On "silly" reviews and hyperbole.....Elena Kuschnerova revisited

[dave12122]

Recently, I posted a largely positive review of Elena Kuschnerova
playing Bach, one of my favorite CDs. A certain Andy Evans (who I do
not know) took me to task for being far too positive, and thus
apparently unbelievable.
This is disturbing. Are there really people out there that think a
particular CD cannot be of the highest flight, the best caliber, the
most life enhancing?? One of the reasons I really don't like reading
most reviews is the distressing mentality that at some point the
reviewer has to show his endless knowledge of classical recordings by
making some uncalled for comparison (which 99% of the time can be
distilled down to mere "taste") or picayune technical comments
regarding a wrong note or smudged passage that would not affect most
peoples' enjoyment of the CD. People that know Elena realize that the
issue with my review is not that I went too far, but that I did not go
far enough. Listen to her stream of Stravinsky's Three Movements from
Petruschka and then tell me that she is one of the finest living woman
pianists, probably the very finest if sheer musicality is considered.
To me, Elena is the quintessential successful pianist. Of course, no
one has to agree with this, but that does not make my reviews "silly",
"over the top", or "hyperbole". It's so easy to criticize and make
fun of something you don't like....fortunately, Elena's extraordinary
vision triumphs over all. Her live in Tokyo CD, along with the
Scriabin and Prokofieff CDs are really absolutely essential, if for no
other reason to illustrate what someone can accomplish who is not a
"household word". Is Elena's playing perfect? Of course not, but
neither is anyone elses'....look at Horowitz for example. People
don't realize how much of his playing is outright sloppy with
inconsistent tone, if you or I submitted similar performances to a
classical music recording company our CD would be quickly returned.
Elena's "track record" is remarkable...no even slightly second rate
performances, and a startling affinity to a wide variety of composers
from Scarlatti through Bach to Chopin and Liszt and eventually
Stravinsky, Prokofieff and Scriabin. Few pianists (Richter comes to
mind) can handle such a bewildering array of styles and imitate
Elena's complete identification with the composer. I hope that my
review inspires some open-minded individuals to go to her website and
prepare to be blown away. Oops...there I go with hyperbole
again....guess I'll have to go to bed without any supper and listen to
The Three Tenors. Thank you Elena, and apologizes for the tone and
ugly comments on the last thread.....you certainly deserve better!

Dave DeLucia

[d***@yahoo.com]

She is one of the finest living woman
pianists, probably the very finest if sheer musicality is considered.
To me, Elena is the quintessential successful pianist. Of course, no
one has to agree with this, but that does not make my reviews "silly",
"over the top", or "hyperbole".
Dave DeLucia

Well, it actually does, Dave.

It is always very difficult to "compare" pianists anyway, but to use
phrases such as "one of the finest living woman pianist", "probably
the finest" is meaningless. Why? Because of one Bach CD? Moreover,
what has her sex got to do with it anyway? Why is she not simply a
pianist?

To say that she is a fine pianist, and a fine musician should be
enough. And that you like her a lot, if you want to add that.

But the superlatives are simply unnecessary and constitute the kind of
hyperbole which causes problems with other listeners who may not share
your views or even take exception to the very notion of a kind of
pecking order of pianists, with a few sitting at the top. Cats
fighting over the top spot on the totem pole. A really lamentable view
of music and musicians.

What does that make the other women pianists? Inferior pianists,
inferior musicians, somehow less interesting?

And you don't have to throw up the Martha A example either. We all
know Martha's abilities, her charisma, her technical wizzardry. Should
we say that she is good, but not that good, really, and certainly not
as good as EK? Can't she just stand on her own, without being compared
to others? The same for EK?

That said, I have compared EK - when egged on by Dmitry - with other
pianists simply in order to defend my expression of surprise at the
Moussorgsky Pictures sounding like Beethoven Op. 111 and called up
Horowitz and Richter and Janis as more successful interpreters, or at
the very least very interesting interpreters of the same music, both
Russians, and therefore putting EK's view of this music into a
different, less successful light.

But my first instinct is simply to say I find it too ernst, too heavy,
too serious, too Beethoven Op. 111.

So, by all means share your enthusiasm, but perhaps you should temper
it a bit and make it less exclusionary. We all understand why Dmitry
does this, but not you.

TD

[LaVirtuosa]

Post by d***@yahoo.com

She is one of the finest living woman
pianists, probably the very finest if sheer musicality is considered.
To me, Elena is the quintessential successful pianist. Of course, no
one has to agree with this, but that does not make my reviews "silly",
"over the top", or "hyperbole".
Dave DeLucia

Well, it actually does, Dave.
It is always very difficult to "compare" pianists anyway, but to use
phrases such as "one of the finest living woman pianist", "probably
the finest" is meaningless. Why? Because of one Bach CD? Moreover,
what has her sex got to do with it anyway? Why is she not simply a
pianist?

Good point. From now on, on should refer to non-female pianists as
male pianists. The difference does matter. A prominent music critic
who is also a good friend of mine, once suggested that women handle
climaxes differetly than men, the women being better at doing several
subclimaxes, while the men do just one big one.

*********Val

[d***@yahoo.com]

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com
It is always very difficult to "compare" pianists anyway, but to use
phrases such as "one of the finest living woman pianist", "probably
the finest" is meaningless. Why? Because of one Bach CD? Moreover,
what has her sex got to do with it anyway? Why is she not simply a
pianist?

Good point. From now on, on should refer to non-female pianists as
male pianists. The difference does matter. A prominent music critic
who is also a good friend of mine, once suggested that women handle
climaxes differetly than men, the women being better at doing several
subclimaxes, while the men do just one big one.
*********Val

This is a hilarious notion, Val.

What if the composer only wrote one climax instead of many? Would that
mean that the women couldn't handle it properly.

Think, perhaps, of the Liszt Sonata, which really does have only one
climax, although there are other high points, of course. Does that
mean that women couldn't tell the difference and that all the points
would be equally high, thus eliminating the climax.

Martha, then, would be something of a hermaphrodite, as she does play
the Liszt Sonata with the real climax in the proper place.

As I say, a hilarious notion. One clearly invented by men!!!

TD

[LaVirtuosa]

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com
It is always very difficult to "compare" pianists anyway, but to use
phrases such as "one of the finest living woman pianist", "probably
the finest" is meaningless. Why? Because of one Bach CD? Moreover,
what has her sex got to do with it anyway? Why is she not simply a
pianist?

Good point. From now on, on should refer to non-female pianists as
male pianists. The difference does matter. A prominent music critic
who is also a good friend of mine, once suggested that women handle
climaxes differetly than men, the women being better at doing several
subclimaxes, while the men do just one big one.
*********Val

This is a hilarious notion, Val.
What if the composer only wrote one climax instead of many? Would that
mean that the women couldn't handle it properly.
Think, perhaps, of the Liszt Sonata, which really does have only one
climax, although there are other high points, of course. Does that
mean that women couldn't tell the difference and that all the points
would be equally high, thus eliminating the climax.
Martha, then, would be something of a hermaphrodite, as she does play
the Liszt Sonata with the real climax in the proper place.
As I say, a hilarious notion. One clearly invented by men!!!
TD

You don't think the Liszt Sonata has multiple climaxes?????? It's
ironic, but Rachmaninoff's music, with his famous culminating point,
is handled especially well by women pianists. Why? Because we can
sustain the tension longer. Men, S. Richter for instance, tend or
tended to blow it all prematurely.

**********Val (who remembers Leonard Bernstein's talks)

[d***@yahoo.com]

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com
It is always very difficult to "compare" pianists anyway, but to use
phrases such as "one of the finest living woman pianist", "probably
the finest" is meaningless. Why? Because of one Bach CD? Moreover,
what has her sex got to do with it anyway? Why is she not simply a
pianist?

Good point. From now on, on should refer to non-female pianists as
male pianists. The difference does matter. A prominent music critic
who is also a good friend of mine, once suggested that women handle
climaxes differetly than men, the women being better at doing several
subclimaxes, while the men do just one big one.
*********Val

This is a hilarious notion, Val.
What if the composer only wrote one climax instead of many? Would that
mean that the women couldn't handle it properly.
Think, perhaps, of the Liszt Sonata, which really does have only one
climax, although there are other high points, of course. Does that
mean that women couldn't tell the difference and that all the points
would be equally high, thus eliminating the climax.
Martha, then, would be something of a hermaphrodite, as she does play
the Liszt Sonata with the real climax in the proper place.
As I say, a hilarious notion. One clearly invented by men!!!
TD

You don't think the Liszt Sonata has multiple climaxes?????? It's
ironic, but Rachmaninoff's music, with his famous culminating point,
is handled especially well by women pianists. Why? Because we can
sustain the tension longer. Men, S. Richter for instance, tend or
tended to blow it all prematurely.
**********Val (who remembers Leonard Bernstein's talks)

As I think I said above, Val, the Liszt Sonata has many "high points"
but only one climax.

And if you miss that one, flattening it out to the same level as the
others, you have missed the "point" of the sonata.

Interestingly enough, this happens a lot, you know, which is why I
rarely go to hear anyone play this piece any more.

TD

[LaVirtuosa]

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com
It is always very difficult to "compare" pianists anyway, but to use
phrases such as "one of the finest living woman pianist", "probably
the finest" is meaningless. Why? Because of one Bach CD? Moreover,
what has her sex got to do with it anyway? Why is she not simply a
pianist?

Good point. From now on, on should refer to non-female pianists as
male pianists. The difference does matter. A prominent music critic
who is also a good friend of mine, once suggested that women handle
climaxes differetly than men, the women being better at doing several
subclimaxes, while the men do just one big one.
*********Val

This is a hilarious notion, Val.
What if the composer only wrote one climax instead of many? Would that
mean that the women couldn't handle it properly.
Think, perhaps, of the Liszt Sonata, which really does have only one
climax, although there are other high points, of course. Does that
mean that women couldn't tell the difference and that all the points
would be equally high, thus eliminating the climax.
Martha, then, would be something of a hermaphrodite, as she does play
the Liszt Sonata with the real climax in the proper place.
As I say, a hilarious notion. One clearly invented by men!!!
TD

You don't think the Liszt Sonata has multiple climaxes?????? It's
ironic, but Rachmaninoff's music, with his famous culminating point,
is handled especially well by women pianists. Why? Because we can
sustain the tension longer. Men, S. Richter for instance, tend or
tended to blow it all prematurely.
**********Val (who remembers Leonard Bernstein's talks)

As I think I said above, Val, the Liszt Sonata has many "high points"
but only one climax.
And if you miss that one, flattening it out to the same level as the
others, you have missed the "point" of the sonata.
Interestingly enough, this happens a lot, you know, which is why I
rarely go to hear anyone play this piece any more.
TD

Tom, I was only taunting you. Of course we need to establish a
climax, not necessarily where it seems the most obvious. Instead, how
about the very last note?


***************Val

[d***@yahoo.com]

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com
It is always very difficult to "compare" pianists anyway, but to use
phrases such as "one of the finest living woman pianist", "probably
the finest" is meaningless. Why? Because of one Bach CD? Moreover,
what has her sex got to do with it anyway? Why is she not simply a
pianist?

Good point. From now on, on should refer to non-female pianists as
male pianists. The difference does matter. A prominent music critic
who is also a good friend of mine, once suggested that women handle
climaxes differetly than men, the women being better at doing several
subclimaxes, while the men do just one big one.
*********Val

This is a hilarious notion, Val.
What if the composer only wrote one climax instead of many? Would that
mean that the women couldn't handle it properly.
Think, perhaps, of the Liszt Sonata, which really does have only one
climax, although there are other high points, of course. Does that
mean that women couldn't tell the difference and that all the points
would be equally high, thus eliminating the climax.
Martha, then, would be something of a hermaphrodite, as she does play
the Liszt Sonata with the real climax in the proper place.
As I say, a hilarious notion. One clearly invented by men!!!
TD

You don't think the Liszt Sonata has multiple climaxes?????? It's
ironic, but Rachmaninoff's music, with his famous culminating point,
is handled especially well by women pianists. Why? Because we can
sustain the tension longer. Men, S. Richter for instance, tend or
tended to blow it all prematurely.
**********Val (who remembers Leonard Bernstein's talks)

As I think I said above, Val, the Liszt Sonata has many "high points"
but only one climax.
And if you miss that one, flattening it out to the same level as the
others, you have missed the "point" of the sonata.
Interestingly enough, this happens a lot, you know, which is why I
rarely go to hear anyone play this piece any more.
TD

Tom, I was only taunting you. Of course we need to establish a
climax, not necessarily where it seems the most obvious. Instead, how
about the very last note?

You don't taunt, Val. You tease. There is a big difference, you know?

The last note is maybe the hardest of them all. It should be like a
death, the expiry. Unlike the first note, which is a birth.

Liszt was some kind of genius, you know.

TD

[LaVirtuosa]

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com
It is always very difficult to "compare" pianists anyway, but to use
phrases such as "one of the finest living woman pianist", "probably
the finest" is meaningless. Why? Because of one Bach CD? Moreover,
what has her sex got to do with it anyway? Why is she not simply a
pianist?

Good point. From now on, on should refer to non-female pianists as
male pianists. The difference does matter. A prominent music critic
who is also a good friend of mine, once suggested that women handle
climaxes differetly than men, the women being better at doing several
subclimaxes, while the men do just one big one.
*********Val

This is a hilarious notion, Val.
What if the composer only wrote one climax instead of many? Would that
mean that the women couldn't handle it properly.
Think, perhaps, of the Liszt Sonata, which really does have only one
climax, although there are other high points, of course. Does that
mean that women couldn't tell the difference and that all the points
would be equally high, thus eliminating the climax.
Martha, then, would be something of a hermaphrodite, as she does play
the Liszt Sonata with the real climax in the proper place.
As I say, a hilarious notion. One clearly invented by men!!!
TD

You don't think the Liszt Sonata has multiple climaxes?????? It's
ironic, but Rachmaninoff's music, with his famous culminating point,
is handled especially well by women pianists. Why? Because we can
sustain the tension longer. Men, S. Richter for instance, tend or
tended to blow it all prematurely.
**********Val (who remembers Leonard Bernstein's talks)

As I think I said above, Val, the Liszt Sonata has many "high points"
but only one climax.
And if you miss that one, flattening it out to the same level as the
others, you have missed the "point" of the sonata.
Interestingly enough, this happens a lot, you know, which is why I
rarely go to hear anyone play this piece any more.
TD

Tom, I was only taunting you. Of course we need to establish a
climax, not necessarily where it seems the most obvious. Instead, how
about the very last note?

You don't taunt, Val. You tease. There is a big difference, you know?
The last note is maybe the hardest of them all. It should be like a
death, the expiry. Unlike the first note, which is a birth.
Liszt was some kind of genius, you know.
TD

It's the scariest note in the literature of the piano. To me it
signifies something very different--in spite of all the things which
have happened in the piece, nothing has changed. The goblin is still
there.

*********Val

[Ian Pace]

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com
It is always very difficult to "compare" pianists anyway, but to use
phrases such as "one of the finest living woman pianist", "probably
the finest" is meaningless. Why? Because of one Bach CD? Moreover,
what has her sex got to do with it anyway? Why is she not simply a
pianist?

Good point. From now on, on should refer to non-female pianists as
male pianists. The difference does matter. A prominent music critic
who is also a good friend of mine, once suggested that women handle
climaxes differetly than men, the women being better at doing several
subclimaxes, while the men do just one big one.
*********Val

This is a hilarious notion, Val.
What if the composer only wrote one climax instead of many? Would that
mean that the women couldn't handle it properly.
Think, perhaps, of the Liszt Sonata, which really does have only one
climax, although there are other high points, of course. Does that
mean that women couldn't tell the difference and that all the points
would be equally high, thus eliminating the climax.
Martha, then, would be something of a hermaphrodite, as she does play
the Liszt Sonata with the real climax in the proper place.
As I say, a hilarious notion. One clearly invented by men!!!
TD

You don't think the Liszt Sonata has multiple climaxes?????? It's
ironic, but Rachmaninoff's music, with his famous culminating point,
is handled especially well by women pianists. Why? Because we can
sustain the tension longer. Men, S. Richter for instance, tend or
tended to blow it all prematurely.
**********Val (who remembers Leonard Bernstein's talks)

As I think I said above, Val, the Liszt Sonata has many "high points"
but only one climax.
And if you miss that one, flattening it out to the same level as the
others, you have missed the "point" of the sonata.
Interestingly enough, this happens a lot, you know, which is why I
rarely go to hear anyone play this piece any more.
TD

Tom, I was only taunting you. Of course we need to establish a
climax, not necessarily where it seems the most obvious. Instead, how
about the very last note?

The last note (notes, the EMB edition of the sonata reckons the '8' sign
indicates a whole octave, just like that notation is used about 5 pages into
the work) somehow denies all possibility of a total cumulative climax (if
you agree that it should be played short and staccato, Horowitz-style, a
'damped timpani stroke' like Liszt's instruction for the opening, shattering
the illusionary nirvana of the chords that precede). The pitch is a
resolution, of course (we have to wait until a bit later in Liszt's life for
those truly enigmatic, dissonant endings - or are there some earlier
examples that I have forgotten?), but the articulation does something else
entirely, resisting any sense of catharsis. The ongoing dialectic between
the ghostly sounds of the staccato notes and octaves on one hand, and the
long expansive melodies on the other (not to mention many other types of
oppositions), progresses and develops throughout, but is left ultimately
unresolved. This is one of the many reasons the work is so striking for its
modernity. Different elements (passion, virtuosity, violence, lyricism) all
have their own 'climaxes' at different points in the piece (this is true of
a lot of music, really), rather than the work being teleologically directed
to just one singular climatic point, IMO. The last two pages are surely
something more than a mere epilogue? Maybe that is true of the last piece
in Schumann's Davidsbundlertanze, though in that case the musical material
doesn't bear any obvious thematic relationship with that which has preceded
it, unlike in the Liszt.

As for whether these things would be better realized by male or female
pianists, I'd sooner leave that to Susan McClary.

Best,
Ian

[LaVirtuosa]

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com
It is always very difficult to "compare" pianists anyway, but to

use

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com
phrases such as "one of the finest living woman pianist",

"probably

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com
the finest" is meaningless. Why? Because of one Bach CD? Moreover,
what has her sex got to do with it anyway? Why is she not simply a
pianist?

Good point. From now on, on should refer to non-female pianists as
male pianists. The difference does matter. A prominent music

critic

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa
who is also a good friend of mine, once suggested that women handle
climaxes differetly than men, the women being better at doing

several

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa
subclimaxes, while the men do just one big one.
*********Val

This is a hilarious notion, Val.
What if the composer only wrote one climax instead of many? Would

that

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by LaVirtuosa

Post by d***@yahoo.com
mean that the women couldn't handle it properly.
Think, perhaps, of the Liszt Sonata, which really does have only one
climax, although there are other high points, of course. Does that
mean that women couldn't tell the difference and that all the points
would be equally high, thus eliminating the climax.
Martha, then, would be something of a hermaphrodite, as she does play
the Liszt Sonata with the real climax in the proper place.
As I say, a hilarious notion. One clearly invented by men!!!
TD

You don't think the Liszt Sonata has multiple climaxes?????? It's
ironic, but Rachmaninoff's music, with his famous culminating point,
is handled especially well by women pianists. Why? Because we can
sustain the tension longer. Men, S. Richter for instance, tend or
tended to blow it all prematurely.
**********Val (who remembers Leonard Bernstein's talks)

As I think I said above, Val, the Liszt Sonata has many "high points"
but only one climax.
And if you miss that one, flattening it out to the same level as the
others, you have missed the "point" of the sonata.
Interestingly enough, this happens a lot, you know, which is why I
rarely go to hear anyone play this piece any more.
TD

Tom, I was only taunting you. Of course we need to establish a
climax, not necessarily where it seems the most obvious. Instead, how
about the very last note?

The last note (notes, the EMB edition of the sonata reckons the '8' sign
indicates a whole octave, just like that notation is used about 5 pages into
the work) somehow denies all possibility of a total cumulative climax (if
you agree that it should be played short and staccato, Horowitz-style, a
'damped timpani stroke' like Liszt's instruction for the opening, shattering
the illusionary nirvana of the chords that precede). The pitch is a
resolution, of course (we have to wait until a bit later in Liszt's life for
those truly enigmatic, dissonant endings - or are there some earlier
examples that I have forgotten?), but the articulation does something else
entirely, resisting any sense of catharsis. The ongoing dialectic between
the ghostly sounds of the staccato notes and octaves on one hand, and the
long expansive melodies on the other (not to mention many other types of
oppositions), progresses and develops throughout, but is left ultimately
unresolved. This is one of the many reasons the work is so striking for its
modernity. Different elements (passion, virtuosity, violence, lyricism) all
have their own 'climaxes' at different points in the piece (this is true of
a lot of music, really), rather than the work being teleologically directed
to just one singular climatic point, IMO. The last two pages are surely
something more than a mere epilogue? Maybe that is true of the last piece
in Schumann's Davidsbundlertanze, though in that case the musical material
doesn't bear any obvious thematic relationship with that which has preceded
it, unlike in the Liszt.
As for whether these things would be better realized by male or female
pianists, I'd sooner leave that to Susan McClary.
Best,
Ian

The last page is an ascent and a descent. You can see it, almost like
a painting when looking at the notes. I suggested the last note be a
climax in order to illustrate that it's almost like a surprise ending.
I do not play it staccato--not sure how to describe the touch. Here
is how I picture the introduction and then the ending of the Liszt
Sonata: Imagine being in hell, and just as your eyes get used to the
dark, you see the silhouette of a little demon peering from around a
corner, another one appearing here, and then another one over there,
and yet another one. Then, as the development continues, one of them
escapes thrusting itself in an upward direction at the allegro
energico, to commence the story line.

************Val

[Dan Koren]

Baby Kant waking up after the Holidays....

Happy New Year -- and watch your quota!



dk

Post by Ian Pace
The last note (notes, the EMB edition of the sonata reckons the '8' sign
indicates a whole octave, just like that notation is used about 5 pages into
the work) somehow denies all possibility of a total cumulative climax (if
you agree that it should be played short and staccato, Horowitz-style, a
'damped timpani stroke' like Liszt's instruction for the opening, shattering
the illusionary nirvana of the chords that precede). The pitch is a
resolution, of course (we have to wait until a bit later in Liszt's life for
those truly enigmatic, dissonant endings - or are there some earlier
examples that I have forgotten?), but the articulation does something else
entirely, resisting any sense of catharsis. The ongoing dialectic between
the ghostly sounds of the staccato notes and octaves on one hand, and the
long expansive melodies on the other (not to mention many other types of
oppositions), progresses and develops throughout, but is left ultimately
unresolved. This is one of the many reasons the work is so striking for its
modernity. Different elements (passion, virtuosity, violence, lyricism) all
have their own 'climaxes' at different points in the piece (this is true of
a lot of music, really), rather than the work being teleologically directed
to just one singular climatic point, IMO. The last two pages are surely
something more than a mere epilogue? Maybe that is true of the last piece
in Schumann's Davidsbundlertanze, though in that case the musical material
doesn't bear any obvious thematic relationship with that which has preceded
it, unlike in the Liszt.
As for whether these things would be better realized by male or female
pianists, I'd sooner leave that to Susan McClary.
Best,
Ian

[Richard Schultz]

In article <***@posting.google.com>, LaVirtuosa <***@aol.com> wrote:

: You don't think the Liszt Sonata has multiple climaxes?????? It's
: ironic, but Rachmaninoff's music, with his famous culminating point,
: is handled especially well by women pianists. Why? Because we can
: sustain the tension longer. Men, S. Richter for instance, tend or
: tended to blow it all prematurely.

I think that you need to take a good course in statistics. What
female pianist ever came close to Rubinstein, Moiseiwitsch, or
Rachmaninoff himself in the 2d piano concerto?

-----
Richard Schultz ***@mail.biu.ac.il
Department of Chemistry, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, Israel
Opinions expressed are mine alone, and not those of Bar-Ilan University
-----
"Contrariwise," continued Tweedledee, "if it was so, it might be, and
if it were so, it would be; but as it isn't, it ain't. That's logic."

[d***@yahoo.com]

Post by Richard Schultz
: You don't think the Liszt Sonata has multiple climaxes?????? It's
: ironic, but Rachmaninoff's music, with his famous culminating point,
: is handled especially well by women pianists. Why? Because we can
: sustain the tension longer. Men, S. Richter for instance, tend or
: tended to blow it all prematurely.
I think that you need to take a good course in statistics. What
female pianist ever came close to Rubinstein, Moiseiwitsch, or
Rachmaninoff himself in the 2d piano concerto?

I suppose you never heard Gina Bachauer.

Or Moura Lympany.

Or Cecile Ousset.

Or Martha Argerich (in my dreams, of course)

Piano-playing has nothing remotely and exclusively "masculine" about
it. To suggest otherwise is only to prove your status as a
neanderthal, something we all knew anyway.

TD

[Dan Koren]

Post by Richard Schultz
I think that you need to take a good
course in statistics. What female
pianist ever came close to Rubinstein,
Moiseiwitsch, or Rachmaninoff himself
in the 2d piano concerto?

Elisabeth Leonskaja played a Richter
class Rachmaninov 2nd and Rubinstein
class Paganini Rhapsody when she was...
18.

Not to mention Ann Schein whose concert
debut performing the Rachmaninov 3rd at
age... 16 caused a major sensation.

Helene Grimaud's debut recording at
age... 16 included a Rachmaninov 2nd
Sonata that counts among the finest
on record, and a set of Etudes
Tableaux that is competitive
with anyone other than Richter
or Pletnev.




dk

PS. Statistics notwithstanding ;-)

PPS. You should keep an eye (err,
an ear) on Christine Yoshikawa.

[Sonarrat]

Post by Dan Koren

Post by Richard Schultz
I think that you need to take a good
course in statistics. What female
pianist ever came close to Rubinstein,
Moiseiwitsch, or Rachmaninoff himself
in the 2d piano concerto?

Elisabeth Leonskaja played a Richter
class Rachmaninov 2nd and Rubinstein
class Paganini Rhapsody when she was...
18.
Not to mention Ann Schein whose concert
debut performing the Rachmaninov 3rd at
age... 16 caused a major sensation.
Helene Grimaud's debut recording at
age... 16 included a Rachmaninov 2nd
Sonata that counts among the finest
on record, and a set of Etudes
Tableaux that is competitive
with anyone other than Richter
or Pletnev.

I should also mention a Rach 2 at the Russian Music Competition which
deserved to win, but puzzlingly earned only joint 3rd prize, by one Aline
Kabanova. It was wonderful... even playing with a second piano rather than
an orchestra, there was enough color in Kabanova's playing to satisfy all
ears.

The winner, Kana Mimaki, played a fire-spitting Rach 1. It was quite
exciting, but I still think Kabanova's sweep and style should have carried
the day.

-Sonarrat.

[LaVirtuosa]

Post by Richard Schultz
: You don't think the Liszt Sonata has multiple climaxes?????? It's
: ironic, but Rachmaninoff's music, with his famous culminating point,
: is handled especially well by women pianists. Why? Because we can
: sustain the tension longer. Men, S. Richter for instance, tend or
: tended to blow it all prematurely.
I think that you need to take a good course in statistics. What
female pianist ever came close to Rubinstein, Moiseiwitsch, or
Rachmaninoff himself in the 2d piano concerto?

As a woman, I like to see a man do it, naturally. However, the
orchestral part of Rach 2 is so masculine so as to cause the piano
part to be almost feminine! Listen again. BTW, Ian Hobson holds
tension in Rachmaninoff as well as any woman. :) :) :) :)

***********Val

[EG]

Post by LaVirtuosa
Good point. From now on, on should refer to non-female pianists as
male pianists. The difference does matter. A prominent music critic
who is also a good friend of mine, once suggested that women handle
climaxes differetly than men, the women being better at doing several
subclimaxes, while the men do just one big one.
*********Val

You mean pianists orgasm on the piano? Or perhaps this is a statement about
sexual practice in general?


Reminds me that a prominent french philosopher has written
that women are better in fluid dynamics,
while men excel more in solid mechanics.

[Bob Lombard]

On 8 Jan 2004 18:31:42 -0800, ***@aol.com (dave12122) wrote:

[snips]

Post by dave12122
Elena's "track record" is remarkable...no even slightly second rate
performances, and a startling affinity to a wide variety of composers
from Scarlatti through Bach to Chopin and Liszt and eventually
Stravinsky, Prokofieff and Scriabin. Few pianists (Richter comes to
mind) can handle such a bewildering array of styles and imitate
Elena's complete identification with the composer.

[snip]

Aside from the incongruous notion of Richter imitating Ms.
Kuschnerova, are you forgetting Michael Ponti?

bl

[Andy Evans]

A certain Andy Evans (who I do
not know) took me to task for being far too positive, and thus apparently
unbelievable.
This is disturbing.>>

You may call me "Andy Evans"now that we are getting to know each other. Yes -
it is disturbing.

=== Andy Evans ===
Visit our Website:- http://www.artsandmedia.com
Audio, music and health pages and interesting links.

[EG]

Post by dave12122
Recently, I posted a largely positive review of Elena Kuschnerova
playing Bach, one of my favorite CDs. A certain Andy Evans (who I do
not know) took me to task for being far too positive, and thus
apparently unbelievable.
This is disturbing. Are there really people out there that think a
particular CD cannot be of the highest flight, the best caliber, the
most life enhancing??

Yes.


One of the reasons I really don't like reading

Post by dave12122
most reviews is the distressing mentality that at some point the
reviewer has to show his endless knowledge of classical recordings by
making some uncalled for comparison (which 99% of the time can be
distilled down to mere "taste") or picayune technical comments
regarding a wrong note or smudged passage that would not affect most
peoples' enjoyment of the CD.

When writing a review, you should consider also what OTHER people would
find useful. Glowing reviews filled with hyperbole are useless. Comparisons
and pointing factual detail is useful.


People that know Elena realize that the

Post by dave12122
issue with my review is not that I went too far, but that I did not go
far enough. Listen to her stream of Stravinsky's Three Movements from
Petruschka and then tell me that she is one of the finest living woman
pianists, probably the very finest if sheer musicality is considered.
To me, Elena is the quintessential successful pianist. Of course, no
one has to agree with this, but that does not make my reviews "silly",
"over the top", or "hyperbole". It's so easy to criticize and make
fun of something you don't like....fortunately, Elena's extraordinary
vision triumphs over all. Her live in Tokyo CD, along with the
Scriabin and Prokofieff CDs are really absolutely essential, if for no
other reason to illustrate what someone can accomplish who is not a
"household word". Is Elena's playing perfect? Of course not, but
neither is anyone elses'....look at Horowitz for example. People
don't realize how much of his playing is outright sloppy with
inconsistent tone, if you or I submitted similar performances to a
classical music recording company our CD would be quickly returned.
Elena's "track record" is remarkable...no even slightly second rate
performances, and a startling affinity to a wide variety of composers
from Scarlatti through Bach to Chopin and Liszt and eventually
Stravinsky, Prokofieff and Scriabin. Few pianists (Richter comes to
mind) can handle such a bewildering array of styles and imitate
Elena's complete identification with the composer. I hope that my
review inspires some open-minded individuals to go to her website and
prepare to be blown away. Oops...there I go with hyperbole
again....guess I'll have to go to bed without any supper and listen to
The Three Tenors. Thank you Elena, and apologizes for the tone and
ugly comments on the last thread.....you certainly deserve better!
Dave DeLucia

[Van Eyes]

Post by EG
Glowing reviews filled with hyperbole are useless.

Wonderful, and compelling.


Regards

[Raymond Hall]

"dave12122" <***@aol.com> wrote in message news:***@posting.google.com...
| Recently, I posted a largely positive review of Elena Kuschnerova
| playing Bach, one of my favorite CDs. A certain Andy Evans (who I do
| not know) took me to task for being far too positive, and thus
| apparently unbelievable.

On one thing I am absolutely sure. Andy is one of the finest contributors to
this group, with a fine sense of humour, and I believe involved as a player
(or was) in a jazz combo.

It often pays to harden one's skin to criticism of an idol. And it isn't as
if we don't believe your reaction to EK as a pianist, but to many of us (a)
we haven't heard her playing, (b) there may be some who find her playing not
to their taste.

The problem is, in short, to control one's wildest enthusiasms here, because
there are many here whose tastes differ in remarkably different ways. One
thing you should always bear in mind, is that maybe you haven't heard ALL
the pianists on record in the repertoire you are considering, so there may
well be the possibility that you will hear several who may even surpass EK
to your ears.

But, naturally, you won't ever admit it.
<g>

Regards,

# http://www.users.bigpond.com/hallraylily/index.html
See You Tamara (Ozzy Osbourne)

Ray, Taree, NSW

[David7Gable]

Post by Raymond Hall
Andy is one of the finest contributors to
this group, with a fine sense of humour

Ain't that the truth!

-david gable

[John Wiser]

Post by David7Gable

Post by Raymond Hall
Andy is one of the finest contributors to
this group, with a fine sense of humour

Ain't that the truth!

I feel compelled to add that it is the depth of bad manners
to attempt to patronize standing members of a newsgroup
to whom one is a newcomer. Dave De Lucia has been a
particularly obstreperous newbie, deaf to the broadest
matters of style, singularly careless of language, and in
general an embarassment to himself and others. I add the
latter because, while I have had this fool killfiled for some
weeks, I'm told he has posted some kind of off-the-wall
encomium of me, including a quotation of something I am
sure I never said. TBQF, I'd be a lot more comfortable
being attacked than I would being praised by this person.

[Sgolescu]

Post by John Wiser
I feel compelled to add that it is the depth of bad manners
to attempt to patronize standing members of a newsgroup
to whom one is a newcomer. Dave De Lucia has been a
particularly obstreperous newbie, deaf to the broadest
matters of style, singularly careless of language, and in
general an embarassment to himself and others. I add the
latter because, while I have had this fool killfiled for some
weeks, I'm told he has posted some kind of off-the-wall
encomium of me, including a quotation of something I am
sure I never said. TBQF, I'd be a lot more comfortable
being attacked than I would being praised by this person.
--
John Wiser

One question in what respects the above: what is "TBQF", please?

regards,
SG

[Paul Penna]

Post by Sgolescu
One question in what respects the above: what is "TBQF", please?

"To Be Quite Frank," I believe. "To Be Quite John," though more
accurate in that specific case, wouldn't quite have gotten the point
across. OTOH, "To Be Quite Wiser" has a nice ring to it.

[Alan Watkins]

Post by Sgolescu
One question in what respects the above: what is "TBQF", please?
regards,
SG

It's a tab...To Be Quite Frank but whether tab notated or ordinarily
notated to be played as written.

Kind regards,
Alan M. Watkins

[dave12122]

Post by John Wiser

Post by David7Gable

Post by Raymond Hall
Andy is one of the finest contributors to
this group, with a fine sense of humour

Ain't that the truth!

I feel compelled to add that it is the depth of bad manners
to attempt to patronize standing members of a newsgroup
to whom one is a newcomer. Dave De Lucia has been a
particularly obstreperous newbie, deaf to the broadest
matters of style, singularly careless of language, and in
general an embarassment to himself and others. I add the
latter because, while I have had this fool killfiled for some
weeks, I'm told he has posted some kind of off-the-wall
encomium of me, including a quotation of something I am
sure I never said. TBQF, I'd be a lot more comfortable
being attacked than I would being praised by this person.

The last sentence is the strangest thing I've ever read....in any case
I don't think I was "patronizing" Andy when I stated that he said my
reviews were "silly" and "hyperbole"....that's exactly what he said if
you would care to read his posts. The notion that someone new to a
newsgroup is somehow inferior to "standing members" is rather
ridiculous and calls for no further comment. In any case, I would
hardly call myself new, contributing to RCMR on and off for at least 6
months. As to my post about John Wiser, it is available around Dec
29th, 2003 or so. I am absolutely certain that quote about Mahler's
8th symphony is correct, as I was fascinated with the piece at the
time and was rather surprised that he said it. I consider the
"encomium" to be largely praiseworthy, as I expressed a concern that
there really is no one I can think of to replace John when he is no
longer part of the music scene for whatever reason. Only Les Gerber
has that kind of all-encompassing knowledge about classical music
recordings and he is not exactly a spring chicken either,
unfortunately. Where are the people in their 20's and 30's that will
be the John Wisers of the next generation? Hardly an "off-the-wall"
matter....rather, a serious one. It is always better to read the
actual post John, then to rely on second hand information. That way,
you won't be misinformed as your last post indicates.

Dave

[d***@yahoo.com]

On Sat, 10 Jan 2004 01:23:31 GMT, "John Wiser"

Post by John Wiser
Dave De Lucia has been a
particularly obstreperous newbie, deaf to the broadest
matters of style, singularly careless of language, and in
general an embarassment to himself and others.

I doubt that you meant this to come out sounding so unutterably
pompous as it has, John. But you should know that I, for one, don't
give a tinker's damn whether someone is what you call a "newbie" or
not.

Tenure in this mad-house is no guarantee of either intelligence,
knowledge or even good manners. If that were the case Tepper wouldn't
be the vulgar, whining, ignorant slob he is, since he is far from
being a "newbie" (in fact, from what I read, he may be the oldest of
"oldies").

My own position is that I take all comments at face value and simply
read what they say and respond accordingly. You, of course, are free
to establish any kind of hierarchy you wish, but you should know that
some here don't really care.

TD

[Steve Emerson]

Post by d***@yahoo.com
On Sat, 10 Jan 2004 01:23:31 GMT, "John Wiser"

Post by John Wiser
Dave De Lucia has been a
particularly obstreperous newbie, deaf to the broadest
matters of style, singularly careless of language, and in
general an embarassment to himself and others.

I doubt that you meant this to come out sounding so unutterably
pompous as it has, John.

It takes a decent ear, although not a great one, to tell the difference
between pomposity and the special ironies of grandiloquence.

SE.

[d***@yahoo.com]

On Sat, 10 Jan 2004 22:38:15 GMT, Steve Emerson

Post by Steve Emerson

Post by d***@yahoo.com
On Sat, 10 Jan 2004 01:23:31 GMT, "John Wiser"

Post by John Wiser
Dave De Lucia has been a
particularly obstreperous newbie, deaf to the broadest
matters of style, singularly careless of language, and in
general an embarassment to himself and others.

I doubt that you meant this to come out sounding so unutterably
pompous as it has, John.

It takes a decent ear, although not a great one, to tell the difference
between pomposity and the special ironies of grandiloquence.

Perhaps. My ear must be more attuned to the special qualities of
simplicity.

TD

[Dan Koren]

Post by Steve Emerson

Post by d***@yahoo.com
On Sat, 10 Jan 2004 01:23:31 GMT, "John Wiser"

Post by John Wiser
Dave De Lucia has been a
particularly obstreperous newbie, deaf to the broadest
matters of style, singularly careless of language, and in
general an embarassment to himself and others.

I doubt that you meant this to come out sounding so unutterably
pompous as it has, John.

It takes a decent ear, although not a great one,
to tell the difference between pomposity and the
special ironies of grandiloquence.

What about indecently eared people?

Can they tell the difference?




dk

[Alan Watkins]

Post by John Wiser

Post by David7Gable

Post by Raymond Hall
Andy is one of the finest contributors to
this group, with a fine sense of humour

Ain't that the truth!

I feel compelled to add that it is the depth of bad manners
to attempt to patronize standing members of a newsgroup
to whom one is a newcomer. Dave De Lucia has been a
particularly obstreperous newbie, deaf to the broadest
matters of style, singularly careless of language, and in
general an embarassment to himself and others. I add the
latter because, while I have had this fool killfiled for some
weeks, I'm told he has posted some kind of off-the-wall
encomium of me, including a quotation of something I am
sure I never said. TBQF, I'd be a lot more comfortable
being attacked than I would being praised by this person.

Blimey, if I didn't know better that might sound like hyperbole to me!

This is why Old Chap ended up in a third rate orchestra. I was always
"deaf to the broadest matters of style" and still am because no one
has ever managed to explain them to me properly. If you know the
secret of the broadest matters of style could you either post on here
(or email them privately if you wish).

While on the subject of being "singularly careless of language" there
are two r's in embarrassment or there were the last time I looked.

In writing it is called, I think, a "literal". In music it is called
a wrong note. My guess is that I have probably played rather more
wrong notes than you have written "literals" but either way we both
make mistakes.

Your literal does not detract from the essence or impact of your post
so far as I can see. My mistake might ruin a contribution in my
field, not only of me but of others as well.

I could write hyperbole (or should that be hyperbolically?) if I
wished. Here is an example: "Wow! This is a great performance, the
phrasing, the control of dynamics, astonishing playing, the score of
the composer followed wonderfully, an inspired performance which
stunned the audience, a performance at the very HEART of the music,
someone with something fantastic to say about the music, it's like
hearing something reinvented. This is simply great, great playing by
all involved and after a lifetime in this business, it thrills me
through and through."

But I would not dare. So I am going to keep the performance to myself
and get my thrills in private.

Of course the original poster may have got carried away with his
enthusiasm but so what? He LOVES music and found someone who brought
it alive to HIM.

Haven't you all done that? You may have expressed it more eloquently
than the original poster but has that not happened to you?

Kind regards,
Alan M. Watkins

[John Wiser]

Alan Watkins lectures gently at some length:
I edit out all but those aspects
to which I intend a
[presumably habitually incurably pompous]

Post by Alan Watkins
This is why Old Chap ended up in a third rate orchestra. I was always
"deaf to the broadest matters of style" and still am because no one
has ever managed to explain them to me properly.

You sell yourself short, I'm sure!
I was in any case referring
to style in written language, not in music.

If you know the

Post by Alan Watkins
secret of the broadest matters of style could you either post on here
(or email them privately if you wish).

Unfortunately, I have disabled the soundcard in this machine...,
so I will have to whistle...suffice it to say, you will find my prose
exemplary.

Post by Alan Watkins
While on the subject of being "singularly careless of language" there
are two r's in embarrassment or there were the last time I looked.

Careful. _Some_ people get their knickers in a twist
when caught out of order in areas dear to them.
Shall we put it down to mis-typography and get on with it?

Post by Alan Watkins
In writing it is called, I think, a "literal". In music it is called
a wrong note. My guess is that I have probably played rather more
wrong notes than you have written "literals" but either way we both
make mistakes.

I have been writing for about as long as you have been tom-tomming,
but always in less distinguished company, never in ensemble, and
to uniformly imperceptible effect. My "literals" are of small quantity,
and relative to this medium, next to nonexistent. My "literallys"
[to take this thread back to first causes]
are genuinely nonexistent. But, Doctor, I have to dwell soooo long over
every "which" and "that." [snif] No editor can help.

Post by Alan Watkins
Your literal does not detract from the essence or impact of your post
so far as I can see. My mistake might ruin a contribution in my
field, not only of me but of others as well.
I could write hyperbole (or should that be hyperbolically?) if I
wished. Here is an example: "Wow! This is a great performance, the
phrasing, the control of dynamics, astonishing playing, the score of
the composer followed wonderfully, an inspired performance which
stunned the audience, a performance at the very HEART of the music,
someone with something fantastic to say about the music, it's like
hearing something reinvented. This is simply great, great playing by
all involved and after a lifetime in this business, it thrills me
through and through."

You would be set right with blinding speed
by the arbiters and arsebiters of this virtual space.
Unbridled enthusiasm is just too too uncool. We will therefore
pass over this in tactful silence and hope that you will
take the hint to remain, um, ah, discreet in your praises.

Post by Alan Watkins
But I would not dare. So I am going to keep the performance to myself
and get my thrills in private.

Much the wisest choice; you owe it to yourself
to guard against all idle and fortuitous pecksniffery.
I shall remain merely comparative.

Post by Alan Watkins
Of course the original poster may have got carried away with his
enthusiasm but so what? He LOVES music and found someone who brought
it alive to HIM.
Haven't you all done that? You may have expressed it more eloquently
than the original poster but has that not happened to you?

Blood knee deep before I would own to such a thing!
Alan, you are such a pussycat! I would lie like a trooper
to avoid disappointing you. I think.

with assorted tokens of fond esteem

[Alan Watkins]

Touche Mr Wiser:))

But the absorbing of sounds which attract us is a curious personal
matter which may be individually unique to all of us.

I am reminded of this fact by a story told by a colleague. He recalls
playing for a visiting conductor in which he was required to play a
very modest part on the glockenspiel.

The conductor said: "I did not like the sound of that. Do you have
other mallets with you?".

Because it was a simple, straightforward part he did not have other
mallets with him but rather than letting on removed the "offending"
mallets to his stick bag and after much rummaging replayed the part
with the same mallets.

He replayed the part with approval and the conductor remarked: "NOW do
you see how much better that is?"

This is not to mention the lady who posted to the Percussive Arts
Society about four years ago: "Do you have any mallets with red ends?
I far prefer the sound of those".

All in the ear of the beholder I suspect.

Kind regards,
Alan M. Watkins

[DmitryG]

Post by Raymond Hall
| Recently, I posted a largely positive review of Elena Kuschnerova
| playing Bach, one of my favorite CDs. A certain Andy Evans (who I do
| not know) took me to task for being far too positive, and thus
| apparently unbelievable.
On one thing I am absolutely sure. Andy is one of the finest contributors to
this group, with a fine sense of humour, and I believe involved as a player
(or was) in a jazz combo.
It often pays to harden one's skin to criticism of an idol. And it isn't as
if we don't believe your reaction to EK as a pianist, but to many of us (a)
we haven't heard her playing, (b) there may be some who find her playing not
to their taste.
The problem is, in short, to control one's wildest enthusiasms here, because
there are many here whose tastes differ in remarkably different ways. One
thing you should always bear in mind, is that maybe you haven't heard ALL
the pianists on record in the repertoire you are considering, so there may
well be the possibility that you will hear several who may even surpass EK
to your ears.
But, naturally, you won't ever admit it.
<g>
Regards,
# http://www.users.bigpond.com/hallraylily/index.html
See You Tamara (Ozzy Osbourne)
Ray, Taree, NSW

- Ray, your post is correct and reasonable but, in a more general
framework, not in the spirit of art. Art is not math and fans are wild
and passionate strugglers for their favorite artists and not cold
clinical investigators. The fact is, that practically all great
artists recieved support from some of the "makers" who invested money,
connections, energy in his/her career. If they would endlessly
speculate about not being able to hear all artists to decide who is
more deserving, they would not be able to act. Nadezhda von Meck was a
mecenate of Peter Tchaikovsky whereas young Debussy was a music
teacher of her kids and also needed financial support. He has not
recieved it but should we blame Nadezhda von Meck? I think not, at
least she supported Tchaikovsky. Sol Hurok in his late years declared
Lasar Berman "the greatest pianist of the new generation" or something
to this effect. That was not true but it gave Lasar Berman a huge
career chance that he has not used, but could have used. After Lilya
Zilberstein's win in Bolzano some old famous pianist (was in Annie
Fischer?) said that she has not heard such a playing in her whole
life. Strange statement but it helped Zilberstein to get into the
roster of DG. There are hundreds of histories of this kind. You can
read on Dimitris Sgouros' web site that Artur Rubinstein heard him and
called him "....". And so on. Martha Argerich also supports a group of
young artists. Does she check all to decide who deserves her support?
I do not believe in it, she has no time for that. Maybe it is all not
correct but that is how it works in the real life of artists.

The same with fans. Fans are just fans, an important part of artist's
environment, and it is not a reasonable task to try to convert them
into non-fans.

Even more useless task is to argue on the positions of non-listening
("I haven't heard this artist but I don't believe that s/he can be so
good as you claim"). This is a purely procedural discussion, a trivia,
in fact. You do not discover anything in such discussions. When I hear
that somebody is heavily advertized I usually ask for an MP3. If there
are no MP3s, I simply do not react.

Best regards,

Dmitry
http://profiles.yahoo.com/dgaranin

[d***@yahoo.com]

Post by DmitryG
Martha Argerich also supports a group of
young artists. Does she check all to decide who deserves her support?
I do not believe in it, she has no time for that. Maybe it is all not
correct but that is how it works in the real life of artists.

Unless you know it is correct, it is completely gratuitous to utter
such an accusation.

TD

[DmitryG]

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by DmitryG
Martha Argerich also supports a group of
young artists. Does she check all to decide who deserves her support?
I do not believe in it, she has no time for that. Maybe it is all not
correct but that is how it works in the real life of artists.

Unless you know it is correct, it is completely gratuitous to utter
such an accusation.
TD

- I am not accusing Martha, just relax..

D

[d***@yahoo.com]

Post by DmitryG

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by DmitryG
Martha Argerich also supports a group of
young artists. Does she check all to decide who deserves her support?
I do not believe in it, she has no time for that. Maybe it is all not
correct but that is how it works in the real life of artists.

Unless you know it is correct, it is completely gratuitous to utter
such an accusation.
TD

- I am not accusing Martha, just relax..

I am completely relaxed.

It is simply that your idle speculation about one of the music world's
few remaining "icons" is quite silly.

Moreover, it only points up the degree of envy or jealousy you must
harbour.

Very sad, Dmitry. EK deserves better and certainly does not need to
denigrate other artists in order to assert her own quality. Her
playing does that quite well, thank you.

TD

[DmitryG]

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by DmitryG
- I am not accusing Martha, just relax..

I am completely relaxed.
It is simply that your idle speculation about one of the music world's
few remaining "icons" is quite silly.
Moreover, it only points up the degree of envy or jealousy you must
harbour.
TD

- Tom, you really are making an elefant out of a fly here. I was not
accusing anybody.

Although it could irritate some members, I have to say, as a
legitimate self-defence, that your political accusations in my adress
are completely ungrounded.

It is really disconcerting that most of Kuschnerova threads are
turning into a succession of personal assaults but I hope that it will
change to the positive in a near future.

Dmitry

[d***@yahoo.com]

Post by DmitryG
- Tom, you really are making an elefant out of a fly here. I was not
accusing anybody.
Although it could irritate some members, I have to say, as a
legitimate self-defence, that your political accusations in my adress
are completely ungrounded.

I am unaware of your politics, Dmitry and fairly indifferent to them.

Post by DmitryG
It is really disconcerting that most of Kuschnerova threads are
turning into a succession of personal assaults but I hope that it will
change to the positive in a near future.

One would devoutly wish that that would happen.

But in saying that, I hope that you do not mean that all comments
about EK's recordings should be positive. Some will be; but equally,
some may not be. That is what I trust that you can accept without
becoming defensive, directing posters to your website (as though we
did not know of its existence and had never heard EK at all) and
starting to accuse MA, for example, of fostering a claque of
supporters and trying to boost herself through promotion. Anyone at
all familiar with this lady will simply laugh at such comments.

TD

[DmitryG]

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by DmitryG
- Tom, you really are making an elefant out of a fly here. I was not
accusing anybody.
Although it could irritate some members, I have to say, as a
legitimate self-defence, that your political accusations in my adress
are completely ungrounded.

I am unaware of your politics, Dmitry and fairly indifferent to them.

Post by DmitryG
It is really disconcerting that most of Kuschnerova threads are
turning into a succession of personal assaults but I hope that it will
change to the positive in a near future.

One would devoutly wish that that would happen.
But in saying that, I hope that you do not mean that all comments
about EK's recordings should be positive. Some will be; but equally,
some may not be.
TD

- Could we stop this trivia?

D

[Andy Evans]

I hope that you do not mean that all comments about EK's recordings should be
positive. Some will be; but equally,
some may not be. TD>>

- Could we stop this trivia?>

It isn't trivia - Tom is exactly right here - you get defensive at any
criticism. If you expect us all to shut up and worship Elena you are going to
get well roasted on this ng. You've seen the first effects already. Flood this
ng with posts about Elena and you'll see a lot more. Refuse to listen to
anybody else and you will ultimately be killfiled.

=== Andy Evans ===
Visit our Website:- http://www.artsandmedia.com
Audio, music and health pages and interesting links.

[DmitryG]

Post by Andy Evans
I hope that you do not mean that all comments about EK's recordings should be
positive. Some will be; but equally,
some may not be. TD>>
- Could we stop this trivia?>
It isn't trivia - Tom is exactly right here - you get defensive at any
criticism. If you expect us all to shut up and worship Elena you are going to
get well roasted on this ng. You've seen the first effects already. Flood this
ng with posts about Elena and you'll see a lot more. Refuse to listen to
anybody else and you will ultimately be killfiled.
=== Andy Evans ===

- Andy, read this complete thread carefully. I've made only one post
and it was not about Elena at all. After that I was assaulted and then
I was only trying to calm it down. I was completely uncalled for to
resume bashing of me.

I do not expect anybody to shut up and worship. This is what you and
some others are ascribing to me. But it won't stick. Please, stop it,
it is getting really tedious.

For those who are deleting posts I quote my initial post completely
below.

*****************************************************************************

"- Ray, your post is correct and reasonable but, in a more general
framework, not in the spirit of art. Art is not math and fans are wild
and passionate strugglers for their favorite artists and not cold
clinical investigators. The fact is, that practically all great
artists recieved support from some of the "makers" who invested money,
connections, energy in his/her career. If they would endlessly
speculate about not being able to hear all artists to decide who is
more deserving, they would not be able to act. Nadezhda von Meck was a
mecenate of Peter Tchaikovsky whereas young Debussy was a music
teacher of her kids and also needed financial support. He has not
recieved it but should we blame Nadezhda von Meck? I think not, at
least she supported Tchaikovsky. Sol Hurok in his late years declared
Lasar Berman "the greatest pianist of the new generation" or something
to this effect. That was not true but it gave Lasar Berman a huge
career chance that he has not used, but could have used. After Lilya
Zilberstein's win in Bolzano some old famous pianist (was in Annie
Fischer?) said that she has not heard such a playing in her whole
life. Strange statement but it helped Zilberstein to get into the
roster of DG. There are hundreds of histories of this kind. You can
read on Dimitris Sgouros' web site that Artur Rubinstein heard him and
called him "....". And so on. Martha Argerich also supports a group of
young artists. Does she check all to decide who deserves her support?
I do not believe in it, she has no time for that. Maybe it is all not
correct but that is how it works in the real life of artists.

The same with fans. Fans are just fans, an important part of artist's
environment, and it is not a reasonable task to try to convert them
into non-fans.

Even more useless task is to argue on the positions of non-listening
("I haven't heard this artist but I don't believe that s/he can be so
good as you claim"). This is a purely procedural discussion, a trivia,
in fact. You do not discover anything in such discussions. When I hear
that somebody is heavily advertized I usually ask for an MP3. If there
are no MP3s, I simply do not react.

Best regards,

Dmitry"

*********************************************

End quote

[dave12122]

Post by Andy Evans
I hope that you do not mean that all comments about EK's recordings should be
positive. Some will be; but equally,
some may not be. TD>>
- Could we stop this trivia?>
It isn't trivia - Tom is exactly right here - you get defensive at any
criticism. If you expect us all to shut up and worship Elena you are going to
get well roasted on this ng. You've seen the first effects already. Flood this
ng with posts about Elena and you'll see a lot more. Refuse to listen to
anybody else and you will ultimately be killfiled.
=== Andy Evans ===
Visit our Website:- http://www.artsandmedia.com
Audio, music and health pages and interesting links.

Andy, there have been three threads on Elena out of the hundreds that
are created from day to day. That is hardly "flooding the newsgroup
with posts about Elena". Now, there's real "hyperbole" for you! As
to Dmitry being defensive about criticism of Elena, I have always
found him receptive to REASONABLE criticism of Elena, such as my other
reviews of her CDs to be found on The Piano ng. Posts such as this
one and many on the three Elena threads reek with sarcasm, hostility
and veiled threats. The "Golden Rule" may be trite, but it applies
here ....would you be as patient as Dmitry has been if a pianist you
knew were treated in a similar crass, dismissive manner? I think not,
so please stop the "I'm running this newsgroup and you better behave"
posturing. You're no better or worse than anyone else in this
newsgroup and no one has to listen to the King spouting off as in this
"silly" post!


Dave

[Bob Lombard]

Post by dave12122
Andy, there have been three threads on Elena out of the hundreds that
are created from day to day. That is hardly "flooding the newsgroup
with posts about Elena". Now, there's real "hyperbole" for you! As
to Dmitry being defensive about criticism of Elena, I have always
found him receptive to REASONABLE criticism of Elena, such as my other
reviews of her CDs to be found on The Piano ng. Posts such as this
one and many on the three Elena threads reek with sarcasm, hostility
and veiled threats. The "Golden Rule" may be trite, but it applies
here ....would you be as patient as Dmitry has been if a pianist you
knew were treated in a similar crass, dismissive manner? I think not,
so please stop the "I'm running this newsgroup and you better behave"
posturing. You're no better or worse than anyone else in this
newsgroup and no one has to listen to the King spouting off as in this
"silly" post!
Dave

Dave12122, you are reading what is not there, and/or misinterpreting
what is there. Among "sarcasm, hostility and veiled threats", only
the first exists in these threads. It isn't hostility toward Dmitry or
Elena to opine that someone appreciates Yudina's 'Pictures' more than
Elena's. There is no 'veiled threat' in suggesting that duplicating
the Valour Blitzkrieg (pro Lugansky) is counterproductive. Certainly,
arguing with TD is pointless.

Take a deep breath, a sniff and a sip of brandy, and contemplate the
relative importance of any rmcr opinion compared to the upcoming
Colts/Patriots game.

bl

[d***@yahoo.com]

Post by Bob Lombard

Post by dave12122
Andy, there have been three threads on Elena out of the hundreds that
are created from day to day. That is hardly "flooding the newsgroup
with posts about Elena". Now, there's real "hyperbole" for you! As
to Dmitry being defensive about criticism of Elena, I have always
found him receptive to REASONABLE criticism of Elena, such as my other
reviews of her CDs to be found on The Piano ng. Posts such as this
one and many on the three Elena threads reek with sarcasm, hostility
and veiled threats. The "Golden Rule" may be trite, but it applies
here ....would you be as patient as Dmitry has been if a pianist you
knew were treated in a similar crass, dismissive manner? I think not,
so please stop the "I'm running this newsgroup and you better behave"
posturing. You're no better or worse than anyone else in this
newsgroup and no one has to listen to the King spouting off as in this
"silly" post!
Dave

Dave12122, you are reading what is not there, and/or misinterpreting
what is there. Among "sarcasm, hostility and veiled threats", only
the first exists in these threads. It isn't hostility toward Dmitry or
Elena to opine that someone appreciates Yudina's 'Pictures' more than
Elena's. There is no 'veiled threat' in suggesting that duplicating
the Valour Blitzkrieg (pro Lugansky) is counterproductive. Certainly,
arguing with TD is pointless.
Take a deep breath, a sniff and a sip of brandy, and contemplate the
relative importance of any rmcr opinion compared to the upcoming
Colts/Patriots game.

Since that is of almost no importance whatsoever, Bob, I don't really
get your point.

TD(the pointless poster)

[Gerrie Collins]

Post by Bob Lombard
Take a deep breath, a sniff and a sip of brandy, and contemplate the
relative importance of any rmcr opinion compared to the upcoming
Colts/Patriots game.
bl

Righto Bob! I'm picking the Colts by a field goal.

Gerrie C

[DmitryG]

Post by Bob Lombard
Dave12122, you are reading what is not there, and/or misinterpreting
what is there. Among "sarcasm, hostility and veiled threats", only
the first exists in these threads. It isn't hostility toward Dmitry or
Elena to opine that someone appreciates Yudina's 'Pictures' more than
Elena's. There is no 'veiled threat' in suggesting that duplicating
the Valour Blitzkrieg (pro Lugansky) is counterproductive. Certainly,
arguing with TD is pointless.
bl

- Bob, I would say there is a lot of general unfriendliness, own
ambitions, sarcasm, political accusations, and ultimatums in these
threads that were caused by an innocent fan review of Kuschnerova's
Bach CD by Dave. Is an ultimatum a threatening or a warning? It is
beyond me, how in such a big forum with tons of hatred flowing in
different direction a fan review on a less known artist could cause
such an effect. This is really disconcerting.

I am prepared to be a target for political accusations of the too
evident origin. This is not for the first time that I am accused of
making everybody worship Kuschnerova and make critical voices shut up.
This is all not true, as usual, just fantasies of some members with
ambitions of group owners. To the contrary, I would like to see a free
discussion of Kuschnerova's actual playing. I am certainly not obliged
to agree with every criticism and I reserve the right to reply to it
in a civilized form. Arguing about her performances and personal
bashing are different things. In some cases I disagree with a
criticism and then I am being bashed and threatened for that. Andy
Evans accused me in an attempt to make everybody "shut up and
worship". This is not true. To the contrary, it was Andy Evans who
told Dave to "shut up" in his response to Dave's fan review and
brought this review in connection with self-promotion (??) and
spamming, and even with the Cheryl Studer guy. This was a completely
unmotivated hostility, IMHO. To the contrast, I faced a couple of
rather arrogant opinions on Elena's playing. In the case of the
Jonathan Morgan, the Baroque specialist, I prefered not to argue at
all as it is evidently just the difference in our ideas about Bach
that cannot be reconciled. Tom Deacon made a one-line dismissal of the
Mussorgsky CD that I have chosen to counter by arguing. This was my
legitimate right, and I was not offensive in using it. Still I was
accused.

Also bashing of me in this particular thread is completely uncalled
for. I was making a general comment on the post of Raimond Hall,
concerning the rational vs irrational attitudes towards artists. My
post was completely innocent and still it caused a new wave of
bashing, political accusations, and ultimatums.

Dmitry

[d***@yahoo.com]

Post by DmitryG

Post by Bob Lombard
Dave12122, you are reading what is not there, and/or misinterpreting
what is there. Among "sarcasm, hostility and veiled threats", only
the first exists in these threads. It isn't hostility toward Dmitry or
Elena to opine that someone appreciates Yudina's 'Pictures' more than
Elena's. There is no 'veiled threat' in suggesting that duplicating
the Valour Blitzkrieg (pro Lugansky) is counterproductive. Certainly,
arguing with TD is pointless.
bl

- Bob, I would say there is a lot of general unfriendliness, own
ambitions, sarcasm, political accusations, and ultimatums in these
threads that were caused by an innocent fan review of Kuschnerova's
Bach CD by Dave. Is an ultimatum a threatening or a warning? It is
beyond me, how in such a big forum with tons of hatred flowing in
different direction a fan review on a less known artist could cause
such an effect. This is really disconcerting.
I am prepared to be a target for political accusations of the too
evident origin. This is not for the first time that I am accused of
making everybody worship Kuschnerova and make critical voices shut up.
This is all not true, as usual, just fantasies of some members with
ambitions of group owners. To the contrary, I would like to see a free
discussion of Kuschnerova's actual playing. I am certainly not obliged
to agree with every criticism and I reserve the right to reply to it
in a civilized form. Arguing about her performances and personal
bashing are different things. In some cases I disagree with a
criticism and then I am being bashed and threatened for that. Andy
Evans accused me in an attempt to make everybody "shut up and
worship". This is not true. To the contrary, it was Andy Evans who
told Dave to "shut up" in his response to Dave's fan review and
brought this review in connection with self-promotion (??) and
spamming, and even with the Cheryl Studer guy. This was a completely
unmotivated hostility, IMHO. To the contrast, I faced a couple of
rather arrogant opinions on Elena's playing. In the case of the
Jonathan Morgan, the Baroque specialist, I prefered not to argue at
all as it is evidently just the difference in our ideas about Bach
that cannot be reconciled. Tom Deacon made a one-line dismissal of the
Mussorgsky CD that I have chosen to counter by arguing. This was my
legitimate right, and I was not offensive in using it. Still I was
accused.
Also bashing of me in this particular thread is completely uncalled
for. I was making a general comment on the post of Raimond Hall,
concerning the rational vs irrational attitudes towards artists. My
post was completely innocent and still it caused a new wave of
bashing, political accusations, and ultimatums.
Dmitry

There is a point, Dmitry, - and you have, I think reached it - when
the less said the better.

TD

[Andy Evans]

Yes of course, Dmitri, You're completely right about everything. Let's just
leave it at that. This isn't going any further.

=== Andy Evans ===
Visit our Website:- http://www.artsandmedia.com
Audio, music and health pages and interesting links.

[Dan Koren]

Post by Andy Evans
Yes of course, Dmitri, You're completely right
about everything. Let's just leave it at that.

Sounds like a line from one of my favorite movies...

;-)



dk

[Andy Evans]

would you be as patient as Dmitry has been if a pianist you knew were treated
in a similar crass, dismissive manner?>

Good grief man - read what I say!!! I've said continually since the beginning
that Elena is an excellent pianist and that I have her Scriabin disc. How is it
possible to discuss anything if you don't read what other people say. You're
quite welcome to live in any state of delusion you wish to - that's your
business - but try to get the basics right if you are trying to make a point. I
didn't say anything about her Mussorgsky disc and I didn't say anything bad
about her playing. I was talking about how she is marketed/reviewed and nothing
else.

=== Andy Evans ===
Visit our Website:- http://www.artsandmedia.com
Audio, music and health pages and interesting links.

[dave12122]

Post by Andy Evans
would you be as patient as Dmitry has been if a pianist you knew were treated
in a similar crass, dismissive manner?>
Good grief man - read what I say!!! I've said continually since the beginning
that Elena is an excellent pianist and that I have her Scriabin disc. How is it
possible to discuss anything if you don't read what other people say. You're
quite welcome to live in any state of delusion you wish to - that's your
business - but try to get the basics right if you are trying to make a point. I
didn't say anything about her Mussorgsky disc and I didn't say anything bad
about her playing. I was talking about how she is marketed/reviewed and nothing
else.

Andy, That's not what I was talking about....you were making veiled
threats toward Dmitry that if he "flooded the ng with posts about
Elena" there would be consequences....killfiling, etc. That kind of
talk is inappropriate here....Dmitry can post as many messages about
Elena as he wants. I've read everything you've wrote, thus my
emphasis on the words "hyperbole" and "silly" which apparently you
missed. You were dismissive of my review, saying that it couldn't
possibly be true, and then bringing in the ridiculous analogy of
Cheryl Studer (this was my FIRST post about Elena!!!.....How do the
two situations compare?) Everyone seems to have their head in the
sand on this one...the fact remains Kuschnerova can hold her own with
any "name" pianist. Dmitry was perfectly within his right to direct
people to her non-commercial website where people can make their own
decisions. There shouldn't have been any controversy here, nor should
Dmitry have to defend himself. I did not ascribe all the sarcasm,
threats, and other unpleasantries to you, I was only addressing your
comments in your most recent post, which I still believe were
overbearing and inappropriate.

Dave

[DmitryG]

Post by Andy Evans
would you be as patient as Dmitry has been if a pianist you knew were treated
in a similar crass, dismissive manner?>
Good grief man - read what I say!!! I've said continually since the beginning
that Elena is an excellent pianist and that I have her Scriabin disc. How is it
possible to discuss anything if you don't read what other people say. You're
quite welcome to live in any state of delusion you wish to - that's your
business - but try to get the basics right if you are trying to make a point. I
didn't say anything about her Mussorgsky disc and I didn't say anything bad
about her playing. I was talking about how she is marketed/reviewed and nothing
else.
=== Andy Evans ===

- I believe that speaking about how Elena Kuschnerova is being
marketed/reviewed, especially in such negative tones, is much less
helpful that simply to discuss her playing.

I have created her web site with tons of free music and I am posting
announcements in this forum from time to time, just to introduce her
to the members. This should not be considered as spam. This is a forum
for RECORDINGS, thus the absence of a big management and a big concert
career should not be a turn off for the most. On the other hand,
Elena is a successful recording pianist, and most of her CDs are
critically acclaimed. Her Prokofiev CD recieved the "German Record
Critics' Award" and was included into the list of the 50 best piano
recordings of all times by the German music magazine SCALA. Harold
Schonberg wrote in the American Record Guide "These are the best
recorded performances I am familiar with" about her Scriabin CD. Now
Elena's Bach CD recieved a rosette in the Penguin Guide. I do not
believe to music critics myself and I am not asking anybody to accept
these reviews unconditionally, but I hope that at least they could
arouse a curiosity toward this pianist. However, as I have found out,
most of the people here are dismissive of the music press, are not
reading, so that this information simply does not penetrate here. Then
I think it is the only practical choice for me to come here and invite
all to Elena's web site. Not to sell CDs, just to get some free music.

I am not doing it too often, so that everybody can stay quiet. There
is absolutely no reason to start flame wars about it.

Dmitry
http://profiles.yahoo.com/dgaranin

[Nick X Sun]

Dmitry:
When I saw your website last month, and listened through those MP3 files, I
have to say it did raise my interest in EK's play. I even posted that link
in another forum so that other folks there who are interested in piano play
may also take a listen. Thanks for your nice work, and I do hope other
certain artist's fans may do the same, a more concrete work, unlike certain
Lugansky's promotions where we can only got tiny clips like those online
music stores, too little to make a judgment. But, as others here has already
pointed out, sometimes less is better. EK is an excellent pianist, since you
have already caused our attention on her, I think it's better to leave this
endless arguments dying off naturally.

Nick

Post by DmitryG

Post by Andy Evans
would you be as patient as Dmitry has been if a pianist you knew were treated
in a similar crass, dismissive manner?>
Good grief man - read what I say!!! I've said continually since the beginning
that Elena is an excellent pianist and that I have her Scriabin disc. How is it
possible to discuss anything if you don't read what other people say. You're
quite welcome to live in any state of delusion you wish to - that's your
business - but try to get the basics right if you are trying to make a point. I
didn't say anything about her Mussorgsky disc and I didn't say anything bad
about her playing. I was talking about how she is marketed/reviewed and nothing
else.
=== Andy Evans ===

- I believe that speaking about how Elena Kuschnerova is being
marketed/reviewed, especially in such negative tones, is much less
helpful that simply to discuss her playing.
I have created her web site with tons of free music and I am posting
announcements in this forum from time to time, just to introduce her
to the members. This should not be considered as spam. This is a forum
for RECORDINGS, thus the absence of a big management and a big concert
career should not be a turn off for the most. On the other hand,
Elena is a successful recording pianist, and most of her CDs are
critically acclaimed. Her Prokofiev CD recieved the "German Record
Critics' Award" and was included into the list of the 50 best piano
recordings of all times by the German music magazine SCALA. Harold
Schonberg wrote in the American Record Guide "These are the best
recorded performances I am familiar with" about her Scriabin CD. Now
Elena's Bach CD recieved a rosette in the Penguin Guide. I do not
believe to music critics myself and I am not asking anybody to accept
these reviews unconditionally, but I hope that at least they could
arouse a curiosity toward this pianist. However, as I have found out,
most of the people here are dismissive of the music press, are not
reading, so that this information simply does not penetrate here. Then
I think it is the only practical choice for me to come here and invite
all to Elena's web site. Not to sell CDs, just to get some free music.
I am not doing it too often, so that everybody can stay quiet. There
is absolutely no reason to start flame wars about it.
Dmitry
http://profiles.yahoo.com/dgaranin

[DmitryG]

Hi, Nick and others,

OK, I also believe that everything has now been said and we can stop
this argumenting. I am going to avoid/ignore unpleasant topics in the
future.

Dmitry

Post by Nick X Sun
When I saw your website last month, and listened through those MP3 files, I
have to say it did raise my interest in EK's play. I even posted that link
in another forum so that other folks there who are interested in piano play
may also take a listen. Thanks for your nice work, and I do hope other
certain artist's fans may do the same, a more concrete work, unlike certain
Lugansky's promotions where we can only got tiny clips like those online
music stores, too little to make a judgment. But, as others here has already
pointed out, sometimes less is better. EK is an excellent pianist, since you
have already caused our attention on her, I think it's better to leave this
endless arguments dying off naturally.
Nick

Post by DmitryG

Post by Andy Evans
would you be as patient as Dmitry has been if a pianist you knew were

treated

Post by DmitryG

Post by Andy Evans
in a similar crass, dismissive manner?>
Good grief man - read what I say!!! I've said continually since the

beginning

Post by DmitryG

Post by Andy Evans
that Elena is an excellent pianist and that I have her Scriabin disc.

How is it

Post by DmitryG

Post by Andy Evans
possible to discuss anything if you don't read what other people say.

You're

Post by DmitryG

Post by Andy Evans
quite welcome to live in any state of delusion you wish to - that's your
business - but try to get the basics right if you are trying to make a

point. I

Post by DmitryG

Post by Andy Evans
didn't say anything about her Mussorgsky disc and I didn't say anything

bad

Post by DmitryG

Post by Andy Evans
about her playing. I was talking about how she is marketed/reviewed and

nothing

Post by DmitryG

Post by Andy Evans
else.
=== Andy Evans ===

- I believe that speaking about how Elena Kuschnerova is being
marketed/reviewed, especially in such negative tones, is much less
helpful that simply to discuss her playing.
I have created her web site with tons of free music and I am posting
announcements in this forum from time to time, just to introduce her
to the members. This should not be considered as spam. This is a forum
for RECORDINGS, thus the absence of a big management and a big concert
career should not be a turn off for the most. On the other hand,
Elena is a successful recording pianist, and most of her CDs are
critically acclaimed. Her Prokofiev CD recieved the "German Record
Critics' Award" and was included into the list of the 50 best piano
recordings of all times by the German music magazine SCALA. Harold
Schonberg wrote in the American Record Guide "These are the best
recorded performances I am familiar with" about her Scriabin CD. Now
Elena's Bach CD recieved a rosette in the Penguin Guide. I do not
believe to music critics myself and I am not asking anybody to accept
these reviews unconditionally, but I hope that at least they could
arouse a curiosity toward this pianist. However, as I have found out,
most of the people here are dismissive of the music press, are not
reading, so that this information simply does not penetrate here. Then
I think it is the only practical choice for me to come here and invite
all to Elena's web site. Not to sell CDs, just to get some free music.
I am not doing it too often, so that everybody can stay quiet. There
is absolutely no reason to start flame wars about it.
Dmitry
http://profiles.yahoo.com/dgaranin

[Dan Koren]

How is it possible to discuss anything
if you don't read what other people say.

It makes it much easier. Trust me!

;-)




dk

[Dan Koren]

Post by d***@yahoo.com

Post by DmitryG
Martha Argerich also supports a group of
young artists. Does she check all to decide who deserves her support?
I do not believe in it, she has no time for that. Maybe it is all not
correct but that is how it works in the real life of artists.

Unless you know it is correct, it is completely gratuitous to utter
such an accusation.

Deacon,

Ignorance has never stopped you from
making authoritative statements.



dk

[Casey]

Martha Argerich also supports a group of young artists. Does
she check all to decide who deserves her support?

Maybe she does and maybe she does not, but I am glad she does.
I happen to really like her playing and I don't like all of the players
she has recommended, but the fact that she does this is very useful
for the industry. Maria Joao Pires also supports young artists. Too
bad more artists don't do this.


Casey

[d***@yahoo.com]

Post by Casey

Martha Argerich also supports a group of young artists. Does
she check all to decide who deserves her support?

Maybe she does and maybe she does not, but I am glad she does.
I happen to really like her playing and I don't like all of the players
she has recommended, but the fact that she does this is very useful
for the industry. Maria Joao Pires also supports young artists. Too
bad more artists don't do this.

Correct.

Most are far too busy boosting themselves to worry about anyone else.
And the weakest of them all tend to waste time trying to denigrate
their so-called "rivals".

A fairly appalling sight, in my opinion.

TD