Discussion:
My UK General Election 2019 predictions, and putting my money where my mouth is
(too old to reply)
Stephen Cole
2019-11-02 06:17:45 UTC
Permalink
Over the last few years, I’ve actually been quite good at sensing which way
the wind is blowing in terms of politics in the UK. I correctly predicted
early in Corbyn’s 2015 leadership campaign that he was on for a landslide;
that Leave was likely to win the 2016 EU referendum; and that Labour would
out-perform expectations in the 2017 General Election and scupper Theresa
May’s plans. I also predicted way back in early-2017, when Article 50 was
voted through by the British Parliament, that Brexit wasn’t going to happen
two years later, and almost certainly wouldn’t happen at all. I was proved
right on the first part of that prediction when May extended Article 50 to
Halloween, and then again when Boris Johnson extended it to January 31st
2020. I still expect to be proved right on the second clause of that
prediction; Brexit ain’t gonna happen. Feel free to quote me on that!

Truth is, it’s not difficult to do. It just requires a modicum of objective
thought and some fairly casual observation of the way conversation about
these matters ebbs and flows, online and offline. I mean, I really wanted
Ed Miliband to win the 2015 General Election but, deep down, I knew it was
a tough ask as he was such a soft target for his enemies. Absolutely
terrified of his own shadow, Miliband was terrorised by the media and
forced in to making endless needless mistakes, throughout his leadership
but particularly so during the 2015 campaign. He became a national joke
because of it. Labour lost that one, badly, but that horrifying loss opened
the door for the Left’s resurrection in Jeremy Corbyn.

Barely being aware of Corbyn before that leadership campaign, it didn’t
take many of his speeches to turn me into a Corbynite. He proposed simple,
just concepts such as equality, pacifism, compassion, and restructuring the
economic system so it works for the people rather than The Man. What’s
wrong with all that? The backdrop in the country at the time was one of
ruination at the hands of the financial crisis and the Tory/Lib Dem
Coalition government. David Cameron had just secured a majority for the
Tories to ramp up their attack on, well, everybody who isn’t a millionaire.
The time was right for a straightforward man of integrity to drive a bus
through the bullshit and deliver justice to the masses. It was obvious that
Corbyn would demolish the tepid centrism of the other leadership hopefuls.

The Centrists in the Labour PLP went absolutely mental after Corbyn won the
leadership in a crushing landslide and spent much of the next couple of
years going after him but all for nought; Corbyn owns Labour now.

We’re now going into *another* snap General Election, Brexit remains
unresolved, the economy is in absolute bits, and the electorate is rattier
and more fed-up of all the horsehit than they have been for a long time.
Polls have been up and down all year. The culture wars rage on social
media. This is going to be a weird one, no mistake.

That said, I feel quite confident as to the outcomes we’ll see in the
morning of December 13th 2019:

Labour will win the most seats and be the largest party in Parliament

An overall majority for Labour feels unlikely, though

Labour will form a minority government, likely with SNP support [1]

Jeremy Corbyn will be the next Prime Minister

I’ve felt this way since the 2017 General Election results came in and
Theresa May managed to hobble on by bribing the DUP; that at the next
election, whenever that might be, Labour had it in the bag. That sureness
was reinforced when May capitulated on her main red lines and signed up to
the softest of Soft Brexits in December 2017. The Tories were now dead in
the water, they just didn’t know it yet.

Reality bit them on the arse throughout 2018 and into 2019 as the terms of
that agreement, essentially locking the UK into the EU’s regulatory orbit
forever, dictated the very limited set of Brexit options open to them. May
desperately spent months splitting hairs about it, always refusing to admit
that she had signed away the supposed freedom that the anti-EU set had long
sought. But it eventually destroyed her, failing in Parliament over and
over again by massive majorities against her deal. It was top LOLs. Labour
made it their official-but-unspoken policy to simply sit on the fence,
refuse to commit to Leave or Remain, and allow the Tories to self-immolate.
Corbyn took a lot of stick for these tactics but he played a winning hand
and it’s going to carry him into Downing Street.

Labour will face a Tory Party now relatively united over Brexit and a Tory
leader committed to a Hard-ish Brexit to satisfy the maniacs in his Party
who demand it in exchange for keeping him in power. But Johnson’s Brexit
deal isn’t anywhere near hard enough for some, not least of all Nigel
Farage who today insisted that, unless Boris dumps his deal and embraces
crashing out of the EU with nothing, Farage’s Brexit party will contest
every seat in the country. This will be carnage for the Conservatives but
it’s difficult to see how Boris could possibly agree to enter a pact by
dumping his sole achievement in Number 10; his Brexit deal.

Farage wants to leave the EU, that’s beyond doubt, but he also wants to
*really* leave the EU, with no connections at all left, and Johnson’s deal
doesn’t really do that despite it being harder than May’s. Farage has been
playing the long game with regards the EU, making a rich living out of it
for more than 20 years now, so he won’t be too dispirited at the idea of
waiting a year or two longer to have another shot at getting the
catastrophic outcome he needs. And in the meantime, he can make hay (and
lots of money!) while the sun shines by causing trouble in the EU and
British Parliaments with his band of Brexit-loving acolytes.

The Brexit Party are a problem for Labour to consider, too, but on a much
smaller scale. Much is made of “Labour Heartlands” voting Leave but the
facts are that most people inclined to vote Labour in 2019 (as in 2017)
voted Remain in the referendum, so Farage will have much thinner pickings
from potential Labour voters as he will from potential Tory voters. The Lib
Dems are arguably a genuine threat to Labour but, again, voters inclined to
switch to the Lib Dems already did so two years ago. There’s not many votes
to lose, despite what the media pundits say about the Lib Dems being the
home of Remain; Labour are offering to negotiate their own version of a
deal and put that to a referendum vs Remain. It’s objectively clear that
this is the only intellectually honest way forward, and left-leaning
Remainer voters will recognise that. If I’m honest, I’d not be surprised to
see the Lib Dems secure less than 10% of the national vote. We’ll see.

I don’t gamble often, it’s a mug’s game, but I have put a few quid on my
predictions above. I’ve also punted £5 on Labour winning an overall
majority, which I don’t expect to happen but the sentimental twat in me
forces me to put my money where my mouth is and get right behind Labour.

I’ll let you know how much I’ve won on December 13th!

[1] I believe that, whilst there will be no formal coalition, the SNP and
Labour will form a gentleman’s agreement to work together to form a Labour
minority government, in exchange for a 2nd EU referendum (which is already
Labour policy) and a future Scottish Indepence referendum (which is not
Labour policy but they *should* officially adopt a neutral stance on the
matter, in my opinion).
--
M0TEY // STC
www.twitter.com/ukradioamateur
Rod Speed
2019-11-02 08:08:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stephen Cole
Over the last few years, I’ve actually been quite good at sensing which
way the wind is blowing in terms of politics in the UK. I correctly
predicted
early in Corbyn’s 2015 leadership campaign that he was on for a landslide;
that Leave was likely to win the 2016 EU referendum; and that Labour would
out-perform expectations in the 2017 General Election and scupper Theresa
May’s plans. I also predicted way back in early-2017, when Article 50 was
voted through by the British Parliament, that Brexit wasn’t going to happen
two years later, and almost certainly wouldn’t happen at all.
So you stuffed that last up completely.
Post by Stephen Cole
I was proved right on the first part of that prediction
when May extended Article 50 to Halloween,
Yes.
Post by Stephen Cole
and then again when Boris Johnson
extended it to January 31st 2020.
No you werent and Boris didn’t do that, parliament did.
Post by Stephen Cole
I still expect to be proved right on the second clause
of that prediction; Brexit ain’t gonna happen.
It will, you watch.
Post by Stephen Cole
Feel free to quote me on that!
We will and with the even sillier predication
that Labour will win the GE in a landslide.
That’s just mindless wishful thinking.
Post by Stephen Cole
Truth is, it’s not difficult to do.
We'll see...
Post by Stephen Cole
It just requires a modicum of objective thought
Something you arent actually capable of.
Post by Stephen Cole
and some fairly casual observation of the way conversation
about these matters ebbs and flows, online and offline.
With that either.
Post by Stephen Cole
I mean, I really wanted Ed Miliband to win the 2015
General Election but, deep down, I knew it was a
tough ask as he was such a soft target for his enemies.
And because Blair and Brown had fucked up so spectacularly.
Post by Stephen Cole
Absolutely terrified of his own shadow, Miliband was terrorised
by the media and forced in to making endless needless mistakes,
throughout his leadership but particularly so during the 2015 campaign.
That wasn’t the problem, Blair and Brown were.
Post by Stephen Cole
He became a national joke because of it. Labour lost that one, badly,
But not for that reason.
Post by Stephen Cole
but that horrifying loss opened the door
for the Left’s resurrection in Jeremy Corbyn.
Yes, and Corbyn's horrible loss this time will see the same thing in
reverse.
Post by Stephen Cole
Barely being aware of Corbyn before that leadership campaign,
it didn’t take many of his speeches to turn me into a Corbynite.
Yep, you actually are that stupid. Even tho he couldn’t
even manage to even get a viable opposition cabinet.

That’s what its about, getting stuff done, not speeches.
Post by Stephen Cole
He proposed simple, just concepts such as equality,
pacifism, compassion, and restructuring the economic
system so it works for the people rather than The Man.
Pity that the voters wont buy it, you watch. At most
they might conceivably be too stupid to work out
that his bribes are completely unaffordable until
that collapses the economy completely.
Post by Stephen Cole
What’s wrong with all that?
The votes arent interested.
Post by Stephen Cole
The backdrop in the country at the time was one
of ruination at the hands of the financial crisis
And the effect of that on the UK economy was
entirely due to Blair and Brown actually being
stupid enough to deregulate the banks. Neither
Canada nor Australia had even a single retail
bank implode spectacularly or even need to
be bailed out by govt.
Post by Stephen Cole
and the Tory/Lib Dem Coalition government.
The voters clearly felt otherwise.
Post by Stephen Cole
David Cameron had just secured a majority for the Tories to
ramp up their attack on, well, everybody who isn’t a millionaire.
How odd that the voters actually gave him a decent
majority after they had seen what he could deliver.
Post by Stephen Cole
The time was right for a straightforward man of integrity to drive
a bus through the bullshit and deliver justice to the masses.
How odd that that fool Corbyn couldn’t actually convince
the voters that he could actually do that, twice.
Post by Stephen Cole
It was obvious that Corbyn would demolish the
tepid centrism of the other leadership hopefuls.
But couldn’t even manage to deliver a viable shadow cabinet.

If he couldn’t even manage that, no hope of running the country.
Post by Stephen Cole
The Centrists in the Labour PLP went absolutely mental
after Corbyn won the leadership in a crushing landslide
and spent much of the next couple of years going after him
Because they realised that the voters would never
buy him even if he was able to stack the system
that Labour was actually stupid enough to use
do decide who was the Labour leader.
Post by Stephen Cole
but all for nought; Corbyn owns Labour now.
But wont in 6 weeks when Labour seats are decimated.
Post by Stephen Cole
We’re now going into *another* snap General Election,
Brexit remains unresolved,
But will be resolved after the election.
Post by Stephen Cole
the economy is in absolute bits,
Even sillier than you usually manage and that’s saying something.
Post by Stephen Cole
and the electorate is rattier and more fed-up of all
the horsehit than they have been for a long time.
But will pull the plug on Labour anyway, you watch.
Post by Stephen Cole
Polls have been up and down all year.
Down only for Labour.
Post by Stephen Cole
The culture wars rage on social media.
This is going to be a weird one, no mistake.
Bet it isnt.
Post by Stephen Cole
That said, I feel quite confident as to the outcomes
Yes, you actually are that stupid.
Post by Stephen Cole
Labour will win the most seats
No chance.
Post by Stephen Cole
and be the largest party in Parliament
No chance.
Post by Stephen Cole
An overall majority for Labour feels unlikely, though
Impossible,, actually.
Post by Stephen Cole
Labour will form a minority government, likely with SNP support [1]
They have always said that they wont do that. And
arent going to have enough seats to do that anyway.
Post by Stephen Cole
Jeremy Corbyn will be the next Prime Minister
No chance.
Post by Stephen Cole
I’ve felt this way since the 2017 General Election results came in
and Theresa May managed to hobble on by bribing the DUP; that
at the next election, whenever that might be, Labour had it in the bag.
And you're about to discover that they don’t.
Post by Stephen Cole
That sureness was reinforced when May capitulated
on her main red lines and signed up to the softest of
Soft Brexits in December 2017.
It was actually a BRINO.
Post by Stephen Cole
The Tories were now dead in the water, they just didn’t know it yet.
You'll see that that Labour, as usual.
Post by Stephen Cole
Reality bit them on the arse throughout 2018 and into 2019 as the terms
of that agreement, essentially locking the UK into the EU’s regulatory
orbit
forever, dictated the very limited set of Brexit options open to them. May
desperately spent months splitting hairs about it, always refusing to admit
that she had signed away the supposed freedom that the anti-EU set had
long sought. But it eventually destroyed her, failing in Parliament over
and
over again by massive majorities against her deal. It was top LOLs. Labour
made it their official-but-unspoken policy to simply sit on the fence,
refuse
to commit to Leave or Remain, and allow the Tories to self-immolate.
Corbyn took a lot of stick for these tactics but he played a winning hand
and it’s going to carry him into Downing Street.
No chance, you watch.
Post by Stephen Cole
Labour will face a Tory Party now relatively united over Brexit and a Tory
leader committed to a Hard-ish Brexit to satisfy the maniacs in his Party
To satisfy the referendum, actually.
Post by Stephen Cole
who demand it in exchange for keeping him in power.
Completely off with the fairys as always.
Post by Stephen Cole
But Johnson’s Brexit deal isn’t anywhere near hard
enough for some, not least of all Nigel Farage
Who is now completely irrelevant.
Post by Stephen Cole
who today insisted that, unless Boris dumps his deal
and embraces crashing out of the EU with nothing,
Farage’s Brexit party will contest every seat in the country.
Pity they don’t actually have the money to do that properly.
Post by Stephen Cole
This will be carnage for the Conservatives but it’s difficult
to see how Boris could possibly agree to enter a pact by
dumping his sole achievement in Number 10; his Brexit deal.
Yep its just more Farage bullshit.
Post by Stephen Cole
Farage wants to leave the EU, that’s beyond doubt, but he also wants
to *really* leave the EU, with no connections at all left, and Johnson’s
deal doesn’t really do that despite it being harder than May’s. Farage
has been playing the long game with regards the EU, making a rich
living out of it for more than 20 years now, so he won’t be too
dispirited at the idea of waiting a year or two longer to have
another shot at getting the catastrophic outcome he needs.
He wont get that. The UK will leave in Jan, you watch.
Post by Stephen Cole
And in the meantime, he can make hay (and lots of money!)
while the sun shines by causing trouble in the EU and British
Parliaments with his band of Brexit-loving acolytes.
He wont get even a single seat in the UK parliament
and the EP is completely irrelevant to brexit.
Post by Stephen Cole
The Brexit Party are a problem for Labour to consider,
too, but on a much smaller scale. Much is made of
“Labour Heartlands” voting Leave but the facts are
that most people inclined to vote Labour in 2019
(as in 2017)voted Remain in the referendum,
Bullshit they did.
Post by Stephen Cole
so Farage will have much thinner pickings from potential
Labour voters as he will from potential Tory voters.
Farage will be as irrelevant in this election as he was in the last one.

< The Lib Dems are arguably a genuine threat to Labour but, again,
Post by Stephen Cole
voters inclined to switch to the Lib Dems already did so two years ago.
That’s bullshit now the LD are the only unambiguous remain party that
matters.
Post by Stephen Cole
There’s not many votes to lose, despite what the media
pundits say about the Lib Dems being the home of Remain;
That’s bullshit too with the votes.
Post by Stephen Cole
Labour are offering to negotiate their own version of a deal
And no one believes they can do that.
Post by Stephen Cole
and put that to a referendum vs Remain. It’s objectively
clear that this is the only intellectually honest way forward,
and left-leaning Remainer voters will recognise that.
But very few of those will be stupid enough to vote
for a Trot and Marxist and will vote LD instead.
Post by Stephen Cole
If I’m honest,
Which means that you usually arent. Thanks for that foot shot.
Post by Stephen Cole
I’d not be surprised to see the Lib Dems secure
less than 10% of the national vote. We’ll see.
Yep, you face down in the mud, as always.
Post by Stephen Cole
I don’t gamble often, it’s a mug’s game, but I have put
a few quid on my predictions above. I’ve also punted £5
Talk about the last of the big spenders...
Post by Stephen Cole
on Labour winning an overall majority, which
I don’t expect to happen but the sentimental
twat in me forces me to put my money where
my mouth is and get right behind Labour.
I hope Corbyn has his poofter stopper installed.
Post by Stephen Cole
I’ll let you know how much I’ve won on December 13th!
You should at least have the decency to disembowel yourself.
Post by Stephen Cole
[1] I believe that, whilst there will be no formal coalition,
the SNP and Labour will form a gentleman’s agreement
to work together to form a Labour minority government,
They wont have enough seats to do that.
Post by Stephen Cole
in exchange for a 2nd EU referendum (which is already Labour
policy) and a future Scottish Indepence referendum (which is
not Labour policy but they *should* officially adopt a neutral
stance on the matter, in my opinion).
Peeler
2019-11-02 09:22:37 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 2 Nov 2019 19:08:51 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH 336 !!! lines of the senile Australian asshole's latest trollshit>
--
Website (from 2007) dedicated to the 85-year-old trolling senile
cretin from Oz:
https://www.pcreview.co.uk/threads/rod-speed-faq.2973853/
Norman Wells
2019-11-02 09:00:52 UTC
Permalink
On 02/11/2019 06:17, Stephen Cole wrote:

<4th form essay snipped>
Post by Stephen Cole
That said, I feel quite confident as to the outcomes we’ll see in the
Labour will win the most seats and be the largest party in Parliament
Put your money where your mouth is then. Paddypower will gove you odds
of 5/1.
Post by Stephen Cole
An overall majority for Labour feels unlikely, though
No-brainer. Labour majority 14/1 against.
Post by Stephen Cole
Labour will form a minority government, likely with SNP support [1]
5/1 against.
Post by Stephen Cole
Jeremy Corbyn will be the next Prime Minister
Unlikely. He's at 7/2.
Post by Stephen Cole
I don’t gamble often, it’s a mug’s game, but I have put a few quid on my
predictions above.
So, you're not as confident as you make out. Surely, at those odds, and
with your proclaimed record, you could make your fortune. But you'd
have to bet the farm.
Post by Stephen Cole
I’ve also punted £5 on Labour winning an overall
majority, which I don’t expect to happen
At 14/1 against, not many do.
Post by Stephen Cole
but the sentimental twat in me
forces me to put my money where my mouth is and get right behind Labour.
Gambling is a business transaction. Sentiment doesn't come into it.
Post by Stephen Cole
I’ll let you know how much I’ve won on December 13th!
Will you also report your losses?
Keema's Nan
2019-11-02 09:48:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Norman Wells
<4th form essay snipped>
Post by Stephen Cole
That said, I feel quite confident as to the outcomes we’ll see in the
Labour will win the most seats and be the largest party in Parliament
Put your money where your mouth is then. Paddypower will gove you odds
of 5/1.
Post by Stephen Cole
An overall majority for Labour feels unlikely, though
No-brainer. Labour majority 14/1 against.
Post by Stephen Cole
Labour will form a minority government, likely with SNP support [1]
5/1 against.
Post by Stephen Cole
Jeremy Corbyn will be the next Prime Minister
Unlikely. He's at 7/2.
Post by Stephen Cole
I don’t gamble often, it’s a mug’s game, but I have put a few quid on my
predictions above.
So, you're not as confident as you make out. Surely, at those odds, and
with your proclaimed record, you could make your fortune. But you'd
have to bet the farm.
Post by Stephen Cole
I’ve also punted £5 on Labour winning an overall
majority, which I don’t expect to happen
At 14/1 against, not many do.
Post by Stephen Cole
but the sentimental twat in me
forces me to put my money where my mouth is and get right behind Labour.
Gambling is a business transaction. Sentiment doesn't come into it.
Post by Stephen Cole
I’ll let you know how much I’ve won on December 13th!
Will you also report your losses?
I doubt it, because with the money he will lose the internet company will cut
his service due to lack of payment.
Basil Jet
2019-11-02 10:17:41 UTC
Permalink
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll need
someone to cook all the dogs.
--
Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to
Radiohead - 1997 - No Surprises
Farmer Giles
2019-11-02 11:23:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll need
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
Keema's Nan
2019-11-02 13:24:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll need
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?

Have you never had a meat balti?
Farmer Giles
2019-11-02 13:27:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll need
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
I wouldn't want to, but I'd be happy for others to do it. I can't see
what most of them are supposed to be for, other than barking and making
a mess on the pavement.
Post by Keema's Nan
Have you never had a meat balti?
No.
Ophelia
2019-11-02 18:52:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll need
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?

Have you never had a meat balti?

===

You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
Incubus
2019-11-02 22:58:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll need
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
  You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
Ophelia
2019-11-03 08:30:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll need
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?

====

I would never make one from a dog! I love my dog very much and could
never use her for meat.

I am not a vegetarian but I could be. I live in a tiny village in the
middle of the countryside and I must confess I have problems when I see the
sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh dear. I hope this hasn't started
something here.
Keema's Nan
2019-11-03 08:53:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll need
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
I would never make one from a dog! I love my dog very much and could
never use her for meat.
I am not a vegetarian but I could be. I live in a tiny village in the
middle of the countryside and I must confess I have problems when I see the
sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh dear. I hope this hasn't started
something here.
I’m not advocating eating your pets.

Just pointing out that some folk may have inadvertently eaten dog meat
without knowing, at some curry joints; and yet they treat the very thought of
others doing so with snobby high-minded dismissal which they reserve for all
third world culinary experiences.

Deep fried cockroaches anyone?
Ophelia
2019-11-03 09:04:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll need
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
I would never make one from a dog! I love my dog very much and could
never use her for meat.
I am not a vegetarian but I could be. I live in a tiny village in the
middle of the countryside and I must confess I have problems when I see the
sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh dear. I hope this hasn't started
something here.
I’m not advocating eating your pets.

Just pointing out that some folk may have inadvertently eaten dog meat
without knowing, at some curry joints; and yet they treat the very thought
of
others doing so with snobby high-minded dismissal which they reserve for all
third world culinary experiences.

Very probably. I would never eat from those places. Actually we
haven't eaten out for a very long time. I prefer to cook everything
myself.:) I am not a big eater, but I love to cook and fortunately for me,
D. and the family love what I cook:)))

Deep fried cockroaches anyone?

Ewwwwwwww
Farmer Giles
2019-11-03 09:15:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll
need
Post by Basil Jet
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
   You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
   I would never make one from a dog!  I love my dog very much and could
never use her for meat.
  I am not a vegetarian but I could be.  I live in a tiny village in
the middle of the countryside and I must confess I have problems when I
see the sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh dear.  I hope this
hasn't started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am also
not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition of the
impracticality of vegetarianism.

Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also true
that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient way of
doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will thrive on
land where little else could be grown.

Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if we
are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to anything else. I
don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather than logic.
Ophelia
2019-11-03 10:55:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll
need
Post by Basil Jet
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
I would never make one from a dog! I love my dog very much and could
never use her for meat.
I am not a vegetarian but I could be. I live in a tiny village in the
middle of the countryside and I must confess I have problems when I see
the sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh dear. I hope this hasn't
started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am also
not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition of the
impracticality of vegetarianism.

Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also true
that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient way of
doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will thrive on
land where little else could be grown.

Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if we
are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to anything else. I
don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather than logic.

===

Yes, I agree with all you say, but it is good to see you saying it. I
suppose if I learned to love a sheep or a cow I would feel the same way as I
do about my dog. Taking it further I guess we are all made out of 'meat'
too, but the line has to be drawn somewhere!
Keema's Nan
2019-11-03 11:26:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll
need
Post by Basil Jet
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
I would never make one from a dog! I love my dog very much and could
never use her for meat.
I am not a vegetarian but I could be. I live in a tiny village in the
middle of the countryside and I must confess I have problems when I see
the sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh dear. I hope this hasn't
started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am also
not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition of the
impracticality of vegetarianism.
Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also true
that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient way of
doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will thrive on
land where little else could be grown.
Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if we
are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to anything else. I
don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather than logic.
===
Yes, I agree with all you say, but it is good to see you saying it. I
suppose if I learned to love a sheep or a cow I would feel the same way as I
do about my dog. Taking it further I guess we are all made out of 'meat'
too, but the line has to be drawn somewhere!
Yes, I have often wondered how I would react if I kept a pig in the orchard
(if I had one) and fattened it up over a year or two in order to have it
killed and butchered for me to eat at a later date.

This is my main problem with current cheap food, that there is an almost
total disconnect between the lives of the animals and the emotions of the
people who eat them at meal times.

I try to mitigate this by purchasing meat which has been raised to organic
free-range standards. I appreciate that not everyone can afford to do this -
at least at the current rate of meat consumption; but that a higher welfare
standard (with higher meat prices) might help folk to eat more vegetables and
less meat.

The biggest problem, as I see it, is that not only do the majority of meat
eaters not see the animals alive prior to the killing process, but they have
no idea of the shocking, cruel and inhumane conditions many billions of food
animals (especially poultry) are kept in for the few miserable months of
their lives before slaughter.

If people were to see the reality of the mass produced meat industry around
the world, there would be a rush of billions into vegetarianism and veganism.
kat
2019-11-03 12:29:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll
need
Post by Basil Jet
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
I would never make one from a dog! I love my dog very much and could
never use her for meat.
I am not a vegetarian but I could be. I live in a tiny village in the
middle of the countryside and I must confess I have problems when I see
the sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh dear. I hope this hasn't
started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am also
not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition of the
impracticality of vegetarianism.
Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also true
that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient way of
doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will thrive on
land where little else could be grown.
Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if we
are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to anything else. I
don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather than logic.
===
Yes, I agree with all you say, but it is good to see you saying it. I
suppose if I learned to love a sheep or a cow I would feel the same way as I
do about my dog. Taking it further I guess we are all made out of 'meat'
too, but the line has to be drawn somewhere!
Yes, I have often wondered how I would react if I kept a pig in the orchard
(if I had one) and fattened it up over a year or two in order to have it
killed and butchered for me to eat at a later date.
I have a friend who has done just that, this year she has sheep ( and wool too).
Post by Keema's Nan
This is my main problem with current cheap food, that there is an almost
total disconnect between the lives of the animals and the emotions of the
people who eat them at meal times.
I try to mitigate this by purchasing meat which has been raised to organic
free-range standards. I appreciate that not everyone can afford to do this -
at least at the current rate of meat consumption; but that a higher welfare
standard (with higher meat prices) might help folk to eat more vegetables and
less meat.
I do much the same, and yes, it costs more so, less of it.
Post by Keema's Nan
The biggest problem, as I see it, is that not only do the majority of meat
eaters not see the animals alive prior to the killing process, but they have
no idea of the shocking, cruel and inhumane conditions many billions of food
animals (especially poultry) are kept in for the few miserable months of
their lives before slaughter.
Free range tastes better, ok maybe only my personal opinion, but one year mr kat
didn't understand my paying a shedload more for a free range turkey - until he
ate it. I guess it had a better diet.
Post by Keema's Nan
If people were to see the reality of the mass produced meat industry around
the world, there would be a rush of billions into vegetarianism and veganism.
And there is so much good food that is meat free.
--
kat
Post by Keema's Nan
^..^<
Keema's Nan
2019-11-03 14:37:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by kat
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll
need
Post by Basil Jet
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
I would never make one from a dog! I love my dog very much and could
never use her for meat.
I am not a vegetarian but I could be. I live in a tiny village in the
middle of the countryside and I must confess I have problems when I see
the sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh dear. I hope this hasn't
started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am also
not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition of the
impracticality of vegetarianism.
Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also true
that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient way of
doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will thrive on
land where little else could be grown.
Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if we
are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to anything else. I
don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather than logic.
===
Yes, I agree with all you say, but it is good to see you saying it. I
suppose if I learned to love a sheep or a cow I would feel the same way as I
do about my dog. Taking it further I guess we are all made out of 'meat'
too, but the line has to be drawn somewhere!
Yes, I have often wondered how I would react if I kept a pig in the orchard
(if I had one) and fattened it up over a year or two in order to have it
killed and butchered for me to eat at a later date.
I have a friend who has done just that, this year she has sheep ( and wool too).
Post by Keema's Nan
This is my main problem with current cheap food, that there is an almost
total disconnect between the lives of the animals and the emotions of the
people who eat them at meal times.
I try to mitigate this by purchasing meat which has been raised to organic
free-range standards. I appreciate that not everyone can afford to do this -
at least at the current rate of meat consumption; but that a higher welfare
standard (with higher meat prices) might help folk to eat more vegetables and
less meat.
I do much the same, and yes, it costs more so, less of it.
Post by Keema's Nan
The biggest problem, as I see it, is that not only do the majority of meat
eaters not see the animals alive prior to the killing process, but they have
no idea of the shocking, cruel and inhumane conditions many billions of food
animals (especially poultry) are kept in for the few miserable months of
their lives before slaughter.
Free range tastes better, ok maybe only my personal opinion, but one year mr kat
didn't understand my paying a shedload more for a free range turkey - until he
ate it. I guess it had a better diet.
My wife is exactly the same with the price of organic turkeys but, as you
say, the taste is great and I can get five or six meals for two out of one
decent sized turkey, and a few bowls of soup - so very cost effective in some
ways.

It helps though that I love turkey.
Post by kat
Post by Keema's Nan
If people were to see the reality of the mass produced meat industry around
the world, there would be a rush of billions into vegetarianism and veganism.
And there is so much good food that is meat free.
I only use quorn mince now instead of beef mince, because I find the results
in a spag-bol or cottage pie are superior to meat.
Ophelia
2019-11-03 14:17:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll
need
Post by Basil Jet
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
I would never make one from a dog! I love my dog very much and could
never use her for meat.
I am not a vegetarian but I could be. I live in a tiny village in the
middle of the countryside and I must confess I have problems when I see
the sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh dear. I hope this hasn't
started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am also
not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition of the
impracticality of vegetarianism.
Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also true
that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient way of
doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will thrive on
land where little else could be grown.
Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if we
are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to anything else. I
don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather than logic.
===
Yes, I agree with all you say, but it is good to see you saying it. I
suppose if I learned to love a sheep or a cow I would feel the same way as I
do about my dog. Taking it further I guess we are all made out of 'meat'
too, but the line has to be drawn somewhere!
Yes, I have often wondered how I would react if I kept a pig in the orchard
(if I had one) and fattened it up over a year or two in order to have it
killed and butchered for me to eat at a later date.

Yes, I couldn't do that!!!

This is my main problem with current cheap food, that there is an almost
total disconnect between the lives of the animals and the emotions of the
people who eat them at meal times.

I 'have' to disconnect between the animals I see nearby in the
fields and the slabs of meat for sale, or D. would never get any. It isn't
easy but I can't expect him to stop eating meat altogether.

I try to mitigate this by purchasing meat which has been raised to organic
free-range standards. I appreciate that not everyone can afford to do this -
at least at the current rate of meat consumption; but that a higher welfare
standard (with higher meat prices) might help folk to eat more vegetables
and
less meat.

Agreed! I always serve a lot of fresh veg. Good job we like it,
eh? :)

The biggest problem, as I see it, is that not only do the majority of meat
eaters not see the animals alive prior to the killing process, but they have
no idea of the shocking, cruel and inhumane conditions many billions of food
animals (especially poultry) are kept in for the few miserable months of
their lives before slaughter.

Yes:(

If people were to see the reality of the mass produced meat industry around
the world, there would be a rush of billions into vegetarianism and
veganism.

We would have to hope so, but I think some people couldn't care
less so long as they get what they want.
Wor Kevin Keegan
2019-11-03 17:10:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Basil Jet
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in
Korean
Post by Basil Jet
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury,
we'll
need
Post by Basil Jet
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
   You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
   I would never make one from a dog!  I love my dog very much and could
never use her for meat.
  I am not a vegetarian but I could be.  I live in a tiny village
in the middle of the countryside and I must confess I have problems
when I see the sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh dear.  I
hope this hasn't started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am also
not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition of the
impracticality of vegetarianism.
Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also true
that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient way of
doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will thrive on
land where little else could be grown.
Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if we
are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to anything
else. I don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather than logic.
You don't kill cows to milk them. And you're supposed to be a farmer...
--
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Farmer Giles
2019-11-03 17:27:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll
need
Post by Basil Jet
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
   You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
    I would never make one from a dog!  I love my dog very much and
could
never use her for meat.
   I am not a vegetarian but I could be.  I live in a tiny village in
the middle of the countryside and I must confess I have problems when
I see the sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh dear.  I hope
this hasn't started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am also
not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition of the
impracticality of vegetarianism.
Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also true
that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient way of
doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will thrive on
land where little else could be grown.
Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if we
are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to anything else.
I don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather than logic.
You don't kill cows to milk them. And you're supposed to be a farmer...
Well, you're certainly not that is clear.

In order to produce milk a cow must have had a calf - and approximately
half of those calves will be male. The odd one or two will be required
for breeding, but what do you propose we should do with the rest?
Keema's Nan
2019-11-03 17:45:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll
need
Post by Basil Jet
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
I would never make one from a dog! I love my dog very much and
could
never use her for meat.
I am not a vegetarian but I could be. I live in a tiny village in
the middle of the countryside and I must confess I have problems when
I see the sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh dear. I hope
this hasn't started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am also
not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition of the
impracticality of vegetarianism.
Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also true
that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient way of
doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will thrive on
land where little else could be grown.
Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if we
are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to anything else.
I don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather than logic.
You don't kill cows to milk them. And you're supposed to be a farmer...
Well, you're certainly not that is clear.
In order to produce milk a cow must have had a calf - and approximately
half of those calves will be male. The odd one or two will be required
for breeding, but what do you propose we should do with the rest?
That depends on how obsessed the farmer is with cashflow and maximising
profits.

It is cheap to send a baby male calf for cat meat, but about three times as
expensive to feed it for a month or so in order to be able to sell it to veal
or beef farmers.
Farmer Giles
2019-11-03 17:53:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in Korean
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury, we'll
need
Post by Basil Jet
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
I would never make one from a dog! I love my dog very much and
could
never use her for meat.
I am not a vegetarian but I could be. I live in a tiny village in
the middle of the countryside and I must confess I have problems when
I see the sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh dear. I hope
this hasn't started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am also
not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition of the
impracticality of vegetarianism.
Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also true
that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient way of
doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will thrive on
land where little else could be grown.
Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if we
are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to anything else.
I don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather than logic.
You don't kill cows to milk them. And you're supposed to be a farmer...
Well, you're certainly not that is clear.
In order to produce milk a cow must have had a calf - and approximately
half of those calves will be male. The odd one or two will be required
for breeding, but what do you propose we should do with the rest?
That depends on how obsessed the farmer is with cashflow and maximising
profits.
It is cheap to send a baby male calf for cat meat, but about three times as
expensive to feed it for a month or so in order to be able to sell it to veal
or beef farmers.
I was expanding on my point (which was challenged) about not being able
to have dairy products if we don't kill animals.
Wor Kevin Keegan
2019-11-04 12:45:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Basil Jet
Korean
we'll
need
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
   You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
    I would never make one from a dog!  I love my dog very much
and could
never use her for meat.
   I am not a vegetarian but I could be.  I live in a tiny
village in the middle of the countryside and I must confess I
have problems when I see the sheep and cows. I eat very little
meat. Oh dear.  I hope this hasn't started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am
also not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition
of the impracticality of vegetarianism.
Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also
true that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient
way of doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will
thrive on land where little else could be grown.
Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if
we are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to
anything else. I don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather
than logic.
You don't kill cows to milk them. And you're supposed to be a
farmer...
Well, you're certainly not that is clear.
In order to produce milk a cow must have had a calf - and
approximately half of those calves will be male. The odd one or two
will be required for breeding, but what do you propose we should do
with the rest?
So what's wrong with artificial insemination?
--
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Ian Jackson
2019-11-04 13:12:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Basil Jet
Korean
we'll
need
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
   You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
    I would never make one from a dog!  I love my dog very
much and could
never use her for meat.
   I am not a vegetarian but I could be.  I live in a tiny
village in the middle of the countryside and I must confess I have
problems when I see the sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh
dear.  I hope this hasn't started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am
also not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition
of the impracticality of vegetarianism.
Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also
true that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient
way of doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will
thrive on land where little else could be grown.
Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if
we are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to anything
else. I don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather than logic.
You don't kill cows to milk them. And you're supposed to be a farmer...
Well, you're certainly not that is clear.
In order to produce milk a cow must have had a calf - and
approximately half of those calves will be male. The odd one or two
will be required for breeding, but what do you propose we should do
with the rest?
So what's wrong with artificial insemination?
The latest poll of cows clearly indicated that the vast majority
definitely preferred the 'real thing'.
--
Ian
Incubus
2019-11-04 13:21:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Basil Jet
Korean
we'll
need
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
   You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
    I would never make one from a dog!  I love my dog very
much and could
never use her for meat.
   I am not a vegetarian but I could be.  I live in a tiny
village in the middle of the countryside and I must confess I have
problems when I see the sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh
dear.  I hope this hasn't started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am
also not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition
of the impracticality of vegetarianism.
Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also
true that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient
way of doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will
thrive on land where little else could be grown.
Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if
we are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to anything
else. I don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather than logic.
You don't kill cows to milk them. And you're supposed to be a farmer...
Well, you're certainly not that is clear.
In order to produce milk a cow must have had a calf - and
approximately half of those calves will be male. The odd one or two
will be required for breeding, but what do you propose we should do
with the rest?
So what's wrong with artificial insemination?
The latest poll of cows clearly indicated that the vast majority
definitely preferred the 'real thing'.
You've been listening to LBC (Load of Bloody Crap) for too long.
Farmer Giles
2019-11-04 13:53:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Basil Jet
Korean
we'll
need
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
   You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
    I would never make one from a dog!  I love my dog very much and
could
never use her for meat.
   I am not a vegetarian but I could be.  I live in a tiny village
in the middle of the countryside and I must confess I have problems
when I see the sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh dear.  I
hope this hasn't started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am
also not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition
of the impracticality of vegetarianism.
Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also true
that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient way of
doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will thrive
on land where little else could be grown.
Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if
we are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to anything
else. I don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather than logic.
You don't kill cows to milk them. And you're supposed to be a farmer...
Well, you're certainly not that is clear.
In order to produce milk a cow must have had a calf - and
approximately half of those calves will be male. The odd one or two
will be required for breeding, but what do you propose we should do
with the rest?
So what's wrong with artificial insemination?
What's that got to do with it?
Ian Jackson
2019-11-04 16:09:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Basil Jet
Korean
we'll
need
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not
that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
   You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
    I would never make one from a dog!  I love my dog very
much and could
never use her for meat.
   I am not a vegetarian but I could be.  I live in a tiny
village in the middle of the countryside and I must confess I have
problems when I see the sheep and cows. I eat very little meat.
Oh dear.  I hope this hasn't started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am
also not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition
of the impracticality of vegetarianism.
Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also
true that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient
way of doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will
thrive on land where little else could be grown.
Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if
we are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to anything
else. I don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather than logic.
You don't kill cows to milk them. And you're supposed to be a farmer...
Well, you're certainly not that is clear.
In order to produce milk a cow must have had a calf - and
approximately half of those calves will be male. The odd one or two
will be required for breeding, but what do you propose we should do
with the rest?
So what's wrong with artificial insemination?
What's that got to do with it?
First you've got to summon up the courage to masturbate a bull. Like the
cows, bulls usually prefer the 'real thing' (well, at least the lucky
one does - the one who is the successful candidate when applying for the
server's job).
--
Ian
Keema's Nan
2019-11-04 17:16:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Basil Jet
Korean
we'll
need
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not
that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
I would never make one from a dog! I love my dog very
much and could
never use her for meat.
I am not a vegetarian but I could be. I live in a tiny
village in the middle of the countryside and I must confess I have
problems when I see the sheep and cows. I eat very little meat.
Oh dear. I hope this hasn't started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am
also not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition
of the impracticality of vegetarianism.
Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also
true that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient
way of doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will
thrive on land where little else could be grown.
Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if
we are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to anything
else. I don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather than logic.
You don't kill cows to milk them. And you're supposed to be a farmer...
Well, you're certainly not that is clear.
In order to produce milk a cow must have had a calf - and
approximately half of those calves will be male. The odd one or two
will be required for breeding, but what do you propose we should do
with the rest?
So what's wrong with artificial insemination?
What's that got to do with it?
First you've got to summon up the courage to masturbate a bull. Like the
cows, bulls usually prefer the 'real thing' (well, at least the lucky
one does - the one who is the successful candidate when applying for the
server's job).
I don’t think masturbating a bull and artificially inseminating a cow, is
going to guarantee any more female offspring as letting them do it naturally.

It is the perceived non (financially) productive male dairy calves that are
the problem for farmers whose bottom line is profit, while bullshitting the
public that they “really do care about the environment and animal
welfare”
Wor Kevin Keegan
2019-11-04 19:43:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Incubus
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
    I would never make one from a dog!  I love my dog very much
and could
never use her for meat.
   I am not a vegetarian but I could be.  I live in a tiny
village in the middle of the countryside and I must confess I
have problems when I see the sheep and cows. I eat very little
meat. Oh dear.  I hope this hasn't started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am
also not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a
recognition of the impracticality of vegetarianism.
Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter
- things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least.
Veganism recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative.
It's also true that rearing reaing animals for food is not a
very efficient way of doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep,
for example will thrive on land where little else could be
grown.
Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point,
if we are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to
anything else. I don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather
than logic.
You don't kill cows to milk them. And you're supposed to be a farmer...
Well, you're certainly not that is clear.
In order to produce milk a cow must have had a calf - and
approximately half of those calves will be male. The odd one or
two will be required for breeding, but what do you propose we
should do with the rest?
So what's wrong with artificial insemination?
What's that got to do with it?
Get orf moi laaaand!
--
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
abelard
2019-11-05 12:06:23 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 04 Nov 2019 12:45:29 GMT, Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
So what's wrong with artificial insemination?
you get artificial people
--
www.abelard.org
Keema's Nan
2019-11-03 17:33:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Basil Jet
Post by Basil Jet
I'm not betting on Labour winning, but I am buying shares in
Korean
Post by Basil Jet
restaurants, because when McDonnell is running the treasury,
we'll
need
Post by Basil Jet
someone to cook all the dogs.
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
I would never make one from a dog! I love my dog very much and
could
never use her for meat.
I am not a vegetarian but I could be. I live in a tiny village
in the middle of the countryside and I must confess I have problems
when I see the sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh dear. I
hope this hasn't started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am also
not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition of the
impracticality of vegetarianism.
Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also true
that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient way of
doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will thrive on
land where little else could be grown.
Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if we
are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to anything
else. I don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather than logic.
You don't kill cows to milk them. And you're supposed to be a farmer...
Oh dear. Another self appointed pedant has arrived.
Wor Kevin Keegan
2019-11-03 19:54:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Wor Kevin Keegan
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Incubus
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Farmer Giles
we'll
need
That possibility would almost tempt me to vote Labour - not that I want
to eat any dogs!
What’s wrong with eating dogs?
Have you never had a meat balti?
===
You sure as hell won't eat mine!!!
What's wrong with your meat balti?
====
I would never make one from a dog! I love my dog very much and
could
never use her for meat.
I am not a vegetarian but I could be. I live in a tiny village
in the middle of the countryside and I must confess I have
problems when I see the sheep and cows. I eat very little meat. Oh
dear. I hope this hasn't started something here.
I share your misgivings about killing animals for food, and I am
also not a vegetarian. Hypocrisy? Possibly, but also a recognition
of the impracticality of vegetarianism.
Without killing animals there could be no milk, cheese or butter -
things I like - well, not on any sizeable scale at least. Veganism
recognises that fact and is a defensible alternative. It's also
true that rearing reaing animals for food is not a very efficient
way of doing so - except on marginal land. Sheep, for example will
thrive on land where little else could be grown.
Having said all of that, and getting back to the salient point, if
we are going to eat meat then dogs are little different to anything
else. I don't fancy it, but that is conditioning rather than logic.
You don't kill cows to milk them. And you're supposed to be a
farmer...
Oh dear. Another self appointed pedant has arrived.
Pot, kettle springs to mind.
--
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Fredxx
2019-11-03 11:42:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stephen Cole
Over the last few years, I’ve actually been quite good at sensing which way
the wind is blowing in terms of politics in the UK.
Care to cite any posts of your claimed predictions prior to the actual
events?

Its very easy to claim you sense which way the wind blows after the event.
Stephen Cole
2019-11-03 13:19:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fredxx
Post by Stephen Cole
Over the last few years, I’ve actually been quite good at sensing which way
the wind is blowing in terms of politics in the UK.
Care to cite any posts of your claimed predictions prior to the actual
events?
Its very easy to claim you sense which way the wind blows after the event.
It’s all in the archives. DYOR. HTH.
--
M0TEY // STC
www.twitter.com/ukradioamateur
Fredxx
2019-11-03 14:17:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stephen Cole
Post by Fredxx
Post by Stephen Cole
Over the last few years, I’ve actually been quite good at sensing which way
the wind is blowing in terms of politics in the UK.
Care to cite any posts of your claimed predictions prior to the actual
events?
Its very easy to claim you sense which way the wind blows after the event.
It’s all in the archives. DYOR. HTH.
As are many billions of posts. Best to cite or keep quiet. The former is
preferable.

You made the claim, back it or no one will believe you.
Roger Hayter
2019-11-03 15:06:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fredxx
On 02/11/2019 06:17:45, Stephen Cole wrote: > Over the last few years,
I've actually been quite good at sensing which way > the wind is blowing
in terms of politics in the UK.
Care to cite any posts of your claimed predictions prior to the actual
events?
Its very easy to claim you sense which way the wind blows after the event.
It's all in the archives. DYOR. HTH.
As are many billions of posts. Best to cite or keep quiet. The former is
preferable.
You made the claim, back it or no one will believe you.
I believe him; but then I remember the posts. Anyway, if you are
talking about posts from Cole, there are surely only tens of millions,
not many billions.
--
Roger Hayter
Rod Speed
2019-11-03 17:46:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fredxx
Post by Stephen Cole
Over the last few years, I’ve actually been quite good at sensing which
way the wind is blowing in terms of politics in the UK.
Care to cite any posts of your claimed predictions prior to the actual
events?
From memory he did predict that Corbyn would piss it in
as the Labour leader in the Labour election of their leader.
Post by Fredxx
Its very easy to claim you sense which way the wind blows after the event.
Peeler
2019-11-03 18:26:02 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 4 Nov 2019 04:46:07 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Fredxx
Care to cite any posts of your claimed predictions prior to the actual
events?
From memory he did predict that Corbyn would piss it in
as the Labour leader in the Labour election of their leader.
From some people's memories and online sources, you were already a trolling
senile pest back in 2007, senile Rodent!
--
Website (from 2007) dedicated to the 85-year-old trolling senile
cretin from Oz:
https://www.pcreview.co.uk/threads/rod-speed-faq.2973853/
Incubus
2019-11-04 14:29:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stephen Cole
Over the last few years, I’ve actually been quite good at sensing which way
the wind is blowing in terms of politics in the UK. I correctly predicted
early in Corbyn’s 2015 leadership campaign that he was on for a landslide;
that Leave was likely to win the 2016 EU referendum; and that Labour would
out-perform expectations in the 2017 General Election and scupper Theresa
May’s plans. I also predicted way back in early-2017, when Article 50 was
voted through by the British Parliament, that Brexit wasn’t going to happen
two years later, and almost certainly wouldn’t happen at all. I was proved
right on the first part of that prediction when May extended Article 50 to
Halloween, and then again when Boris Johnson extended it to January 31st
2020. I still expect to be proved right on the second clause of that
prediction; Brexit ain’t gonna happen. Feel free to quote me on that!
Truth is, it’s not difficult to do. It just requires a modicum of objective
thought and some fairly casual observation of the way conversation about
these matters ebbs and flows, online and offline. I mean, I really wanted
Ed Miliband to win the 2015 General Election but, deep down, I knew it was
a tough ask as he was such a soft target for his enemies. Absolutely
terrified of his own shadow, Miliband was terrorised by the media and
forced in to making endless needless mistakes, throughout his leadership
but particularly so during the 2015 campaign. He became a national joke
because of it. Labour lost that one, badly, but that horrifying loss opened
the door for the Left’s resurrection in Jeremy Corbyn.
Barely being aware of Corbyn before that leadership campaign, it didn’t
take many of his speeches to turn me into a Corbynite. He proposed simple,
just concepts such as equality, pacifism, compassion, and restructuring the
economic system so it works for the people rather than The Man. What’s
wrong with all that? The backdrop in the country at the time was one of
ruination at the hands of the financial crisis and the Tory/Lib Dem
Coalition government. David Cameron had just secured a majority for the
Tories to ramp up their attack on, well, everybody who isn’t a millionaire.
The time was right for a straightforward man of integrity to drive a bus
through the bullshit and deliver justice to the masses. It was obvious that
Corbyn would demolish the tepid centrism of the other leadership hopefuls.
The Centrists in the Labour PLP went absolutely mental after Corbyn won the
leadership in a crushing landslide and spent much of the next couple of
years going after him but all for nought; Corbyn owns Labour now.
We’re now going into *another* snap General Election, Brexit remains
unresolved, the economy is in absolute bits, and the electorate is rattier
and more fed-up of all the horsehit than they have been for a long time.
Polls have been up and down all year. The culture wars rage on social
media. This is going to be a weird one, no mistake.
That said, I feel quite confident as to the outcomes we’ll see in the
Labour will win the most seats and be the largest party in Parliament
An overall majority for Labour feels unlikely, though
Labour will form a minority government, likely with SNP support [1]
Jeremy Corbyn will be the next Prime Minister
I’ve felt this way since the 2017 General Election results came in and
Theresa May managed to hobble on by bribing the DUP; that at the next
election, whenever that might be, Labour had it in the bag. That sureness
was reinforced when May capitulated on her main red lines and signed up to
the softest of Soft Brexits in December 2017. The Tories were now dead in
the water, they just didn’t know it yet.
Reality bit them on the arse throughout 2018 and into 2019 as the terms of
that agreement, essentially locking the UK into the EU’s regulatory orbit
forever, dictated the very limited set of Brexit options open to them. May
desperately spent months splitting hairs about it, always refusing to admit
that she had signed away the supposed freedom that the anti-EU set had long
sought. But it eventually destroyed her, failing in Parliament over and
over again by massive majorities against her deal. It was top LOLs. Labour
made it their official-but-unspoken policy to simply sit on the fence,
refuse to commit to Leave or Remain, and allow the Tories to self-immolate.
Corbyn took a lot of stick for these tactics but he played a winning hand
and it’s going to carry him into Downing Street.
Labour will face a Tory Party now relatively united over Brexit and a Tory
leader committed to a Hard-ish Brexit to satisfy the maniacs in his Party
who demand it in exchange for keeping him in power. But Johnson’s Brexit
deal isn’t anywhere near hard enough for some, not least of all Nigel
Farage who today insisted that, unless Boris dumps his deal and embraces
crashing out of the EU with nothing, Farage’s Brexit party will contest
every seat in the country. This will be carnage for the Conservatives but
it’s difficult to see how Boris could possibly agree to enter a pact by
dumping his sole achievement in Number 10; his Brexit deal.
Farage wants to leave the EU, that’s beyond doubt, but he also wants to
*really* leave the EU, with no connections at all left, and Johnson’s deal
doesn’t really do that despite it being harder than May’s. Farage has been
playing the long game with regards the EU, making a rich living out of it
for more than 20 years now, so he won’t be too dispirited at the idea of
waiting a year or two longer to have another shot at getting the
catastrophic outcome he needs. And in the meantime, he can make hay (and
lots of money!) while the sun shines by causing trouble in the EU and
British Parliaments with his band of Brexit-loving acolytes.
The Brexit Party are a problem for Labour to consider, too, but on a much
smaller scale. Much is made of “Labour Heartlands” voting Leave but the
facts are that most people inclined to vote Labour in 2019 (as in 2017)
voted Remain in the referendum, so Farage will have much thinner pickings
from potential Labour voters as he will from potential Tory voters. The Lib
Dems are arguably a genuine threat to Labour but, again, voters inclined to
switch to the Lib Dems already did so two years ago. There’s not many votes
to lose, despite what the media pundits say about the Lib Dems being the
home of Remain; Labour are offering to negotiate their own version of a
deal and put that to a referendum vs Remain. It’s objectively clear that
this is the only intellectually honest way forward, and left-leaning
Remainer voters will recognise that. If I’m honest, I’d not be surprised to
see the Lib Dems secure less than 10% of the national vote. We’ll see.
I don’t gamble often, it’s a mug’s game, but I have put a few quid on my
predictions above. I’ve also punted £5 on Labour winning an overall
majority, which I don’t expect to happen but the sentimental twat in me
forces me to put my money where my mouth is and get right behind Labour.
I’ll let you know how much I’ve won on December 13th!
[1] I believe that, whilst there will be no formal coalition, the SNP and
Labour will form a gentleman’s agreement to work together to form a Labour
minority government, in exchange for a 2nd EU referendum (which is already
Labour policy) and a future Scottish Indepence referendum (which is not
Labour policy but they *should* officially adopt a neutral stance on the
matter, in my opinion).
I predict a Conservative majority that will vote for Boris' deal. So confident
am I in my prediction that I propose a wager of sorts: if your prediction comes
to pass, I will leave Usenet for six months and if my prediction comes to pass,
you leave Usenet for six months. In the event that neither prediction comes to
pass, there is no forfeit.

What do you say?
Rod Speed
2019-11-04 18:30:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Incubus
Post by Stephen Cole
Over the last few years, I’ve actually been quite good at sensing which way
the wind is blowing in terms of politics in the UK. I correctly predicted
early in Corbyn’s 2015 leadership campaign that he was on for a landslide;
that Leave was likely to win the 2016 EU referendum; and that Labour would
out-perform expectations in the 2017 General Election and scupper Theresa
May’s plans. I also predicted way back in early-2017, when Article 50 was
voted through by the British Parliament, that Brexit wasn’t going to happen
two years later, and almost certainly wouldn’t happen at all. I was proved
right on the first part of that prediction when May extended Article 50 to
Halloween, and then again when Boris Johnson extended it to January 31st
2020. I still expect to be proved right on the second clause of that
prediction; Brexit ain’t gonna happen. Feel free to quote me on that!
Truth is, it’s not difficult to do. It just requires a modicum of objective
thought and some fairly casual observation of the way conversation about
these matters ebbs and flows, online and offline. I mean, I really wanted
Ed Miliband to win the 2015 General Election but, deep down, I knew it was
a tough ask as he was such a soft target for his enemies. Absolutely
terrified of his own shadow, Miliband was terrorised by the media and
forced in to making endless needless mistakes, throughout his leadership
but particularly so during the 2015 campaign. He became a national joke
because of it. Labour lost that one, badly, but that horrifying loss opened
the door for the Left’s resurrection in Jeremy Corbyn.
Barely being aware of Corbyn before that leadership campaign, it didn’t
take many of his speeches to turn me into a Corbynite. He proposed simple,
just concepts such as equality, pacifism, compassion, and restructuring the
economic system so it works for the people rather than The Man. What’s
wrong with all that? The backdrop in the country at the time was one of
ruination at the hands of the financial crisis and the Tory/Lib Dem
Coalition government. David Cameron had just secured a majority for the
Tories to ramp up their attack on, well, everybody who isn’t a millionaire.
The time was right for a straightforward man of integrity to drive a bus
through the bullshit and deliver justice to the masses. It was obvious that
Corbyn would demolish the tepid centrism of the other leadership hopefuls.
The Centrists in the Labour PLP went absolutely mental after Corbyn won the
leadership in a crushing landslide and spent much of the next couple of
years going after him but all for nought; Corbyn owns Labour now.
We’re now going into *another* snap General Election, Brexit remains
unresolved, the economy is in absolute bits, and the electorate is rattier
and more fed-up of all the horsehit than they have been for a long time.
Polls have been up and down all year. The culture wars rage on social
media. This is going to be a weird one, no mistake.
That said, I feel quite confident as to the outcomes we’ll see in the
Labour will win the most seats and be the largest party in Parliament
An overall majority for Labour feels unlikely, though
Labour will form a minority government, likely with SNP support [1]
Jeremy Corbyn will be the next Prime Minister
I’ve felt this way since the 2017 General Election results came in and
Theresa May managed to hobble on by bribing the DUP; that at the next
election, whenever that might be, Labour had it in the bag. That sureness
was reinforced when May capitulated on her main red lines and signed up to
the softest of Soft Brexits in December 2017. The Tories were now dead in
the water, they just didn’t know it yet.
Reality bit them on the arse throughout 2018 and into 2019 as the terms of
that agreement, essentially locking the UK into the EU’s regulatory orbit
forever, dictated the very limited set of Brexit options open to them. May
desperately spent months splitting hairs about it, always refusing to admit
that she had signed away the supposed freedom that the anti-EU set had long
sought. But it eventually destroyed her, failing in Parliament over and
over again by massive majorities against her deal. It was top LOLs. Labour
made it their official-but-unspoken policy to simply sit on the fence,
refuse to commit to Leave or Remain, and allow the Tories to
self-immolate.
Corbyn took a lot of stick for these tactics but he played a winning hand
and it’s going to carry him into Downing Street.
Labour will face a Tory Party now relatively united over Brexit and a Tory
leader committed to a Hard-ish Brexit to satisfy the maniacs in his Party
who demand it in exchange for keeping him in power. But Johnson’s Brexit
deal isn’t anywhere near hard enough for some, not least of all Nigel
Farage who today insisted that, unless Boris dumps his deal and embraces
crashing out of the EU with nothing, Farage’s Brexit party will contest
every seat in the country. This will be carnage for the Conservatives but
it’s difficult to see how Boris could possibly agree to enter a pact by
dumping his sole achievement in Number 10; his Brexit deal.
Farage wants to leave the EU, that’s beyond doubt, but he also wants to
*really* leave the EU, with no connections at all left, and Johnson’s deal
doesn’t really do that despite it being harder than May’s. Farage has been
playing the long game with regards the EU, making a rich living out of it
for more than 20 years now, so he won’t be too dispirited at the idea of
waiting a year or two longer to have another shot at getting the
catastrophic outcome he needs. And in the meantime, he can make hay (and
lots of money!) while the sun shines by causing trouble in the EU and
British Parliaments with his band of Brexit-loving acolytes.
The Brexit Party are a problem for Labour to consider, too, but on a much
smaller scale. Much is made of “Labour Heartlands” voting Leave but the
facts are that most people inclined to vote Labour in 2019 (as in 2017)
voted Remain in the referendum, so Farage will have much thinner pickings
from potential Labour voters as he will from potential Tory voters. The Lib
Dems are arguably a genuine threat to Labour but, again, voters inclined to
switch to the Lib Dems already did so two years ago. There’s not many votes
to lose, despite what the media pundits say about the Lib Dems being the
home of Remain; Labour are offering to negotiate their own version of a
deal and put that to a referendum vs Remain. It’s objectively clear that
this is the only intellectually honest way forward, and left-leaning
Remainer voters will recognise that. If I’m honest, I’d not be surprised to
see the Lib Dems secure less than 10% of the national vote. We’ll see.
I don’t gamble often, it’s a mug’s game, but I have put a few quid on my
predictions above. I’ve also punted £5 on Labour winning an overall
majority, which I don’t expect to happen but the sentimental twat in me
forces me to put my money where my mouth is and get right behind Labour.
I’ll let you know how much I’ve won on December 13th!
[1] I believe that, whilst there will be no formal coalition, the SNP and
Labour will form a gentleman’s agreement to work together to form a Labour
minority government, in exchange for a 2nd EU referendum (which is already
Labour policy) and a future Scottish Indepence referendum (which is not
Labour policy but they *should* officially adopt a neutral stance on the
matter, in my opinion).
I predict a Conservative majority that will vote for Boris' deal. So confident
am I in my prediction that I propose a wager of sorts: if your prediction comes
to pass, I will leave Usenet for six months and if my prediction comes to pass,
you leave Usenet for six months. In the event that neither prediction comes to
pass, there is no forfeit.
What do you say?
That a Jap would have the decency to disembowel itself when it gets it
wrong.
Peeler
2019-11-04 18:48:21 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 5 Nov 2019 05:30:10 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Post by Rod Speed
That a Jap would have the decency to disembowel itself when it gets it
wrong.
Keep your senile trollshit out of normally evolved humans' ngs, you
nym-shifting, trolling, senile Ozzie shit!
--
Bill Wright to Rot Speed:
"That confirms my opinion that you are a despicable little shit."
MID: <pjqpo3$1la0$***@gioia.aioe.org>
Keema's Nan
2019-11-04 19:03:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Stephen Cole
Over the last few years, I’ve actually been quite good at sensing which way
the wind is blowing in terms of politics in the UK. I correctly predicted
early in Corbyn’s 2015 leadership campaign that he was on for a landslide;
that Leave was likely to win the 2016 EU referendum; and that Labour would
out-perform expectations in the 2017 General Election and scupper Theresa
May’s plans. I also predicted way back in early-2017, when Article 50 was
voted through by the British Parliament, that Brexit wasn’t going to happen
two years later, and almost certainly wouldn’t happen at all. I was proved
right on the first part of that prediction when May extended Article 50 to
Halloween, and then again when Boris Johnson extended it to January 31st
2020. I still expect to be proved right on the second clause of that
prediction; Brexit ain’t gonna happen. Feel free to quote me on that!
Truth is, it’s not difficult to do. It just requires a modicum of objective
thought and some fairly casual observation of the way conversation about
these matters ebbs and flows, online and offline. I mean, I really wanted
Ed Miliband to win the 2015 General Election but, deep down, I knew it was
a tough ask as he was such a soft target for his enemies. Absolutely
terrified of his own shadow, Miliband was terrorised by the media and
forced in to making endless needless mistakes, throughout his leadership
but particularly so during the 2015 campaign. He became a national joke
because of it. Labour lost that one, badly, but that horrifying loss opened
the door for the Left’s resurrection in Jeremy Corbyn.
Barely being aware of Corbyn before that leadership campaign, it didn’t
take many of his speeches to turn me into a Corbynite. He proposed simple,
just concepts such as equality, pacifism, compassion, and restructuring the
economic system so it works for the people rather than The Man. What’s
wrong with all that? The backdrop in the country at the time was one of
ruination at the hands of the financial crisis and the Tory/Lib Dem
Coalition government. David Cameron had just secured a majority for the
Tories to ramp up their attack on, well, everybody who isn’t a millionaire.
The time was right for a straightforward man of integrity to drive a bus
through the bullshit and deliver justice to the masses. It was obvious that
Corbyn would demolish the tepid centrism of the other leadership hopefuls.
The Centrists in the Labour PLP went absolutely mental after Corbyn won the
leadership in a crushing landslide and spent much of the next couple of
years going after him but all for nought; Corbyn owns Labour now.
We’re now going into *another* snap General Election, Brexit remains
unresolved, the economy is in absolute bits, and the electorate is rattier
and more fed-up of all the horsehit than they have been for a long time.
Polls have been up and down all year. The culture wars rage on social
media. This is going to be a weird one, no mistake.
That said, I feel quite confident as to the outcomes we’ll see in the
Labour will win the most seats and be the largest party in Parliament
An overall majority for Labour feels unlikely, though
Labour will form a minority government, likely with SNP support [1]
Jeremy Corbyn will be the next Prime Minister
I’ve felt this way since the 2017 General Election results came in and
Theresa May managed to hobble on by bribing the DUP; that at the next
election, whenever that might be, Labour had it in the bag. That sureness
was reinforced when May capitulated on her main red lines and signed up to
the softest of Soft Brexits in December 2017. The Tories were now dead in
the water, they just didn’t know it yet.
Reality bit them on the arse throughout 2018 and into 2019 as the terms of
that agreement, essentially locking the UK into the EU’s regulatory orbit
forever, dictated the very limited set of Brexit options open to them. May
desperately spent months splitting hairs about it, always refusing to admit
that she had signed away the supposed freedom that the anti-EU set had long
sought. But it eventually destroyed her, failing in Parliament over and
over again by massive majorities against her deal. It was top LOLs. Labour
made it their official-but-unspoken policy to simply sit on the fence,
refuse to commit to Leave or Remain, and allow the Tories to self-immolate.
Corbyn took a lot of stick for these tactics but he played a winning hand
and it’s going to carry him into Downing Street.
Labour will face a Tory Party now relatively united over Brexit and a Tory
leader committed to a Hard-ish Brexit to satisfy the maniacs in his Party
who demand it in exchange for keeping him in power. But Johnson’s Brexit
deal isn’t anywhere near hard enough for some, not least of all Nigel
Farage who today insisted that, unless Boris dumps his deal and embraces
crashing out of the EU with nothing, Farage’s Brexit party will contest
every seat in the country. This will be carnage for the Conservatives but
it’s difficult to see how Boris could possibly agree to enter a pact by
dumping his sole achievement in Number 10; his Brexit deal.
Farage wants to leave the EU, that’s beyond doubt, but he also wants to
*really* leave the EU, with no connections at all left, and Johnson’s deal
doesn’t really do that despite it being harder than May’s. Farage has been
playing the long game with regards the EU, making a rich living out of it
for more than 20 years now, so he won’t be too dispirited at the idea of
waiting a year or two longer to have another shot at getting the
catastrophic outcome he needs. And in the meantime, he can make hay (and
lots of money!) while the sun shines by causing trouble in the EU and
British Parliaments with his band of Brexit-loving acolytes.
The Brexit Party are a problem for Labour to consider, too, but on a much
smaller scale. Much is made of “Labour Heartlands” voting Leave but the
facts are that most people inclined to vote Labour in 2019 (as in 2017)
voted Remain in the referendum, so Farage will have much thinner pickings
from potential Labour voters as he will from potential Tory voters. The Lib
Dems are arguably a genuine threat to Labour but, again, voters inclined to
switch to the Lib Dems already did so two years ago. There’s not many votes
to lose, despite what the media pundits say about the Lib Dems being the
home of Remain; Labour are offering to negotiate their own version of a
deal and put that to a referendum vs Remain. It’s objectively clear that
this is the only intellectually honest way forward, and left-leaning
Remainer voters will recognise that. If I’m honest, I’d not be
surprised
to
see the Lib Dems secure less than 10% of the national vote. We’ll see.
I don’t gamble often, it’s a mug’s game, but I have put a few quid on my
predictions above. I’ve also punted £5 on Labour winning an overall
majority, which I don’t expect to happen but the sentimental twat in me
forces me to put my money where my mouth is and get right behind Labour.
I’ll let you know how much I’ve won on December 13th!
[1] I believe that, whilst there will be no formal coalition, the SNP and
Labour will form a gentleman’s agreement to work together to form a Labour
minority government, in exchange for a 2nd EU referendum (which is already
Labour policy) and a future Scottish Indepence referendum (which is not
Labour policy but they *should* officially adopt a neutral stance on the
matter, in my opinion).
I predict a Conservative majority that will vote for Boris' deal. So
confident
am I in my prediction that I propose a wager of sorts: if your prediction comes
to pass, I will leave Usenet for six months and if my prediction comes to pass,
you leave Usenet for six months. In the event that neither prediction
comes to
pass, there is no forfeit.
What do you say?
That a Jap would have the decency to disembowel itself when it gets it
wrong.
You never really make any statements of policy.

You just pour shit on anyone who does.

How much of a coward does that make you?
Rod Speed
2019-11-04 19:22:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by Rod Speed
Post by Stephen Cole
Over the last few years, I’ve actually been quite good at sensing
which
way
the wind is blowing in terms of politics in the UK. I correctly predicted
early in Corbyn’s 2015 leadership campaign that he was on for a landslide;
that Leave was likely to win the 2016 EU referendum; and that Labour would
out-perform expectations in the 2017 General Election and scupper Theresa
May’s plans. I also predicted way back in early-2017, when Article 50 was
voted through by the British Parliament, that Brexit wasn’t going to happen
two years later, and almost certainly wouldn’t happen at all. I was proved
right on the first part of that prediction when May extended Article
50
to
Halloween, and then again when Boris Johnson extended it to January 31st
2020. I still expect to be proved right on the second clause of that
prediction; Brexit ain’t gonna happen. Feel free to quote me on that!
Truth is, it’s not difficult to do. It just requires a modicum of objective
thought and some fairly casual observation of the way conversation about
these matters ebbs and flows, online and offline. I mean, I really wanted
Ed Miliband to win the 2015 General Election but, deep down, I knew
it
was
a tough ask as he was such a soft target for his enemies. Absolutely
terrified of his own shadow, Miliband was terrorised by the media and
forced in to making endless needless mistakes, throughout his leadership
but particularly so during the 2015 campaign. He became a national joke
because of it. Labour lost that one, badly, but that horrifying loss opened
the door for the Left’s resurrection in Jeremy Corbyn.
Barely being aware of Corbyn before that leadership campaign, it didn’t
take many of his speeches to turn me into a Corbynite. He proposed simple,
just concepts such as equality, pacifism, compassion, and
restructuring
the
economic system so it works for the people rather than The Man. What’s
wrong with all that? The backdrop in the country at the time was one of
ruination at the hands of the financial crisis and the Tory/Lib Dem
Coalition government. David Cameron had just secured a majority for the
Tories to ramp up their attack on, well, everybody who isn’t a millionaire.
The time was right for a straightforward man of integrity to drive a bus
through the bullshit and deliver justice to the masses. It was
obvious
that
Corbyn would demolish the tepid centrism of the other leadership hopefuls.
The Centrists in the Labour PLP went absolutely mental after Corbyn
won
the
leadership in a crushing landslide and spent much of the next couple of
years going after him but all for nought; Corbyn owns Labour now.
We’re now going into *another* snap General Election, Brexit remains
unresolved, the economy is in absolute bits, and the electorate is rattier
and more fed-up of all the horsehit than they have been for a long time.
Polls have been up and down all year. The culture wars rage on social
media. This is going to be a weird one, no mistake.
That said, I feel quite confident as to the outcomes we’ll see in the
Labour will win the most seats and be the largest party in Parliament
An overall majority for Labour feels unlikely, though
Labour will form a minority government, likely with SNP support [1]
Jeremy Corbyn will be the next Prime Minister
I’ve felt this way since the 2017 General Election results came in and
Theresa May managed to hobble on by bribing the DUP; that at the next
election, whenever that might be, Labour had it in the bag. That sureness
was reinforced when May capitulated on her main red lines and signed
up
to
the softest of Soft Brexits in December 2017. The Tories were now dead in
the water, they just didn’t know it yet.
Reality bit them on the arse throughout 2018 and into 2019 as the
terms
of
that agreement, essentially locking the UK into the EU’s regulatory orbit
forever, dictated the very limited set of Brexit options open to
them.
May
desperately spent months splitting hairs about it, always refusing to admit
that she had signed away the supposed freedom that the anti-EU set
had
long
sought. But it eventually destroyed her, failing in Parliament over and
over again by massive majorities against her deal. It was top LOLs. Labour
made it their official-but-unspoken policy to simply sit on the fence,
refuse to commit to Leave or Remain, and allow the Tories to self-immolate.
Corbyn took a lot of stick for these tactics but he played a winning hand
and it’s going to carry him into Downing Street.
Labour will face a Tory Party now relatively united over Brexit and a Tory
leader committed to a Hard-ish Brexit to satisfy the maniacs in his Party
who demand it in exchange for keeping him in power. But Johnson’s Brexit
deal isn’t anywhere near hard enough for some, not least of all Nigel
Farage who today insisted that, unless Boris dumps his deal and embraces
crashing out of the EU with nothing, Farage’s Brexit party will contest
every seat in the country. This will be carnage for the Conservatives but
it’s difficult to see how Boris could possibly agree to enter a pact by
dumping his sole achievement in Number 10; his Brexit deal.
Farage wants to leave the EU, that’s beyond doubt, but he also wants to
*really* leave the EU, with no connections at all left, and Johnson’s deal
doesn’t really do that despite it being harder than May’s. Farage has been
playing the long game with regards the EU, making a rich living out of it
for more than 20 years now, so he won’t be too dispirited at the idea of
waiting a year or two longer to have another shot at getting the
catastrophic outcome he needs. And in the meantime, he can make hay (and
lots of money!) while the sun shines by causing trouble in the EU and
British Parliaments with his band of Brexit-loving acolytes.
The Brexit Party are a problem for Labour to consider, too, but on a much
smaller scale. Much is made of “Labour Heartlands” voting Leave but the
facts are that most people inclined to vote Labour in 2019 (as in 2017)
voted Remain in the referendum, so Farage will have much thinner pickings
from potential Labour voters as he will from potential Tory voters.
The
Lib
Dems are arguably a genuine threat to Labour but, again, voters
inclined
to
switch to the Lib Dems already did so two years ago. There’s not many votes
to lose, despite what the media pundits say about the Lib Dems being the
home of Remain; Labour are offering to negotiate their own version of a
deal and put that to a referendum vs Remain. It’s objectively clear that
this is the only intellectually honest way forward, and left-leaning
Remainer voters will recognise that. If I’m honest, I’d not be
surprised
to
see the Lib Dems secure less than 10% of the national vote. We’ll see.
I don’t gamble often, it’s a mug’s game, but I have put a few quid on my
predictions above. I’ve also punted £5 on Labour winning an overall
majority, which I don’t expect to happen but the sentimental twat in me
forces me to put my money where my mouth is and get right behind Labour.
I’ll let you know how much I’ve won on December 13th!
[1] I believe that, whilst there will be no formal coalition, the SNP and
Labour will form a gentleman’s agreement to work together to form a Labour
minority government, in exchange for a 2nd EU referendum (which is already
Labour policy) and a future Scottish Indepence referendum (which is not
Labour policy but they *should* officially adopt a neutral stance on the
matter, in my opinion).
I predict a Conservative majority that will vote for Boris' deal. So
confident
am I in my prediction that I propose a wager of sorts: if your
prediction
comes
to pass, I will leave Usenet for six months and if my prediction comes
to
pass,
you leave Usenet for six months. In the event that neither prediction
comes to
pass, there is no forfeit.
What do you say?
That a Jap would have the decency to disembowel itself when it gets it
wrong.
You never really make any statements of policy.
That’s a lie. I have in fact said that imo all three
of a no deal brexit, boris's brexit and remaining
will all work fine obviously with different detail
on the outcome. And I have said that multiple
times and have said other similar stuff too.

<reams of your shit any 2 year old could leave for dead flushed where it
belongs>
Peeler
2019-11-04 19:53:12 UTC
Permalink
gOn Tue, 5 Nov 2019 06:22:24 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest trollshit>

...and much better air in here, again!
--
Bill Wright to Rot Speed:
"That confirms my opinion that you are a despicable little shit."
MID: <pjqpo3$1la0$***@gioia.aioe.org>
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