "very selfish".

Post by R. Mark Clayton
You seem to want Yanks to be able to visit the UK on the cheap.

Yes, it's good for the economy.

It is good if they visit. Less so if they do so on the cheap.

How about Romanians, Bulgarians, Lithuanians and Poles?
What are you doing to cut down their numbers?

Nothing - what do you want - Aktion Rheinard all over again?

I just wondered why you've got it in for the Americans but,
inconsistently, not for Europeans, that's all.

R. Mark Clayton

2018-08-11 16:42:55 UTC

That depends, as I am a Brit obviously I want to enjoy foreign holidays and not get ripped off.

That's very selfish of you.

Self interested maybe, hardly "very selfish".

Post by R. Mark Clayton
You seem to want Yanks to be able to visit the UK on the cheap.

Yes, it's good for the economy.

It is good if they visit. Less so if they do so on the cheap.

How about Romanians, Bulgarians, Lithuanians and Poles?
What are you doing to cut down their numbers?

Nothing - what do you want - Aktion Rheinard all over again?

I just wondered why you've got it in for the Americans but,
inconsistently, not for Europeans, that's all.

Not really, I just find loud mouthed US tourists a bot of chore.

Yellow

2018-08-11 16:47:38 UTC

That depends, as I am a Brit obviously I want to enjoy foreign holidays and not get ripped off.

That's very selfish of you.

Self interested maybe, hardly "very selfish".

LOL!

Yellow

2018-08-11 16:46:58 UTC

That depends, as I am a Brit obviously I want to enjoy foreign holidays and not get ripped off. You seem to want Yanks to be able to visit the UK on the cheap.

Not just any yanks but my family, and of course I care more about them
than I do about you. But further, they will be bringing money into the
UK while you wish to take it out.

Seems the lower pound therefore wins 2/0.

Post by R. Mark Clayton
As this is a UK group I think you will find most posters are Brit's and don't want to pay £££ more for holidays

Please realise that you are talking about yourself, not "the group" nor
"the British people", because we do not all holiday in the EU or abroad
at all.

Meanwhile, money coming in from abroad is making us richer while you
going to the Costa-Del-Sol is making us, as a country, poorer.

Post by R. Mark Clayton
and imported items for the sake of racial purity.

?????

Post by R. Mark Clayton
That said I
would not welcome hoards of US tourists in my locale...

Yet you think the EU is happy to have hordes of you?

R. Mark Clayton

2018-08-11 16:50:12 UTC

That depends, as I am a Brit obviously I want to enjoy foreign holidays and not get ripped off. You seem to want Yanks to be able to visit the UK on the cheap.

Post by R. Mark Clayton
As this is a UK group I think you will find most posters are Brit's and don't want to pay £££ more for holidays

Please realise that you are talking about yourself, not "the group" nor
"the British people", because we do not all holiday in the EU or abroad
at all.

Do check before typing rubbish.

https://abta.com/about-us/press/brits-take-more-holidays-in-past-12-months-than-at-any-point-since-2011

Post by Yellow
Meanwhile, money coming in from abroad is making us richer while you
going to the Costa-Del-Sol is making us, as a country, poorer.

Post by R. Mark Clayton
and imported items for the sake of racial purity.

?????

Post by R. Mark Clayton
That said I
would not welcome hoards of US tourists in my locale...

Yet you think the EU is happy to have hordes of you?

Shitsack Moishe Goldberg

2018-08-08 20:53:13 UTC

I remember when you were gleefully forecasting parity with the Euro as a
result of the Brexit referendum.
Didn't happen, did it?
Anyway, a lower pound is a great boon to all our exporters. It's only
willy-waving to want it higher.

WHAT exporters? JCB and who else? Let's not forget that a lower pound
means paying more for the raw materials and other inputs that go IN to
these 'exports'.

The Peeler

2018-08-08 21:59:46 UTC

On Wed, 8 Aug 2018 13:53:13 -0700, serbian bitch Razovic, the resident
psychopath of sci and scj and Usenet's famous sexual cripple, making an ass

Post by Norman Wells
I remember when you were gleefully forecasting parity with the Euro as a
result of the Brexit referendum.
Didn't happen, did it?
Anyway, a lower pound is a great boon to all our exporters. It's only
willy-waving to want it higher.

WHAT exporters? JCB and who else?

E.g. they could export fags like you en masse, dumb anal gay Razovic! Would
be a boon for the country!

--
Dumb gay anal Razovic about herself:
"And you just wish someone, anyone, anything would cornhole you!"

Yellow

2018-08-08 23:07:02 UTC

I remember when you were gleefully forecasting parity with the Euro as a
result of the Brexit referendum.
Didn't happen, did it?
Anyway, a lower pound is a great boon to all our exporters. It's only
willy-waving to want it higher.

WHAT exporters? JCB and who else? Let's not forget that a lower pound
means paying more for the raw materials and other inputs that go IN to
these 'exports'.

The manufacturing industry adds value so even if all the raw material
was imported, a lower pound means exporting would potentially be more
profitable than with a higher pound.

So perhaps What you really need to consider is what we import for our
own use verse what we export.

Shitsack Moishe Goldberg

2018-08-09 12:57:54 UTC

WHAT exporters? JCB and who else? Let's not forget that a lower pound
means paying more for the raw materials and other inputs that go IN to
these 'exports'.

The manufacturing industry adds value so even if all the raw material
was imported, a lower pound means exporting would potentially be more
profitable than with a higher pound.

Importing all the raw material with a lower pound would mean paying more
for manufacturing inputs, which in turn would make the manufactured
output more expensive and therefore less competitive, even with a lower
pound.

Post by Yellow
So perhaps What you really need to consider is what we import for our
own use verse what we export.

It's not really relevant. What is relevant is that, in general, we
import more than we export, and with a lower pound, the trade gap will
increase.

Yellow

2018-08-09 13:41:18 UTC

WHAT exporters? JCB and who else? Let's not forget that a lower pound
means paying more for the raw materials and other inputs that go IN to
these 'exports'.

The manufacturing industry adds value so even if all the raw material
was imported, a lower pound means exporting would potentially be more
profitable than with a higher pound.

But as I said - the finished item will be cheaper to sell abroad.

So, unless you have figures of course, it is not possible to state that
any arbitrary value of the pound is better or worse then any other
arbitrary value of the pound for a given manufacturer.

Post by Yellow
So perhaps What you really need to consider is what we import for our
own use verse what we export.

It's not really relevant.

Of course it is because the country gains wealth by getting more money
in from abroad than it spends out.

Post by Shitsack Moishe Goldberg
What is relevant is that, in general, we
import more than we export, and with a lower pound, the trade gap will
increase.

Through-put or turn over tells us nothing and instead we need to look at
profit and loss.

Shitsack Moishe Goldberg

2018-08-09 14:41:57 UTC

WHAT exporters? JCB and who else? Let's not forget that a lower pound
means paying more for the raw materials and other inputs that go IN to
these 'exports'.

The manufacturing industry adds value so even if all the raw material
was imported, a lower pound means exporting would potentially be more
profitable than with a higher pound.

But as I said - the finished item will be cheaper to sell abroad.

But if the costs of manufacturing the finished item are excessive
because of expensive imports, you won't be able to sell it abroad
without making a loss, even with a cheap pound. What would be the point
of that?

Post by Yellow
So, unless you have figures of course, it is not possible to state that
any arbitrary value of the pound is better or worse then any other
arbitrary value of the pound for a given manufacturer.

A lower pound is better for manufacturers who source all their inputs
domestically. And of course it's better for services, without which the
trade gap would be horrendous.

Post by Yellow
So perhaps What you really need to consider is what we import for our
own use verse what we export.

It's not really relevant.

Of course it is because the country gains wealth by getting more money
in from abroad than it spends out.

That used to happen when Maggie Thatcher was PM. Apart from a short
blip in the mid 1990s, it has rarely happened since.

Yellow

2018-08-09 16:25:21 UTC

WHAT exporters? JCB and who else? Let's not forget that a lower pound
means paying more for the raw materials and other inputs that go IN to
these 'exports'.

The manufacturing industry adds value so even if all the raw material
was imported, a lower pound means exporting would potentially be more
profitable than with a higher pound.

But as I said - the finished item will be cheaper to sell abroad.

What is your basis for your claim, that -

import cost + added value < export cost.

- for any given value of the pound?

A lower pound is better for manufacturers who source all their inputs
domestically. And of course it's better for services, without which the
trade gap would be horrendous.

Post by Yellow
So perhaps What you really need to consider is what we import for

our

Post by Yellow
own use verse what we export.

It's not really relevant.

Of course it is because the country gains wealth by getting more money
in from abroad than it spends out.

That used to happen when Maggie Thatcher was PM. Apart from a short
blip in the mid 1990s, it has rarely happened since.

Shitsack Moishe Goldberg

2018-08-09 18:53:15 UTC

WHAT exporters? JCB and who else? Let's not forget that a lower pound
means paying more for the raw materials and other inputs that go IN to
these 'exports'.

The manufacturing industry adds value so even if all the raw material
was imported, a lower pound means exporting would potentially be more
profitable than with a higher pound.

But as I said - the finished item will be cheaper to sell abroad.

What is your basis for your claim, that -
import cost + added value < export cost.
- for any given value of the pound?

Imported materials cost + other raw materials cost + labour cost = total
cost.

What's this 'export cost' of yours?

The Peeler

2018-08-09 19:26:32 UTC

On Thu, 9 Aug 2018 11:53:15 -0700, serbian bitch Razovic, the resident
psychopath of sci and scj and Usenet's famous sexual cripple, making an ass

Post by Yellow
What is your basis for your claim, that -
import cost + added value < export cost.
- for any given value of the pound?

Imported materials cost + other raw materials cost + labour cost = total
cost.

"labour cost" ROTFLOL! ...and this coming from the unemployable housebound
mentally sick idiot who has been "living" on Usenet for OVER TWENTY YEARS!
LMAO

--
The top 5 truths about poor dumb Razovic, our colostomy bag wearing resident
psychopath, aka "The Rectum":

the desperate psycho can't SLEEP anymore,
she can't get out of the house anymore,
she got NOBODY to talk to anymore,
she can't FUCK anymore,
she got no life outside Usenet AT ALL!

Yellow

2018-08-10 02:19:24 UTC

WHAT exporters? JCB and who else? Let's not forget that a lower pound
means paying more for the raw materials and other inputs that go IN to
these 'exports'.

The manufacturing industry adds value so even if all the raw material
was imported, a lower pound means exporting would potentially be more
profitable than with a higher pound.

But as I said - the finished item will be cheaper to sell abroad.

What is your basis for your claim, that -
import cost + added value < export cost.
- for any given value of the pound?

Imported materials cost + other raw materials cost + labour cost = total
cost.
What's this 'export cost' of yours?

The price you sell it for abroad.

What I am trying to explain to you is that even if imports are more
expensive, they only make up part of the value of the item for sale
because of what manufacturing is, and that is adding value to raw
material.

If you sell your manufactured part abroad at the same(ish) exchange
rate, mathematics tells you that the extra money you have had to pay for
the imports will be more than offset by the extra money you get when the
item is sold.

Shitsack Moishe Goldberg

2018-08-10 16:56:10 UTC

Post by Shitsack Moishe Goldberg
But if the costs of manufacturing the finished item are excessive
because of expensive imports, you won't be able to sell it abroad
without making a loss, even with a cheap pound. What would be the point
of that?

What is your basis for your claim, that -
import cost + added value < export cost.
- for any given value of the pound?

Imported materials cost + other raw materials cost + labour cost = total
cost.
What's this 'export cost' of yours?

Since Britain basically has no raw materials, they make up an increasing
part of the value of the item. Automation is rapidly depleting the
labour input.

Note also that not all foreign currencies appreciate against the Pound
at the same rate. If your inputs are priced in dollars and you sell in
the Euro market, that differential could be more than enough to wipe out
your competitive advantage.

Post by Yellow
If you sell your manufactured part abroad at the same(ish) exchange
rate, mathematics tells you that the extra money you have had to pay for
the imports will be more than offset by the extra money you get when the
item is sold.

You're relying entirely on cheap labour to make your products
competitive abroad. That's not going to last. That same cheap labour
relies mostly on imported goodies for its standard of living. When's
the last time a television or DVD player was manufactured in the UK?
If labour's compensation does not keep up with the higher cost of living
resulting from a cheap pound, the good labour will go elsewhere, you'll
be left with all the shit labour, quality will drop, and you won't be
able to sell your product at any price.

abelard

2018-08-10 17:14:30 UTC

On Fri, 10 Aug 2018 09:56:10 -0700, Shitsack Moishe Goldberg

What is your basis for your claim, that -
import cost + added value < export cost.
- for any given value of the pound?

Imported materials cost + other raw materials cost + labour cost = total
cost.
What's this 'export cost' of yours?

Since Britain basically has no raw materials, they make up an increasing
part of the value of the item. Automation is rapidly depleting the
labour input.
Note also that not all foreign currencies appreciate against the Pound
at the same rate. If your inputs are priced in dollars and you sell in
the Euro market, that differential could be more than enough to wipe out
your competitive advantage.

people often buy from britain for higher level of abstraction...

eg out top unis and non-government schools...
design...
money expertise...
secure gated communities..and ungated ones!

let secondary countries produce ironmongery like cars :-)

--
www.abelard.org

Shitsack Moishe Goldberg

2018-08-10 17:33:17 UTC

In article <***@4ax.com>, abelard3
@abelard.org says...

Post by abelard

Post by Shitsack Moishe Goldberg
Note also that not all foreign currencies appreciate against the Pound
at the same rate. If your inputs are priced in dollars and you sell in
the Euro market, that differential could be more than enough to wipe out
your competitive advantage.

people often buy from britain for higher level of abstraction...
eg out top unis and non-government schools...
design...
money expertise...
secure gated communities..and ungated ones!

Indeed. Services do very well in the export market with a weak pound.
They could be the ONLY saving grace.

Post by abelard
let secondary countries produce ironmongery like cars :-)

As long as people in the UK are willing/able to pay the correspondingly
higher prices!

abelard

2018-08-10 17:40:45 UTC

On Fri, 10 Aug 2018 10:33:17 -0700, Shitsack Moishe Goldberg

Post by Yellow
@abelard.org says...

Post by abelard

people often buy from britain for higher level of abstraction...
eg out top unis and non-government schools...
design...
money expertise...
secure gated communities..and ungated ones!

Indeed. Services do very well in the export market with a weak pound.
They could be the ONLY saving grace.

Post by abelard
let secondary countries produce ironmongery like cars :-)

As long as people in the UK are willing/able to pay the correspondingly
higher prices!

depends on how much we can get for frozen peas...

picked by e. european slaves or by vast british designed
machines guided by british satellites

or we'll have to walk!

--
www.abelard.org

The Peeler

2018-08-10 17:55:47 UTC

On Fri, 10 Aug 2018 10:33:17 -0700, serbian bitch Razovic, the resident
psychopath of sci and scj and Usenet's famous sexual cripple, making an ass

Post by abelard
let secondary countries produce ironmongery like cars :-)

As long as people in the UK are willing/able to pay the correspondingly
higher prices!

The REAL funny thing is that your shithole serbia has NO choice about it,
dreckserb Razovic! You simply won't be allowed in the EU! LOL

--
Nefesh about stinking serb peasant Razovic: "All good people shit on the
Revd"
MID: <8560bbb2-d446-4ba9-a3e7-***@c20g2000prc.googlegroups.com>

Yellow

2018-08-10 17:39:53 UTC

What is your basis for your claim, that -
import cost + added value < export cost.
- for any given value of the pound?

Imported materials cost + other raw materials cost + labour cost = total
cost.
What's this 'export cost' of yours?

Since Britain basically has no raw materials, they make up an increasing
part of the value of the item.

Raw materials in this context can also mean finished goods that are used
to make new goods.

Think of a car, where it is built (in part) of bits that are made
elsewhere.

Post by Shitsack Moishe Goldberg
Automation is rapidly depleting the
labour input.

This is not new in manufacturing and I spent the 80s, 90s, and 00s
automating factories.

Which may work for or against any given manufacturer, as I have already
highlighted in another post in this thread.

There is no perfect exchange rate that will suit everyone.

You're relying entirely on cheap labour to make your products
competitive abroad.

I have no idea why you have concluded that but the cost of labour does
not alter because the exchange rate has changed so for the purposes of
this discussion it is a constant.

Obviously in the longer term, if we get inflation, there will be calls
for increases in wages but I do not see what that has to do with your
"cheap labour" argument.

Post by Shitsack Moishe Goldberg
That's not going to last. That same cheap labour
relies mostly on imported goodies for its standard of living. When's
the last time a television or DVD player was manufactured in the UK?

Which is why, again as I highlighted in another post, we should be
looking at imports we use for ourselves vs what we export, rather than
the importing of materials for goods are subsequently exported.

Post by Shitsack Moishe Goldberg
If labour's compensation does not keep up with the higher cost of living
resulting from a cheap pound, the good labour will go elsewhere, you'll
be left with all the shit labour, quality will drop, and you won't be
able to sell your product at any price.

I can't see people leaving the UK in their droves because the price of
cheese has increased but, as above, imports we use for ourselves vs what
we export is probably of more interest than imports for manufacturing vs
export of manufactured goods.

The Peeler

2018-08-10 17:49:55 UTC

On Fri, 10 Aug 2018 09:56:10 -0700, serbian bitch Razovic, the resident
psychopath of sci and scj and Usenet's famous sexual cripple, making an ass
of herself as "Shitsack Moishe Goldberg", farted again:

<FLUSH psychopath's usual psychopathic bullshit unread>

...and nothing's left, AGAIN! LOL

--
Dumb anal Razovic's talking about her experience, on July 2nd, 2018:
"Suck a jew rectum hard enough and diarrhoea will come out!"
MID: <***@4ax.com>

pensive hamster

2018-08-09 19:21:17 UTC

On Thursday, 9 August 2018 17:25:21 UTC+1, Yellow wrote:
[...]

Post by Yellow
What is your basis for your claim, that -
import cost + added value < export cost.
- for any given value of the pound?

You may need to add in shipping costs (both inward and outward).

Depending on whether you pay shipping costs in sterling or
foreign currency, that may alter the equation.

And then there is cash flow, which may be adversely affected
if import costs go up.

The Peeler

2018-08-09 16:53:23 UTC

On Thu, 9 Aug 2018 07:41:57 -0700, serbian bitch Razovic, the resident
psychopath of sci and scj and Usenet's famous sexual cripple, making an ass

Post by Shitsack Moishe Goldberg
A lower pound is

No pound could ever get as low as you, you lowly serb cretin!

--
Dumb gay anal Razovic about herself:
"And you just wish someone, anyone, anything would cornhole you!"

R. Mark Clayton

2018-08-09 17:42:59 UTC

SNIP

Post by Shitsack Moishe Goldberg
WHAT exporters? JCB and who else? Let's not forget that a lower pound
means paying more for the raw materials and other inputs that go IN to
these 'exports'.

The manufacturing industry adds value so even if all the raw material
was imported, a lower pound means exporting would potentially be more
profitable than with a higher pound.

But as I said - the finished item will be cheaper to sell abroad.

I don't often agree with Yellow, but you have the wrong end of the stick here.

A lower pound is better for manufacturers who source all their inputs
domestically. And of course it's better for services, without which the
trade gap would be horrendous.

Post by Yellow
So perhaps What you really need to consider is what we import for

our

Post by Yellow
own use verse what we export.

It's not really relevant.

Of course it is because the country gains wealth by getting more money
in from abroad than it spends out.

That used to happen when Maggie Thatcher was PM. Apart from a short
blip in the mid 1990s, it has rarely happened since.

Shitsack Moishe Goldberg

2018-08-09 18:56:53 UTC

Post by Shitsack Moishe Goldberg
WHAT exporters? JCB and who else? Let's not forget that a lower pound
means paying more for the raw materials and other inputs that go IN to
these 'exports'.

The manufacturing industry adds value so even if all the raw material
was imported, a lower pound means exporting would potentially be more
profitable than with a higher pound.

But as I said - the finished item will be cheaper to sell abroad.

I don't often agree with Yellow, but you have the wrong end of the stick here.

You're relying on the diminishing role of labour in manufacturing for
your competitive edge with a falling pound?

Sounds like you have the wrong end of the automation stick.

The Peeler

2018-08-09 19:30:01 UTC

On Thu, 9 Aug 2018 11:56:53 -0700, serbian bitch Razovic, the resident
psychopath of sci and scj and Usenet's famous sexual cripple, making an ass

Post by R. Mark Clayton
I don't often agree with Yellow, but you have the wrong end of the stick here.

You're relying on the diminishing role of labour in manufacturing for
your competitive edge with a falling pound?
Sounds like you have the wrong end of the automation stick.

The ONLY "stick" you know something about is the one alternately in your
arse and your gob, dumb anal dreckserb!

--
Dumb gay anal Razovic about herself:
"And you just wish someone, anyone, anything would cornhole you!"

R. Mark Clayton

2018-08-11 09:28:12 UTC

Post by Shitsack Moishe Goldberg
WHAT exporters? JCB and who else? Let's not forget that a lower pound
means paying more for the raw materials and other inputs that go IN to
these 'exports'.

The manufacturing industry adds value so even if all the raw material
was imported, a lower pound means exporting would potentially be more
profitable than with a higher pound.

But as I said - the finished item will be cheaper to sell abroad.

I don't often agree with Yellow, but you have the wrong end of the stick here.

You're relying on the diminishing role of labour in manufacturing for
your competitive edge with a falling pound?
Sounds like you have the wrong end of the automation stick.

If any value is added in the UK it either comes from primary production or [massively more likely] added value, True the value can be added by expensive machinery, however normally it is labour.

Handsome Jack

2018-08-09 15:14:02 UTC

WHAT exporters? JCB and who else? Let's not forget that a lower pound
means paying more for the raw materials and other inputs that go IN to
these 'exports'.

The manufacturing industry adds value so even if all the raw material
was imported, a lower pound means exporting would potentially be more
profitable than with a higher pound.

No it wouldn't. The cost of imported raw materials (in dollars) would
stay the same as it was before, whereas the cost of the labour input to
the finished product (in dollars) would *fall*, because UK labour is
paid in pounds. The offer price of the finished product (in dollars) is
the sum of those two terms, and therefore it *falls* in dollar terms,
making it more competitive on world markets

Post by Yellow
So perhaps What you really need to consider is what we import for our
own use verse what we export.

It's not really relevant. What is relevant is that, in general, we
import more than we export, and with a lower pound, the trade gap will
increase.

You're hopelessly, ignorantly wrong, son.

--
Jack

abelard

2018-08-09 15:21:18 UTC

Post by Handsome Jack

WHAT exporters? JCB and who else? Let's not forget that a lower pound
means paying more for the raw materials and other inputs that go IN to
these 'exports'.

The manufacturing industry adds value so even if all the raw material
was imported, a lower pound means exporting would potentially be more
profitable than with a higher pound.

wow..i'm impressed :-)

Post by Handsome Jack

Post by Yellow
So perhaps What you really need to consider is what we import for our
own use verse what we export.

It's not really relevant. What is relevant is that, in general, we
import more than we export, and with a lower pound, the trade gap will
increase.

You're hopelessly, ignorantly wrong, son.

--
www.abelard.org

The Peeler

2018-08-09 16:53:03 UTC

On Thu, 9 Aug 2018 05:57:54 -0700, serbian bitch Razovic, the resident
psychopath of sci and scj and Usenet's famous sexual cripple, making an ass
of herself as "jew pedophile Ron Jacobson (jew pedophile Baruch 'Barry'

Post by Shitsack Moishe Goldberg
It's not really relevant. What is relevant is that, in general, we
import more than we export, and with a lower pound, the trade gap will
increase.

That gap can't increase as much as the huge gap of your overused anus,
dreckserb Razovic!

--
Retarded, anal, subnormal and extremely proud of it: our resident
psychopath, dumb serbian bitch G. Razovic (aka "The Rectum").

R. Mark Clayton

2018-08-09 17:40:15 UTC

I remember when you were gleefully forecasting parity with the Euro as a
result of the Brexit referendum.
Didn't happen, did it?
Anyway, a lower pound is a great boon to all our exporters. It's only
willy-waving to want it higher.

WHAT exporters? JCB and who else? Let's not forget that a lower pound
means paying more for the raw materials and other inputs that go IN to
these 'exports'.

Ah but the Brexiteer answer to this is that in real [aka dollar / Euro] terms labour costs are less, making UK produced goods more competitive

of course workers wages don't go as far, but when did Brexiteers ever care about the economic cost to ordinary people.

Norman Wells

2018-08-09 17:51:03 UTC

Post by MM
(But why then does my Google for "sterling v euro" return €1.11?)

I remember when you were gleefully forecasting parity with the Euro as a
result of the Brexit referendum.
Didn't happen, did it?
Anyway, a lower pound is a great boon to all our exporters. It's only
willy-waving to want it higher.

WHAT exporters? JCB and who else? Let's not forget that a lower pound
means paying more for the raw materials and other inputs that go IN to
these 'exports'.

Ah but the Brexiteer answer to this is that in real [aka dollar / Euro] terms labour costs are less, making UK produced goods more competitive

That's not a Brexiteer answer, it's an unassailable economic one.

R. Mark Clayton

2018-08-09 17:52:12 UTC

Post by MM
(But why then does my Google for "sterling v euro" return €1.11?)

I remember when you were gleefully forecasting parity with the Euro as a
result of the Brexit referendum.
Didn't happen, did it?
Anyway, a lower pound is a great boon to all our exporters. It's only
willy-waving to want it higher.

WHAT exporters? JCB and who else? Let's not forget that a lower pound
means paying more for the raw materials and other inputs that go IN to
these 'exports'.

Ah but the Brexiteer answer to this is that in real [aka dollar / Euro] terms labour costs are less, making UK produced goods more competitive

That's not a Brexiteer answer, it's an unassailable economic one.

So that's the Brexit plan - make workers poorer?

Norman Wells

2018-08-09 19:17:45 UTC

Post by MM
(But why then does my Google for "sterling v euro" return €1.11?)

I remember when you were gleefully forecasting parity with the Euro as a
result of the Brexit referendum.
Didn't happen, did it?
Anyway, a lower pound is a great boon to all our exporters. It's only
willy-waving to want it higher.

WHAT exporters? JCB and who else? Let's not forget that a lower pound
means paying more for the raw materials and other inputs that go IN to
these 'exports'.

Ah but the Brexiteer answer to this is that in real [aka dollar / Euro] terms labour costs are less, making UK produced goods more competitive

That's not a Brexiteer answer, it's an unassailable economic one.

So that's the Brexit plan - make workers poorer?

The exchange rate has little to do with the reality of the economy. An
economy doesn't fall by 10% overnight just because there's been a vote,
yet that's what happened after the referendum.

The truth is, it's set by speculators trading in currencies, all
gambling in the hope of making a profit. As such, you can't read
anything into it at all. And it's not a Brexiteer strategy to lower the
exchange rate. They can't influence it any more than you or I can.

The lower the exchange rate, the more it aids exporters. It makes
imports more expensive of course, but that encourages buying goods
produced here, which again is a good thing for the domestic economy. It
encourages tourism here and discourages Brits holidaying abroad. Again,
that's good for the UK economy.

Ordinary workers aren't greatly affected by the exchange rate one way or
the other.

R. Mark Clayton

2018-08-11 09:37:55 UTC

SNIP

Post by R. Mark Clayton
Ah but the Brexiteer answer to this is that in real [aka dollar / Euro] terms labour costs are less, making UK produced goods more competitive

That's not a Brexiteer answer, it's an unassailable economic one.

So that's the Brexit plan - make workers poorer?

The exchange rate has little to do with the reality of the economy. An
economy doesn't fall by 10% overnight just because there's been a vote,
yet that's what happened after the referendum.

Yes it does and yes it did - overnight everyone who had money (not just a minority of speculators) downgraded their long term view of the health of the UK economy on the basis of Leave winning. Over two year later and the pound is still down - that is NOT the result of overnight speculation.

Post by Norman Wells
The truth is, it's set by speculators trading in currencies, all
gambling in the hope of making a profit.

Wrong again - the vast majority of Fx trades are either conversion of simple payments or manufacturers hedging against future currency movements (they buy or sell futures contract to protect their future transactions from sudden movements.

Post by Norman Wells
As such, you can't read anything into it at all.

True for an overnight fluctuation of 10% (OTOH one of the largest ever), but when sterling is still sick over two years later from the same cause...

Post by Norman Wells
And it's not a Brexiteer strategy to lower the
exchange rate. They can't influence it any more than you or I can.

Clearly they can - Davis opens his mouth and the there is another big sell off of the pound...

OTOH Brextremists didn't set out to do down the pound - they naively that leaving would be a big boost for the economy (and ergo the pound) despite everyone telling them the opposite.

Post by Norman Wells
The lower the exchange rate, the more it aids exporters. It makes
imports more expensive of course, but that encourages buying goods
produced here, which again is a good thing for the domestic economy. It
encourages tourism here and discourages Brits holidaying abroad. Again,
that's good for the UK economy.
Ordinary workers aren't greatly affected by the exchange rate one way or
the other.

Apart from inflation or a big rise in the cost of their two weeks in Benidorm...

Norman Wells

2018-08-11 10:09:58 UTC

Post by R. Mark Clayton
Ah but the Brexiteer answer to this is that in real [aka dollar / Euro] terms labour costs are less, making UK produced goods more competitive

That's not a Brexiteer answer, it's an unassailable economic one.

So that's the Brexit plan - make workers poorer?

The exchange rate has little to do with the reality of the economy. An
economy doesn't fall by 10% overnight just because there's been a vote,
yet that's what happened after the referendum.

It's continued speculation. All currency trades are speculation.

Post by Norman Wells
The truth is, it's set by speculators trading in currencies, all
gambling in the hope of making a profit.

Yes, it's called speculation. They're hoping to make a profit from
their currency dealings, or reduce a loss, which amounts to the same thing.

Post by Norman Wells
As such, you can't read anything into it at all.

True for an overnight fluctuation of 10% (OTOH one of the largest ever), but when sterling is still sick over two years later from the same cause...

Who sets the rate, and how?

Post by Norman Wells
And it's not a Brexiteer strategy to lower the
exchange rate. They can't influence it any more than you or I can.

Clearly they can - Davis opens his mouth and the there is another big sell off of the pound...

By 'currency traders', ie speculators. Who else?

Post by R. Mark Clayton
OTOH Brextremists didn't set out to do down the pound - they naively that leaving would be a big boost for the economy (and ergo the pound) despite everyone telling them the opposite.

Apart from inflation or a big rise in the cost of their two weeks in Benidorm...

If the UK is good enough for all those US citizens to come here for a
holiday, why not for Brits to stay in the UK?

R. Mark Clayton

2018-08-11 10:28:33 UTC

SNIP

Post by R. Mark Clayton
Yes it does and yes it did - overnight everyone who had money (not just a minority of speculators) downgraded their long term view of the health of the UK economy on the basis of Leave winning. Over two year later and the pound is still down - that is NOT the result of overnight speculation.

It's continued speculation. All currency trades are speculation.

So I buy Euro to go on holiday and it is speculation - rubbish.

Post by Norman Wells
The truth is, it's set by speculators trading in currencies, all
gambling in the hope of making a profit.

Yes, it's called speculation. They're hoping to make a profit from
their currency dealings,

that is speculation

Post by Norman Wells
or reduce a loss, which amounts to the same thing.

which is not, but much more akin to insurance, where one pays a premium to transfer the risk of your house burning down or your car being stolen.

Post by Norman Wells
As such, you can't read anything into it at all.

True for an overnight fluctuation of 10% (OTOH one of the largest ever), but when sterling is still sick over two years later from the same cause...

Who sets the rate, and how?

The market sets the rate, by balancing the price people will pay for different currencies.

Post by Norman Wells
And it's not a Brexiteer strategy to lower the
exchange rate. They can't influence it any more than you or I can.

Clearly they can - Davis opens his mouth and the there is another big sell off of the pound...

By 'currency traders', ie speculators. Who else?

In the very short term - a hard Brexit will make this long term [and worse].

Apart from inflation or a big rise in the cost of their two weeks in Benidorm...

If the UK is good enough for all those US citizens to come here for a
holiday, why not for Brits to stay in the UK?

If more foreign tourists visit and more Brit's stay at home then increased demand will increase prices in the UK. That's the trouble with Brexit, however you slice it Brits LOSE.

Ian Jackson

2018-08-10 07:27:26 UTC

Post by R. Mark Clayton
So that's the Brexit plan - make workers poorer?

As James o'Brien has found out on several occasions, many Brexiteers
have said they will be quite happy if they (and, of course, all of us)
end up being poorer.

--
Ian

kat

2018-08-10 07:32:11 UTC

Post by R. Mark Clayton
So that's the Brexit plan - make workers poorer?

As James o'Brien has found out on several occasions, many Brexiteers have said
they will be quite happy if they (and, of course, all of us) end up being poorer.

One could assume they have higher priorities than mere money, unlike Remainers then.

--
kat

^..^<

The Peeler

2018-08-10 08:52:50 UTC

Post by R. Mark Clayton
So that's the Brexit plan - make workers poorer?

As James o'Brien has found out on several occasions, many Brexiteers have said
they will be quite happy if they (and, of course, all of us) end up being poorer.

One could assume they have higher priorities than mere money, unlike Remainers then.

Or lower priorities, like their hatred and narrow-mindedness. ;-)

Yellow

2018-08-10 12:45:02 UTC

In article <***@mid.individual.net>, ***@hotmail.com
says...

Post by R. Mark Clayton
So that's the Brexit plan - make workers poorer?

As James o'Brien has found out on several occasions, many Brexiteers have said
they will be quite happy if they (and, of course, all of us) end up being poorer.

One could assume they have higher priorities than mere money, unlike Remainers then.

Except Ian is not quite telling it as it is because what people actually
say is that they are prepared to be poorer, and generally only expect
this to be in the short term, not that they are happy to be poorer.

It is a bit like the "no one voted to be poorer" nonsense - playing
games to make it sound like people who do not agree with your position
actually do.

Ian Jackson

2018-08-10 14:47:00 UTC

Post by Yellow
says...

Post by R. Mark Clayton
So that's the Brexit plan - make workers poorer?

As James o'Brien has found out on several occasions, many
Brexiteers have said
they will be quite happy if they (and, of course, all of us) end up being poorer.

One could assume they have higher priorities than mere money, unlike Remainers then.

Well, some of the more 'patrio-emotional' in-phoners really didn't seem
to care how long it would take to break even, and start becoming richer
than we had been before Brexit.

Post by Yellow
It is a bit like the "no one voted to be poorer" nonsense - playing
games to make it sound like people who do not agree with your position
actually do.

Despite some of the ludicrous expressions of 'patrio-bravado', I doubt
if even the daftest Brexiteer really DID vote to be poorer. It was only
when some of the downside consequences of Brexit (which they'd probably
never really bothered to consider) were subsequently pointed out to them
that they tried to find credible explanations for they way they has
voted. The most popular one is, of course, "To get my country back" (or
similar).

--
Ian

Bod

2018-08-10 14:56:18 UTC

Post by Yellow
says...

Post by R. Mark Clayton
So that's the Brexit plan - make workers poorer?

As James o'Brien has found out on several occasions, many
Brexiteers have said
they will be quite happy if they (and, of course, all of us) end up being poorer.

One could assume they have higher priorities than mere money, unlike Remainers then.

Well, some of the more 'patrio-emotional' in-phoners really didn't seem
to care how long it would take to break even, and start becoming richer
than we had been before Brexit.

Post by Yellow
It is a bit like the "no one voted to be poorer" nonsense - playing
games to make it sound like people who do not agree with your position
actually do.

LONDON (Reuters) - Britain’s economy looks on track to grow at its
fastest rate since the tail end of 2016, according to an estimate from
the National Institute of Economic and Social Research (NIESR) on Friday.

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-economy-niesr/uk-economy-on-track-to-grow-at-fastest-since-q4-2016-niesr-idUKKBN1KV1IV

--
Bod

Shitsack Moishe Goldberg

2018-08-10 16:57:26 UTC

In article <***@mid.individual.net>, ***@yahoo.co.uk
says...

Post by Yellow
says...

Post by R. Mark Clayton
So that's the Brexit plan - make workers poorer?

As James o'Brien has found out on several occasions, many Brexiteers have said
they will be quite happy if they (and, of course, all of us) end up
being poorer.

One could assume they have higher priorities than mere money, unlike
Remainers then.

Well, some of the more 'patrio-emotional' in-phoners really didn't seem
to care how long it would take to break even, and start becoming richer
than we had been before Brexit.

Post by Yellow
It is a bit like the "no one voted to be poorer" nonsense - playing
games to make it sound like people who do not agree with your position
actually do.

LONDON (Reuters) - Britain?s economy looks on track to grow at its
fastest rate since the tail end of 2016, according to an estimate from
the National Institute of Economic and Social Research (NIESR) on Friday.

What is the value of this economy measured in? Cheaper pounds? What
does it look like on a dollar basis?

The Peeler

2018-08-10 18:05:30 UTC

On Fri, 10 Aug 2018 09:57:26 -0700, serbian bitch Razovic, the resident
psychopath of sci and scj and Usenet's famous sexual cripple, making an ass

What is the value of this economy measured in? Cheaper pounds? What
does it look like on a dollar basis?

It looks extremely good on a dinar basis, dreckserb Razovic! LOL

--
Shadow about anal Razovic:
"Not forgetting that her asshole is bigger than her brain."
MID: <57f3d883$0$10651$b1db1813$***@news.astraweb.com>

Yellow

2018-08-10 17:10:32 UTC

Post by Yellow
says...

Post by R. Mark Clayton
So that's the Brexit plan - make workers poorer?

As James o'Brien has found out on several occasions, many
Brexiteers have said
they will be quite happy if they (and, of course, all of us) end up being poorer.

One could assume they have higher priorities than mere money, unlike Remainers then.

Well, some of the more 'patrio-emotional' in-phoners really didn't seem
to care how long it would take to break even, and start becoming richer
than we had been before Brexit.

Post by Yellow
It is a bit like the "no one voted to be poorer" nonsense - playing
games to make it sound like people who do not agree with your position
actually do.

Despite some of the ludicrous expressions of 'patrio-bravado', I doubt
if even the daftest Brexiteer really DID vote to be poorer.

This statement is used to claim that 'people', because "no one voted to
be poorer", are not prepared to be poorer to achieve the goal of leaving
the EU - which is a lie.

I am 'people' and I am prepared to be poorer. I do not however demand
it.

But we have been through all this before.

Post by Ian Jackson
It was only
when some of the downside consequences of Brexit (which they'd probably
never really bothered to consider) were subsequently pointed out to them
that they tried to find credible explanations for they way they has
voted. The most popular one is, of course, "To get my country back" (or
similar).

We were told before the vote we risked being poorer if we left the EU
yet the majority who expressed a preference still voted to leave.

But again, we have been through all this before.

Ian Jackson

2018-08-10 21:45:54 UTC

Post by Yellow
says...

Post by R. Mark Clayton
So that's the Brexit plan - make workers poorer?

As James o'Brien has found out on several occasions, many Brexiteers have said
they will be quite happy if they (and, of course, all of us) end up
being poorer.

One could assume they have higher priorities than mere money, unlike Remainers then.

Well, some of the more 'patrio-emotional' in-phoners really didn't seem
to care how long it would take to break even, and start becoming richer
than we had been before Brexit.

Post by Yellow
It is a bit like the "no one voted to be poorer" nonsense - playing
games to make it sound like people who do not agree with your position
actually do.

Despite some of the ludicrous expressions of 'patrio-bravado', I doubt
if even the daftest Brexiteer really DID vote to be poorer.

This statement is used to claim that 'people', because "no one voted to
be poorer", are not prepared to be poorer to achieve the goal of leaving
the EU - which is a lie.
I am 'people' and I am prepared to be poorer. I do not however demand
it.
But we have been through all this before.

We were told before the vote we risked being poorer if we left the EU
yet the majority who expressed a preference still voted to leave.

What!?! I certainly don't recall much mention of risking being poorer!
On the contrary, I thought we were told that we would be better off
outside the EU, where we could make all those tasty independent trade
deals with the Rest Of The World (Sunny Uplands in a Land Of Milk And
Honey - and all that jazz).

Post by Yellow
But again, we have been through all this before.

Despite this, reality is still being denied.

--
Ian

Yellow

2018-08-11 03:09:00 UTC

Post by Yellow
says...