OT: Paging the LandRover-isti

[DR]

A rogue brain cell misfire has caused me to contemplate owning an
ex-MOD Land Rover, on the basis that if the Army can't fuck it, that's
the one for me. Tell me I'm hideously mistaken?

[The Older Gentleman]

Post by DR
A rogue brain cell misfire has caused me to contemplate owning an
ex-MOD Land Rover, on the basis that if the Army can't fuck it, that's
the one for me. Tell me I'm hideously mistaken?

All MOD Land Rovers are 24v wired.

[DR]

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 20:55:57 +0100,

Post by The Older Gentleman

Post by DR
A rogue brain cell misfire has caused me to contemplate owning an
ex-MOD Land Rover, on the basis that if the Army can't fuck it, that's
the one for me. Tell me I'm hideously mistaken?

All MOD Land Rovers are 24v wired.

So it was a bad idea from the word go? Ta much. Probably worn out
anyway by the time they sell them on.

[Andy Wegg]

Post by DR

Post by The Older Gentleman
All MOD Land Rovers are 24v wired.

Not all were 24V - the FFR 109 Landies are, but the SWB ones are usually
Civvie standar and 12V.

Post by DR
So it was a bad idea from the word go? Ta much. Probably worn out
anyway by the time they sell them on.

Depends where they've been - some are stored and sold on with little
mileage and some lead sheltered lives if they've been with second line
units. Anything that the infantry or the TA had got hold of, on the
other hand...

[sweller]

Post by Andy Wegg

Post by The Older Gentleman
All MOD Land Rovers are 24v wired.

Not all were 24V - the FFR 109 Landies are, but the SWB ones are usually
Civvie standar and 12V.

Mine was an ex 24v radio car and had been converted to 12v.

[rb]

Post by Andy Wegg
some lead sheltered lives if they've been with second line
units.

ITYM RAF.

[Simon Atkinson]

Post by The Older Gentleman

Post by DR
A rogue brain cell misfire has caused me to contemplate owning an
ex-MOD Land Rover, on the basis that if the Army can't fuck it,
that's the one for me. Tell me I'm hideously mistaken?

All MOD Land Rovers are 24v wired.

No they aren't - pretty much only the FFR ones are 24 Volt and that's
not really a problem anyway. You can fit lorry bits to replace blown
bulbs, alternators etc. Starter motors for 24 Volt ones are pricey
though.

However, they are normally fucked to arseholes and back. Occasionally
you get a good one - one that's been stored at COD Donnington for it's
25 year MOD life, but they are rare.

Normally they've been driven by Pongos who imagine that they are
unbreakable. They're not.

Unless you know what you're doing avoid ex-MOD SOLandies.

[rb]

Post by Simon Atkinson
No they aren't - pretty much only the FFR ones are 24 Volt and that's
not really a problem anyway.

That was a *fucking* pain. The number of times some muppet would come
to me because they had put a GS trailer on an FFR 'rover.

"Ooh, bright lights"

<pop>


I don't know if there are any going through the auctions yet but the
newer HS or Wolf 'rovers are all 24V again[1]. They have chopped and
changed over the years with some FFRs having 12V vehicle electrics and
a second, 24V, alternator for the radio batteries. I always liked the
24V petrol lightweight SIIIs with the screened electrics.

[1] For the same reasons the army wants diesel bikes.

[Lord Frag]

Post by The Older Gentleman

Post by DR
A rogue brain cell misfire has caused me to contemplate owning an
ex-MOD Land Rover, on the basis that if the Army can't fuck it,
that's the one for me. Tell me I'm hideously mistaken?

All MOD Land Rovers are 24v wired.

How does that make it more likely to be fucked?

[The Older Gentleman]

Post by Lord Frag

Post by The Older Gentleman

Post by DR
A rogue brain cell misfire has caused me to contemplate owning an
ex-MOD Land Rover, on the basis that if the Army can't fuck it,
that's the one for me. Tell me I'm hideously mistaken?

All MOD Land Rovers are 24v wired.

How does that make it more likely to be fucked?

No, it just makes it more of a pain and more likely that something else
will get fucked. See rb's posting about trailers.

[Lord Frag]

Post by The Older Gentleman

Post by Lord Frag

Post by The Older Gentleman

Post by DR
A rogue brain cell misfire has caused me to contemplate owning
an ex-MOD Land Rover, on the basis that if the Army can't fuck
it, that's the one for me. Tell me I'm hideously mistaken?

All MOD Land Rovers are 24v wired.

How does that make it more likely to be fucked?

No, it just makes it more of a pain and more likely that something
else will get fucked. See rb's posting about trailers.

Ah yes, point taken. Personally I'd just view a 24V system as having
the potential for a lot more fun. More power available to accessories :)

They don't do those nice big huge fog horns in 12V versions :)

(yes I know P = V*I so the alternator and battery would have to have a
decent KWh rating)

[rb]

Post by Lord Frag
(yes I know P = V*I so the alternator and battery would have to have a
decent KWh rating)

Well the FFR alternator was designed to charge 6 (six) 12V batteries, 2
for the vehicle and 4 for the radio kit. The radio charging circuit had
a 100A fuse...

[Grimly Curmudgeon]

It was somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the

Post by Lord Frag
They don't do those nice big huge fog horns in 12V versions :)

http://www.vehicle-wiring-products.co.uk/VWPweb2000/horns/horns.html

[rb]

Post by Grimly Curmudgeon

Post by Lord Frag
They don't do those nice big huge fog horns in 12V versions :)

http://www.vehicle-wiring-products.co.uk/VWPweb2000/horns/horns.html

Heh, half way down:

"Reversing/surveillance camera."

Paging Mr Dodger...

[Salad Dodger]

Post by rb

Post by Grimly Curmudgeon

Post by Lord Frag
They don't do those nice big huge fog horns in 12V versions :)

http://www.vehicle-wiring-products.co.uk/VWPweb2000/horns/horns.html

"Reversing/surveillance camera."
Paging Mr Dodger...

Doctor Murray, more like.
--
| ___ Salad Dodger
|/ \
_/_____\_ GL1500SEV/CBR1100XXX/KH500A8/TS250C
|_\_____/_| ..73850../..18203.../..3184./.19406
(>|_|_|<) TPPFATUICG#7 DIAABTCOD#9 YTC#4 PM#5
|__|_|__| BOTAFOT #70 BOTAFOF #09 two#11 WG*
\ |^| / IbW#0 & KotIbW# BotTOS#6 GP#4
\|^|/ ANORAK#17 IbB#4
'^' RBR Landmarks: 5 Pts: 90 Miles: 455

[Lord Frag]

Post by Grimly Curmudgeon
It was somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the

Post by Lord Frag
They don't do those nice big huge fog horns in 12V versions :)

http://www.vehicle-wiring-products.co.uk/VWPweb2000/horns/horns.html

Heh, not them though. I could get hold of ones off the railway that
were only 24V. Too loud to actually be legally fitted to wagons though,
as if the drivers cared :)

[sweller]

Post by Lord Frag
Heh, not them though. I could get hold of ones off the railway that
were only 24V.

What ones? Off of what railway?

Trains use compressed air between 100psi - 140psi.

[ogden]

Post by sweller

Post by Lord Frag
Heh, not them though. I could get hold of ones off the railway that
were only 24V.

What ones? Off of what railway?
Trains use compressed air between 100psi - 140psi.

Fuckwit!

:)

[Lord Frag]

Post by Lord Frag
Heh, not them though. I could get hold of ones off the railway that
were only 24V.

What ones? Off of what railway?

<fx : thinks back years>

The ones I was offered. How the feck would I know which railway they
were nicked off?

Trains use compressed air between 100psi - 140psi.

Are they about 3 foot long, maybe 6~8" at the end of the horn? And
fitted with FOAD 24V compressors?

[sweller]

Post by Lord Frag

Post by sweller
Trains use compressed air between 100psi - 140psi.

Are they about 3 foot long, maybe 6~8" at the end of the horn? And
fitted with FOAD 24V compressors?

Depends what traction but the horns are about that big (maybe not that
long) but the compressors are 110v and about the size of a CG125 (the
entire bike) and there are two of them. Obviously not just for the
horns...

[frag]

Post by sweller

Post by Lord Frag

Post by sweller
Trains use compressed air between 100psi - 140psi.

Are they about 3 foot long, maybe 6~8" at the end of the horn? And
fitted with FOAD 24V compressors?

Depends what traction but the horns are about that big (maybe not that
long) but the compressors are 110v and about the size of a CG125 (the
entire bike) and there are two of them.

Jesus H Christ. Onna stick. What else were they used for? Brakes?
<struggles to think of any other reason...>

Post by sweller
Obviously not just for the horns...

I can just about see why those weren't nicked too and an ikkle 24V one
was fitted :)

[Peter]

Post by Grimly Curmudgeon
It was somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the

Post by Lord Frag
They don't do those nice big huge fog horns in 12V versions :)

http://www.vehicle-wiring-products.co.uk/VWPweb2000/horns/horns.html

Hmmmmm - rather like the marine at 108dBa - what's the legal limit?

[Grimly Curmudgeon]

It was somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember Peter

Post by Peter

Post by Grimly Curmudgeon
http://www.vehicle-wiring-products.co.uk/VWPweb2000/horns/horns.html

Hmmmmm - rather like the marine at 108dBa - what's the legal limit?

Hear it once and die... 180dbA, afair.

[z***@technologist.com]

Post by The Older Gentleman

Post by DR
A rogue brain cell misfire has caused me to contemplate owning an
ex-MOD Land Rover, on the basis that if the Army can't fuck it, that's
the one for me. Tell me I'm hideously mistaken?

All MOD Land Rovers are 24v wired.

Err, bollocks. Most of the radio trucks were, but mine wasn't.

HTH

Cheers

Paul.

[rb]

Post by z***@technologist.com

Post by The Older Gentleman
All MOD Land Rovers are 24v wired.

Err, bollocks. Most of the radio trucks were, but mine wasn't.

This has already been established. However, it's also worth mentioning
that it was only the FFR rovers that generally came with a hard top as
standard.

[Bear]

Post by rb

Post by z***@technologist.com

Post by The Older Gentleman
All MOD Land Rovers are 24v wired.

Err, bollocks. Most of the radio trucks were, but mine wasn't.

This has already been established. However, it's also worth mentioning
that it was only the FFR rovers that generally came with a hard top as
standard.

Please excuse my ignorance, but why were they 24v? Some of them, I mean.

[Andy Wegg]

rb says...

Post by rb
This has already been established. However, it's also worth mentioning
that it was only the FFR rovers that generally came with a hard top as
standard.

Eh? Borrocks, do they.

[rb]

Post by Andy Wegg
rb says...

Post by rb
This has already been established. However, it's also worth
mentioning that it was only the FFR rovers that generally came
with a hard top as standard.

Eh? Borrocks, do they.

No, it's true. GS landrovers are generally soft tops whereas FFRs are
generally hard tops. That's why our workshop had nearly all FFR trucks,
so we could lock the tools/spares in the back. Even the armourer's V8
was a hard top, but it didn't start off that way.

[AndyW]

Post by rb
No, it's true. GS landrovers are generally soft tops whereas FFRs are
generally hard tops. That's why our workshop had nearly all FFR trucks,
so we could lock the tools/spares in the back. Even the armourer's V8
was a hard top, but it didn't start off that way.

I've seen FFR hard tops, but far more FFR soft tops. The "start off
that way" thing might be a clue... I think hard tops were preferred
for command use, but most front line users wanted softtops so they
could be stripped down more easily to keep the profile down or to lift
with a chopper.

[Cab]

Post by Andy Wegg
rb says...

Post by rb
This has already been established. However, it's also worth
mentioning that it was only the FFR rovers that generally came
with a hard top as standard.

Eh? Borrocks, do they.

I don't actually remember *any* FFR's that were hard top. Mined Ewe,
this is in my limited experience.

[Andy Wegg]

"Cab" muttered

Post by Cab
I don't actually remember *any* FFR's that were hard top. Mined Ewe,
this is in my limited experience.

I've seen some, but most I've seen (and including the ex-7th armoured
one currently languishing in my brother's yard) are rag tops.

[rb]

Post by Andy Wegg
"Cab" muttered

I don't actually remember any FFR's that were hard top. Mined Ewe,
this is in my limited experience.

I've seen some, but most I've seen (and including the ex-7th armoured
one currently languishing in my brother's yard) are rag tops.

Is it a Series III? I think all SIII were soft tops. Defender and
90/110 FFR rovers were generally all hard tops.

[Andy Wegg]

"Bear" muttered

Post by Bear
Please excuse my ignorance, but why were they 24v? Some of them, I mean.

Power. To run the big clunky army radios

[Bear]

In article <***@mygate.mailgate.org>,
Andy Wegg says...

Post by Andy Wegg
"Bear" muttered

Post by Bear
Please excuse my ignorance, but why were they 24v? Some of them, I mean.

Power. To run the big clunky army radios

Ah, right, cheers. I was sat here thinking it must have been to help
them start faster so they could run away quicker :)

So does everything work on 24v then? Starter motor, etc? Or are there 2
systems, one 12v for the vehicle and one 24v one for the radios?

[rb]

Post by Bear
So does everything work on 24v then? Starter motor, etc? Or are there
2 systems, one 12v for the vehicle and one 24v one for the radios?

That's what varies. All vehicle radio kit is 24V[1] . Some landrovers
had dual electrics, 12V vehicle electrics and a second 24V alternator
just for the radio kit in the back. Some had totally 24V electrics,
lights, starter, ignition, the lot.

[1] Tracked vehicles are all 24V like HGVs.

[Bear]

Post by rb

Post by Bear
So does everything work on 24v then? Starter motor, etc? Or are there
2 systems, one 12v for the vehicle and one 24v one for the radios?

That's what varies. All vehicle radio kit is 24V[1] . Some landrovers
had dual electrics, 12V vehicle electrics and a second 24V alternator
just for the radio kit in the back. Some had totally 24V electrics,
lights, starter, ignition, the lot.

Strewth. That must make spare parts coverage a bit of a logistical
nightmare?

[Paul - xxx]

Post by Bear

Post by rb

Post by Bear
So does everything work on 24v then? Starter motor, etc? Or are there
2 systems, one 12v for the vehicle and one 24v one for the radios?

That's what varies. All vehicle radio kit is 24V[1] . Some landrovers
had dual electrics, 12V vehicle electrics and a second 24V alternator
just for the radio kit in the back. Some had totally 24V electrics,
lights, starter, ignition, the lot.

Strewth. That must make spare parts coverage a bit of a logistical
nightmare?

Landrover owners like to think of it as 'a challenge'. ;)

[Andy Wegg]

"Paul - xxx" muttered

Post by Paul - xxx

Post by Bear
Strewth. That must make spare parts coverage a bit of a logistical
nightmare?

Landrover owners like to think of it as 'a challenge'. ;)

...and the Army procurement eejets as "standard operating procedure"...
;-)

[Andy Wegg]

"Paul - xxx" muttered

Post by Paul - xxx

Post by Bear
Strewth. That must make spare parts coverage a bit of a logistical
nightmare?

Landrover owners like to think of it as 'a challenge'. ;)

...and the Army procurement eejeets as "standard operating procedure"...
;-)

[z***@technologist.com]

Post by Bear
Andy Wegg says...

Post by Andy Wegg
"Bear" muttered

Post by Bear
Please excuse my ignorance, but why were they 24v? Some of them, I mean.

Power. To run the big clunky army radios

So does everything work on 24v then? Starter motor, etc? Or are there 2
systems, one 12v for the vehicle and one 24v one for the radios?

Nope, they are 24V throughout. The Fitted for Radio trucks also had
shielded electrics which are a pain to maintain as all the plugs etc
have shrouds and cost a fortune apeice.

They also have a hyooge engine driven generator on them rather than a
shoddy little alternator.

Cheers

Paul.

[rb]

Post by z***@technologist.com
Nope, they are 24V throughout. The Fitted for Radio trucks also had
shielded electrics which are a pain to maintain as all the plugs etc
have shrouds and cost a fortune apeice.

Now you are definitely talking Series III as they were the last SI FFR
trucks. The shielded HT leads were a pain. Did you know it had a 12V
coil? This was to account for the loss in the all the shielding.

[Cab]

Post by Andy Wegg
"Bear" muttered

Post by Bear
Please excuse my ignorance, but why were they 24v? Some of them, I mean.

Power. To run the big clunky army radios

<fx: disppears into deep thought> Do you remember the lever next to the
gear stick that was connected to the accelerator, to keep the engine
turning over at high revs? Great cruise control that was. Until you
needed to do an emergency stop. :-)

[Krusty]

Post by Cab

Post by Andy Wegg
"Bear" muttered

Post by Bear
Please excuse my ignorance, but why were they 24v? Some of them, I mean.

Power. To run the big clunky army radios

<fx: disppears into deep thought> Do you remember the lever next to
the gear stick that was connected to the accelerator, to keep the
engine turning over at high revs? Great cruise control that was.
Until you needed to do an emergency stop. :-)

Heh, good they are - had one of those in my UMM Transcat - great for
off-roading when it was so bumpy your foot kept bouncing off the pedal.

[Paul - xxx]

Post by DR
A rogue brain cell misfire has caused me to contemplate owning an
ex-MOD Land Rover, on the basis that if the Army can't fuck it, that's
the one for me. Tell me I'm hideously mistaken?

As TOG says, not all actually, but most MOD are 24v. Many places
selling ex-MOD Landies will convert them back if you ask nicely, and pay
a chunk out, I guess. Where are you thinking of getting it from? If
it's from a private seller then it might already be 12v. If it's from
someone like Withams then it might or might not be.

They can have quite a few other differences to civvy Landies too, but
all the parts are available, and they're dead easy to work on.

Trouble is, MOD and Landrover had a close relationship, and what the MOD
wanted, they got. That was whether it was a one-off or a hundred off
and many differences to standard spec are un-documented, so it can be a
minefield to work with. In many ways this is also an attraction to some
people .. ;)

Have you ever driven a Landrover? They are, er, different and can take
a bit of getting used to, especially if it's an older series one. If
it's a newer Defender based variant with power steering then they're
mostly a bit like driving a Transit van, but with style .. ;)

[DR]

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 21:18:25 +0100, "Paul - xxx"

Post by Paul - xxx
Have you ever driven a Landrover? They are, er, different and can take
a bit of getting used to, especially if it's an older series one. If
it's a newer Defender based variant with power steering then they're
mostly a bit like driving a Transit van, but with style .. ;)

I'd only just thought about it, to be honest; this was in effect my
initial research. I like the idea of a large, lumbering object with
limited damageability and a "fuck you" attitude. I know there are
enough knowledgeable types around here, so I thought I'd dip a toe
into the water.

[The Older Gentleman]

Post by DR
I like the idea of a large, lumbering object with
limited damageability and a "fuck you" attitude.

What about a Ferret armoured car?

http://adcache.collectorcartraderonline.com/10/2/3/78372923.htm

Cheaper in the UK, of course. Like this one:

http://www.milweb.net/classifieds/class2.php?type=1

"I will throw in a Bren Gun and mags"

[DR]

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 22:04:53 +0100,

Post by The Older Gentleman
http://www.milweb.net/classifieds/class2.php?type=1
"I will throw in a Bren Gun and mags"

I like that idea, but I wouldn't be interested in keeping it standard.
Now I'm having thoughts of a matt black rat-tank to take on the school
run crowd...

[rb]

Post by DR
On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 22:04:53 +0100,

Post by The Older Gentleman
http://www.milweb.net/classifieds/class2.php?type=1
"I will throw in a Bren Gun and mags"

I like that idea, but I wouldn't be interested in keeping it standard.
Now I'm having thoughts of a matt black rat-tank to take on the school
run crowd...

You've got a cheap supply of petrol then have you?

[DR]

Post by rb

Post by DR
On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 22:04:53 +0100,

Post by The Older Gentleman
http://www.milweb.net/classifieds/class2.php?type=1
"I will throw in a Bren Gun and mags"

I like that idea, but I wouldn't be interested in keeping it standard.
Now I'm having thoughts of a matt black rat-tank to take on the school
run crowd...

You've got a cheap supply of petrol then have you?

There's always a fly in the ointment.

[Grimly Curmudgeon]

It was somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember

Post by The Older Gentleman

Post by DR
I like the idea of a large, lumbering object with
limited damageability and a "fuck you" attitude.

What about a Ferret armoured car?
http://adcache.collectorcartraderonline.com/10/2/3/78372923.htm
http://www.milweb.net/classifieds/class2.php?type=1
"I will throw in a Bren Gun and mags"

Not quite the real thing, but by fuck...

http://www.milweb.net/webverts/17343/

[Bear]

In article <***@4ax.com>, Grimly
Curmudgeon says...

Post by Grimly Curmudgeon
It was somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember

Post by The Older Gentleman

Post by DR
I like the idea of a large, lumbering object with
limited damageability and a "fuck you" attitude.

What about a Ferret armoured car?
http://adcache.collectorcartraderonline.com/10/2/3/78372923.htm
http://www.milweb.net/classifieds/class2.php?type=1
"I will throw in a Bren Gun and mags"

Not quite the real thing, but by fuck...
http://www.milweb.net/webverts/17343/

30K for a fake?! Are they insane?

[jsp]

Post by DR
I'd only just thought about it, to be honest; this was in effect my
initial research. I like the idea of a large, lumbering object with
limited damageability and a "fuck you" attitude. I know there are
enough knowledgeable types around here, so I thought I'd dip a toe
into the water.

I had an SIII landrover, not MOD and loved it.

A friend of mine had a military lightweight. For road presence, way to
go: sort of a Landrover / streetfighter.
His was MOD green, but someone else in the town had a yellow one. Hideous.

[Salad Dodger]

Post by jsp
A friend of mine had a military lightweight. For road presence, way to
go: sort of a Landrover / streetfighter.
His was MOD green, but someone else in the town had a yellow one. Hideous.

Air Traffic Control, then.
--
| ___ Salad Dodger
|/ \
_/_____\_ GL1500SEV/CBR1100XXX/KH500A8/TS250C
|_\_____/_| ..73850../..18203.../..3184./.19406
(>|_|_|<) TPPFATUICG#7 DIAABTCOD#9 YTC#4 PM#5
|__|_|__| BOTAFOT #70 BOTAFOF #09 two#11 WG*
\ |^| / IbW#0 & KotIbW# BotTOS#6 GP#4
\|^|/ ANORAK#17 IbB#4
'^' RBR Landmarks: 5 Pts: 90 Miles: 455

[Bear]

Post by Salad Dodger

Post by jsp
A friend of mine had a military lightweight. For road presence, way to
go: sort of a Landrover / streetfighter.
His was MOD green, but someone else in the town had a yellow one. Hideous.

Air Traffic Control, then.

Sorry, but I've got to ask this; why do they need a yellow one?

I mean, don't *they* know where the planes are going to come down, even
if no-one else does?

[Salad Dodger]

Post by Bear

Post by Salad Dodger

Post by jsp
A friend of mine had a military lightweight. For road presence, way to
go: sort of a Landrover / streetfighter.
His was MOD green, but someone else in the town had a yellow one. Hideous.

Air Traffic Control, then.

Sorry, but I've got to ask this; why do they need a yellow one?

So they can find it in the snow.

Or, so it's easily visible from the tower.

Post by Bear
I mean, don't *they* know where the planes are going to come down, even
if no-one else does?

Well, the approach controller might know, but he might not tell the
airfield controller.
--
| ___ Salad Dodger
|/ \
_/_____\_ GL1500SEV/CBR1100XXX/KH500A8/TS250C
|_\_____/_| ..73850../..18203.../..3184./.19406
(>|_|_|<) TPPFATUICG#7 DIAABTCOD#9 YTC#4 PM#5
|__|_|__| BOTAFOT #70 BOTAFOF #09 two#11 WG*
\ |^| / IbW#0 & KotIbW# BotTOS#6 GP#4
\|^|/ ANORAK#17 IbB#4
'^' RBR Landmarks: 5 Pts: 90 Miles: 455

[Bear]

Post by Salad Dodger

Post by Bear

Post by Salad Dodger

Post by jsp
A friend of mine had a military lightweight. For road presence, way to
go: sort of a Landrover / streetfighter.
His was MOD green, but someone else in the town had a yellow one. Hideous.

Air Traffic Control, then.

Sorry, but I've got to ask this; why do they need a yellow one?

So they can find it in the snow.

<nods sagely>

Post by Salad Dodger
Or, so it's easily visible from the tower.

Sorry, but why would they need to see it from the tower?

Post by Salad Dodger

Post by Bear
I mean, don't *they* know where the planes are going to come down, even
if no-one else does?

Well, the approach controller might know, but he might not tell the
airfield controller.

I tell you what, sod the tasty tuck and Ph.D. style uniforms; it's a
man's life in the RAF. Walking around not knowing where the next plane
is going to lawn dart? Fuck that.

[Salad Dodger]

Post by Bear

Post by Salad Dodger

Post by Bear

Post by Salad Dodger
Air Traffic Control, then.

Sorry, but I've got to ask this; why do they need a yellow one?

Or, so it's easily visible from the tower.

Sorry, but why would they need to see it from the tower?

So they don't land a plane on it. It might be out doing FOD patrol, or
summat.

Post by Bear

Post by Salad Dodger

Post by Bear
I mean, don't *they* know where the planes are going to come down, even
if no-one else does?

Well, the approach controller might know, but he might not tell the
airfield controller.

I tell you what, sod the tasty tuck and Ph.D. style uniforms; it's a
man's life in the RAF. Walking around not knowing where the next plane
is going to lawn dart? Fuck that.

It's not that likely - I went to Northolt on and off for six years,
and only saw three aircraft in that time. Two, officially - and I had
to wash one of those. Kinloss was a bit more fun, but not hectic, by
any means. Then there was the TriStar tanker at Brize.

Less than a dozen, all in, I reckon.

Oh, and it's only tasty tuck at Kinloss. The contract caterers at
Northolt tested the limits of acceptability.
--
| ___ Salad Dodger
|/ \
_/_____\_ GL1500SEV/CBR1100XXX/KH500A8/TS250C
|_\_____/_| ..73850../..18203.../..3184./.19406
(>|_|_|<) TPPFATUICG#7 DIAABTCOD#9 YTC#4 PM#5
|__|_|__| BOTAFOT #70 BOTAFOF #09 two#11 WG*
\ |^| / IbW#0 & KotIbW# BotTOS#6 GP#4
\|^|/ ANORAK#17 IbB#4
'^' RBR Landmarks: 5 Pts: 90 Miles: 455

[The Older Gentleman]

Post by Salad Dodger
It's not that likely - I went to Northolt on and off for six years,
and only saw three aircraft in that time. Two, officially - and I had
to wash one of those.

OK, so two questions.

What was the one you "didn't see"?

What was the one you had to wash? Here's me really, really hoping it was
a Galaxy.

[Andy Wegg]

"The Older Gentleman" muttered

Post by The Older Gentleman
What was the one you "didn't see"?
What was the one you had to wash? Here's me really, really hoping it was
a Galaxy.

He wasn't looking then. I saw a Spitfire in one of the hangars, the day
after the 50th anniversary of VE Day flypast, the regular weekly RAFG
shuttle flight, various comings and goings of the based stuff of the
time - 32 Sq Gazelles and BAe 125s plus the Queens Flight 146s and
Wessexes (Wessi?) when they merged into 32 and the Station Flight
Islanders which seemed to lead a fairly cloak and dagger life.
Plus the regular weekly USN shuttle flight, plus all the biz jet civil
stuff that uses Northolt. It would be fair to say Northolt wasn't
exactly Heathrow-ish in terms of traffic volume and RAF stations do tend
to pretty much shut up shop at the weekends, which was mostly when we
were there.

<Washing> Queen's Flight Andover CC1.

<Of yellow lightweight Landies> Could have been from an ATC glider unit
also, ie another airside vehicle.

[Salad Dodger]

On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 07:20:42 +0100,

Post by The Older Gentleman

Post by Salad Dodger
It's not that likely - I went to Northolt on and off for six years,
and only saw three aircraft in that time. Two, officially - and I had
to wash one of those.

OK, so two questions.
What was the one you "didn't see"?

C-130, late one Wednesday night, in the tower.

I was told that I "didn't" see it, with a knowing tap to the nose.

I was told not to enter it in the logs, either.

Turns out they told that to all new AATCs when they saw it for the
first time. Bit of an in-joke, apparently. I was asked the following
evening if I'd seen the C-130 the night before - being a good little
airman, I said no. Then I was shown the previous night's log. It was
there.

*Officially*, I never saw it.

Not quite as "black helicopters" as it sounds.

Post by The Older Gentleman
What was the one you had to wash? Here's me really, really hoping it was
a Galaxy.

Andover. For a bet. Our Flt Sgt with the engineering Warrant Officer.
Our first week of training - we were still in "do anything, without
thinking" mode.
--
| ___ Salad Dodger
|/ \
_/_____\_ GL1500SEV/CBR1100XXX/KH500A8/TS250C
|_\_____/_| ..73850../..18203.../..3184./.19406
(>|_|_|<) TPPFATUICG#7 DIAABTCOD#9 YTC#4 PM#5
|__|_|__| BOTAFOT #70 BOTAFOF #09 two#11 WG*
\ |^| / IbW#0 & KotIbW# BotTOS#6 GP#4
\|^|/ ANORAK#17 IbB#4
'^' RBR Landmarks: 5 Pts: 90 Miles: 455

[jsp]

Post by Salad Dodger

Post by jsp
A friend of mine had a military lightweight. For road presence, way to
go: sort of a Landrover / streetfighter.
His was MOD green, but someone else in the town had a yellow one. Hideous.

Air Traffic Control, then.

Maybe. I thought it was an 'after market' paint job, myself.

[z***@technologist.com]

Post by DR

Post by Paul - xxx
Have you ever driven a Landrover? They are, er, different and can take
a bit of getting used to, especially if it's an older series one.

If

Post by DR

Post by Paul - xxx
it's a newer Defender based variant with power steering then they're
mostly a bit like driving a Transit van, but with style .. ;)

I'd only just thought about it, to be honest; this was in effect my
initial research. I like the idea of a large, lumbering object with
limited damageability and a "fuck you" attitude. I know there are
enough knowledgeable types around here, so I thought I'd dip a toe
into the water.

If you've no money, as your sig suggests then an ex-mod landy
(especially a series 3) is not for you.

They are thirsty, noisy, uncomfortable and slow. But unbreakable.

If you can live with this, go right ahead :-)

Cheers

Paul. (ex MOD SIII 109" Royal Highland Regiment)

[Muck]

Post by z***@technologist.com

Post by DR

Post by Paul - xxx
Have you ever driven a Landrover? They are, er, different and can

take

Post by DR

Post by Paul - xxx
a bit of getting used to, especially if it's an older series one.

If

Post by DR

Post by Paul - xxx
it's a newer Defender based variant with power steering then they're
mostly a bit like driving a Transit van, but with style .. ;)

I'd only just thought about it, to be honest; this was in effect my
initial research. I like the idea of a large, lumbering object with
limited damageability and a "fuck you" attitude. I know there are
enough knowledgeable types around here, so I thought I'd dip a toe
into the water.

If you've no money, as your sig suggests then an ex-mod landy
(especially a series 3) is not for you.

Yeh, they're a bit of a money pit for sure. The only way of making one
both economical and fast, is to push it off beachy head.

Post by z***@technologist.com
They are thirsty, noisy, uncomfortable and slow. But unbreakable.

All of the above, plus.. they bleed fluids, so can piss off the SO or
Land Lord if parked on their nice clean drive.

Post by z***@technologist.com
If you can live with this, go right ahead :-)

They are great fun though. :) I had a SIII Air portable and loved it to
bits, until I sold it to buy a bike.

[Ben]

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 21:42:11 +0100, DR

Post by DR
On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 21:18:25 +0100, "Paul - xxx"

Post by Paul - xxx
Have you ever driven a Landrover? They are, er, different and can take
a bit of getting used to, especially if it's an older series one. If
it's a newer Defender based variant with power steering then they're
mostly a bit like driving a Transit van, but with style .. ;)

I'd only just thought about it, to be honest; this was in effect my
initial research. I like the idea of a large, lumbering object with
limited damageability and a "fuck you" attitude.

Toyota Hi-lux or a Mitsu L200.

[SteveH]

Post by DR
A rogue brain cell misfire has caused me to contemplate owning an
ex-MOD Land Rover, on the basis that if the Army can't fuck it, that's
the one for me. Tell me I'm hideously mistaken?

Don't ponce about with flimsy crap like that. Get a Unimog.

[Ginge]

In article <1gu7ihv.125xir788y4mxN%***@italiancar.co.uk>, SteveH
says...

Post by SteveH

Post by DR
A rogue brain cell misfire has caused me to contemplate owning an
ex-MOD Land Rover, on the basis that if the Army can't fuck it, that's
the one for me. Tell me I'm hideously mistaken?

Don't ponce about with flimsy crap like that. Get a Unimog.

I'm begining to see why you claim to need over 30k a year.

Darren, buy a normal car, abuse it, then sell it.. Spend the difference
on having fun.

:-)

[DR]

Post by Ginge
Darren, buy a normal car, abuse it, then sell it.. Spend the difference
on having fun.
:-)

Currently doing; at stage 2 (car, abuse thereof). I own two vehicles;
the bigger engine is on 2 wheels...

[Johannes Gerber]

Post by SteveH

Post by DR
A rogue brain cell misfire has caused me to contemplate owning an
ex-MOD Land Rover, on the basis that if the Army can't fuck it, that's
the one for me. Tell me I'm hideously mistaken?

Don't ponce about with flimsy crap like that. Get a Unimog.

ITYM

http://www.tatra.cz/en/force/force_en.asp

Unimog? good for scaring small children in Tonkatoys/Hummers.

Real Men go for for 610 kW of MTU power, a 10 speed auto and the
instructions: "If you get stuck, floor it. Repeat as necessary."

Alternatively, if you don't go for small, underpowered army kit,
there's always the T282B: http://www.liebherr.com/me/en/40787.asp


Johannes Gerber

[Bear]

In article <***@4ax.com>, Johannes Gerber
says...

Post by Johannes Gerber

Post by SteveH

Post by DR
A rogue brain cell misfire has caused me to contemplate owning an
ex-MOD Land Rover, on the basis that if the Army can't fuck it, that's
the one for me. Tell me I'm hideously mistaken?

Don't ponce about with flimsy crap like that. Get a Unimog.

ITYM
http://www.tatra.cz/en/force/force_en.asp
Unimog? good for scaring small children in Tonkatoys/Hummers.
Real Men go for for 610 kW of MTU power, a 10 speed auto and the
instructions: "If you get stuck, floor it. Repeat as necessary."

heh.

The chap who owned the building leased by the company dog and I used to
work for had a 6 (or maybe 8, but I think 6) wheel APC-type thing ... it
was supposedly amphibious too, or maybe partially so. British army I
think, BICBW ... anyone know what it was?

[Ginge]

Post by Bear
The chap who owned the building leased by the company dog and I used to
work for had a 6 (or maybe 8, but I think 6) wheel APC-type thing ... it
was supposedly amphibious too, or maybe partially so. British army I
think, BICBW ... anyone know what it was?

Alvis Stalwart?

http://www.olive-drab.com/idphoto/id_photos_stalwart.php3

Very silly vehicles, I've witnessed them playing off road.

[Bear]

Post by Ginge

Post by Bear
The chap who owned the building leased by the company dog and I used to
work for had a 6 (or maybe 8, but I think 6) wheel APC-type thing ... it
was supposedly amphibious too, or maybe partially so. British army I
think, BICBW ... anyone know what it was?

Alvis Stalwart?
http://www.olive-drab.com/idphoto/id_photos_stalwart.php3
Very silly vehicles, I've witnessed them playing off road.

The very thing! Thank you :)

His name was Russell, and he was a property developer of the multi-
millionaire persuasion. He had a nice new R1 (tyres ground down to the
edges), a KTM Duke II (which was funny, because he was very short, and
thus had to almost vault to get on, and admitted to having to put his
feet on kerbs when he stopped at lights, or half get off) and kept a
collection of ex-military vehicles in the car park, including 4 or 5 ex-
Army LRs, 2 of those Alvis things, and one of those 2 wheels at the
front, 4 wheels at the back military truck things. Every so often he, or
one of his builders, would get one out in rotation, charge the battery
(or jump start, or crank handle) them into life, and set off to go get
building materials in them ... this is the LRs & truck I'm talking about
... I'm not sure the amphibious thingy would have been road-legal?

Strange bloke, strange hobbies :)

Are those things 6 wheel drive then?

[rb]

Post by Bear
I'm not sure the amphibious thingy would have been road-legal?

Oh it is. Last time I saw one was at Weymouth last year as part of the
60th celebrations.

Post by Bear
Are those things 6 wheel drive then?

Umm, dunno. Never had the /pleasure/ of driving one myself.

[Ginge]

Post by Bear
Are those things 6 wheel drive then?

Yep, Here's a better webpage:

http://www.4x4mag.co.uk/junefeatures/magstalwart.htm

For such a huge machine they aren't half nimble looking, thirsty mind!

[Bear]

Post by Ginge

Post by Bear
Are those things 6 wheel drive then?

http://www.4x4mag.co.uk/junefeatures/magstalwart.htm
For such a huge machine they aren't half nimble looking, thirsty mind!

Wow :)

5 mpg is a *bit* steep, but I guess you don't care if you get the grins
:)

[Paul - xxx]

Post by Ginge

Post by Bear
Are those things 6 wheel drive then?

http://www.4x4mag.co.uk/junefeatures/magstalwart.htm
For such a huge machine they aren't half nimble looking, thirsty mind!

Trouble is with an Alvis, you _can't_ really get stuck .. unlike my
Landrover Discovery .. ;)

http://groups.msn.com/LosiPaulsPictures/shoebox.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=118
and 119, 120, 121 etc

It took an hour or so with another Discovery and a Series 3 in tandem and a
shit-load of chain, towrope, and reverse gear wellie to get out. It was a
slurry pond with a crust on it, 'cept I went through the crust, and it kept
sinking .. slowly ... At the point where the pictures were taken the chassis
was 'grounded' and the wheels had absolutely nothing to grip on, just
sand/slurry. If you look at the next pic, 119, just ahead and to the right
of the Landie is a hole ... a _deep_ hole, again with a crust on the surface
which looks, feels rock solid and is even when jumped upon, just not when
driven on. Most of the water you can see is what came up when we went
through the crust .. ;)

We were trying to get up the bank to the left, at first, but the rear wheels
broke through and front end swung round, and I wellied it to try and get up,
but just got deeper and deeper.

[Bear]

Post by Paul - xxx
It took an hour or so with another Discovery and a Series 3 in tandem and a
shit-load of chain, towrope, and reverse gear wellie to get out. It was a
slurry pond with a crust on it, 'cept I went through the crust, and it kept
sinking .. slowly ... At the point where the pictures were taken the chassis
was 'grounded' and the wheels had absolutely nothing to grip on, just
sand/slurry. If you look at the next pic, 119, just ahead and to the right
of the Landie is a hole ... a _deep_ hole, again with a crust on the surface
which looks, feels rock solid and is even when jumped upon, just not when
driven on. Most of the water you can see is what came up when we went
through the crust .. ;)

Oh dear :)

I learnt my lesson early on; fixing fence posts on the farm in Ca., aged
15, I had a choice of walking the various posts across ground made
marshy from irrigation, and a small leak in an irrigation pipe, or
driving one of these:

http://4wheeldrive.about.com/library/uc/ucRon_Johnson.htm

... across it. (actually a slightly different model, and colour, and
obviously without the mental engine mods, but let's keep the ukrm
accuracy saddos happy, eh)

Easy, I thought. Just back the truck up, floor it, and let the huge
septic V8 do its worst. It's only about 50 yards of marshy ground, FFS;
if I hit it at about 60 there's no *way* I can bog down ...

Ten seconds later I had what I believe is termed "that sinking feeling";
I couldn't believe just how fast it slowed on hitting the gooey stuff.
Followed by a 4 miles trudge home to grab a tractor out of the workshop
to pull it out with :)

[Paul - xxx]

Post by Bear

Post by Paul - xxx
It took an hour or so with another Discovery and a Series 3 in tandem
and a shit-load of chain, towrope, and reverse gear wellie to get out.
It was a slurry pond with a crust on it, 'cept I went through the crust,
and it kept sinking .. slowly ... At the point where the pictures were
taken the chassis was 'grounded' and the wheels had absolutely nothing
to grip on, just sand/slurry. If you look at the next pic, 119, just
ahead and to the right of the Landie is a hole ... a _deep_ hole, again
with a crust on the surface which looks, feels rock solid and is even
when jumped upon, just not when driven on. Most of the water you can
see is what came up when we went through the crust .. ;)

Oh dear :)
I learnt my lesson early on; fixing fence posts on the farm in Ca., aged
15, I had a choice of walking the various posts across ground made
marshy from irrigation, and a small leak in an irrigation pipe, or
http://4wheeldrive.about.com/library/uc/ucRon_Johnson.htm

Like there was a choice then ...

Post by Bear
... across it. (actually a slightly different model, and colour, and
obviously without the mental engine mods, but let's keep the ukrm
accuracy saddos happy, eh)
Easy, I thought. Just back the truck up, floor it, and let the huge
septic V8 do its worst. It's only about 50 yards of marshy ground, FFS;
if I hit it at about 60 there's no *way* I can bog down ...
Ten seconds later I had what I believe is termed "that sinking feeling";
I couldn't believe just how fast it slowed on hitting the gooey stuff.
Followed by a 4 miles trudge home to grab a tractor out of the workshop
to pull it out with :)

I was close to calling my sis and borrowing the farm Manitou .. Now _that's_
a great getter-outer-of-sticky-shit kinda vehicle .. ;)

[Bear]

Post by Paul - xxx
Like there was a choice then ...

heh.

Post by Paul - xxx

Post by Bear
Ten seconds later I had what I believe is termed "that sinking feeling";
I couldn't believe just how fast it slowed on hitting the gooey stuff.
Followed by a 4 miles trudge home to grab a tractor out of the workshop
to pull it out with :)

I was close to calling my sis and borrowing the farm Manitou .. Now _that's_
a great getter-outer-of-sticky-shit kinda vehicle .. ;)

My step-brother used to have this brilliant trick for getting tractors
out of the gunk; he used to attach a hawser, rev the towing tractor like
fuck, then drive it away at maximum speed; the sunken tractor would then
pop free as the hawser went slightly elastic.

He did this once too often with the same hawser once, heard a whooshing
noise and ducked. It cut through 3 of the 4 roof support posts, and
would have taken his head off neat as you like. He didn't do it again :)

[Paul - xxx]

Post by Bear
My step-brother used to have this brilliant trick for getting tractors
out of the gunk; he used to attach a hawser, rev the towing tractor like
fuck, then drive it away at maximum speed; the sunken tractor would then
pop free as the hawser went slightly elastic.

I think I can see where this is leading ..

Post by Bear
He did this once too often with the same hawser once, heard a whooshing
noise and ducked. It cut through 3 of the 4 roof support posts, and
would have taken his head off neat as you like. He didn't do it again :)

Yup, BTDTGTTS .. ;)

It's a well used recovery method, though 'they' now use a proper 'Kinetic'
recovery rope .. ;)

[Bear]

Post by Paul - xxx

Post by Bear
My step-brother used to have this brilliant trick for getting tractors
out of the gunk; he used to attach a hawser, rev the towing tractor like
fuck, then drive it away at maximum speed; the sunken tractor would then
pop free as the hawser went slightly elastic.

I think I can see where this is leading ..

Post by Bear
He did this once too often with the same hawser once, heard a whooshing
noise and ducked. It cut through 3 of the 4 roof support posts, and
would have taken his head off neat as you like. He didn't do it again :)

Yup, BTDTGTTS .. ;)

It impressed me coz I've never managed to fuck up in quite that way :)

Post by Paul - xxx
It's a well used recovery method, though 'they' now use a proper 'Kinetic'
recovery rope .. ;)

One could argue that the hawser was about as "kinetic" as one could get
... well into "Kinell" territory :)

[PDannyD]

Post by DR
A rogue brain cell misfire has caused me to contemplate owning an
ex-MOD Land Rover, on the basis that if the Army can't fuck it, that's
the one for me. Tell me I'm hideously mistaken?

Ask on alt.fan.landrover for a more accurate answer, particularly concerning
parts and 12/24v versions.