Post by bigdogPost by mainframetechPost by Beyond WikipediaPost by bigdogThat explanation is absolutely bizarre. Lipsey didn't say anything that
remotely suggests that.
LIPSEY: The bullet entered lower part of the head or upper part of the
neck. [long pause] To the best of my knowledge, came out the front of the
neck. But the one that I remember they spent so much time on, obviously,
was the one they found did not come out. There was a bullet -- that's my
vivid recollection cause that's all they talked about. For about two hours
all they talked about was finding that bullet. To the rest of my
recollection they found some particles but they never found the bullet --
pieces of it, trances of it. The best of my knowledge, this is one thing I
definitely remember they just never found that whole bullet.
Q: What was it you observed that made you feel that exited -- the bullet
that entered the rear portion of his head exited in the throat area?
LIPSEY: The throat area. Right. The lower throat area.
Q: What, were there markings there that indicated that the doctors came to
that conclusion?
LIPSEY: I saw where, you know, they were working and also listening to
their conclusions.
https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/hsca/med_testimony/Lipsey_1-18-78/HSCA-Lipsey.htm
In the earlier part of the autopsy, the prosectors ALL realized there
was NO EXIT for that bullet that hit the upper back (not any part of the
'neck').
No they THOUGHT there was no exit wound because they had an entry wound in
the back and no apparent corresponding exit wound. That observation was
made based on limited information.
I agree. However, later they got validation of their first thoughts.
I'll fill in the proof later.
Post by bigdogThey were really baffled when two sets
of x-rays failed to reveal a bullet which they thought should still be in
the body. Stumped by those facts, entry wound and no bullet in the body,
they floated some bizarre ideas like the ice bullet and the bullet falling
out during heart massage.
The "ice bullet" idea was from James Sibert, FBI agent,. who felt he had
to make a call about it, when he heard the prosectors couldn't find the
back wound bullet. Another possibility that weacaped everyone was the
sworn testimony of Jerrol Custer, X-ray Technician who said the following:
"When I lifted the body up to take films of
the torso, and the lumbar spine, and the pelvis,
this is when a king-size fragment - I’d say -
estimate around three, four sonometers - fell from
the back. And this is when Dr. Finck come over
with a pair of forceps, picked it up, and took -
That’s the last time I ever saw it.
Now, it was big enough -That’s about,
I’d say, an inch and a half. My finger-my small
finger. First joints."
From: http://aarclibrary.org/publib/jfk/arrb/medical_testimony/pdf/Custer_10-28-97.pdf
Page 53
Sonometer = centimeter, and 3-4 centimeters is long enough to be many
types of bullet.
Post by bigdogLater on when they opened up the chest cavity
and observed the trail of damaged tissue leading from the exit wound to
the trachea they began to suspect that the tracheostomy incision had been
performed over a bullet hole in the throat, a suspicion that was confirmed
when they contacted Parkland.
Sorry, they did NOT find a "trail of damaged tissue" from the back
wound to the throat wound. If you go back and read the Autopsy Report
(AR) again, you'll see that they say that the "pleura was INTACT". The
pleura is tissue that was between the back wound and the throat wound, so
the bullet never passed that point, or the pleura would have been torn or
punctured. As well, there was NO reference to any dissection of such a
path you describe, and that's the standard method for determining the path
of a bullet. The AR also says "The missile path through the fascia and
musculature cannot be easily probed." And then it says nothing about any
prof of that path.
Post by bigdogMystery solved. But you, being a conspiracy
hobbyist, continue to insist they must stick with the early observation of
"no exit" no matter what they later learned. You insist that comment was a
conclusion rather than a hypothesis that proved to be incorrect.
Post by mainframetechHere's the sworn testimony of James Sibert, FBI agent, who was
"But when they raised him up, then they
found this back wound. And that’s when they
started probing with the rubber glove and the
finger, and - and also with the chrome probe.
And that’s just before, of course, I made
this call, because they were at a loss to explain
what had happened to this bullet. They couldn’t
find any bullet.
And they said, ‘There's no exit.” Finck,
in particular, said, "There’s no exit.” And they
said that you could feel it with the end of the
finger - I mean, the depth of this wound."
From: http://aarclibrary.org/publib/jfk/arrb/medical_testimony/pdf/Sibert_9-11-97.pdf
Page 111
They later got verification of that conclusion when they had removed
the organs and saw that the pleura and right lung had NOT been penetrated,
and had NO tears or punctures.
No, they later saw evidence that the "no exit" idea was just plain wrong.
Post by mainframetechThe Autopsy Report (AR) also stated that
the pleura was still "intact".
Of course it was. The bullet didn't pass through it. It passed over the
top of it.
Nope. Bullets don't make curves in cases like this around tissues,
they go through them. The Pleura and the right lung it encases both had
bruises of about 2 inches in diameter, clearly showing that they both were
hit by the bullet, yet there was NO tears or punctures in them.
Post by bigdogPost by mainframetechTherefore NO bullet got past that point in
the body, and either was removed during the clandestine work done on the
body by Humes and Boswell, or it fell out of the back as Jerrol Custer
You seem to be one of the few people in this world who actually believes
that nonsense and none of the others is any more qualified than you to
make such a judgement.
You forget that I'm not making a judgment, I'm repeating what a
technician said under oath. But let's go a little further, since you're
an unbeliever. Here's the statement of one of the members of the autopsy
team Paul O'Connor:
"O'Connor: We started out with a rigid probe and found that it only went
in so far. I'd say maybe an inch and a quarter. It didn't go any further
than that. So we used a malleable probe and bent it a little bit and found
out that the bullet entered the body, went through the intercostal
muscles—the muscles in between the ribs. The bullet went in
through the muscles, didn't touch any of the ribs, arched downwards, hit
the back of the pleural cavity, which encases the lungs, both front and
back. It bounced off that cavity and stopped. It actually went down and
stopped. Went through the ribs and stopped. So we didn't know the track of
the bullet until we eviscerated the body later. That's what happened at
that time. We traced the bullet path down and found out it didn't traverse
the body. It did not go in one side and come out the other side of the
body.
Law: You can be reasonably sure of that?
O'Connor: Absolutely.
Law: It was just from the probe then?
O'Connor: Oh yes.
Law: And these doctors knew that?
O'Connor: Absolutely.
Law: While it happened?
O'Connor: Absolutely."
From: "In the Eyes of History" by William Matson Law, pages 40-41
https://www.krusch.com/books/kennedy/In_The_Eye_Of_History.pdf
Post by bigdogPost by mainframetech"When I lifted the body up to take films of
the torso, and the lumbar spine, and the pelvis,
this is when a king-size fragment - I’d say -
estimate around three, four sonometers - fell from
the back. And this is when Dr. Finck come over
with a pair of forceps, picked it up, and took -
That’s the last time I ever saw it.
Now, it was big enough -That’s about,
I’d say, an inch and a half. My finger-my small
finger. First joints."
From: http://aarclibrary.org/publib/jfk/arrb/medical_testimony/pdf/Custer_10-28-97.pdf
Page 53
Sonometer = centimeter, and 3-4 centimeters is long enough to be many
types of bullet.
You continue to put your faith in a lying bozo who doesn't even know the
difference between a sonometer and a centimeter.
I wonder how you figured out that he was a "lying bozo". I guess I
have to inform you as well as the other bozo that thought that, sonometer
is used in the medical profession, probably a bastardization of Centimeter
in a French accent. The X-ray technician probably picked it up from the
doctors around Bethesda. It was 1963, not current day.
There is other evidence that the prosectors had to lie under orders in
the Autopsy Report (AR). However, when the order of silence was
dismissed, and the ARRB came into being, many of the forgotten enlisted
men, who had been ignored, were able to make statements and clear up a lot
of cover up.
The whole purpose in stealing the body and limousine off to Washington
was to get the body autopsied at a military hospital so that orders would
be given with the right excuse, and the orders would be followed, which
was the case here.
Chris