Discussion:
Supermarkets go anti-clockwise
(too old to reply)
D.M. Procida
2004-02-17 21:18:39 UTC
Permalink
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about supermarket
design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is 'better' (i.e.
somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's owners) if shoppers flow
around it anti-clockwise, and so most supermarkets have their entrances
at the right.

Daniele
--
Apple Juice Ltd
Chapter Arts Centre
Market Road www.apple-juice.co.uk
Cardiff CF5 1QE 029 2019 0140
james
2004-02-17 22:43:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about supermarket
design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is 'better' (i.e.
somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's owners) if shoppers flow
around it anti-clockwise, and so most supermarkets have their entrances
at the right.
My understanding is that this has been subjected to true research
methods, and that the theory holds.

Bear in mind, this only applies to the Northern Hemisphere, in the
Southern, supermarkets are clockwise.
R H Draney
2004-02-17 22:51:03 UTC
Permalink
In article
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about supermarket
design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is 'better' (i.e.
somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's owners) if shoppers flow
around it anti-clockwise, and so most supermarkets have their entrances
at the right.
My understanding is that this has been subjected to true research
methods, and that the theory holds.
I know they made a big deal out of "natural progression" when I took ballroom
dancing...you could do fancy little turns and things that would lead you briefly
in the other direction, but keep moving clockwise around the room for very long
and you'd draw all kinds of funny looks...a proper box steps has you spinning
counterclockwise too...as with the planets, motion of a couple about their
shared axis and around the center of the orbit is in the same direction....
Bear in mind, this only applies to the Northern Hemisphere, in the
Southern, supermarkets are clockwise.
And here the dance analogy breaks down...the tango, originating in Argentina,
was never touted as any sort of an exception....

R H "make your own afu-based reference to what country Vienna is in" Draney
Olivers
2004-02-22 14:58:54 UTC
Permalink
R H Draney muttered....
Post by R H Draney
In article
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about
supermarket design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is
'better' (i.e. somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's
owners) if shoppers flow around it anti-clockwise, and so most
supermarkets have their entrances at the right.
My understanding is that this has been subjected to true research
methods, and that the theory holds.
I know they made a big deal out of "natural progression" when I took
ballroom dancing...you could do fancy little turns and things that
would lead you briefly in the other direction, but keep moving
clockwise around the room for very long and you'd draw all kinds of
funny looks...a proper box steps has you spinning counterclockwise
too...as with the planets, motion of a couple about their shared axis
and around the center of the orbit is in the same direction....
The classic dance style in the Southwest's dance halls, beer parlors and
juke joints, booted and hatted bejeaned gents a-pushing their podnuhs
around the dance floor, the man always headin' forward, the woman dancing
backwards, is ivariably counter-clockwise.
Post by R H Draney
Bear in mind, this only applies to the Northern Hemisphere, in the
Southern, supermarkets are clockwise.
And here the dance analogy breaks down...the tango, originating in
Argentina, was never touted as any sort of an exception....
The cry of the wrongfully directed Argie...

"We don' haf no steenkin' watches and are therefore unable to emulate
Coriolis."

AS for 'Strayans...

"Will dance in any direction ewe want to go."

TM "No waltzing in Roaring Forties" Oliver
Alice Faber
2004-02-18 00:04:02 UTC
Permalink
In article
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about supermarket
design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is 'better' (i.e.
somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's owners) if shoppers flow
around it anti-clockwise, and so most supermarkets have their entrances
at the right.
My understanding is that this has been subjected to true research
methods, and that the theory holds.
Bear in mind, this only applies to the Northern Hemisphere, in the
Southern, supermarkets are clockwise.
There are two Stop and Shop supermarkets that I shop at, in neighboring
towns (in the same hemisphere). The arrangement of one is pretty much
the mirror image of the arrangement of the other. The first time I
shopped at the second supermarket, I found it most disconcerting, and it
took me substantially longer to find what I needed.

Alice "left-right challenged under the best of circumstances" Faber
--
"Personally, I rely on a Rottweiler for 802.11 security"
--Nathan Tenny shares his "professional" networking expertise
Bob Beck
2004-02-23 03:35:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alice Faber
In article
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about supermarket
design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is 'better' (i.e.
somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's owners) if shoppers flow
around it anti-clockwise, and so most supermarkets have their entrances
at the right.
My understanding is that this has been subjected to true research
methods, and that the theory holds.
Bear in mind, this only applies to the Northern Hemisphere, in the
Southern, supermarkets are clockwise.
There are two Stop and Shop supermarkets that I shop at, in neighboring
^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Post by Alice Faber
towns (in the same hemisphere). The arrangement of one is pretty much
the mirror image of the arrangement of the other. The first time I
shopped at the second supermarket, I found it most disconcerting, and it
took me substantially longer to find what I needed.
Alice "left-right challenged under the best of circumstances" Faber
Ah, you see, there's your problem right there.

Everybody knows, you have to *drive past* the Stop and Shop.

bob "with the radio on, at night" beck
Marc Reeve
2004-02-24 06:06:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob Beck
Post by Alice Faber
In article
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about
supermarket design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is
'better' (i.e. somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's
owners) if shoppers flow around it anti-clockwise, and so most
supermarkets have their entrances at the right.
My understanding is that this has been subjected to true research
methods, and that the theory holds.
Bear in mind, this only applies to the Northern Hemisphere, in the
Southern, supermarkets are clockwise.
There are two Stop and Shop supermarkets that I shop at, in neighboring
^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Post by Alice Faber
towns (in the same hemisphere). The arrangement of one is pretty much
the mirror image of the arrangement of the other. The first time I
shopped at the second supermarket, I found it most disconcerting, and it
took me substantially longer to find what I needed.
Alice "left-right challenged under the best of circumstances" Faber
Ah, you see, there's your problem right there.
Everybody knows, you have to *drive past* the Stop and Shop.
bob "with the radio on, at night" beck
Only the first time around. The second time you drive *to* the Stop and
Shop. Having the radio on is non-optional, however.

Marc "the modern sounds of modern Massachusetts" Reeve
--
Marc Reeve
actual email address after removal of 4s & spaces is
c4m4r4a4m4a4n a4t c4r4u4z4i4o d4o4t c4o4m
D.M. Procida
2004-02-24 08:39:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Marc Reeve
Only the first time around. The second time you drive *to* the Stop and
Shop. Having the radio on is non-optional, however.
No, the first time you walk by the Stop and Shop, then you drive by the
Stop and Shop, which is much better than walking by the Stop and Shop,
because you have the radio on.

The whole point is that you're going by it, not to it (that would just
be a bit pathetic).

Daniele
--
Apple Juice Ltd
Chapter Arts Centre
Market Road www.apple-juice.co.uk
Cardiff CF5 1QE 029 2019 0140
Bob Beck
2004-02-25 05:32:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob Beck
Post by Bob Beck
Post by Alice Faber
In article
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about
supermarket design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is
'better' (i.e. somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's
owners) if shoppers flow around it anti-clockwise, and so most
supermarkets have their entrances at the right.
My understanding is that this has been subjected to true research
methods, and that the theory holds.
Bear in mind, this only applies to the Northern Hemisphere, in the
Southern, supermarkets are clockwise.
There are two Stop and Shop supermarkets that I shop at, in neighboring
^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Post by Bob Beck
Post by Alice Faber
towns (in the same hemisphere). The arrangement of one is pretty much
the mirror image of the arrangement of the other. The first time I
shopped at the second supermarket, I found it most disconcerting, and it
took me substantially longer to find what I needed.
Alice "left-right challenged under the best of circumstances" Faber
Ah, you see, there's your problem right there.
Everybody knows, you have to *drive past* the Stop and Shop.
bob "with the radio on, at night" beck
Only the first time around. The second time you drive *to* the Stop and
Shop. Having the radio on is non-optional, however.
Marc "the modern sounds of modern Massachusetts" Reeve
Ah. Thanks for the correction.

I have to admit to a sneaking sort of liking for the cover version by
Joan "50 thousand watts of power" Jett.

bob "still in love with modern moonlight" beck
Anthony McCafferty
2004-02-25 06:04:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Marc Reeve
Only the first time around. The second time you drive *to* the Stop and
Shop. Having the radio on is non-optional, however.
Marc "the modern sounds of modern Massachusetts" Reeve
God, I love this place.

Call me Tevye.

Anthony "If I were a Richman" McCafferty
Bob Beck
2004-02-25 19:39:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Anthony McCafferty
Post by Marc Reeve
Only the first time around. The second time you drive *to* the Stop and
Shop. Having the radio on is non-optional, however.
Marc "the modern sounds of modern Massachusetts" Reeve
God, I love this place.
Call me Tevye.
Anthony "If I were a Richman" McCafferty
Little-known fact: the Modern Lovers were originally called the Matchmakers.

bob "you could look it up" beck
Gig Giacona
2004-02-18 14:31:49 UTC
Permalink
I did a reaserch paper when in high school, many many moons ago. We were
supposed to do field research on anything, it didn't matter what, but field
reasearch had to be done.

So I went and sat through five movies all in theaters where the doors were
centered in the back of the theater. And counted which way people turn when
they walk in. over 80% turned right on entering. This number was stable
within 2% for all five movies which were tested on four different movies and
five different days.

Gig "It probably has something to do with where our swords are kept" Giacona
Richard Evans
2004-02-18 15:10:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gig Giacona
So I went and sat through five movies all in theaters where the doors were
centered in the back of the theater. And counted which way people turn when
they walk in. over 80% turned right on entering. This number was stable
within 2% for all five movies which were tested on four different movies and
five different days.
My first job was as a theater usher in 1961, back when theaters still
had ushers. That was a common observation, even back then. (Slightly
different setup: From the lobby, you had a choice of a door on the
right and a door on the left.) To this day, if I enter a theater that
I expect to be crowded, I'll take the fork to the left expecting to
find better seats.

Dick Evans
M. J. Freeman
2004-02-18 15:41:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Richard Evans
Post by Gig Giacona
So I went and sat through five movies all in theaters where the
doors were centered in the back of the theater. And counted which
way people turn when they walk in. over 80% turned right on
entering. This number was stable within 2% for all five movies
which were tested on four different movies and five different
days.
My first job was as a theater usher in 1961, back when theaters
still had ushers. That was a common observation, even back then.
(Slightly different setup: From the lobby, you had a choice of a
door on the right and a door on the left.) To this day, if I enter
a theater that I expect to be crowded, I'll take the fork to the
left expecting to find better seats.
I think the theatres are ahead of you. Many newer venues have one
door, on the left side of the seats, which gives you the option to
turn right, *or go straight ahead*. There is no left-turn option.

Tricky bastards, those theatre designers.
--
Michael J. Freeman Cincinnati, OH
'85 VF700S (The Leper) ***@SPMBLOKmac.com
"Insanity runs in the family; it practically gallops"
Ellison, H. Thompson, D. Parker, Prince, SRV, Led Zep
harp98
2004-02-21 06:03:36 UTC
Permalink
I'm guessing that you are posting from a country where traffic drives on the
right.

My inclination is to go left, probably because I drive on the left side of
the road.
Post by Gig Giacona
I did a reaserch paper when in high school, many many moons ago. We were
supposed to do field research on anything, it didn't matter what, but field
reasearch had to be done.
So I went and sat through five movies all in theaters where the doors were
centered in the back of the theater. And counted which way people turn when
they walk in. over 80% turned right on entering. This number was stable
within 2% for all five movies which were tested on four different movies and
five different days.
Gig "It probably has something to do with where our swords are kept" Giacona
Lee Ayrton
2004-02-19 13:36:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by james
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about supermarket
design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is 'better' (i.e.
somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's owners) if shoppers flow
around it anti-clockwise, and so most supermarkets have their entrances
at the right.
My understanding is that this has been subjected to true research
methods, and that the theory holds.
Bear in mind, this only applies to the Northern Hemisphere, in the
Southern, supermarkets are clockwise.
"Customers like to move anti-clockwise" appeared in the public record in
the UK in 2000, and the transcript mentions a book titled _Consuming
Passions_.

2. House of Commons Hansard Debates for 21 Jun 2000 (pt 1)
<URL:http://www.parliament.the-stationery-office.co.uk/pa/cm199900/cmhansrd/vo000621/halltext/00621h01.htm>

[quote]----------------------
Recently, I read an interesting book called "Consuming Passions",
which sets out the psychology of retailing. It mentions supermarket
layout, anti-clockwise movement, different temperatures, products at
certain heights and smells from the delicatessen and the bakery
section. Those are always the same for every supermarket in order to
homogenise the overall product but, within that, competition is
available.
[unquote]--------------------

I couldn't find anything online about _Comsuming Passions_ that satisfied
me and I'm not interested enough to request it from the library, but it
appears to not be only concerned with retail marketing but with
consumption by the human population in general.


This Murrican consulting firm reports (in a bit of self-promotion) that
customers will move in an anti-clockwise direction around a store:

12. Special Report: Counter-Clockwise Dominates
<URL:http://www.sorensen-associates.com/pathtracker/entrancestudy.htm>


The same consulting firm appears in this story, in which their research
methods are discussed.

18. Tracking grocery 'hot spots'
<URL:http://business.mainetoday.com/news/040127tracking.shtml>
[quote]----------------------
Sorensen said stores should put their entrances on the right as a
shopper approaches the store, and then route them counterclockwise to
the checkouts. He said studies of other activities, such as walking
tours, indicate that people have a natural tendency to want to walk in
a counterclockwise direction.
[unquote]--------------------


There are, of course, always those that seek to not go with the cattle.
This consultant in Feng Shui (the modern art of improving your income
energy by releasing it from other people) says _clockwise_ is the proper
direction of flow. Presumably that is why clockwise is clockwise in the
first place.

17. Feng Shui, Interior Design, Fountains, & More!
<URL:http://www.artoffengshuiinc.com/audit.htm>
[quote]----------------------
When you enter any facility, always move in a clockwise direction.
Healthy cells move in a clockwise direction and pathology moves in
a counterclockwise direction. Make sure that the layout of your
store encourages this direction of movement.
[unquote]--------------------


And, as the toilets flow, so do the buyers -- south of the equator, that
is. james, this one's for you:

<URL:http://www.afsd.com.au/article/dsbm/dsbm8a.htm>
[quote]----------------------
[Customers] tend to move from left to right in a clockwise direction.
So if you have a left hand opening to your store, this is a good start to
direct the traffic flow throughout the store.
[unquote]--------------------


Lee "In and out, no rotation for me" Ayrton
Mary Shafer
2004-02-19 19:04:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lee Ayrton
[quote]----------------------
Recently, I read an interesting book called "Consuming Passions",
which sets out the psychology of retailing. It mentions supermarket
layout, anti-clockwise movement, different temperatures, products at
certain heights and smells from the delicatessen and the bakery
section. Those are always the same for every supermarket in order to
homogenise the overall product but, within that, competition is
available.
[unquote]--------------------
It's not just supermarkets, of course. We were Austria some years
ago, at Surfers Paradise, and had occasion to do a little shopping in
a department store. We needed face cloths, actually.

We went to the store and found the face cloths exactly where I
expected them to be. We just went right to them. This really
astounded my husband.

Now you tell me that the Austrians probably learned store layout from
a book. I'd rather believe it's a fine old British custom that
Americans and Canadians and Austrians and the residents of other
formerly-British colonies have preserved as part of their Anglo-Saxon
heritage. That is, we do it that way because we always have.

Mary "second floor, of course"
--
Mary Shafer Retired aerospace research engineer
***@qnet.com
Richard Fitzpatrick
2004-02-20 01:45:31 UTC
Permalink
Mary Shafer wrote...
Post by Mary Shafer
It's not just supermarkets, of course. We were Austria some years
ago, at Surfers Paradise, and had occasion to do a little shopping
in a department store. We needed face cloths, actually.
We went to the store and found the face cloths exactly where I
expected them to be. We just went right to them. This really
astounded my husband.
<snip>
Post by Mary Shafer
Mary "second floor, of course"
Of course they were on the second floor. Men never by face cloths, so
there's no need to put them on the ground floor.

And, of course[#2], Surfers Paradise is not really in Austria - it's
in its own separate dimension.

Richard "please don't go to SP next time, ve haf many better places to
show you" Fitzpatrick
Mary Shafer
2004-02-21 00:49:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Richard Fitzpatrick
Mary Shafer wrote...
Post by Mary Shafer
It's not just supermarkets, of course. We were Austria some years
ago, at Surfers Paradise, and had occasion to do a little shopping
in a department store. We needed face cloths, actually.
We went to the store and found the face cloths exactly where I
expected them to be. We just went right to them. This really
astounded my husband.
<snip>
Post by Mary Shafer
Mary "second floor, of course"
Of course they were on the second floor. Men never by face cloths, so
there's no need to put them on the ground floor.
Furs are on the second floor and men buy those. I always assumed it
was that almost no one buys face cloths or mink jackets on impulse,
only on purpose, so there's no point in wasting the prime real estate
tempting folks with them.
Post by Richard Fitzpatrick
And, of course[#2], Surfers Paradise is not really in Austria - it's
in its own separate dimension.
It seemed OK to me, but I'm from SoCal so what do I know? I liked the
flowering plants used in landscaping.
Post by Richard Fitzpatrick
Richard "please don't go to SP next time, ve haf many better places to
show you" Fitzpatrick
You already haf shown me. Townsville, Cairns, Brisbane, Rockhampton,
Alice Springs, Ayres Rock, the Olgas, the Red Centre, Adelaide,
Geelong, Sydney, Melbourne, Fishermans Bend, Canberra, Hobart, Botany
Bay, the southern coast road, and a lot of points in between. I've
only got Darwin and Perth left, I think.

There's only one thing I saw in Austria that I didn't think was really
neat and that was the torrential rainfall at the airport in
Townsville. I even liked the giant concrete Merino ram and Moreton
Bay bug.

Speaking of coastal resorts and odd tourist attractions, did you know
the biggest tree in California (biggest being largest trunk five feet
above the ground or something) is a Moreton Bay fig in Santa Barbara?

Mary "liked the Australian architecture in Vienna, too"
--
Mary Shafer Retired aerospace research engineer
***@qnet.com
Celia
2004-02-20 01:07:52 UTC
Permalink
"Mary Shafer" <***@qnet.com> wrote in message news:***@4ax.com...
| On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 08:36:57 -0500, Lee Ayrton <***@panix.com>
| wrote:
|
| > [quote]----------------------
| > Recently, I read an interesting book called "Consuming Passions",
| > which sets out the psychology of retailing. It mentions supermarket
| > layout, anti-clockwise movement, different temperatures, products at
| > certain heights and smells from the delicatessen and the bakery
| > section. Those are always the same for every supermarket in order to
| > homogenise the overall product but, within that, competition is
| > available.
| > [unquote]--------------------
|
| It's not just supermarkets, of course. We were Austria some years
| ago, at Surfers Paradise, and had occasion to do a little shopping in
| a department store. We needed face cloths, actually.
|
| We went to the store and found the face cloths exactly where I
| expected them to be. We just went right to them. This really
| astounded my husband.
|
| Now you tell me that the Austrians probably learned store layout from
| a book. I'd rather believe it's a fine old British custom that
| Americans and Canadians and Austrians and the residents of other
| formerly-British colonies have preserved as part of their Anglo-Saxon
| heritage. That is, we do it that way because we always have.
|
| Mary "second floor, of course"
|
| --
| Mary Shafer Retired aerospace research engineer
| ***@qnet.com

Think you are getting Australia mixed up with Austria.
Charles Wm. Dimmick
2004-02-20 13:15:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Celia
Think you are getting Australia mixed up with Austria.
No, No. Think you are getting your alternate universes mixed
up. Here in AFU-land Australia is that Vienna-sausage land
east of the home of the Swiss.

Charles
--
"And some rin up hill and down dale, knapping the
chucky stanes to pieces wi' hammers, like sae mony
road-makers run daft -- they say it is to see how
the warld was made!"
David Winsemius
2004-02-20 14:29:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Charles Wm. Dimmick
Post by Celia
Think you are getting Australia mixed up with Austria.
No, No. Think you are getting your alternate universes mixed
up. Here in AFU-land Australia is that Vienna-sausage land
east of the home of the Swiss.
We may have another time traveler. Celia's earlier attempt at correcting
AFU's geography is dated next week.
--
David "temporal-spatial distortions everywhere" Winsemius
Celia
2004-02-24 15:08:20 UTC
Permalink
"Charles Wm. Dimmick" <***@snet.net> wrote in message news:iMnZb.41400$***@newssvr33.news.prodigy.com...
| Celia wrote:
|
| > Think you are getting Australia mixed up with Austria.
|
| No, No. Think you are getting your alternate universes mixed
| up. Here in AFU-land Australia is that Vienna-sausage land
| east of the home of the Swiss.
|
| Charles
|

LOL..I must of missed something.
M. J. Freeman
2004-02-24 16:13:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Celia
|
| > Think you are getting Australia mixed up with Austria.
|
| No, No. Think you are getting your alternate universes mixed
| up. Here in AFU-land Australia is that Vienna-sausage land
| east of the home of the Swiss.
|
| Charles
|
LOL..I must of missed something.
When did "of" become a verb?
--
Michael J. Freeman Cincinnati, OH
'85 VF700S (The Leper) ***@SPMBLOKmac.com
"Insanity runs in the family; it practically gallops"
Ellison, H. Thompson, D. Parker, Prince, SRV, Led Zep
Jim Cambias
2004-02-24 17:03:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by M. J. Freeman
Post by Celia
|
| > Think you are getting Australia mixed up with Austria.
|
| No, No. Think you are getting your alternate universes mixed
| up. Here in AFU-land Australia is that Vienna-sausage land
| east of the home of the Swiss.
|
| Charles
|
LOL..I must of missed something.
When did "of" become a verb?
You didn't hear? It was in all the papers. They also made "islets of
langerhans" and "anvil" into verbs, while "interpret" is now a noun. The
colors "green" and "magenta" are now adverbs instead of adjectives. Keep
up with the news, dammit!

Cambias
Charles Wm. Dimmick
2004-02-24 23:59:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by M. J. Freeman
Post by Celia
LOL..I must of missed something.
When did "of" become a verb?
In certain dialects of American English as she were spoke
it is quite permissible. It is, of course, not Standard
English, nor is it RP nor American Broadcast English.
http://www.bartleby.com/68/25/4225.html

Charles
--
"And some rin up hill and down dale, knapping the
chucky stanes to pieces wi' hammers, like sae mony
road-makers run daft -- they say it is to see how
the warld was made!"
unknown
2004-02-25 12:12:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Charles Wm. Dimmick
Post by M. J. Freeman
Post by Celia
LOL..I must of missed something.
When did "of" become a verb?
In certain dialects of American English as she were spoke
it is quite permissible.
Celia is posting from Australia. I've always assumed that "of" in this
context[1] was merely a mispledding of "'ve".

Lara


[1] where "in this context" = "in the vicinity of a LOL".
me
2004-02-20 17:33:16 UTC
Permalink
"Celia" <***@removethis.excite.com> wrote in message news:<4035f23a$0$22511$***@freenews.iinet.net.au>...
[snip]
Post by Celia
Think you are getting Australia mixed up with Austria.
You might wanna duck.
Alan J Rosenthal
2004-02-20 20:11:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by me
Post by Celia
Think you are getting Australia mixed up with Austria.
You might wanna duck.
Nah... a bit too greasy, and WAY too anechoic.

-- aj "two buffalo girls go in an anti-clockwise direction" r
R H Draney
2004-02-20 20:33:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alan J Rosenthal
Post by me
Post by Celia
Think you are getting Australia mixed up with Austria.
You might wanna duck.
Nah... a bit too greasy, and WAY too anechoic.
-- aj "two buffalo girls go in an anti-clockwise direction" r
...and dance by the light of the moon....r
james
2004-02-19 23:33:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lee Ayrton
smells from the delicatessen and the bakery
section.
Shirley others can remember Sears stores with the centrally located
popcorn shop. They didn't care if they sold any popcorn, the purpose
was to create the aroma.
Deborah Stevenson
2004-02-19 23:40:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by james
Post by Lee Ayrton
smells from the delicatessen and the bakery
section.
Shirley others can remember Sears stores with the centrally located
popcorn shop. They didn't care if they sold any popcorn, the purpose
was to create the aroma.
Don't remember it at all in Sears. I do remember it in Woolworth's--idea
copied or general store confused?
--
Deborah Stevenson
***@OBSTACLESuiuc.edu
[eliminate OBSTACLES to email me]
L0nD0t.$t0we11
2004-02-20 03:31:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Deborah Stevenson
Post by james
Post by Lee Ayrton
smells from the delicatessen and the bakery
section.
Shirley others can remember Sears stores with the centrally located
popcorn shop. They didn't care if they sold any popcorn, the purpose
was to create the aroma.
Don't remember it at all in Sears. I do remember it in Woolworth's--idea
copied or general store confused?
My recall as well. Woolworths had this way back when I was too short
to see up into the candy bins unassisted. Sears has often had a very
good candy section where making friends with the manager could help
fill in gaps in your coin collection. And some Macy's used to have
truly sinful candy storelets populated by such goodies as Joseph
Schmidts chocolates...then some bean counter made it into a kidswear
section and offered jalapeno flavored malted milk balls as the
replacement "gourmet" item.
--
Boys are stupid, throw rocks at them...
technomaNge
2004-02-20 04:00:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Deborah Stevenson
Post by james
Post by Lee Ayrton
smells from the delicatessen and the bakery
section.
Shirley others can remember Sears stores with the centrally located
popcorn shop. They didn't care if they sold any popcorn, the purpose
was to create the aroma.
Don't remember it at all in Sears. I do remember it in Woolworth's--idea
copied or general store confused?
Our Sears, here in LA (Lower Alabama) had it like that. Twas a 3 story
wooden building in downtown. Also had pretty good chocolate covered
raisins.

technomaNge
Karen J. Cravens
2004-02-20 04:29:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Deborah Stevenson
Don't remember it at all in Sears. I do remember it in
Woolworth's--idea copied or general store confused?
I remember Sears having *something* in the middle, and it might have been
a popcorn shop, but whatever it was it also had candy. I pestered for,
and occasionally got, nonpareils.
--
Karen J. Cravens
David
2004-02-20 13:02:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Karen J. Cravens
Post by Deborah Stevenson
Don't remember it at all in Sears. I do remember it in
Woolworth's--idea copied or general store confused?
I remember Sears having *something* in the middle, and it might have
been a popcorn shop, but whatever it was it also had candy. I
pestered for, and occasionally got, nonpareils.
No, no, no. The treat was to get mom to first park on the top floor of the
parking garage, then go across the 4th floor walkway across the street, then
get Ju Ju Bees at the candy counter. The candy was for energy carbs to run
up and down the escalators.
--
David
For really, really short URLs, try http://qurl.us
L0nD0t.$t0we11
2004-02-21 03:40:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by David
Post by Karen J. Cravens
Post by Deborah Stevenson
Don't remember it at all in Sears. I do remember it in
Woolworth's--idea copied or general store confused?
I remember Sears having *something* in the middle, and it might have
been a popcorn shop, but whatever it was it also had candy. I
pestered for, and occasionally got, nonpareils.
No, no, no. The treat was to get mom to first park on the top floor of the
parking garage, then go across the 4th floor walkway across the street, then
get Ju Ju Bees at the candy counter. The candy was for energy carbs to run
up and down the escalators.
Plus if you get bored, you can drop them into the little grooves
in the escalator and watch them get squished...
--
Boys are stupid, throw rocks at them...
Mary Shafer
2004-02-20 17:00:14 UTC
Permalink
On 20 Feb 2004 04:29:04 GMT, "Karen J. Cravens"
Post by Karen J. Cravens
Post by Deborah Stevenson
Don't remember it at all in Sears. I do remember it in
Woolworth's--idea copied or general store confused?
I remember Sears having *something* in the middle, and it might have been
a popcorn shop, but whatever it was it also had candy. I pestered for,
and occasionally got, nonpareils.
Popcorn. Definitely popcorn. Geez, I can smell it now, and see the
lawn mowers and sewing machines. Bulk candy and paper bags, too.

I think Woolworth's had popcorn, too. Sav-On Drug, across the street
from Woolworth's, had ice cream. Actually, they might still have it.
Thrifty Drug had great ice cream, so great that other places sell it
now that Thrifty is no more, having been bought out by Rite-Aid.

Mary
--
Mary Shafer Retired aerospace research engineer
***@qnet.com
Marc Reeve
2004-02-23 15:15:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mary Shafer
On 20 Feb 2004 04:29:04 GMT, "Karen J. Cravens"
Post by Karen J. Cravens
Post by Deborah Stevenson
Don't remember it at all in Sears. I do remember it in
Woolworth's--idea copied or general store confused?
I remember Sears having *something* in the middle, and it might have been
a popcorn shop, but whatever it was it also had candy. I pestered for,
and occasionally got, nonpareils.
Popcorn. Definitely popcorn. Geez, I can smell it now, and see the
lawn mowers and sewing machines. Bulk candy and paper bags, too.
I think Woolworth's had popcorn, too. Sav-On Drug, across the street
from Woolworth's, had ice cream. Actually, they might still have it.
Thrifty Drug had great ice cream, so great that other places sell it
now that Thrifty is no more, having been bought out by Rite-Aid.
Our lo cal Rite Aid still has the ice cream counter and the ice cream is
still Thrifty brand.

Lovely stuff. Price has risen summat since I was small, though. Used to
be a quarter a scoop - now up to 99 cents.

Marc "still cheaper than Maskin-Robbers though" Reeve
--
Marc Reeve
actual email address after removal of 4s & spaces is
c4m4r4a4m4a4n a4t c4r4u4z4i4o d4o4t c4o4m
Burroughs Guy
2004-02-23 17:49:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Marc Reeve
Our lo cal Rite Aid still has the ice cream counter and the ice cream is
still Thrifty brand.
Lovely stuff. Price has risen summat since I was small, though. Used to
be a quarter a scoop - now up to 99 cents.
^^^^^^^

You mispplepled "nickel".
--
Burroughs Guy
Vaguer memories available upon request
Hatunen
2004-02-23 17:59:55 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 23 Feb 2004 12:49:40 -0500 (EST), "Burroughs Guy"
Post by Bob Beck
Post by Marc Reeve
Our lo cal Rite Aid still has the ice cream counter and the ice cream is
still Thrifty brand.
Lovely stuff. Price has risen summat since I was small, though. Used to
be a quarter a scoop - now up to 99 cents.
^^^^^^^
You mispplepled "nickel".
Yeah...

Sigh....

************* DAVE HATUNEN (***@cox.net) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *
Olivers
2004-02-24 14:49:39 UTC
Permalink
Hatunen muttered....
Post by Hatunen
On Mon, 23 Feb 2004 12:49:40 -0500 (EST), "Burroughs Guy"
Post by Bob Beck
Post by Marc Reeve
Our lo cal Rite Aid still has the ice cream counter and the ice
cream is still Thrifty brand.
Lovely stuff. Price has risen summat since I was small, though. Used
to be a quarter a scoop - now up to 99 cents.
^^^^^^^
You mispplepled "nickel".
Yeah...
Sigh....
....Back when I was mere lad of 13 enslaved in violation of the child labor
standards behind the soda fountain at Heights Pharmacy (2 afternoons after
school and all day Saturday - and after closing pulling the wooden
duckboards out to the alley to be washed clean of icecream drips, dropped
chicken salad - homemade back then, but inedible to me since it contained
both apples and hard boiled eggs, yuck! - etc.), a fountain Coke (best
without ice from the iced red dispenser atop the counter) was but a nickel
(as wasa single dip cone van, choc, straw, buttter pecan plus a flavor of
the week, shakes and malts were $.20 & .25, the classic ice cream soda and
the locally popular root beer and Dr. Pepper floats were still 15 cents,
while the ultimate banana split had been marked up to $ .35 (a split jumbo
banana, a dip of each of the 3 primary flavors, pineapple, strawberry and
chocolate toppings, real whippped cream preloaded by a local dairy into a
pressure can, a sprinkle of chopped peacans or walnuts and a maraschino
cherry).

For the premium trade, we charged $.35 for the "House Special", a shake
made with a whole banana, a dash of vanilla, 3 dips of ice cream, a little
half and half instead of milk, and a raw egg....

No wonder we grew obese (but in 1952, folks clearly remembered the minor
restrictions during WWII and lusted after plenty.

TM "Heaven has a marble counter top with nickeled fixtures." Oliver
Marc Reeve
2004-02-24 06:06:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob Beck
Post by Marc Reeve
Our lo cal Rite Aid still has the ice cream counter and the ice cream is
still Thrifty brand.
Lovely stuff. Price has risen summat since I was small, though. Used to
be a quarter a scoop - now up to 99 cents.
^^^^^^^
You mispplepled "nickel".
I may have a more recent value of being small than you do.

Lowest price I can recall is $.25/scoop.

Marc "or maybe my memory is going, who knows?" Reeve
--
Marc Reeve
actual email address after removal of 4s & spaces is
c4m4r4a4m4a4n a4t c4r4u4z4i4o d4o4t c4o4m
Mary Shafer
2004-02-24 23:04:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Marc Reeve
Post by Mary Shafer
I think Woolworth's had popcorn, too. Sav-On Drug, across the street
from Woolworth's, had ice cream. Actually, they might still have it.
Thrifty Drug had great ice cream, so great that other places sell it
now that Thrifty is no more, having been bought out by Rite-Aid.
Our lo cal Rite Aid still has the ice cream counter and the ice cream is
still Thrifty brand.
Lovely stuff. Price has risen summat since I was small, though. Used to
be a quarter a scoop - now up to 99 cents.
Marc "still cheaper than Maskin-Robbers though" Reeve
And maybe better. We didn't have 31 Flavors to compare to, though.
Thrifty or Savon had vanilla with peppermint stick chips that no one
else did and it was really good. Their chocolate was excellent, too.
I don't remember it being a quarter; it seems to me it was a dime,
maybe.

A few years later, when I was in college and working summers at NASA,
we'd have ice cream cones at afternoon break. That was also really
good, being some premium brand, but it was also a social event and the
company may have been a part of my memories. That was when young
women in engineering were a rarity and got a lot of attention. Now
the NASA cafeteria has a soft-serve machine.

Did your Thrifty have the grill? Ours did and for decades a group of
NASA engineers used to meet there on Saturday for breakfast followed
by a day of photography or hiking. They served killer cholesterol
specials for breakfast, the classic eggs with hash browns and sausage
or bacon or ham, for some really great prices. That's long gone,
because the Rite-Aid that took over that location was closed within a
year. Rite-Aid hasn't done very well in Lancaster, actually.

Mary "I wonder if Savon still has ice cream? Healthier than breakfast
at Crazy Otto's."
--
Mary Shafer Retired aerospace research engineer
***@qnet.com
Lee Rudolph
2004-02-25 00:29:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mary Shafer
That was when young
women in engineering were a rarity and got a lot of attention. Now
the NASA cafeteria has a soft-serve machine.
Oh. My. God.

Lee "Soylent Green is ... soft-serve!" Rudolph
Bob Ward
2004-02-25 06:25:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mary Shafer
Post by Marc Reeve
Post by Mary Shafer
I think Woolworth's had popcorn, too. Sav-On Drug, across the street
from Woolworth's, had ice cream. Actually, they might still have it.
Thrifty Drug had great ice cream, so great that other places sell it
now that Thrifty is no more, having been bought out by Rite-Aid.
Our lo cal Rite Aid still has the ice cream counter and the ice cream is
still Thrifty brand.
Lovely stuff. Price has risen summat since I was small, though. Used to
be a quarter a scoop - now up to 99 cents.
Marc "still cheaper than Maskin-Robbers though" Reeve
And maybe better. We didn't have 31 Flavors to compare to, though.
Thrifty or Savon had vanilla with peppermint stick chips that no one
else did and it was really good. Their chocolate was excellent, too.
I don't remember it being a quarter; it seems to me it was a dime,
maybe.
It was a nickel until the 70's, I believe - then went to 15 cents,
later to a quarter.
JC Dill
2004-02-26 22:33:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mary Shafer
I don't remember it being a quarter; it seems to me it was a dime,
maybe.
I remember it being a dime too, this would have been in the early
'70s.

jc
Burroughs Guy
2004-02-27 18:48:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by JC Dill
Post by Mary Shafer
I don't remember it being a quarter; it seems to me it was a dime,
maybe.
I remember it being a dime too, this would have been in the early
'70s.
When I was a wee lad[1], Thrifty ice cream was 5¢ for a single scoop,
10¢ for a double scoop, and 15¢ for a triple scoop. One day in the
early 1970s[2] my sister came home and reported that the prices had
been raised to 10¢/15¢/20¢. My mother remarked that the price of
sugar was going up. My friend Chaz²[3] remarked "They only raised the
price of the cone".[4]

[1] And continuing into years when I was not so wee.
[2] The fact that Chaz² was at my house means this could not have been
prior to early 1972 and probably not later than summer of 1974.
[3] He actually spelled his name with a superscripted 2. Of course my
use of this high Ascii[5] character (as well as the cent sign) will
cause some people's computers to display strange and mysterious things.
[4] Mathematically inclined Thrifty patrons had oft remarked that if
you bought two singles you got as much ice cream as one double, plus
you got an extra cone.[6]
[5] It's called "high Ascii" because it causes your computer to
display strange and mysterious things as though it is high on drugs.
[6] I always bought a double anyway. Chocolate above, vanilla below.
I am rather a traditionalist about ice cream.
--
Burroughs Guy
Vaguer memories available upon request
Marc Reeve
2004-02-28 06:01:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Burroughs Guy
Post by JC Dill
Post by Mary Shafer
I don't remember it being a quarter; it seems to me it was a dime,
maybe.
I remember it being a dime too, this would have been in the early
'70s.
When I was a wee lad[1], Thrifty ice cream was 5¢ for a single scoop,
10¢ for a double scoop, and 15¢ for a triple scoop. One day in the
early 1970s[2] my sister came home and reported that the prices had
been raised to 10¢/15¢/20¢. My mother remarked that the price of
sugar was going up. My friend Chaz"[3] remarked "They only raised the
price of the cone".[4]
Ah, this would explain much. My memory of Thrifty ice cream's price is
circa 1980 - that being when i was considered old enough (10) to bicycle
the distance to Thrifty (several miles) unsupervised.

And I would have to agree with Mary back there - the Thrifty peppermint
stick ice cream with real bits of peppermint hard candy was/is The Best.

Marc "single scoop of ice cream = 5 returned soda bottles[1]" Reeve

[1] One of the truly lame things about the "California Redemption Value"
for beverage containers is that it reduced the amount one could get for
bottles. When Dad's Root Beer came in 8 ounce stubby bottles, they were
a dime each, plus 5 cents deposit - but our neigborhood grocery[2] could
and would refund the 5 cents when you brought them back.

[2] Which, according to my mother, is soon to re-open after being closed
for the last 10 years. It'll probably be some sort of yuppie haven now,
though. The old neigborhood's rather gentrified now - my parents' house
is the only one that's essentially the same as when they moved in 33
years ago.
--
Marc Reeve
actual email address after removal of 4s & spaces is
c4m4r4a4m4a4n a4t c4r4u4z4i4o d4o4t c4o4m
Charles Bishop
2004-02-25 02:59:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Marc Reeve
Post by Mary Shafer
On 20 Feb 2004 04:29:04 GMT, "Karen J. Cravens"
Post by Karen J. Cravens
Post by Deborah Stevenson
Don't remember it at all in Sears. I do remember it in
Woolworth's--idea copied or general store confused?
I remember Sears having *something* in the middle, and it might have been
a popcorn shop, but whatever it was it also had candy. I pestered for,
and occasionally got, nonpareils.
Popcorn. Definitely popcorn. Geez, I can smell it now, and see the
lawn mowers and sewing machines. Bulk candy and paper bags, too.
I think Woolworth's had popcorn, too. Sav-On Drug, across the street
from Woolworth's, had ice cream. Actually, they might still have it.
Thrifty Drug had great ice cream, so great that other places sell it
now that Thrifty is no more, having been bought out by Rite-Aid.
Our lo cal Rite Aid still has the ice cream counter and the ice cream is
still Thrifty brand.
Lovely stuff. Price has risen summat since I was small, though. Used to
be a quarter a scoop - now up to 99 cents.
Youngster. It was a nickle, and Baskin Robbins was a dime.

charles
Charles Wm. Dimmick
2004-02-25 03:09:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by Charles Bishop
Youngster. It was a nickle, and Baskin Robbins was a dime.
charles
Youngster yourself. Baskin-Robbins didn't even exist until
1945, several years after my first ice-cream cone.

Charles
--
"And some rin up hill and down dale, knapping the
chucky stanes to pieces wi' hammers, like sae mony
road-makers run daft -- they say it is to see how
the warld was made!"
Bill
2004-02-25 05:28:49 UTC
Permalink
"Charles Wm. Dimmick" <***@snet.net> wrote in message news:AlU_b.17577$***@newssvr31.news.prodigy.com...
| Charles Bishop wrote:
|
| > Youngster. It was a nickle, and Baskin Robbins was a dime.
| >
| > charles
|
| Youngster yourself. Baskin-Robbins didn't even exist until
| 1945, several years after my first ice-cream cone.
|
| Charles

Brigham's. Boston. 1924. Whippersnappers.

http://www.brighams.com/about/

Bill "No, I was *not* at the opening"
Hatunen
2004-02-25 06:01:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Charles Bishop
Post by Marc Reeve
Lovely stuff. Price has risen summat since I was small, though. Used to
be a quarter a scoop - now up to 99 cents.
Youngster. It was a nickle, and Baskin Robbins was a dime.
You must have lived in California. Baskin Robbins didn't escape
the Bear Republic until 1959 when almost all icecream had gone up
to a dime a scoop.

Now if you had said "Howard Johnsons".....


************* DAVE HATUNEN (***@cox.net) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *
Bill
2004-02-25 06:49:27 UTC
Permalink
"Hatunen" <***@cox.net> wrote in message news:***@4ax.com...
| On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:59:04 GMT, ***@earthlink.netttt
| (Charles Bishop) wrote:
|
| >In article <1g9isnu.cd62ef1gv888wN%***@nospam.calm>,
| >***@nospam.calm (Marc Reeve) wrote:
| >
| >>Lovely stuff. Price has risen summat since I was small, though. Used to
| >>be a quarter a scoop - now up to 99 cents.
| >
| >Youngster. It was a nickle, and Baskin Robbins was a dime.
| >
| You must have lived in California. Baskin Robbins didn't escape
| the Bear Republic until 1959 when almost all icecream had gone up
| to a dime a scoop.
|
| Now if you had said "Howard Johnsons".....

Ah, yes. 28 flavors. My father (in the restaurant biz) took me to the
first one on Quincy Circle where they gave away fried clams just get people
in the door...

http://www.hojo.com/HowardJohnson/control/brand_history

He said (correctly) that they would do well because families (like ours) on
a week-end outing would take the kids to some place where they knew what
they were going to see on the menu.

Bill "He drove a Packard 120, I operated the tube radio"
|
|
| ************* DAVE HATUNEN (***@cox.net) *************
| * Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
| * My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *
Charles Bishop
2004-02-25 15:13:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Hatunen
Post by Charles Bishop
Post by Marc Reeve
Lovely stuff. Price has risen summat since I was small, though. Used to
be a quarter a scoop - now up to 99 cents.
Youngster. It was a nickle, and Baskin Robbins was a dime.
You must have lived in California. Baskin Robbins didn't escape
the Bear Republic until 1959 when almost all icecream had gone up
to a dime a scoop.
If my memory is correct, it would have been about that year. BR was a dime
and Thrifty was a nickle. If we had extra cash, we'd srping for the BR,
but the Thrifty ice cream was good as well. I think you got more too,
though it would have been by volume rather than weight. BR advertised
theirs as "hand packed" and I don't think it had as much air in it.

I got surprising results recently by weighing Haagen Das vs a Dryers
package of ice cream. A couple of pints of HD was nearly equivalent to a
half gallon of Dryers.
Post by Hatunen
Now if you had said "Howard Johnsons".....
Did you know of Curries?, if I have that right. The signs had very tall,
swirled ice cream on the cone.

charles, in CA in '59 after a peregrenatious childhood
R H Draney
2004-02-25 20:07:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Charles Bishop
Did you know of Curries?, if I have that right. The signs had very tall,
swirled ice cream on the cone.
My mother worked for them, after telling her parents during her teenage years
that she'd like an ice cream cone as big as the one on the sign [1]...she
slapped me when I made a similar observation in reference to the rotating bucket
above the local KFC....r

[1] Wasn't just on the sign...Curries sold what they called a "mile-hi" cone,
with the ice cream piled high using a special scoop designed for precisely that
purpose....
james
2004-02-20 19:49:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Deborah Stevenson
Don't remember it at all in Sears. I do remember it in Woolworth's--idea
copied or general store confused?
Perhaps. I remember Sears stores always having the popcorn counter, but
my memory only goes back to nineteen-sixty-mumble.

But the reason I think of Sears in particular, is because I'm repeating
as gospel something that professor told me, that it started at Sears,
and I suppose others copied it. If this were unfolding TODAY, then the
we'd see the business model shift from "discount retail goods" to
"litigation over the patented popcorn method".

My lo cal Woolworth's smelled like fish...
Lots42 The Library Avenger
2004-02-23 13:44:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by james
My lo cal Woolworth's smelled like fish...
My cat's breath smells like cat food.
Ray Heindl
2004-02-20 22:25:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Deborah Stevenson
Post by james
Shirley others can remember Sears stores with the centrally
located popcorn shop. They didn't care if they sold any popcorn,
the purpose was to create the aroma.
Don't remember it at all in Sears. I do remember it in
Woolworth's--idea copied or general store confused?
Jenquins Hardware in Marinette, Wisconsin, has a free-popcorn machine
by the door. Unfortunately they always use too much salt.
--
Ray Heindl
(remove the Xs to reply to: ***@xnccwx.net)
Larry D. Farrell
2004-02-20 22:51:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ray Heindl
Post by Deborah Stevenson
Post by james
Shirley others can remember Sears stores with the centrally
located popcorn shop. They didn't care if they sold any popcorn,
the purpose was to create the aroma.
Don't remember it at all in Sears. I do remember it in
Woolworth's--idea copied or general store confused?
Jenquins Hardware in Marinette, Wisconsin, has a free-popcorn machine
by the door. Unfortunately they always use too much salt.
--
Ray Heindl
How far was it to the stand where they sold the over-priced soft drinks?
Ray Heindl
2004-02-21 21:46:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Larry D. Farrell
Post by Ray Heindl
Jenquins Hardware in Marinette, Wisconsin, has a free-popcorn
machine by the door. Unfortunately they always use too much
salt.
How far was it to the stand where they sold the over-priced soft drinks?
Strangely enough, they don't sell drinks. The machine is by the exit
door, so I assume they want people to take it with them and avoid
spilling popcorn in the plumbing supplies aisle. Maybe Mr. Jenquins
also owns the bar across the street.

A local bar used to give away popcorn, especially to those waiting for
a table. It was even saltier than Jenquins's, for obvious reasons.
--
Ray Heindl
(remove the Xs to reply to: ***@xnccwx.net)
Lots42 The Library Avenger
2004-02-23 13:45:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Larry D. Farrell
How far was it to the stand where they sold the over-priced soft drinks?
Once went to one of Florida's many crazy-ass fairs. The fried candy bar place
was twenty steps away from a drink place that just happened to sell gooood
milk. Whoever thought of that was a genius.
--
"Oh, trusty soda machine! I push you for root beer, you give me coke." -
Willow Rosenberg
[ Yendi: "It's almost 10! Why didn't you eat dinner?"
Me: "Because I was writing." ] - Shadesong, via Livejournal
TeaLady (Mari C.)
2004-02-21 00:42:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ray Heindl
Post by Deborah Stevenson
Post by james
Shirley others can remember Sears stores with the centrally
located popcorn shop. They didn't care if they sold any
popcorn, the purpose was to create the aroma.
Don't remember it at all in Sears. I do remember it in
Woolworth's--idea copied or general store confused?
Jenquins Hardware in Marinette, Wisconsin, has a
free-popcorn machine by the door. Unfortunately they always
use too much salt.
mmm, salt. Free salt. mmmmm.
--
Tea"I don't have a sweet tooth"Lady / mari conroy

"Stated to me for a fact. I only tell it as I got it. I am
willing to believe it. I can believe anything." Sam Clemens
Spressobean at yahoo has a spam problem. A better address is
culcie at yahoo dot com.
L0nD0t.$t0we11
2004-02-21 03:47:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ray Heindl
Post by Deborah Stevenson
Post by james
Shirley others can remember Sears stores with the centrally
located popcorn shop. They didn't care if they sold any popcorn,
the purpose was to create the aroma.
Don't remember it at all in Sears. I do remember it in
Woolworth's--idea copied or general store confused?
Jenquins Hardware in Marinette, Wisconsin, has a free-popcorn machine
by the door. Unfortunately they always use too much salt.
...urine remnants are rumored to have a salty taste...
--
Boys are stupid, throw rocks at them...
Lots42 The Library Avenger
2004-02-23 13:39:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about supermarket
design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is 'better' (i.e.
somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's owners) if shoppers flow
around it anti-clockwise, and so most supermarkets have their entrances
at the right.
So are the exits on the left? I hope so. Fires trapping people is bad.
Burroughs Guy
2004-02-18 00:19:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about supermarket
design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is 'better' (i.e.
somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's owners) if shoppers flow
around it anti-clockwise, and so most supermarkets have their entrances
at the right.
I generally travel through the market boustrophedonically, but we're
addressing the overall pattern of motion. The two markets I regularly
use here in lower Manhattan are indeed configured to encourage
anti-clockwise behavior. However the market I used in Jersey City
encouraged clockwise behavior. I think most of the large markets I
used in California were completely ambidextrous. Some of them have
oddities which made it impossible to tour the entire market by a
perfectly boustrophedonic path (and this always distresses me).
--
Burroughs Guy
Vaguer memories available upon request
TeaLady (Mari C.)
2004-02-18 01:11:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Burroughs Guy
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about
supermarket design, and the claim that studies have shown
that it is 'better' (i.e. somehow more advantageous for the
supermarket's owners) if shoppers flow around it
anti-clockwise, and so most supermarkets have their
entrances at the right.
I generally travel through the market boustrophedonically,
but we're addressing the overall pattern of motion. The two
markets I regularly use here in lower Manhattan are indeed
configured to encourage anti-clockwise behavior. However
the market I used in Jersey City encouraged clockwise
behavior. I think most of the large markets I used in
California were completely ambidextrous. Some of them have
oddities which made it impossible to tour the entire market
by a perfectly boustrophedonic path (and this always
distresses me).
I have 2 markets up the road from me, a large super market and a
smaller not-so-super super market. The larger one has the main
entry into the shopping area at the center, but to shop you must
go to the right and wend your way back to the left, so I guess
they set it up for counter-clocking. The smaller of the 2 has
you enter on the right, but you then get led to the far left of
the store and circle about clock-ways. Both markets are
generally packed (at least when I go shopping).
--
TeaLady / mari conroy

"Stated to me for a fact. I only tell it as I got it. I am
willing to believe it. I can believe anything." Sam Clemens
Spressobean at yahoo has a spam problem. A better address is
culcie at yahoo dot com.
Lots42 The Library Avenger
2004-02-23 13:47:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Burroughs Guy
I generally travel through the market boustrophedonically, but we're
addressing the overall pattern of motion. The two markets I regularly
use here in lower Manhattan are indeed configured to encourage
anti-clockwise behavior. However the market I used in Jersey City
encouraged clockwise behavior.
The stores I shop in encourage pinball behavior. The milk and eggs are in one
section, the cheese and lunch meats in another and the bread hides in a swirly
dimensional vortex. Of pain.

Lot "and bread" 42.
Stephan Lemonjello Jr.
2004-02-18 09:08:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about supermarket
design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is 'better' (i.e.
somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's owners) if shoppers flow
around it anti-clockwise, and so most supermarkets have their entrances
at the right.
I've yet to see a round supermarket.
D.M. Procida
2004-02-18 13:33:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stephan Lemonjello Jr.
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about supermarket
design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is 'better' (i.e.
somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's owners) if shoppers flow
around it anti-clockwise, and so most supermarkets have their entrances
at the right.
I've yet to see a round supermarket.
That's because in a round supermarket you can't put the entrance at the
right.

Daniele
--
Apple Juice Ltd
Chapter Arts Centre
Market Road www.apple-juice.co.uk
Cardiff CF5 1QE 029 2019 0140
Charles Wm. Dimmick
2004-02-18 12:20:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about supermarket
design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is 'better' (i.e.
somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's owners) if shoppers flow
around it anti-clockwise, and so most supermarkets have their entrances
at the right.
Two supermarkets are remaining in my town. One has its entry on the
left. The second has entrances on both left and right side [big
supermarket]. Third supermarket I shop at, south end of next town
north, has entrance on left. Fourth supermarket I occasionally shop
at, north end of next town north, has entrance on the right, as you
suggest. Fifth supermarket, near where I work, has entrance in the
very middle.

I know that five is a very small sample, statistically, but I
certainly don't see a trend.

Charles
--
"And some rin up hill and down dale, knapping the
chucky stanes to pieces wi' hammers, like sae mony
road-makers run daft -- they say it is to see how
the warld was made!"
Tom Accuosti
2004-02-18 19:28:09 UTC
Permalink
In news:ZLIYb.23232$O%***@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com,
Charles Wm. Dimmick <***@snet.net> informed us:
| D.M. Procida wrote:
|| I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about
|| supermarket design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is
|| 'better' (i.e. somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's
|| owners) if shoppers flow around it anti-clockwise, and so most
|| supermarkets have their entrances at the right.
|
| Two supermarkets are remaining in my town. One has its entry on the
| left. The second has entrances on both left and right side [big
| supermarket]. Third supermarket I shop at, south end of next town
| north, has entrance on left. Fourth supermarket I occasionally shop
| at, north end of next town north, has entrance on the right, as you
| suggest. Fifth supermarket, near where I work, has entrance in the
| very middle.
|
| I know that five is a very small sample, statistically, but I
| certainly don't see a trend.

This is coincidental - a new supermarket just opened in my town - that's
three for 40,000 people - and they are set up just like the other two:
doors open in the middle, but traffic tends to flow right (CCW).

This strikes me as odd, until I realized that if you follow the route,
you hit Produce first, then Meats, then other groceries, and finish up
in the Frozen Food aisle. If you are buying for a family for a week or
so, a shopping trip might take 45 minutes. It makes sense to pick up the
ice cream last so it's not drippy when you get it home.

Tom "I'm outta there in 10 minutes anyway" Accuosti
Mary Shafer
2004-02-18 23:55:30 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 19:28:09 GMT, "Tom Accuosti"
Post by Tom Accuosti
This is coincidental - a new supermarket just opened in my town - that's
doors open in the middle, but traffic tends to flow right (CCW).
This strikes me as odd, until I realized that if you follow the route,
you hit Produce first, then Meats, then other groceries, and finish up
in the Frozen Food aisle. If you are buying for a family for a week or
so, a shopping trip might take 45 minutes. It makes sense to pick up the
ice cream last so it's not drippy when you get it home.
In Lancaster and Palm Desert, the frozen food is typically in the
middle and produce is on the left (as you come in the door). There
are two sets of doors, one on each side, about a quarter of the width
from the side walls. Service deli, service bakery, meat, dairy, fish,
and produce are on the perimeter.

The flow seems to be equally divided. I like to end up at the service
deli, which dictates clockwise in three of the stores and
counter-clockwise in two. However, that's idiosyncratic and purely
because I don't trust deli foods to be quite as safe as packaged food.

I'm inclined to think that boustrophedon, followed by a sweep around
the perimeter, is most efficient. That puts the heavy stuff, like
canned goods and diet coke, in the bottom of the cart, and delicate
stuff, like eggs and deli sandwiches, on top. Not that I'm always
good at doing it this way, of course. I don't buy enough from the
interior rows to go up and down every one.

I just got back from the market and I'm still a little irritated that
the carts won't hold a fifteen-roll package of paper towels on the
shelf under the basket. The vertical height is about a half an inch
too short. It wouldn't have been so bad except that diet coke
twelve-packs were on sale three for $7.59, which is a really good
price, and I'd filled the basket up with a few of those, so I had to
go around the store with the paper towels balanced crosswise on the
top of the basket.

Mary "where's my club card?"
--
Mary Shafer Retired aerospace research engineer
***@qnet.com
danny burstein
2004-02-19 00:00:32 UTC
Permalink
[ whole bunch of stuff deleted ]

This ties into the "which way do bank robbers run when they reach the
corner" question. And as all followers of crime dramas know, it's
generally to the right.

Apparently it's all tied into the fact that all proper thinking countries
have their motor vehicles on the right, as opposed to left, side of the
road. So you run in the same direction as car travel, etc., etc.
--
_____________________________________________________
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key
***@panix.com
[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]
Ad absurdum per aspera
2004-02-19 17:54:56 UTC
Permalink
Quite a lot of research (and, I'd imagine, a certain amount of
tradition, supposition, and subjective preference and conventional
wisdom masquerading as fact) goes into inducing you to load that
basket maximally and come back for more instead of going to one of the
competitors.

Someone intrigued by the subject might want to start with _Why We
Buy_: The Science of Shopping_ by Paco Underhill (though I seem to
recall it had more to do with dry-goods sorts of stores than
supermarkets) and its new sequel   _Call of the Mall: The Author of
"Why We Buy" on the Geography of Shopping_.


I have a very strong cultural and/or personal expectation of entering
toward the right, then going around the perimeter counterclockwise
starting with produce, with dairy soon thereafter, and the butcher
shop at either twelve or nine o'clock. If it is a large place I
expect ice cream and frozen foods to be more or less in the center.
It's disorienting to encounter major deviations from this scheme,
especially in a supermarket that is exceptionally large and ringed
with additional store-within-a-store areas. I have to deviate from my
usual practice of navigating along familiar paths like Konrad Lorenz's
shrews and actually study the signs, and I don't like that (especially
if my trouble is rewarded by prices that aren't all that good anyway).

--Joe
Thomas Prufer
2004-02-18 13:13:05 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 17 Feb 2004 21:18:39 +0000,
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about supermarket
design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is 'better' (i.e.
somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's owners) if shoppers flow
around it anti-clockwise, and so most supermarkets have their entrances
at the right.
Read something similar: shoppers will tend to go around
counter-clockwise, and also head off to the right more than to the left.
So a standard shopper will come in, turn right, and go round the walls
counterclockwise. "Power lanes" are used to direct shoppers -- open
routes, often delineated by flooring in different colors.

This traffic pattern also tends to influence the layout of the goods.
The things a shopper will buy anyway (say, toilet paper), are placed so
that you have to go past the things a shopper needs to be tempted to
buy. Also, the placement of sweets in checkout lanes where children will
have time to apply whines is not accidental. The German term for
checkout lane stuff is "Quengelware" -- "nagware".

Don't recall exactly where I picked up these snippets.


Thomas Prufer
Bill Schnakenberg
2004-02-18 14:30:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thomas Prufer
On Tue, 17 Feb 2004 21:18:39 +0000,
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about supermarket
design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is 'better' (i.e.
somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's owners) if shoppers flow
around it anti-clockwise, and so most supermarkets have their entrances
at the right.
Read something similar: shoppers will tend to go around
counter-clockwise, and also head off to the right more than to the left.
So a standard shopper will come in, turn right, and go round the walls
counterclockwise. "Power lanes" are used to direct shoppers -- open
routes, often delineated by flooring in different colors.
This traffic pattern also tends to influence the layout of the goods.
The things a shopper will buy anyway (say, toilet paper), are placed so
that you have to go past the things a shopper needs to be tempted to
buy. Also, the placement of sweets in checkout lanes where children will
have time to apply whines is not accidental. The German term for
checkout lane stuff is "Quengelware" -- "nagware".
Don't recall exactly where I picked up these snippets.
http://www.checkedforyou.de/UNIQ1076660983014422466/doc5672A.html
For those not fluent in German, you can go to Babelfish and get a rough
translation. http://babelfish.altavista.com/
Post by Thomas Prufer
Thomas Prufer
--
Bill
Lots42 The Library Avenger
2004-02-23 13:50:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thomas Prufer
Also, the placement of sweets in checkout lanes where children will
have time to apply whines is not accidental.
One of the things I missed about Maryland is how many of the stores had signs
pointing out the candy free aisle.

(Heck, I get tempted also!)
--
"Oh, trusty soda machine! I push you for root beer, you give me coke." -
Willow Rosenberg
[ Yendi: "It's almost 10! Why didn't you eat dinner?"
Me: "Because I was writing." ] - Shadesong, via Livejournal
Bill Schnakenberg
2004-02-18 14:17:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about supermarket
design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is 'better' (i.e.
somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's owners) if shoppers flow
around it anti-clockwise, and so most supermarkets have their entrances
at the right.
Daniele
Most of the supermarkets that I frequent do have the entrances on the right
side. Whether they are designed that way for sales purposes, or for the
reason that most customers are right-handed (I am) and there are products
in bins, shelves, or cases along the outside walls, which makes it more
convenient for them to hold the cart with the left hand and pick up items
with their more dexterous right hands, I find it more comfortable to enter
a supermarket from the right side and shop counterclockwise. Of course,
once you start traversing the inner aisles, the location of the entrance
door is moot. When presented with a left door situation, I will usually
make the trip across the front of the store and start on the right side.
There are a few supermarkets that have entrances on both sides, and I
always find myself parking on the right side of the lot so that I can enter
the right side door.
--
Bill
James Roberts
2004-02-18 15:16:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about
supermarket design, and the claim that studies have shown that it
is 'better' (i.e. somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's
owners) if shoppers flow around it anti-clockwise, and so most
supermarkets have their entrances at the right.
Daniele
In the "village" that I live in (population 35000) in .nl
two of the three super?markets that I visit have the door on the left,
checkouts to the right. The one out-of-town big place does have
the door on the right.

But then again, the few Sainsbury & Tesco hypermarkets that
I have visited in the UKoGBaNI all (three of them) had the door
on the left. I detect a certain randomness about this, that
can not be explained by markets that are larger or smaller
that a certain size.

What to me seems consistant is the fresh veg by the entrance,
and the fresh bread in the far most corner.

seamus "ambidextrous markets R Us"
L0nD0t.$t0we11
2004-02-19 04:08:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about supermarket
design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is 'better' (i.e.
somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's owners) if shoppers flow
around it anti-clockwise, and so most supermarkets have their entrances
at the right.
Is old tradition... wandering widdershins thwu the wieners.
--
Boys are stupid, throw rocks at them...
R H Draney
2004-02-19 06:15:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by L0nD0t.$t0we11
Is old tradition... wandering widdershins thwu the wieners.
Traded in your official AFU accordion for a Tiny Tim autographed ukulele?...r
Juergen Nieveler
2004-02-20 12:41:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by D.M. Procida
I just came across a discussion in another newsgroup about supermarket
design, and the claim that studies have shown that it is 'better' (i.e.
somehow more advantageous for the supermarket's owners) if shoppers flow
around it anti-clockwise, and so most supermarkets have their entrances
at the right.
According to this statistic (in german, sorry...) 61% of the
Aldi-stores in the database are anti-clockwise, 39% clockwise:

http://tinyurl.com/yq7bf
--
Juergen Nieveler / ***@web.de / PGP supported!
Researchers at John Hopkins have pinpointed the main cause of teenage
pregnancy. It's called a 'date'
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