Congratulations, John McAdams:

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Please send him some money.
Did you see the pants he wore to the CPAC?

BOZ

2018-07-08 16:41:30 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Please send him some money.
Did you see the pants he wore to the CPAC?

WHY DON'T YOU SEND HIM THE MONEY YOU EARNED FROM YOUR BRIDGE WINNINGS?
CONGRATULATIONS PROFESSOR MCADAMS. ONE QUESTION. WHAT THE HELL DOES THIS
POST HAVE TO DO WITH THE RUBY'S DOG SHEBA OR THE JFK ASSASSINATION? THIS
IS EVEN MORE IRRELEVANT THAN MY POSTS.

Anthony Marsh

2018-07-09 14:57:31 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Please send him some money.
Did you see the pants he wore to the CPAC?

WHY DON'T YOU SEND HIM THE MONEY YOU EARNED FROM YOUR BRIDGE WINNINGS?

I don't play for money. Maybe Master Points, but they are non-transferable.

Post by BOZ
CONGRATULATIONS PROFESSOR MCADAMS. ONE QUESTION. WHAT THE HELL DOES THIS
POST HAVE TO DO WITH THE RUBY'S DOG SHEBA OR THE JFK ASSASSINATION? THIS
IS EVEN MORE IRRELEVANT THAN MY POSTS.

Why bring up Sheba? She didn't shoot JFK.

Bud

2018-07-09 19:56:18 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Please send him some money.
Did you see the pants he wore to the CPAC?

<snicker> It is the only meaningful thing to occur here, ever.

BOZ

2018-07-08 16:41:40 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Please send him some money.
Did you see the pants he wore to the CPAC?

MARSH WHAT WOULD YOU HAVE WORN? A THONG?

Anthony Marsh

2018-07-09 14:57:23 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Please send him some money.
Did you see the pants he wore to the CPAC?

MARSH WHAT WOULD YOU HAVE WORN? A THONG?

a suit.

Jason Burke

2018-07-09 19:40:25 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Please send him some money.
Did you see the pants he wore to the CPAC?

MARSH WHAT WOULD YOU HAVE WORN? A THONG?

Oh God. With that visual I'd almost rather be blind.

Ace Kefford

2018-07-10 22:47:03 UTC

Post by Jason Burke

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Please send him some money.
Did you see the pants he wore to the CPAC?

MARSH WHAT WOULD YOU HAVE WORN? A THONG?

Oh God. With that visual I'd almost rather be blind.

I had the same reaction!

BT George

2018-07-07 22:33:37 UTC

Congratulations.John. Let the haters eat crow! Free speech is for
*everyone* not just those with PC values.

Piotr Mancini

2018-09-25 23:19:16 UTC

Post by BT George
Congratulations.John. Let the haters eat crow! Free speech is for
*everyone* not just those with PC values.

George:

Not to be a party pooper or to steal the professor's thunder, but my
automatic debating application has a mind of its own.

-Ramon
JFK Numbers

=====================

On immigration -and other issues- I am on the exact side as:

- The private sector, the US Chamber of Commerce and Rupert Murdoch
- The Military
- The Churches

I dare you to call them/me:
- Communists
- Traitors
- Haters

respectively.

IOW:

Bud

2018-07-07 22:34:39 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Yes, congratulations indeed!

claviger

2018-07-08 12:57:04 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Yes, congratulations indeed!

Yes, free speech applies even to College Professors.
What a concept our forefathers came up with!

slats

2018-07-09 14:31:52 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Yes, congratulations indeed!

Yes, free speech applies even to College Professors.

Less so at private insitutions compared to public ones, which is probably
why Marquette (where my brother got his MBA) thought it would be easy to
get rid of him. I don't know how you survived three years wihout a salary,
John, but I salute you.

Anthony Marsh

2018-07-10 19:45:33 UTC

Post by slats

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Yes, congratulations indeed!

Yes, free speech applies even to College Professors.

You're not allowed to ask questions like that. And don't mention the
Mercers or CPAC.

claviger

2018-09-29 15:40:20 UTC

Post by slats

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Yes, congratulations indeed!

Yes, free speech applies even to College Professors.

Freedom of Speech is a constitutional derived Civil Right inside the
borders of the USA. Do you think Private Universities should be exempt?
Not trying to be argumentative, maybe there is a logical explanation for
exceptions in Academia.

bigdog

2018-09-30 03:57:39 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Yes, congratulations indeed!

Yes, free speech applies even to College Professors.

It is important to read the actual text of the First Amendment. It is a
limit on what CONGRESS may do. Through the Fourteenth Amendment and the
principle of incorporation, the same restrictions now apply to state and
local governments as well. It does not apply to employers. An employer may
restrict what an employee is allowed to say when representing the
employer. As I understand it, John McAdams' case came down to his
contractual agreement with Marquette University and it found Marquette had
breeched the terms of that contract. I'm sure John will correct me if I am
wrong about that.

Anthony Marsh

2018-10-01 15:07:21 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Yes, congratulations indeed!

Yes, free speech applies even to College Professors.

It is important to read the actual text of the First Amendment. It is a
limit on what CONGRESS may do. Through the Fourteenth Amendment and the

The US Supreme Court has already ruled that Constitution rights
automatically extend down to each state and territory.

Post by bigdog
principle of incorporation, the same restrictions now apply to state and
local governments as well. It does not apply to employers. An employer may
restrict what an employee is allowed to say when representing the
employer. As I understand it, John McAdams' case came down to his
contractual agreement with Marquette University and it found Marquette had
breeched the terms of that contract. I'm sure John will correct me if I am
wrong about that.

I'm not sure Breeched is the correct word. Maybe had no cause.

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-30 18:06:48 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Yes, congratulations indeed!

Yes, free speech applies even to College Professors.

Freedom of Speech is a constitutional derived Civil Right inside the
borders of the USA. Do you think Private Universities should be exempt?

I like your idea that US citizens rights are null and void when they step
foot outside the country. Just 2 inches and any other country is free to
do anything the want to US citizens. Has that been tested in court? Any
case law? So when I cross the border into Canada they are free to shoot me
on sight?

Post by claviger
Not trying to be argumentative, maybe there is a logical explanation for
exceptions in Academia.

Jason Burke

2018-10-01 15:44:30 UTC

Post by slats

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Yes, congratulations indeed!

Yes, free speech applies even to College Professors.

Freedom of Speech is a constitutional derived Civil Right inside the
borders of the USA. Do you think Private Universities should be exempt?

I like your idea that US citizens rights are null and void when they
step foot outside the country. Just 2 inches and any other country is

Yeah. I'm sure two inches resonates nicely with you, Anthony Anthony.

Post by Anthony Marsh
free to do anything the want to US citizens. Has that been tested in
court? Any case law? So when I cross the border into Canada they are
free to shoot me on sight?

Post by claviger
Not trying to be argumentative, maybe there is a logical explanation for
exceptions in Academia.

Anthony Marsh

2018-07-09 19:39:13 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Yes, congratulations indeed!

Yes, free speech applies even to College Professors.
What a concept our forefathers came up with!

Yes, it even includes HATE speech. Aren't you lucky.
And then he turns around and deletes my message for using the word FREE.

Mark

2018-09-24 17:08:25 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

The court case is over, but the battle for free speech continues. The
Marquette Faculty Senate may be trying to come up with ways to stop a
fellow member from publishing, for instance, the Marquette Warrior. For
now, you can read about it here: mu-warrior.blogspot.com.

Mark

bigdog

2018-09-25 02:26:04 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Thanks posting this. Universities are supposed to be places for free
exchange of ideas but they are evolving into places where group think is
mandated and no one is allowed to deviate. They invent all sorts of
excuses to stifle what they deem to be politically incorrect viewpoints as
they did in this case against John McAdams. Kudos to John for fighting the
good fight and striking a blow for academic freedom.

PS. I loved the last cartoon on the page. It pretty much sums up my
reaction to the mainstream media.

Bud

2018-09-26 00:02:46 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Even worse is going on in Canada, with the Lindsay Shepard case. From
Wikipedia..

"In November 2017, Lindsay Shepherd, a teaching assistant at Wilfrid
Laurier University who showed a video of [Jordan] Peterson's critique of
Bill C-16 in her "Canadian Communication in Context" class, was
reprimanded by faculty members, who said that she had created a "toxic
climate" for students by showing parts of Peterson's argument, compared it
to "neutrally playing a speech by Hitler, or Milo Yiannopoulos", and
claimed that she had violated Bill C-16."

Bill c-16 is an anti-discrimination bill, putting ""gender identity or
expression" on the official protected species list. You can bet that if a
straight person walks into a gay bar and ends up getting beat up for being
straight, this bill will afford them no protections or legal repercussions
against his attackers, these things are always a one way street. And it
will have no use against hate speech against white straight males, you
will still be able to make any charges against them you like, no one cares
if they feel "bullied". Instead of making select groups protected why not
just have straight across the board protections? Because leftists wouldn`t
be able to call their opponents names, like "racist" or "nazi".

In any case, the interesting thing in this case is that the Professor
saw Peterson as Hitler. This has become a real leftist mindset, if you
disagree with them, they see you as Hitler and you need to be silenced.
And the Professor claimed there was a complaint by a student, but there
wasn`t, he just didn`t like Peterson`s views being heard in the
University.

More on the case here, and the lawsuits both Peterson and Shepard have
launched against the university...

Post by bigdog
PS. I loved the last cartoon on the page. It pretty much sums up my
reaction to the mainstream media.

bigdog

2018-09-27 01:49:18 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Even worse is going on in Canada, with the Lindsay Shepard case. From
Wikipedia..
"In November 2017, Lindsay Shepherd, a teaching assistant at Wilfrid
Laurier University who showed a video of [Jordan] Peterson's critique of
Bill C-16 in her "Canadian Communication in Context" class, was
reprimanded by faculty members, who said that she had created a "toxic
climate" for students by showing parts of Peterson's argument, compared it
to "neutrally playing a speech by Hitler, or Milo Yiannopoulos", and
claimed that she had violated Bill C-16."
Bill c-16 is an anti-discrimination bill, putting ""gender identity or
expression" on the official protected species list. You can bet that if a
straight person walks into a gay bar and ends up getting beat up for being
straight, this bill will afford them no protections or legal repercussions
against his attackers, these things are always a one way street. And it
will have no use against hate speech against white straight males, you
will still be able to make any charges against them you like, no one cares
if they feel "bullied". Instead of making select groups protected why not
just have straight across the board protections? Because leftists wouldn`t
be able to call their opponents names, like "racist" or "nazi".
In any case, the interesting thing in this case is that the Professor
saw Peterson as Hitler. This has become a real leftist mindset, if you
disagree with them, they see you as Hitler and you need to be silenced.
And the Professor claimed there was a complaint by a student, but there
wasn`t, he just didn`t like Peterson`s views being heard in the
University.
More on the case here, and the lawsuits both Peterson and Shepard have
launched against the university...
http://youtu.be/PkNv4LFpGf4

Post by bigdog
PS. I loved the last cartoon on the page. It pretty much sums up my
reaction to the mainstream media.

Without going into details, I spent part of my vacation in Canada last
year and it was the worst travel experience of my life. A train trip from
Halifax to Montreal which was supposed to take 21 hours took over 35 and
one poor schmuck who voiced his displeasure to the personnel on the train
was escorted off the train by the cops at the next stop. Apparently
Canadians don't enjoy the right to complain about poor service. I will
never set foot in that pitiful country again. When I go to hockey games, I
won't even stand for their anthem.

Bud

2018-09-25 02:26:47 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Since the left has no chance in a discussion of ideas they are forced to
shut down dialog. Notice when they talk about dangerous speech, they don`t
mention the left whipping up the BLM furor, which got cops killed in NY,
Dallas and other places.

Mark

2018-09-25 23:31:33 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

I saw that and wanted to comment on it so bad, I even went to this
thread to put it here, but I thought it wouldn`t be allowed. Liberals
never learn, and they never admit they are wrong (they didn`t learn from
Trump getting elected and they certainly never admitted their role in it,
they just spin it into a form they are comfortable with, like calling
people racists). It is just a matter of rigging the game so they win next
time. If you say things the left doesn`t like, they`ll label you a bully
and silence you. I just saw that the left is trying to get most of the
right leaning discussion on youtube shut down.
+*****
http://youtu.be/Ypt_pnpJLzY
Since the left has no chance in a discussion of ideas they are forced to
shut down dialog. Notice when they talk about dangerous speech, they don`t
mention the left whipping up the BLM furor, which got cops killed in NY,
Dallas and other places.

You know Bud and BD, it would be nice to see just one liberal CT on here
speak up on this issue. Perhaps they don't understand what Free Speech,
to me anyway, means. I'll defend anyone's right to voice liberal views--I
just ask that they, in turn, have my back when I write as a conservative
and disagree with them.

Mark

Bud

2018-09-26 03:55:14 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.

Alan Dershowitz...

https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11

Steven Pinker...

Stephen Fry...

John McAdams

2018-09-26 04:02:56 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

A lot of these people are lawyers, deeply committed to *process.* If
you are committed to process, you don't start with the outcome you
want, and try to reverse engineer the process to get that outcome.

You start with a fair process (free speech, equal protection, due
process) and accept whatever that process produces.

Example: if you believe in free speech, you allow racists to speak,
believing that the process of speech and counter speech will result in
a decent outcome.

I have an interesting clip on my blog of a speech by Richard Spencer.

http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2017/04/racist-tells-auburn-students-football.html

I won't give the point away. But it's epic.
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Bud

2018-09-26 15:57:34 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

A person like Richard Spencer would probably beat most liberals in an
open debate on race. He would poke holes in their belief systems and show
the errors of their remedies. That is why they need to shut people like
Spencer up. The thing is, I`m an adult. I should be able to listen to
whatever viewpoint I want to and decide whether it has any merit. I
shouldn`t have other people deciding for me what is bad to hear, let me
hear it and *I`ll* decide. Spencer could be wrong on everything, or
possibly right on only a very specific thing. Hitchens (the world suffers
from the loss of his voice) nails it at 2:05 in this video...

Paraphrasing his two main points, you infringe a person`s right to
listen when you silence a speaker, and if everyone believes one thing, and
only one person sees things differently, protecting that one voice is more
important than protecting all the rest.

I listened to the full recording of the Lindsay Shepard interrogation by
University officials at Wilfred Laurier in Canada (she secretly recorded
it). They had the poor woman in tears, but I guess it isn`t bullying when
the left does it. The full recording can be heard here...

The reason I bring this up is that one of the people conducting this
interrogation mentioned Charles Murray as the sort of person who should be
censored because of their viewpoints. He is the co-author of the
controversial book about race, "The Bell Curve". He points out the
stupidity of "No Child Left Behind" legislation by pointing out that no
matter what you do, half the children will be below average (pointing this
fact out alone makes him an important voice). Anyway, to get to the point,
I went to Wikipedia to look up Murray, and I saw this...

"On March 2, 2017, Murray was shouted down at Middlebury College
(Middlebury, Vermont) by students and others not connected with the
school, and prevented from speaking at the original location on campus.
The speech was moved to another location and a closed circuit broadcast
showed him being interviewed by professor Allison Stanger. After the
interview, there was a violent confrontation between protesters and
Murray, Vice President for Communications Bill Burger, and Stanger (who
was hospitalized with a neck injury and concussion) as they left the
McCullough Student Center. Middlebury students claimed that Middlebury
Public Safety officers instigated and escalated violence against
nonviolent protesters and that administrator Bill Burger assaulted
protesters with a car.[62] Middlebury President Laurie L. Patton responded
after the event, saying the school would respond to "the clear violations
of Middlebury College policy that occurred inside and outside Wilson
Hall."[63][64][65][66] The school took disciplinary action against 74
students for their involvement in the incident."

So there is a direct correlation between the viewpoints of this
administrator who was questioning Lindsay Shepard and actual acts of
violence, what is being taught (that Murray is bad) is being acted out on.
But with Peterson, the claim is that if he is heard it will be bad for
trans folk is accepted without question, with no examples given. Vague
assumptions about a "toxic atmosphere" being created is enough.

And the same can be said for BLM rhetoric which is getting cops killed.
There is a direct correlation, but that kind of speech is fine with
liberals, even encouraged. It wasn`t a "toxic atmosphere" being created by
the media with the Trevon Martin and Michael Brown cases.

And I think "globalism" is a an evil idea, can I get talk about it
silenced? I was thinking how weird it is that liberals see the growth of
Walmart, it squeezing out competitors, killing the mom and pop stores and
owning too big a share of the market as a bad thing, but think the
opposite when it comes to world government, here they advocate a monopoly.
Isn`t a lot of smaller, independent "mom and pop" nations better than one
monolithic entity that has an unlimited potential of taking life, liberty
and the pursuit of happiness from the people?

Post by John McAdams
I have an interesting clip on my blog of a speech by Richard Spencer.
http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2017/04/racist-tells-auburn-students-football.html
I won't give the point away. But it's epic.
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

See, I agree with Spencer on some of these ideas. The athletes are like
hired guns, sought out and wooed, brought in and pampered, given
privileges (like private tutors tasked with getting them to reach the
barest minimum requirements) based on something that hasn`t the slightest
thing to do with academics. They do strut around like they own the place
and they do behave poorly. Meanwhile the actually more heroic Asian
students are meekly hitting the books, keeping their noses clean and
behaving themselves, and do what Universities are for, they learn. They
should be celebrated and these man-children should be denigrated. And
these same athletes, who have been given every advantage, if they make it
to the pros, insult the country by taking a knee on the sidelines during
the national anthem. My home team Philadelphia Eagles, who I followed all
my life make it to the Super Bowl and I couldn`t even watch it because of
the actions of these spoiled brats. I`ll never watch an NFL game again.

John McAdams

2018-09-26 16:18:46 UTC

Post by John McAdams
A lot of these people are lawyers, deeply committed to *process.* If
you are committed to process, you don't start with the outcome you
want, and try to reverse engineer the process to get that outcome.
You start with a fair process (free speech, equal protection, due
process) and accept whatever that process produces.
Example: if you believe in free speech, you allow racists to speak,
believing that the process of speech and counter speech will result in
a decent outcome.

A person like Richard Spencer would probably beat most liberals in an
open debate on race.

Maybe so, but only because the average liberal knows what he is
*supposed* to believe, but hasn't really looked at the evidence.

Charles Murray could doubtless whip the average liberal on the issue
of race and intelligence.

But let him debate somebody like James Flynn, and you get a good
discussion.

http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2017/03/talking-about-race-and-iq.html

Don't want to believe that blacks are inferior in intelligence? After
listening to Flynn, you have some good arguments.

But the politically correct crowd would not allow the debate.

Post by Bud
He would poke holes in their belief systems and show
the errors of their remedies. That is why they need to shut people like
Spencer up. The thing is, I`m an adult. I should be able to listen to
whatever viewpoint I want to and decide whether it has any merit. I
shouldn`t have other people deciding for me what is bad to hear, let me
hear it and *I`ll* decide. Spencer could be wrong on everything, or
possibly right on only a very specific thing. Hitchens (the world suffers
from the loss of his voice) nails it at 2:05 in this video...
http://youtu.be/K4hqFvXm57M
Paraphrasing his two main points, you infringe a person`s right to
listen when you silence a speaker, and if everyone believes one thing, and
only one person sees things differently, protecting that one voice is more
important than protecting all the rest.
I listened to the full recording of the Lindsay Shepard interrogation by
University officials at Wilfred Laurier in Canada (she secretly recorded
it). They had the poor woman in tears, but I guess it isn`t bullying when
the left does it. The full recording can be heard here...
http://youtu.be/9YdFlKaJv4g
The reason I bring this up is that one of the people conducting this
interrogation mentioned Charles Murray as the sort of person who should be
censored because of their viewpoints. He is the co-author of the
controversial book about race, "The Bell Curve". He points out the
stupidity of "No Child Left Behind" legislation by pointing out that no
matter what you do, half the children will be below average (pointing this
fact out alone makes him an important voice). Anyway, to get to the point,
I went to Wikipedia to look up Murray, and I saw this...
"On March 2, 2017, Murray was shouted down at Middlebury College
(Middlebury, Vermont) by students and others not connected with the
school, and prevented from speaking at the original location on campus.
The speech was moved to another location and a closed circuit broadcast
showed him being interviewed by professor Allison Stanger. After the
interview, there was a violent confrontation between protesters and
Murray, Vice President for Communications Bill Burger, and Stanger (who
was hospitalized with a neck injury and concussion) as they left the
McCullough Student Center. Middlebury students claimed that Middlebury
Public Safety officers instigated and escalated violence against
nonviolent protesters and that administrator Bill Burger assaulted
protesters with a car.[62] Middlebury President Laurie L. Patton responded
after the event, saying the school would respond to "the clear violations
of Middlebury College policy that occurred inside and outside Wilson
Hall."[63][64][65][66] The school took disciplinary action against 74
students for their involvement in the incident."
So there is a direct correlation between the viewpoints of this
administrator who was questioning Lindsay Shepard and actual acts of
violence, what is being taught (that Murray is bad) is being acted out on.
But with Peterson, the claim is that if he is heard it will be bad for
trans folk is accepted without question, with no examples given. Vague
assumptions about a "toxic atmosphere" being created is enough.

The fascists who want to suppress speech are creating a toxic
atmosphere.

The irony is that Murray isn't talking much about race and
intelligence these days, he's talking about his book COMING APART,
which is about the loss of social capital among less educated and
working class whites.

It's not really controversial.

Post by Bud
And the same can be said for BLM rhetoric which is getting cops killed.
There is a direct correlation, but that kind of speech is fine with
liberals, even encouraged. It wasn`t a "toxic atmosphere" being created by
the media with the Trevon Martin and Michael Brown cases.
And I think "globalism" is a an evil idea, can I get talk about it
silenced? I was thinking how weird it is that liberals see the growth of
Walmart, it squeezing out competitors, killing the mom and pop stores and
owning too big a share of the market as a bad thing, but think the
opposite when it comes to world government, here they advocate a monopoly.
Isn`t a lot of smaller, independent "mom and pop" nations better than one
monolithic entity that has an unlimited potential of taking life, liberty
and the pursuit of happiness from the people?

Well . . . you reacted to what Spencer actually said, and didn't view
it the way I did, as motivated by racism. He clearly resents white
students cheering for black players.

I thought the interesting thing was how his remarks went over with
Auburn students. That was what *I* saw as the point.

Obviously, your mileage might differ.

I'm an alum of the University of Alabama, and yes, Alabama football
players are pampered on a massive scale. But they are miles from
being spoiled brats. They all come across as fine young men. And
they are in an absurdly competitive environment. Being a four star
recruit is far from guaranteeing that you'll ever be a starter.

But the point of the video clip was: in the eyes of these Auburn
students, Spencer made a fool of himself.
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Bud

2018-09-27 02:32:15 UTC

A person like Richard Spencer would probably beat most liberals in an
open debate on race.

Maybe so, but only because the average liberal knows what he is
*supposed* to believe, but hasn't really looked at the evidence.
Charles Murray could doubtless whip the average liberal on the issue
of race and intelligence.
But let him debate somebody like James Flynn, and you get a good
discussion.
http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2017/03/talking-about-race-and-iq.html
Don't want to believe that blacks are inferior in intelligence?

Don`t have strong feelings about it. Being an evolutionist, I think it
is possible that the environment in one part of the world could make for a
different physiology, including the way one thinks. Evolution is about
survival, not being able to do math well. What is clear is that it is
wrong to assume that all races are the same just because that makes you
feel warm and fuzzy, and that branding people who challenge your warm and
fuzzy thoughts "evil" is in itself evil.

Post by John McAdams
After
listening to Flynn, you have some good arguments.
But the politically correct crowd would not allow the debate.

That is the thing. Murray could be be wrong in every single idea he
expresses, but he is still a hero in my eyes for willing to take the hit
to open the dialog. Here is another guy who I revere without agreeing
with...

The fascists who want to suppress speech are creating a toxic
atmosphere.
The irony is that Murray isn't talking much about race and
intelligence these days, he's talking about his book COMING APART,
which is about the loss of social capital among less educated and
working class whites.
It's not really controversial.

Who cares about working class whites? He could say they practice
cannibalism and it wouldn`t be controversial.

Well . . . you reacted to what Spencer actually said, and didn't view
it the way I did, as motivated by racism. He clearly resents white
students cheering for black players.
I thought the interesting thing was how his remarks went over with
Auburn students. That was what *I* saw as the point.
Obviously, your mileage might differ.
I'm an alum of the University of Alabama, and yes, Alabama football
players are pampered on a massive scale. But they are miles from
being spoiled brats. They all come across as fine young men. And
they are in an absurdly competitive environment. Being a four star
recruit is far from guaranteeing that you'll ever be a starter.
But the point of the video clip was: in the eyes of these Auburn
students, Spencer made a fool of himself.
.John

It seemed that a lot of them were racists who came to have their racist
outlooks reaffirmed. It did seem he parted ways with them on that football
issue.

I love Hitchens, but his views on the assassination (I accidentally
segued into something on topic) make me squirm...

Post by John McAdams
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

John McAdams

2018-09-27 02:41:58 UTC

Post by Bud
A person like Richard Spencer would probably beat most liberals in an
open debate on race.

Maybe so, but only because the average liberal knows what he is
*supposed* to believe, but hasn't really looked at the evidence.
Charles Murray could doubtless whip the average liberal on the issue
of race and intelligence.
But let him debate somebody like James Flynn, and you get a good
discussion.
http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2017/03/talking-about-race-and-iq.html
Don't want to believe that blacks are inferior in intelligence?

Agreed. And of course, we can agree that people should be treated as
individuals, on their merits.

It's the politically correct crowd that thinks your value is dependent
on your race, gender, sexual orientation, gender identity, etc.

Post by John McAdams
After
listening to Flynn, you have some good arguments.
But the politically correct crowd would not allow the debate.

Yea, when to jail for denying the holocaust.

https://www.theguardian.com/guardianweekly/story/0,,1715580,00.html

I'm sure Tony Marsh approves of that, but when government decides what
the historical truth is, and punishes people who disagree, we are in
really nasty territory.

Wonder what Tony would think if the U.S. government decided to jail
JFK conspiracy people?

Post by John McAdams
Well . . . you reacted to what Spencer actually said, and didn't view
it the way I did, as motivated by racism. He clearly resents white
students cheering for black players.
I thought the interesting thing was how his remarks went over with
Auburn students. That was what *I* saw as the point.
Obviously, your mileage might differ.
I'm an alum of the University of Alabama, and yes, Alabama football
players are pampered on a massive scale. But they are miles from
being spoiled brats. They all come across as fine young men. And
they are in an absurdly competitive environment. Being a four star
recruit is far from guaranteeing that you'll ever be a starter.
But the point of the video clip was: in the eyes of these Auburn
students, Spencer made a fool of himself.

It seemed that a lot of them were racists who came to have their racist
outlooks reaffirmed. It did seem he parted ways with them on that football
issue.
I love Hitchens, but his views on the assassination (I accidentally
segued into something on topic) make me squirm...
http://youtu.be/7wDGs9EwFzs

Interestingly, Hitchens, and outspoken atheist, participated in a
series of debates with Dinesh D'Souza, a Christian.

D'Souza came to really like Hitchens.

https://www.facebook.com/DSouzaDinesh/posts/christopher-hitchens-was-a-terrific-guy-and-over-the-years-became-a-good-friend-/192608960832520/

Good for both of them that they wanted to debate, with each defending
his postion, and each respecting the other.

.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

BT George

2018-09-28 03:08:30 UTC

Post by Bud
A person like Richard Spencer would probably beat most liberals in an
open debate on race.

Maybe so, but only because the average liberal knows what he is
*supposed* to believe, but hasn't really looked at the evidence.
Charles Murray could doubtless whip the average liberal on the issue
of race and intelligence.
But let him debate somebody like James Flynn, and you get a good
discussion.
http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2017/03/talking-about-race-and-iq.html
Don't want to believe that blacks are inferior in intelligence?

Agreed. And of course, we can agree that people should be treated as
individuals, on their merits.
It's the politically correct crowd that thinks your value is dependent
on your race, gender, sexual orientation, gender identity, etc.

One can agree with this possibility even if they are not a Darwinian-level
evolutionist. (I.e., micro vs. macro.) The suggested difference in
*average* intelligence is by no means conclusively established, especially
since intelligence tests are *always* affected in some degree by both
knowledge level, and *training* to think in scientific and ordered
mannner.

But if true, it is *well* within the bounds of inter-species variations
that should be expected to make survivability possible in an often hostile
world, with various climates and environmental challenges. I would say at
that level, it should be no more "out of bounds" to discuss the *data*
than is should be to discuss whether there is an *average* difference
among the races in terms of athletic ablity or ability to thrive with high
exposure to the sun.

The key is to understand that we are taking *averages* not *individuals*
and that the suggested differnces are not great enough to justify those
who would seek to consign any given race to being a "separate" and
"inferior" species of humankind in any case. However, I *do* understand
why this topic must be approached carefully, and with due caution, because
there are always persons who will take it and run with it where it doesn't
rightfully go.

Post by John McAdams
After
listening to Flynn, you have some good arguments.
But the politically correct crowd would not allow the debate.

Yea, when to jail for denying the holocaust.
https://www.theguardian.com/guardianweekly/story/0,,1715580,00.html
I'm sure Tony Marsh approves of that, but when government decides what
the historical truth is, and punishes people who disagree, we are in
really nasty territory.
Wonder what Tony would think if the U.S. government decided to jail
JFK conspiracy people?

It seemed that a lot of them were racists who came to have their racist
outlooks reaffirmed. It did seem he parted ways with them on that football
issue.
I love Hitchens, but his views on the assassination (I accidentally
segued into something on topic) make me squirm...
http://youtu.be/7wDGs9EwFzs

Interestingly, Hitchens, and outspoken atheist, participated in a
series of debates with Dinesh D'Souza, a Christian.
D'Souza came to really like Hitchens.
https://www.facebook.com/DSouzaDinesh/posts/christopher-hitchens-was-a-terrific-guy-and-over-the-years-became-a-good-friend-/192608960832520/
Good for both of them that they wanted to debate, with each defending
his postion, and each respecting the other.
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-29 02:43:20 UTC

Post by Bud
A person like Richard Spencer would probably beat most liberals in an
open debate on race.

Maybe so, but only because the average liberal knows what he is
*supposed* to believe, but hasn't really looked at the evidence.
Charles Murray could doubtless whip the average liberal on the issue
of race and intelligence.
But let him debate somebody like James Flynn, and you get a good
discussion.
http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2017/03/talking-about-race-and-iq.html
Don't want to believe that blacks are inferior in intelligence?

Agreed. And of course, we can agree that people should be treated as
individuals, on their merits.
It's the politically correct crowd that thinks your value is dependent
on your race, gender, sexual orientation, gender identity, etc.

So you don't think evolution has anything to do with it. You could make up
a theory that environment is the cause. Say that colder climates
stiimulate the brain more or something like that. Maybe the amount of sun.

Post by BT George
But if true, it is *well* within the bounds of inter-species variations
that should be expected to make survivability possible in an often hostile
world, with various climates and environmental challenges. I would say at
that level, it should be no more "out of bounds" to discuss the *data*
than is should be to discuss whether there is an *average* difference
among the races in terms of athletic ablity or ability to thrive with high
exposure to the sun.
The key is to understand that we are taking *averages* not *individuals*
and that the suggested differnces are not great enough to justify those
who would seek to consign any given race to being a "separate" and
"inferior" species of humankind in any case. However, I *do* understand
why this topic must be approached carefully, and with due caution, because
there are always persons who will take it and run with it where it doesn't
rightfully go.

Post by John McAdams
After
listening to Flynn, you have some good arguments.
But the politically correct crowd would not allow the debate.

Yea, when to jail for denying the holocaust.
https://www.theguardian.com/guardianweekly/story/0,,1715580,00.html
I'm sure Tony Marsh approves of that, but when government decides what

You have no right to speak for me. Knock it off.

Post by John McAdams
the historical truth is, and punishes people who disagree, we are in
really nasty territory.
Wonder what Tony would think if the U.S. government decided to jail
JFK conspiracy people?

It seemed that a lot of them were racists who came to have their racist
outlooks reaffirmed. It did seem he parted ways with them on that football
issue.
I love Hitchens, but his views on the assassination (I accidentally
segued into something on topic) make me squirm...
http://youtu.be/7wDGs9EwFzs

Interestingly, Hitchens, and outspoken atheist, participated in a
series of debates with Dinesh D'Souza, a Christian.
D'Souza came to really like Hitchens.
https://www.facebook.com/DSouzaDinesh/posts/christopher-hitchens-was-a-terrific-guy-and-over-the-years-became-a-good-friend-/192608960832520/
Good for both of them that they wanted to debate, with each defending
his postion, and each respecting the other.
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

BT George

2018-10-02 02:34:58 UTC

Post by Bud
A person like Richard Spencer would probably beat most liberals in an
open debate on race.

Maybe so, but only because the average liberal knows what he is
*supposed* to believe, but hasn't really looked at the evidence.
Charles Murray could doubtless whip the average liberal on the issue
of race and intelligence.
But let him debate somebody like James Flynn, and you get a good
discussion.
http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2017/03/talking-about-race-and-iq.html
Don't want to believe that blacks are inferior in intelligence?

Agreed. And of course, we can agree that people should be treated as
individuals, on their merits.
It's the politically correct crowd that thinks your value is dependent
on your race, gender, sexual orientation, gender identity, etc.

Can you quote me saying it has nothing to do with any differences? (In
fact, if you would read one sentence below you would see I think that a
possibility.)

Post by John McAdams
After
listening to Flynn, you have some good arguments.
But the politically correct crowd would not allow the debate.

Yea, when to jail for denying the holocaust.
https://www.theguardian.com/guardianweekly/story/0,,1715580,00.html
I'm sure Tony Marsh approves of that, but when government decides what

You have no right to speak for me. Knock it off.

You do realize someone else said that? Either way, I doubt the statement
is in error.

It seemed that a lot of them were racists who came to have their racist
outlooks reaffirmed. It did seem he parted ways with them on that football
issue.
I love Hitchens, but his views on the assassination (I accidentally
segued into something on topic) make me squirm...
http://youtu.be/7wDGs9EwFzs

Interestingly, Hitchens, and outspoken atheist, participated in a
series of debates with Dinesh D'Souza, a Christian.
D'Souza came to really like Hitchens.
https://www.facebook.com/DSouzaDinesh/posts/christopher-hitchens-was-a-terrific-guy-and-over-the-years-became-a-good-friend-/192608960832520/
Good for both of them that they wanted to debate, with each defending
his postion, and each respecting the other.
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-28 02:50:38 UTC

A person like Richard Spencer would probably beat most liberals in an
open debate on race.

Maybe so, but only because the average liberal knows what he is
*supposed* to believe, but hasn't really looked at the evidence.
Charles Murray could doubtless whip the average liberal on the issue
of race and intelligence.
But let him debate somebody like James Flynn, and you get a good
discussion.
http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2017/03/talking-about-race-and-iq.html
Don't want to believe that blacks are inferior in intelligence?

Say what? You got a name for this theory?
So someone born in cold areas the brain develops differently?
How about on some continents Homo sapiens bred more with Cro-Magnon?

Post by Bud
survival, not being able to do math well. What is clear is that it is
wrong to assume that all races are the same just because that makes you

It's also wrong to assume that everyone in the same race is exactly the
same. Like: White Men Can't jump.

Post by Bud
feel warm and fuzzy, and that branding people who challenge your warm and
fuzzy thoughts "evil" is in itself evil.

So you're saying it's evil to hate Nazis? You believe in Agape?

Post by John McAdams
After
listening to Flynn, you have some good arguments.
But the politically correct crowd would not allow the debate.

The fascists who want to suppress speech are creating a toxic
atmosphere.
The irony is that Murray isn't talking much about race and
intelligence these days, he's talking about his book COMING APART,
which is about the loss of social capital among less educated and
working class whites.
It's not really controversial.

Who cares about working class whites? He could say they practice
cannibalism and it wouldn`t be controversial.

Well . . . you reacted to what Spencer actually said, and didn't view
it the way I did, as motivated by racism. He clearly resents white
students cheering for black players.
I thought the interesting thing was how his remarks went over with
Auburn students. That was what *I* saw as the point.
Obviously, your mileage might differ.
I'm an alum of the University of Alabama, and yes, Alabama football
players are pampered on a massive scale. But they are miles from
being spoiled brats. They all come across as fine young men. And
they are in an absurdly competitive environment. Being a four star
recruit is far from guaranteeing that you'll ever be a starter.
But the point of the video clip was: in the eyes of these Auburn
students, Spencer made a fool of himself.
.John

It seemed that a lot of them were racists who came to have their racist
outlooks reaffirmed. It did seem he parted ways with them on that football
issue.
I love Hitchens, but his views on the assassination (I accidentally
segued into something on topic) make me squirm...
http://youtu.be/7wDGs9EwFzs

Post by John McAdams
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Bud

2018-09-29 15:21:28 UTC

A person like Richard Spencer would probably beat most liberals in an
open debate on race.

Maybe so, but only because the average liberal knows what he is
*supposed* to believe, but hasn't really looked at the evidence.
Charles Murray could doubtless whip the average liberal on the issue
of race and intelligence.
But let him debate somebody like James Flynn, and you get a good
discussion.
http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2017/03/talking-about-race-and-iq.html
Don't want to believe that blacks are inferior in intelligence?

Say what? You got a name for this theory?

There are quite a few theories about how intelligence evolved...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution_of_human_intelligence

Post by Anthony Marsh
So someone born in cold areas the brain develops differently?

Surviving where it is cold could cause human beings to develop
differently is the idea.

Post by Anthony Marsh
How about on some continents Homo sapiens bred more with Cro-Magnon?

Post by Bud
survival, not being able to do math well. What is clear is that it is
wrong to assume that all races are the same just because that makes you

It's also wrong to assume that everyone in the same race is exactly the
same.

It`s wrong to assume that has anything to do with what I was saying.

Post by Anthony Marsh
Like: White Men Can't jump.

Post by Bud
feel warm and fuzzy, and that branding people who challenge your warm and
fuzzy thoughts "evil" is in itself evil.

So you're saying it's evil to hate Nazis?

I`m saying the people who emulate the Nazis by taking away free speech
are evil.

Post by Anthony Marsh
You believe in Agape?

Post by John McAdams
After
listening to Flynn, you have some good arguments.
But the politically correct crowd would not allow the debate.

The fascists who want to suppress speech are creating a toxic
atmosphere.
The irony is that Murray isn't talking much about race and
intelligence these days, he's talking about his book COMING APART,
which is about the loss of social capital among less educated and
working class whites.
It's not really controversial.

Who cares about working class whites? He could say they practice
cannibalism and it wouldn`t be controversial.

Well . . . you reacted to what Spencer actually said, and didn't view
it the way I did, as motivated by racism. He clearly resents white
students cheering for black players.
I thought the interesting thing was how his remarks went over with
Auburn students. That was what *I* saw as the point.
Obviously, your mileage might differ.
I'm an alum of the University of Alabama, and yes, Alabama football
players are pampered on a massive scale. But they are miles from
being spoiled brats. They all come across as fine young men. And
they are in an absurdly competitive environment. Being a four star
recruit is far from guaranteeing that you'll ever be a starter.
But the point of the video clip was: in the eyes of these Auburn
students, Spencer made a fool of himself.
.John

It seemed that a lot of them were racists who came to have their racist
outlooks reaffirmed. It did seem he parted ways with them on that football
issue.
I love Hitchens, but his views on the assassination (I accidentally
segued into something on topic) make me squirm...
http://youtu.be/7wDGs9EwFzs

Post by John McAdams
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-30 18:07:24 UTC

A person like Richard Spencer would probably beat most liberals in an
open debate on race.

Maybe so, but only because the average liberal knows what he is
*supposed* to believe, but hasn't really looked at the evidence.
Charles Murray could doubtless whip the average liberal on the issue
of race and intelligence.
But let him debate somebody like James Flynn, and you get a good
discussion.
http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2017/03/talking-about-race-and-iq.html
Don't want to believe that blacks are inferior in intelligence?

Say what? You got a name for this theory?

There are quite a few theories about how intelligence evolved...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution_of_human_intelligence

Post by Anthony Marsh
So someone born in cold areas the brain develops differently?

Surviving where it is cold could cause human beings to develop
differently is the idea.

Cute. WHo's theory is that? Name please. Can you Google a source?

Post by Anthony Marsh
How about on some continents Homo sapiens bred more with Cro-Magnon?

Post by Bud
survival, not being able to do math well. What is clear is that it is
wrong to assume that all races are the same just because that makes you

It's also wrong to assume that everyone in the same race is exactly the
same.

It`s wrong to assume that has anything to do with what I was saying.

Post by Anthony Marsh
Like: White Men Can't jump.

Post by Bud
feel warm and fuzzy, and that branding people who challenge your warm and
fuzzy thoughts "evil" is in itself evil.

So you're saying it's evil to hate Nazis?

I`m saying the people who emulate the Nazis by taking away free speech
are evil.

I am not taking away free speech. McAdams is.
And you support McAdams.

Post by Anthony Marsh
You believe in Agape?

Post by John McAdams
After
listening to Flynn, you have some good arguments.
But the politically correct crowd would not allow the debate.

The fascists who want to suppress speech are creating a toxic
atmosphere.
The irony is that Murray isn't talking much about race and
intelligence these days, he's talking about his book COMING APART,
which is about the loss of social capital among less educated and
working class whites.
It's not really controversial.

Who cares about working class whites? He could say they practice
cannibalism and it wouldn`t be controversial.

Well . . . you reacted to what Spencer actually said, and didn't view
it the way I did, as motivated by racism. He clearly resents white
students cheering for black players.
I thought the interesting thing was how his remarks went over with
Auburn students. That was what *I* saw as the point.
Obviously, your mileage might differ.
I'm an alum of the University of Alabama, and yes, Alabama football
players are pampered on a massive scale. But they are miles from
being spoiled brats. They all come across as fine young men. And
they are in an absurdly competitive environment. Being a four star
recruit is far from guaranteeing that you'll ever be a starter.
But the point of the video clip was: in the eyes of these Auburn
students, Spencer made a fool of himself.
.John

It seemed that a lot of them were racists who came to have their racist
outlooks reaffirmed. It did seem he parted ways with them on that football
issue.
I love Hitchens, but his views on the assassination (I accidentally
segued into something on topic) make me squirm...
http://youtu.be/7wDGs9EwFzs

Post by John McAdams
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

bigdog

2018-09-28 03:09:58 UTC

A person like Richard Spencer would probably beat most liberals in an
open debate on race.

Maybe so, but only because the average liberal knows what he is
*supposed* to believe, but hasn't really looked at the evidence.
Charles Murray could doubtless whip the average liberal on the issue
of race and intelligence.
But let him debate somebody like James Flynn, and you get a good
discussion.
http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2017/03/talking-about-race-and-iq.html
Don't want to believe that blacks are inferior in intelligence?

Of course that is theoretically possible just as it is theoretically
possible a race that evolved in one portion of the globe could be able to
run faster and jump higher than a race that evolved in another portion of
the globe. The important thing is that we judge people as individuals not
by the group they represent. The NBA and NFL don't assume every black guy
is fast and can jump high and they don't assume every white guy is slow
and can't jump. That's why the NFL runs a combine every year in which they
measure those attributes. The stop watch and the tape measure are color
blind. The same approach should be used when considering people for all
fields of endeavor.

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-29 02:43:44 UTC

A person like Richard Spencer would probably beat most liberals in an
open debate on race.

Maybe so, but only because the average liberal knows what he is
*supposed* to believe, but hasn't really looked at the evidence.
Charles Murray could doubtless whip the average liberal on the issue
of race and intelligence.
But let him debate somebody like James Flynn, and you get a good
discussion.
http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2017/03/talking-about-race-and-iq.html
Don't want to believe that blacks are inferior in intelligence?

Of course that is theoretically possible just as it is theoretically
possible a race that evolved in one portion of the globe could be able to

Sure, sure, and you think that one race could have evolved to have 3 legs.

Post by bigdog
run faster and jump higher than a race that evolved in another portion of
the globe. The important thing is that we judge people as individuals not

It's a reverse racism meme and a joke.

Post by bigdog
by the group they represent. The NBA and NFL don't assume every black guy
is fast and can jump high and they don't assume every white guy is slow
and can't jump. That's why the NFL runs a combine every year in which they

Just because most are,you can't ASSuME that all are.
Did you see how miffed Hitler was as Jesse Owens?

Post by bigdog
measure those attributes. The stop watch and the tape measure are color
blind. The same approach should be used when considering people for all
fields of endeavor.

GKnoll

2018-09-27 01:58:53 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

A lot of these people are lawyers, deeply committed to *process.* If
you are committed to process, you don't start with the outcome you
want, and try to reverse engineer the process to get that outcome.
You start with a fair process (free speech, equal protection, due
process) and accept whatever that process produces.
Example: if you believe in free speech, you allow racists to speak,
believing that the process of speech and counter speech will result in
a decent outcome.
I have an interesting clip on my blog of a speech by Richard Spencer.
http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2017/04/racist-tells-auburn-students-football.html
I won't give the point away. But it's epic.
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Some of us do not agree with the courts opinion in your case. Since this
subject is not related to the JFK assassination, I ask that you please
do not post any more threads on this subject.

Bud

2018-09-27 19:20:52 UTC

Post by GKnoll

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

A lot of these people are lawyers, deeply committed to *process.* If
you are committed to process, you don't start with the outcome you
want, and try to reverse engineer the process to get that outcome.
You start with a fair process (free speech, equal protection, due
process) and accept whatever that process produces.
Example: if you believe in free speech, you allow racists to speak,
believing that the process of speech and counter speech will result in
a decent outcome.
I have an interesting clip on my blog of a speech by Richard Spencer.
http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2017/04/racist-tells-auburn-students-football.html
I won't give the point away. But it's epic.
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Some of us do not agree with the courts opinion in your case. Since this
subject is not related to the JFK assassination, I ask that you please
do not post any more threads on this subject.

Is the "off-topic-ness" the reason you want the discussion shut down, or
is it sour grapes because you didn`t like that the decision went in
McAdam`s favor?

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-27 02:16:42 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

Decent outcome? Is that a joke? You mean like concentration camps and
shooting women in the back of the head and running over leftists with your
Dodge? That's what you call a decent outcome?

Only when Trump was elected did we see the KKK and Nazis marching with
their little Tiki torches. The worst people have been emboldened and
provoked to use violence by all the hate speech. And you support hate
speech. As long as it is aimed at your enemies, never at your allies.

John McAdams

2018-09-27 02:18:32 UTC

On 26 Sep 2018 22:16:42 -0400, Anthony Marsh

Decent outcome? Is that a joke? You mean like concentration camps and
shooting women in the back of the head and running over leftists with your
Dodge? That's what you call a decent outcome?

How about the Bernie supporter who shot up a bunch of Republican
congressmen?

I guess Bernie is right there with the KKK, isn't he?

.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Bud

2018-09-27 19:21:37 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

Decent outcome? Is that a joke? You mean like concentration camps and
shooting women in the back of the head and running over leftists with your
Dodge? That's what you call a decent outcome?

<snicker> No raining of frogs or locusts, Tony? All these terrible
calamities that will befall us if we don`t let liberals decide what we can
say or hear.

Post by Anthony Marsh
Only when Trump was elected did we see the KKK and Nazis marching with
their little Tiki torches.

And poor Tony and his liberal friends had to witness this. The horror.

Post by Anthony Marsh
The worst people have been emboldened and
provoked to use violence by all the hate speech.

Yes, they have...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_shooting_of_Dallas_police_officers

https://nypost.com/2017/07/06/politically-fueled-cop-hatred-has-taken-another-innocent-officers-life/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_killings_of_NYPD_officers

Post by Anthony Marsh
And you support hate
speech. As long as it is aimed at your enemies, never at your allies.

We can tolerate both, Tony. It is your kind that can`t.

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-28 20:15:30 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

Decent outcome? Is that a joke? You mean like concentration camps and
shooting women in the back of the head and running over leftists with your
Dodge? That's what you call a decent outcome?

<snicker> No raining of frogs or locusts, Tony? All these terrible
calamities that will befall us if we don`t let liberals decide what we can
say or hear.

Not associated with a Fascist takeover.

Post by Anthony Marsh
Only when Trump was elected did we see the KKK and Nazis marching with
their little Tiki torches.

And poor Tony and his liberal friends had to witness this. The horror.

Ok, so you like to see people run over in real life. I prefer Zombies
because I know they are not real.

Post by Anthony Marsh
The worst people have been emboldened and
provoked to use violence by all the hate speech.

Yes, they have...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_shooting_of_Dallas_police_officers
https://nypost.com/2017/07/06/politically-fueled-cop-hatred-has-taken-another-innocent-officers-life/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_killings_of_NYPD_officers

Post by Anthony Marsh
And you support hate
speech. As long as it is aimed at your enemies, never at your allies.

We can tolerate both, Tony. It is your kind that can`t.

I tolerate all the hate speech here. I told you before that I want you
to speak freely so that everyone can see who you are.

Bud

2018-09-29 15:23:39 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

Decent outcome? Is that a joke? You mean like concentration camps and
shooting women in the back of the head and running over leftists with your
Dodge? That's what you call a decent outcome?

<snicker> No raining of frogs or locusts, Tony? All these terrible
calamities that will befall us if we don`t let liberals decide what we can
say or hear.

Not associated with a Fascist takeover.

Neither is free speech.

Post by Anthony Marsh
Only when Trump was elected did we see the KKK and Nazis marching with
their little Tiki torches.

And poor Tony and his liberal friends had to witness this. The horror.

Ok, so you like to see people run over in real life.

It happens.

Post by Anthony Marsh
I prefer Zombies
because I know they are not real.

Post by Anthony Marsh
The worst people have been emboldened and
provoked to use violence by all the hate speech.

Yes, they have...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_shooting_of_Dallas_police_officers
https://nypost.com/2017/07/06/politically-fueled-cop-hatred-has-taken-another-innocent-officers-life/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_killings_of_NYPD_officers

Post by Anthony Marsh
And you support hate
speech. As long as it is aimed at your enemies, never at your allies.

We can tolerate both, Tony. It is your kind that can`t.

I tolerate all the hate speech here.

Which only shows your kind can`t be trusted to determine what hate
speech is.

Post by Anthony Marsh
I told you before that I want you
to speak freely so that everyone can see who you are.

Jason Burke

2018-09-27 19:22:53 UTC

On Saturday, July 7, 2018 at 7:58:49 AM UTC-5,

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

You know Bud and BD, it would be nice to see just one liberal CT
on here
speak up on this issue. Perhaps they don't understand what Free
Speech,
to me anyway, means. I'll defend anyone's right to voice liberal
views--I
just ask that they, in turn, have my back when I write as a
conservative
and disagree with them.
Mark

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good
fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

Decent outcome? Is that a joke? You mean like concentration camps and
shooting women in the back of the head and running over leftists with
your Dodge? That's what you call a decent outcome?

Again, just a tad off topic, but since that was Anthony Anthony's major
in college...

One of my favorite lines from Married with Children was:

"Dodge is a damn fine car. Ran over my wife with a Dodge."

Post by Anthony Marsh
Only when Trump was elected did we see the KKK and Nazis marching with
their little Tiki torches. The worst people have been emboldened and
provoked to use violence by all the hate speech. And you support hate
speech. As long as it is aimed at your enemies, never at your allies.

I have an interesting clip on my blog of a speech by Richard Spencer.
http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2017/04/racist-tells-auburn-students-football.html
I won't give the point away. But it's epic.
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-28 20:15:50 UTC

Post by Jason Burke

On Saturday, July 7, 2018 at 7:58:49 AM UTC-5,

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

You know Bud and BD, it would be nice to see just one liberal CT
on here
speak up on this issue. Perhaps they don't understand what Free
Speech,
to me anyway, means. I'll defend anyone's right to voice liberal
views--I
just ask that they, in turn, have my back when I write as a conservative
and disagree with them.
Mark

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good
fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

Decent outcome? Is that a joke? You mean like concentration camps and
shooting women in the back of the head and running over leftists with
your Dodge? That's what you call a decent outcome?

Again, just a tad off topic, but since that was Anthony Anthony's major
in college...

I was NEVER off key in college. Stop the slander.

Post by Jason Burke
"Dodge is a damn fine car. Ran over my wife with a Dodge."

You're old enough to remember that show?

Post by Jason Burke

John McAdams

2018-09-26 04:11:03 UTC

Post by Mark
You know Bud and BD, it would be nice to see just one liberal CT on here
speak up on this issue. Perhaps they don't understand what Free Speech,
to me anyway, means. I'll defend anyone's right to voice liberal views--I
just ask that they, in turn, have my back when I write as a conservative
and disagree with them.
Mark

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

As for the scientists: if you are one, you won't accept the notion
that gravity is socially constructed.

But nonscientist reviewers for the journal SOCIAL TEXT published an
article saying exactly that.

Or that men and women are absolutely identical in their innate
dispositions, such that, if they are found in different professions
(on average) , it can only be the result of discrimination, or sexist
socialization.

Postmodernism is going great guns in the humanities. Not so much in
science.

Some disciplines really are "disciplined."

.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Mitch Todd

2018-09-26 15:49:58 UTC

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

That was a classic..

Here's the paper:

http://www.physics.nyu.edu/sokal/transgress_v /transgress_v2_singlefile.html

(feel free to reassemble it if my newsreader chops it)

and the wikipedia article:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sokal_affair

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-27 02:19:34 UTC

Post by Mitch Todd

You know Bud and BD, it would be nice to see just one liberal CT
on here
speak up on this issue. Perhaps they don't understand what Free
Speech,
to me anyway, means. I'll defend anyone's right to voice liberal
views--I
just ask that they, in turn, have my back when I write as a
conservative
and disagree with them.
Mark

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good
fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

As for the scientists: if you are one, you won't accept the notion
that gravity is socially constructed.

I like that Sci-fi theory, How would it work?
It took us a few eears to realize that the moon's gravity affects us.
Some people believe that there is a failed star or something near us
which has affected the planets in our solar system.
How about: Nibiru was thrown at us to destroy our planet?

Post by Mitch Todd

But nonscientist reviewers for the journal SOCIAL TEXT published an
article saying exactly that.

That was a classic..
http://www.physics.nyu.edu/sokal/transgress_v
/transgress_v2_singlefile.html
(feel free to reassemble it if my newsreader chops it)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sokal_affair

Marcus Hanson

2018-09-26 15:50:32 UTC

On Wednesday, September 26, 2018 at 2:11:04 PM UTC+10, John McAdams wrote:
.... Or that men and women are absolutely identical in their innate

Post by John McAdams
dispositions, such that, if they are found in different professions
(on average) , it can only be the result of discrimination, or sexist
socialization.
Postmodernism is going great guns in the humanities. Not so much in
science.
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

And maths (yes , folks - math-S ) is racist:

https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=10005

John McAdams

2018-09-26 15:53:49 UTC

Post by Marcus Hanson
.... Or that men and women are absolutely identical in their innate

https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=10005

Yea, tell black students that math is racist, and they should avoid
it.

Just how helpful is that?

Somehow these women didn't know that math is racist:

https://www.popularmechanics.com/space/rockets/a24429/hidden-figures-real-story-nasa-women-computers/

.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-27 02:20:15 UTC

Post by Marcus Hanson
.... Or that men and women are absolutely identical in their innate

https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=10005

Can Math be racist? Not really. But racists can misuse math to make
racist memes. They could say that only 1 in 100 whites commit crimes,
but 60 out of 100 blacks are criminals.

John McAdams

2018-09-27 02:22:10 UTC

On 26 Sep 2018 22:20:15 -0400, Anthony Marsh

Post by Marcus Hanson
.... Or that men and women are absolutely identical in their innate

https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=10005

Can Math be racist? Not really. But racists can misuse math to make
racist memes. They could say that only 1 in 100 whites commit crimes,
but 60 out of 100 blacks are criminals.

Ironically, it's leftists who are always quoting statistics about the
number of black men in prison.

The interpret it to be just another way in which blacks are oppressed.

But most people will see that, and interpret it to mean that blacks
commit proportionately much more crime than whites.

.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-28 02:59:13 UTC

Post by John McAdams
On 26 Sep 2018 22:20:15 -0400, Anthony Marsh

Post by Marcus Hanson
.... Or that men and women are absolutely identical in their innate

https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=10005

Can Math be racist? Not really. But racists can misuse math to make
racist memes. They could say that only 1 in 100 whites commit crimes,
but 60 out of 100 blacks are criminals.

Ironically, it's leftists who are always quoting statistics about the
number of black men in prison.

That's different. More whites are let go and more blacks are prosecuted
unfairly.

Post by John McAdams
The interpret it to be just another way in which blacks are oppressed.

Maybe like being shot for no reason.

Post by John McAdams
But most people will see that, and interpret it to mean that blacks
commit proportionately much more crime than whites.

Yes, most people don't care to dig into the topic.

Post by John McAdams
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

John McAdams

2018-09-28 03:01:56 UTC

On 27 Sep 2018 22:59:13 -0400, Anthony Marsh

Post by John McAdams
On 26 Sep 2018 22:20:15 -0400, Anthony Marsh

Post by Anthony Marsh
Can Math be racist? Not really. But racists can misuse math to make
racist memes. They could say that only 1 in 100 whites commit crimes,
but 60 out of 100 blacks are criminals.

Ironically, it's leftists who are always quoting statistics about the
number of black men in prison.

That's different. More whites are let go and more blacks are prosecuted
unfairly.

Post by John McAdams
The interpret it to be just another way in which blacks are oppressed.

Maybe like being shot for no reason.

Post by John McAdams
But most people will see that, and interpret it to mean that blacks
commit proportionately much more crime than whites.

Yes, most people don't care to dig into the topic.

Blacks, who are 13% of the population, commit about half of all
murders.

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2015/crime-in-the-u.s.-2015/tables/expanded_homicide_data_table_6_murder_race_and_sex_of_vicitm_by_race_and_sex_of_offender_2015.xls

There. That's what you find when you dig into the topic?

.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-29 02:43:58 UTC

Post by John McAdams
On 27 Sep 2018 22:59:13 -0400, Anthony Marsh

Post by John McAdams
On 26 Sep 2018 22:20:15 -0400, Anthony Marsh

Ironically, it's leftists who are always quoting statistics about the
number of black men in prison.

That's different. More whites are let go and more blacks are prosecuted
unfairly.

Post by John McAdams
The interpret it to be just another way in which blacks are oppressed.

Maybe like being shot for no reason.

Post by John McAdams
But most people will see that, and interpret it to mean that blacks
commit proportionately much more crime than whites.

Yes, most people don't care to dig into the topic.

Blacks, who are 13% of the population, commit about half of all
murders.
https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2015/crime-in-the-u.s.-2015/tables/expanded_homicide_data_table_6_murder_race_and_sex_of_vicitm_by_race_and_sex_of_offender_2015.xls
There. That's what you find when you dig into the topic?

About? You prove my point for me. Most whites are let go.

Post by John McAdams
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Bud

2018-09-29 15:22:39 UTC

Post by John McAdams
On 26 Sep 2018 22:20:15 -0400, Anthony Marsh

Post by Marcus Hanson
.... Or that men and women are absolutely identical in their innate

https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=10005

Can Math be racist? Not really. But racists can misuse math to make
racist memes. They could say that only 1 in 100 whites commit crimes,
but 60 out of 100 blacks are criminals.

Ironically, it's leftists who are always quoting statistics about the
number of black men in prison.

That's different. More whites are let go and more blacks are prosecuted
unfairly.

Liberals love their false narratives. Tony can`t produce evidence that
white people are sentenced differently than blacks when relevant factors
like prior convictions, outstanding warrants, whether the person had a
lawyer rather than a public defender, ext are taken into account. Liberals
only want to look at race and results, and ignore context.

It would be interesting to take a city like here in Philadelphia and
take all the police reports and surveillance video of crimes and break it
down according to race. That is, who the race of the perpetrator was
according to the victim or the apparent race of the person seen committing
a crime on video. Unless victims and film are somehow part of systematic
racism, this should give a pretty good idea how much crime is being
committed by blacks.

Post by John McAdams
The interpret it to be just another way in which blacks are oppressed.

Maybe like being shot for no reason.

Another false narrative. Like the cops are riding down the street
gunning down black people.

People can watch the videos of police shootings here...

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXMYxKMh3prxnM_4kYZuB3g

Generally, they don`t shoot white people or black people, they shoot a
lot of stupid people.

Post by John McAdams
But most people will see that, and interpret it to mean that blacks
commit proportionately much more crime than whites.

Yes, most people don't care to dig into the topic.

Facts do harm to some people`s false narratives.

Post by John McAdams
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-30 18:09:03 UTC

Post by John McAdams
On 26 Sep 2018 22:20:15 -0400, Anthony Marsh

Post by Marcus Hanson
.... Or that men and women are absolutely identical in their innate

https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=10005

Can Math be racist? Not really. But racists can misuse math to make
racist memes. They could say that only 1 in 100 whites commit crimes,
but 60 out of 100 blacks are criminals.

Ironically, it's leftists who are always quoting statistics about the
number of black men in prison.

That's different. More whites are let go and more blacks are prosecuted
unfairly.

Of course I can, but McAdams would censor it. I know where you got your
phony statistics:

FactCheck
Do black Americans commit more crime?

Share
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Send
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By Patrick Worrall
27 Nov 2014

The claim

???It???s important to note that black men commit nearly half of all
murders in this country, which is astounding when you take into
consideration the fact that they only make up 12-13 per cent of the
population.???

???James???, 26 November 2014

There were angry protests across America this week after a grand jury
decided a white police officer should not stand trial for the killing of
black teenager Michael Brown in Ferguson, Missouri.

FactCheck has already looked at the statistics on killings by law
enforcement officials. Though imperfect, the official figures suggest
blacks are disproportionately likely to die at the hands of police.
27_ferguson_327_ferguson_3

Several people have left comments pointing out that this is not
necessarily surprising or unfair, since blacks are also
disproportionately likely to be involved in violent crime in the US,
thereby putting themselves in the firing line.

One reader, ???James???, wrote: ???It???s important to note that black men
commit nearly half of all murders in this country, which is astounding
when you take into consideration the fact that they only make up 12-13
per cent of the population.

???So, given this fact, does it make sense that black men are
disproportionately involved in shootings with the police? Your graph is
appropriately proportionate, when you take into consideration the role
that the black population plays in, not just murder, but crime in general.???

???Sean??? said: ???If one group is more likely to be involved in that then
they are more likely to be killed by the police ??? so they have nothing
to complain about if that is the case.???

We thought we???d check these claims out.
The analysis

It???s true that around 13 per cent of Americans are black, according to
the latest estimates from the US Census Bureau.

And yes, according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics, black offenders
committed 52 per cent of homicides recorded in the data between 1980 and
2008. Only 45 per cent of the offenders were white. Homicide is a
broader category than ???murder??? but let???s not split hairs.
27_bjs_use27_bjs_use

Blacks were disproportionately likely to commit homicide and to be the
victims. In 2008 the offending rate for blacks was seven times higher
than for whites and the victimisation rate was six times higher.

As we found yesterday, 93 per cent of black victims were killed by
blacks and 84 per cent of white victims were killed by whites.

Alternative statistics from the FBI are more up to date but include many
crimes where the killer???s race is not recorded. These numbers tell a
similar story.

In 2013, the FBI has black criminals carrying out 38 per cent of
murders, compared to 31.1 per cent for whites. The offender???s race was
???unknown??? in 29.1 per cent of cases.

What about violent crime more generally? FBI arrest rates are one way
into this. Over the last three years of data ??? 2011 to 2013 ??? 38.5 per
cent of people arrested for murder, manslaughter, rape, robbery, and
aggravated assault were black.

Clearly, these figures are problematic. We???re talking about arrests not
convictions, and high black arrest rates could be taken as evidence that
the police are racist.

Police corral protesters before making mass arrests in Los Angeles,
following Monday's grand jury decision in the shooting of BrownPolice
corral protesters before making mass arrests in Los Angeles, following
Monday's grand jury decision in the shooting of Brown

But academics have noted that the proportion of black suspects arrested
by the police tends to match closely the proportion of offenders
identified as black by victims in the National Crime Victimization Survey.

This doesn???t support the idea that the police are unfairly
discriminating against the black population when they make arrests.

So why are black offenders ??? and young black men in particular ???
over-represented in America???s crime statistics?

Judging from online comments, there is a wide spectrum of views on this,
from unapologetic racism to militant refusal to blame the problem on
anything but historic white racism.

Some criminologists think we could be simply confusing race for poverty
or inequality: black people tend to offend more because they tend to be
more disadvantaged, living in poorer urban areas with less access to
public services, and so on.

If you control for deprivation, people of different races ought to be
similarly predisposed to commit crime. Or that???s the theory, at least.

There is a lot of research in this area, but a lot of it is contradictory.

This study of violent crime in deprived neighbourhoods in Cleveland,
Ohio, found that reductions in poverty led to reductions in the crime
rate in exactly the same way in predominantly black and white areas,
suggesting poverty, not race, is the biggest factor.

Other studies get different results.

All sociologists have suffered from the same basic problem: finding
urban white communities that are as disadvantaged as the poorest black
neighbourhoods, so that you can get a fair comparison.

Some thinkers play down the importance of poverty in favour of the
???violent subculture theory???.

This is the idea that some black communities, for some reason, have
developed cultural values that are more tolerant of crime and violence.

Some commentators on the unrest in Ferguson ??? mostly right-wing, though
not all white ??? seem to favour this idea, but naturally it remains
highly controversial.
The verdict

There is evidence in the official police-recorded figures that black
Americans are more likely to commit certain types of crime than people
of other races.

While it would be na??ve to suggest that there is no racism in the US
criminal justice system, victim reports don???t support the idea that this
is because of mass discrimination.

Higher poverty rates among various urban black communities might explain
the difference in crime rates, although the evidence is mixed.

There are few simple answers and links between crime and race are likely
to remain the subject of bitter argument.

Post by Bud
It would be interesting to take a city like here in Philadelphia and
take all the police reports and surveillance video of crimes and break it
down according to race. That is, who the race of the perpetrator was
according to the victim or the apparent race of the person seen committing
a crime on video. Unless victims and film are somehow part of systematic
racism, this should give a pretty good idea how much crime is being
committed by blacks.

Post by John McAdams
The interpret it to be just another way in which blacks are oppressed.

Maybe like being shot for no reason.

Another false narrative. Like the cops are riding down the street
gunning down black people.
People can watch the videos of police shootings here...
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXMYxKMh3prxnM_4kYZuB3g
Generally, they don`t shoot white people or black people, they shoot a
lot of stupid people.

Post by John McAdams
But most people will see that, and interpret it to mean that blacks
commit proportionately much more crime than whites.

Yes, most people don't care to dig into the topic.

Facts do harm to some people`s false narratives.

Post by John McAdams
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Bud

2018-10-01 15:16:18 UTC

Post by John McAdams
On 26 Sep 2018 22:20:15 -0400, Anthony Marsh

Post by Marcus Hanson
.... Or that men and women are absolutely identical in their innate

https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=10005

Can Math be racist? Not really. But racists can misuse math to make
racist memes. They could say that only 1 in 100 whites commit crimes,
but 60 out of 100 blacks are criminals.

Ironically, it's leftists who are always quoting statistics about the
number of black men in prison.

That's different. More whites are let go and more blacks are prosecuted
unfairly.

Of course I can, but McAdams would censor it. I know where you got your

The FBI. Here are some more...

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2016/crime-in-the-u.s.-2016/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-3.xls

Post by Anthony Marsh
FactCheck
Do black Americans commit more crime?
Share
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By Patrick Worrall
27 Nov 2014
The claim
???It???s important to note that black men commit nearly half of all
murders in this country, which is astounding when you take into
consideration the fact that they only make up 12-13 per cent of the
population.???
???James???, 26 November 2014
There were angry protests across America this week after a grand jury
decided a white police officer should not stand trial for the killing of
black teenager Michael Brown in Ferguson, Missouri.

A case where the cops actions were entirely correct. Nothing shows that
the entire narrative that cops shoot blacks because they are racist as a
false one than the Michael Brown case. Yet, this is the case that
predicated the BLM movement, a movement founded on lies. And no critical
examination of the event was presented to the public by the media, they
stoked the embers as if there was a legitimate complaint.

Post by Anthony Marsh
FactCheck has already looked at the statistics on killings by law
enforcement officials. Though imperfect, the official figures suggest
blacks are disproportionately likely to die at the hands of police.
27_ferguson_327_ferguson_3

This just shows what I said earlier, that people want to look at race
and results and that is it. They don`t want to consider mitigating
factors, they want to pretend all things are equal. Do blacks comply with
police instructions at the same rate as white. Most people who are shot by
police are attacking them, do white people and black people attack cops at
the same rate? Looking at information correctly and in the right context
would do harm to the false narratives of the left, so the media never
supplies it to the public.

Post by Anthony Marsh
Several people have left comments pointing out that this is not
necessarily surprising or unfair, since blacks are also
disproportionately likely to be involved in violent crime in the US,
thereby putting themselves in the firing line.

That is correct, you aren`t going to get equal results when the
realities of the situation are not equal. Liberals want to assume that
racism is the cause. And black cops shoot blacks at the same rate as
whites, are those cops racist? Perhaps it is the reality of what the cops,
white or black, are dealing with.

https://psmag.com/social-justice/black-cops-are-just-as-likely-as-whites-to-kill-black-suspects

Of course the narrative just get changed to institution racism, the
narrative must be protected at all costs, even if it means making stupid
arguments. The argument used to be that white cops would be quicker to
shoot or less likely to give a black suspect the benefit of the doubt. Are
black people who are cops just as biased?

Post by Anthony Marsh
One reader, ???James???, wrote: ???It???s important to note that black men
commit nearly half of all murders in this country, which is astounding
when you take into consideration the fact that they only make up 12-13
per cent of the population.
???So, given this fact, does it make sense that black men are
disproportionately involved in shootings with the police? Your graph is
appropriately proportionate, when you take into consideration the role
that the black population plays in, not just murder, but crime in general.???
???Sean??? said: ???If one group is more likely to be involved in that then
they are more likely to be killed by the police ??? so they have nothing
to complain about if that is the case.???
We thought we???d check these claims out.
The analysis
It???s true that around 13 per cent of Americans are black, according to
the latest estimates from the US Census Bureau.
And yes, according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics, black offenders
committed 52 per cent of homicides recorded in the data between 1980 and
2008. Only 45 per cent of the offenders were white. Homicide is a
broader category than ???murder??? but let???s not split hairs.
27_bjs_use27_bjs_use
Blacks were disproportionately likely to commit homicide and to be the
victims. In 2008 the offending rate for blacks was seven times higher
than for whites and the victimisation rate was six times higher.
As we found yesterday, 93 per cent of black victims were killed by
blacks and 84 per cent of white victims were killed by whites.
Alternative statistics from the FBI are more up to date but include many
crimes where the killer???s race is not recorded. These numbers tell a
similar story.
In 2013, the FBI has black criminals carrying out 38 per cent of
murders, compared to 31.1 per cent for whites. The offender???s race was
???unknown??? in 29.1 per cent of cases.
What about violent crime more generally? FBI arrest rates are one way
into this. Over the last three years of data ??? 2011 to 2013 ??? 38.5 per
cent of people arrested for murder, manslaughter, rape, robbery, and
aggravated assault were black.
Clearly, these figures are problematic. We???re talking about arrests not
convictions, and high black arrest rates could be taken as evidence that
the police are racist.

Look at the police reports. Look at what the victims said about the race
of the person who committed the crime against them.

Post by Anthony Marsh
Police corral protesters before making mass arrests in Los Angeles,
following Monday's grand jury decision in the shooting of BrownPolice
corral protesters before making mass arrests in Los Angeles, following
Monday's grand jury decision in the shooting of Brown

Perhaps masses of blacks throwing bricks at the cops led to mass black
arrests.

Post by Anthony Marsh
But academics have noted that the proportion of black suspects arrested
by the police tends to match closely the proportion of offenders
identified as black by victims in the National Crime Victimization Survey.

Of course liberals will say the police are grabbing any blacks. Anything
to protect their false narratives. By refusing to address the reality of
disproportionate black crime liberals are insuring that the problem will
only get worse, and other blacks will pay the price.

And the problem is being solved anyway, with the proliferation of
security cameras. As the cost goes down they are appearing everywhere.
Many of my neighbors have them, soon it will be half, then almost all. I
don`t know how many times I`ve seen footage of a killer (almost invariably
black) on the news fleeing some murder. And the body cameras activists
insisted be installed are just backfiring, showing cops as professional
and courteous. These films have to be adding jail time to suspects (white
and black)when they show the egregious behavior of the people they have to
deal with. It is merely a matter of building prisons large enough to hold
all these thugs.

Post by Anthony Marsh
This doesn???t support the idea that the police are unfairly
discriminating against the black population when they make arrests.
So why are black offenders ??? and young black men in particular ???
over-represented in America???s crime statistics?
Judging from online comments, there is a wide spectrum of views on this,
from unapologetic racism to militant refusal to blame the problem on
anything but historic white racism.

Liberals can`t admit that blacks might somehow be responsible for their
actions. The problem is rooted in an increasing violent culture, the
welfare state ensuring that most black children are raised by a single
mother and no accountability.

Post by Anthony Marsh
Some criminologists think we could be simply confusing race for poverty
or inequality: black people tend to offend more because they tend to be
more disadvantaged, living in poorer urban areas with less access to
public services, and so on.

This lame idea doesn`t float. Nobody is starving in this country. Just
because you want gold chains and $100 sneakers doesn`t mean you get to
sell drugs or take from other people to get them. People on welfare are
getting upwards of $30,000 a year in housing, medical, food stamps, money,
liheap energy assistance,ect. They get phones and public transportation
passes, because this was said to prevent them from getting work. The
economic excuse for crime just doesn`t fly.

Post by Anthony Marsh
If you control for deprivation, people of different races ought to be
similarly predisposed to commit crime. Or that???s the theory, at least.
There is a lot of research in this area, but a lot of it is contradictory.
This study of violent crime in deprived neighbourhoods in Cleveland,
Ohio, found that reductions in poverty led to reductions in the crime
rate in exactly the same way in predominantly black and white areas,
suggesting poverty, not race, is the biggest factor.
Other studies get different results.
All sociologists have suffered from the same basic problem: finding
urban white communities that are as disadvantaged as the poorest black
neighbourhoods, so that you can get a fair comparison.
Some thinkers play down the importance of poverty in favour of the
???violent subculture theory???.
This is the idea that some black communities, for some reason, have
developed cultural values that are more tolerant of crime and violence.
Some commentators on the unrest in Ferguson ??? mostly right-wing, though
not all white ??? seem to favour this idea, but naturally it remains
highly controversial.

If the situation was looked at objectively it wouldn`t be. Just look at
rap lyrics. Violence is looked at as the "go-to" solution to problems in
the hood. If someone disrespects you you have to retaliate. Children are
taught not to take anything from anyone. You can look at pranking videos
on youtube, black people often go straight to violence. So instead of
learning the lesson in the Trayvon Martin case that *should* have been
learned (keep you hands to yourself) we go with false narratives which
insures the violence perpetuates itself forever.

Post by Anthony Marsh
The verdict
There is evidence in the official police-recorded figures that black
Americans are more likely to commit certain types of crime than people
of other races.

White apologists for a hugely disproportionate amount of black crime. A
black male is eight times more likely to commit a forcible rape than a
white male...

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/table-43

That crime has nothing to do with economics. I went into downtown Philly
yesterday, and wandered into an protest against sexual violence against
women. I saw signs like "Believe Women" and wondered if they knew how
sexist that was. I was wondering what the reaction would be if I wrote a
sign saying "Black Male Commit A Hugely Disproportionate Amount of Sexual
Assaults". Likely I would be attacked, maybe even arrested in this liberal
town, the powers that be would claim my stating of a fact to be hate
speech. And in the world these woman seem to be advocating, if they didn`t
like my sign they need only make a report of sexual assault against me,
and I would be convicted, as it would be somehow wrong to believe me.

Post by Anthony Marsh
While it would be na??ve to suggest that there is no racism in the US
criminal justice system, victim reports don???t support the idea that this
is because of mass discrimination.
Higher poverty rates among various urban black communities might explain
the difference in crime rates, although the evidence is mixed.

No, it really isn`t. Liberals apply spin to the data to muddy the water.
The false narrative of institutional racism must be protected at all cost.

Post by Anthony Marsh
There are few simple answers and links between crime and race are likely
to remain the subject of bitter argument.

With liberals black crime validates white racism. The more black crime
the more white people are at fault.

Post by John McAdams
The interpret it to be just another way in which blacks are oppressed.

Maybe like being shot for no reason.

Another false narrative. Like the cops are riding down the street
gunning down black people.
People can watch the videos of police shootings here...
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXMYxKMh3prxnM_4kYZuB3g
Generally, they don`t shoot white people or black people, they shoot a
lot of stupid people.

Post by John McAdams
But most people will see that, and interpret it to mean that blacks
commit proportionately much more crime than whites.

Yes, most people don't care to dig into the topic.

Facts do harm to some people`s false narratives.

Post by John McAdams
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

John McAdams

2018-10-01 15:41:54 UTC

Post by John McAdams
On 26 Sep 2018 22:20:15 -0400, Anthony Marsh

Of course I can, but McAdams would censor it. I know where you got your

The FBI. Here are some more...
https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2016/crime-in-the-u.s.-2016/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-3.xls

Post by Anthony Marsh
There were angry protests across America this week after a grand jury
decided a white police officer should not stand trial for the killing of
black teenager Michael Brown in Ferguson, Missouri.

Note that the Eric Holder Justice Department determined that the
shooting was justified.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2015/01/09/are-black-or-white-offenders-more-likely-to-kill-police/?utm_term=.3abb08e5696f

"There were 511 officers killed in felonious incidents and 540
offenders from 2004 to 2013, according to FBI reports. Among the total
offenders, 52 percent were white, and 43 percent were black."

Note that blacks are 13% of the population, so blacks kill cops at a
vastly disproportionate rate.

About 25% of people killed by cops (give or take a couple of percent,
depending on the year).

That is correct, you aren`t going to get equal results when the
realities of the situation are not equal. Liberals want to assume that
racism is the cause. And black cops shoot blacks at the same rate as
whites, are those cops racist? Perhaps it is the reality of what the cops,
white or black, are dealing with.
https://psmag.com/social-justice/black-cops-are-just-as-likely-as-whites-to-kill-black-suspects
Of course the narrative just get changed to institution racism, the
narrative must be protected at all costs, even if it means making stupid
arguments. The argument used to be that white cops would be quicker to
shoot or less likely to give a black suspect the benefit of the doubt. Are
black people who are cops just as biased?

Post by Anthony Marsh
Clearly, these figures are problematic. We???re talking about arrests not
convictions, and high black arrest rates could be taken as evidence that
the police are racist.

Look at the police reports. Look at what the victims said about the race
of the person who committed the crime against them.

Those data are called "incident reports," and they show a vast
disproportion of crime committed by blacks.

Post by Anthony Marsh
Judging from online comments, there is a wide spectrum of views on this,
from unapologetic racism to militant refusal to blame the problem on
anything but historic white racism.

The data on how out-of-wedlock birth affects the life prospects of
kids is appalling.

Post by Anthony Marsh
There is evidence in the official police-recorded figures that black
Americans are more likely to commit certain types of crime than people
of other races.

Interestingly, the data are not quite as lopsided for most other
offenses as for homicide. But still pretty lopsided.

But the data at your link does not show an "eight times"
disproportion.

Post by Bud
It would be interesting to take a city like here in Philadelphia and
take all the police reports and surveillance video of crimes and break it
down according to race.

I've done that for police reports in Milwaukee.

https://www.badgerinstitute.org/WIInterest/McA16.3.pdf#page=8

.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Anthony Marsh

2018-10-02 02:37:03 UTC

Post by John McAdams
On 26 Sep 2018 22:20:15 -0400, Anthony Marsh

Post by Marcus Hanson
.... Or that men and women are absolutely identical in their innate

https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=10005

Can Math be racist? Not really. But racists can misuse math to make
racist memes. They could say that only 1 in 100 whites commit crimes,
but 60 out of 100 blacks are criminals.

Ironically, it's leftists who are always quoting statistics about the
number of black men in prison.

That's different. More whites are let go and more blacks are prosecuted
unfairly.

Of course I can, but McAdams would censor it. I know where you got your

The FBI. Here are some more...
https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2016/crime-in-the-u.s.-2016/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-3.xls

That is a different question. Some black cops go along to get along.

Post by Bud
https://psmag.com/social-justice/black-cops-are-just-as-likely-as-whites-to-kill-black-suspects

Nope.

Post by Bud
Of course the narrative just get changed to institution racism, the
narrative must be protected at all costs, even if it means making stupid
arguments. The argument used to be that white cops would be quicker to
shoot or less likely to give a black suspect the benefit of the doubt. Are
black people who are cops just as biased?

Just stop the racism.

Look at the police reports. Look at what the victims said about the race
of the person who committed the crime against them.

What is that supposed to mean? Subjective opinion? You mean whites are
happier being killed by other whites?

Perhaps masses of blacks throwing bricks at the cops led to mass black
arrests.

How many blacks, how many bricks? Yet you think it is OK for the Nazis
to drive cars over protestors?

Of course liberals will say the police are grabbing any blacks. Anything
to protect their false narratives. By refusing to address the reality of

Of course they grab the blacks. But they also shoot and kill blacks
against regulation just for fun.

Post by Bud
disproportionate black crime liberals are insuring that the problem will
only get worse, and other blacks will pay the price.

Did you just invent a meme? There is no such thing.

Post by Bud
And the problem is being solved anyway, with the proliferation of
security cameras. As the cost goes down they are appearing everywhere.
Many of my neighbors have them, soon it will be half, then almost all. I

That's what I said. Just look at the Ring commercials. We have lots of
cameras where I live.

Post by Bud
don`t know how many times I`ve seen footage of a killer (almost invariably
black) on the news fleeing some murder. And the body cameras activists

Racist. You've never seen footage of a white killer fleeing the scene?
Take off your blinders.

Post by Bud
insisted be installed are just backfiring, showing cops as professional
and courteous. These films have to be adding jail time to suspects (white

Most are. Not all are racists.

Post by Bud
and black)when they show the egregious behavior of the people they have to
deal with. It is merely a matter of building prisons large enough to hold
all these thugs.

Any animal will bite you if you beat it.
It's called self-defense.
Few animals WANT to be beaten to death.

False. Maybe more kids are raised by only the mother because the father
is in jail and can't afford bail while waiting 10 years for his trial.

This lame idea doesn`t float. Nobody is starving in this country. Just

Trump is. Conservative racist Replicans are. Were White Liberals slave
owners? Very few.

Post by Bud
because you want gold chains and $100 sneakers doesn`t mean you get to
sell drugs or take from other people to get them. People on welfare are

Only $100? Are you joking? The average white kid already owns $100
sneakers. Have you ever been to a shoe store? Try $600.

Post by Bud
getting upwards of $30,000 a year in housing, medical, food stamps, money,
liheap energy assistance,ect. They get phones and public transportation
passes, because this was said to prevent them from getting work. The
economic excuse for crime just doesn`t fly.

Who? Me? Not quite that much. But I've paid for it with my taxes over
the year. My Obama phone is a piece of crap worth about $3.
Where are you getting your numbers? From a racist web site?

Post by Anthony Marsh
The verdict
There is evidence in the official police-recorded figures that black
Americans are more likely to commit certain types of crime than people
of other races.

So, it wasn't bad enough that you promoted reverse discrimination, now
you've invented reverse sexism?

Post by Bud
sexist that was. I was wondering what the reaction would be if I wrote a
sign saying "Black Male Commit A Hugely Disproportionate Amount of Sexual
Assaults". Likely I would be attacked, maybe even arrested in this liberal

Somehow your slogan doesn't seem to make sense and won't fit onto a 2x3
poster.

Post by Bud
town, the powers that be would claim my stating of a fact to be hate
speech. And in the world these woman seem to be advocating, if they didn`t
like my sign they need only make a report of sexual assault against me,
and I would be convicted, as it would be somehow wrong to believe me.

So you stifle free speech by saying that people complaining about a
problem are the ones engaging in hate speech.

No, it really isn`t. Liberals apply spin to the data to muddy the water.

You just make up data from your imagination.

Post by Bud
The false narrative of institutional racism must be protected at all cost.

Post by Anthony Marsh
There are few simple answers and links between crime and race are likely
to remain the subject of bitter argument.

With liberals black crime validates white racism. The more black crime
the more white people are at fault.

There is no such thing as White racism if you mean racism against
whites. Racism is what whites do to the other races.
Now, it could be fun to talk about racism by the Japanese against the
Chinese, but that is a little more complicated.

Post by John McAdams
The interpret it to be just another way in which blacks are oppressed.

Maybe like being shot for no reason.

Another false narrative. Like the cops are riding down the street
gunning down black people.
People can watch the videos of police shootings here...
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXMYxKMh3prxnM_4kYZuB3g
Generally, they don`t shoot white people or black people, they shoot a
lot of stupid people.

Post by John McAdams
But most people will see that, and interpret it to mean that blacks
commit proportionately much more crime than whites.

Yes, most people don't care to dig into the topic.

Facts do harm to some people`s false narratives.

Post by John McAdams
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Bud

2018-09-27 19:21:55 UTC

Post by Marcus Hanson
.... Or that men and women are absolutely identical in their innate

https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=10005

Can Math be racist? Not really. But racists can misuse math to make
racist memes. They could say that only 1 in 100 whites commit crimes,
but 60 out of 100 blacks are criminals.

Liberals would make it illegal to say what the actual statistics are.

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-28 20:16:04 UTC

Post by Marcus Hanson
.... Or that men and women are absolutely identical in their innate

https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=10005

Can Math be racist? Not really. But racists can misuse math to make
racist memes. They could say that only 1 in 100 whites commit crimes,
but 60 out of 100 blacks are criminals.

Liberals would make it illegal to say what the actual statistics are.

Some people misuse statistics to lie.

You wouldn't dare to actually post the statistics.

Bud

2018-09-29 15:24:36 UTC

Post by Marcus Hanson
.... Or that men and women are absolutely identical in their innate

https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=10005

Can Math be racist? Not really. But racists can misuse math to make
racist memes. They could say that only 1 in 100 whites commit crimes,
but 60 out of 100 blacks are criminals.

Liberals would make it illegal to say what the actual statistics are.

Some people misuse statistics to lie.
You wouldn't dare to actually post the statistics.

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/table-43

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-27 02:13:20 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...

Correction: Dershowitz is a righteing nut who supports Trump.

Post by Bud
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

It is not Free Speech they are trying to promote. It is hate speech that
they are defending. They defend the right of the students to make
homophobic comments. Then McAdams won't let me point out when someone
here is acting like a Nazi.

John McAdams

2018-09-27 02:16:05 UTC

On 26 Sep 2018 22:13:20 -0400, Anthony Marsh

Post by Bud
They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...

Correction: Dershowitz is a righteing nut who supports Trump.

Thank you, Tony, for showing again that you are the sort of leftist
who thinks he and people like him have a right to shut up speech they
don't like.

Is socialist speech "hate speech?" Is attacking Christians "hate
speech?"

Is attacking white males "hate speech?"

.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

Bud

2018-09-27 19:22:25 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...

Correction: Dershowitz is a righteing nut who supports Trump.

It is not Free Speech they are trying to promote.

That is exactly what we are trying to promote.

Post by Anthony Marsh
It is hate speech that
they are defending.

That, too.

Post by Anthony Marsh
They defend the right of the students to make
homophobic comments.

What the hell is a homophobic comment? What does one look like?

Post by Anthony Marsh
Then McAdams won't let me point out when someone
here is acting like a Nazi.

I want to call a poster here an idiot, but I doubt he will let that fly
either.

bigdog

2018-09-28 20:14:39 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...

Correction: Dershowitz is a righteing nut who supports Trump.

It is not Free Speech they are trying to promote.

That is exactly what we are trying to promote.

Post by Anthony Marsh
It is hate speech that
they are defending.

That, too.

Post by Anthony Marsh
They defend the right of the students to make
homophobic comments.

What the hell is a homophobic comment? What does one look like?

Post by Anthony Marsh
Then McAdams won't let me point out when someone
here is acting like a Nazi.

I want to call a poster here an idiot, but I doubt he will let that fly
either.

What so many people fail to appreciate is that if we give the government
the right to pass judgement on what speech is acceptable, we cease to have
free speech. Free speech means we must tolerate much speech that is
offensive to us including hate speech. That means we must put up with
people like the KKK, the American Nazi Party, the Communist Party of the
United States of America, Antifa, and many other groups that advocate for
repulsive things. Antifa has every right to advocate for curtailments on
free speech but those of us who cherish free speech have both the right
and the duty to oppose them with every fiber in our bodies.

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-30 18:09:22 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...

Correction: Dershowitz is a righteing nut who supports Trump.

It is not Free Speech they are trying to promote.

That is exactly what we are trying to promote.

Post by Anthony Marsh
It is hate speech that
they are defending.

That, too.

Post by Anthony Marsh
They defend the right of the students to make
homophobic comments.

What the hell is a homophobic comment? What does one look like?

Post by Anthony Marsh
Then McAdams won't let me point out when someone
here is acting like a Nazi.

I want to call a poster here an idiot, but I doubt he will let that fly
either.

What so many people fail to appreciate is that if we give the government
the right to pass judgement on what speech is acceptable, we cease to have

We already do. The easiest example is shouing FIRE in a theatre.
But what if there really is a fire in the theater and the owners had
locked all the doors?

Post by bigdog
free speech. Free speech means we must tolerate much speech that is
offensive to us including hate speech. That means we must put up with

Yes, please. Bring it on. Show your true self.

Post by bigdog
people like the KKK, the American Nazi Party, the Communist Party of the
United States of America, Antifa, and many other groups that advocate for
repulsive things. Antifa has every right to advocate for curtailments on
free speech but those of us who cherish free speech have both the right
and the duty to oppose them with every fiber in our bodies.

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-28 20:16:28 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...

Correction: Dershowitz is a righteing nut who supports Trump.

It is not Free Speech they are trying to promote.

That is exactly what we are trying to promote.

Post by Anthony Marsh
It is hate speech that
they are defending.

That, too.

Post by Anthony Marsh
They defend the right of the students to make
homophobic comments.

What the hell is a homophobic comment? What does one look like?

I am not allowed to post them here, Mary.

Post by Anthony Marsh
Then McAdams won't let me point out when someone
here is acting like a Nazi.

I want to call a poster here an idiot, but I doubt he will let that fly
either.

Depends. I keep trying different variations and sometimes I can slip a
very obscure word past his Cockney filter. Usually words like moron,
idiot and imbecile will not go through.
Try Dobber.

Bud

2018-09-29 15:26:00 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...

Correction: Dershowitz is a righteing nut who supports Trump.

It is not Free Speech they are trying to promote.

That is exactly what we are trying to promote.

Post by Anthony Marsh
It is hate speech that
they are defending.

That, too.

Post by Anthony Marsh
They defend the right of the students to make
homophobic comments.

What the hell is a homophobic comment? What does one look like?

I am not allowed to post them here, Mary.

Then how can I know what not to say around a trans person? Apparently
they are these fragile, crystalline creatures that shatter into a million
pieces when they get upset, so we have to pass special laws to prevent
that from happening. I just wanted to know what I can`t say, I don`t want
to accidentally make one of these folk explode by saying the wrong thing.
And "homophobe" makes it seem like it is my problem, when I`m not the one
who needs special laws passed to prevent me from shattering.

Post by Anthony Marsh
Then McAdams won't let me point out when someone
here is acting like a Nazi.

I want to call a poster here an idiot, but I doubt he will let that fly
either.

Depends. I keep trying different variations and sometimes I can slip a
very obscure word past his Cockney filter. Usually words like moron,
idiot and imbecile will not go through.
Try Dobber.

You got "Mary" past (and I`m glad McAdams allowed it to pass), that must
make you happy.

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-30 18:09:36 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...

Correction: Dershowitz is a righteing nut who supports Trump.

It is not Free Speech they are trying to promote.

That is exactly what we are trying to promote.

Post by Anthony Marsh
It is hate speech that
they are defending.

That, too.

Post by Anthony Marsh
They defend the right of the students to make
homophobic comments.

What the hell is a homophobic comment? What does one look like?

I am not allowed to post them here, Mary.

Then how can I know what not to say around a trans person? Apparently

Jeez, it's gotten a lot more complicated than that. What variation of
trans? There are different stages of trans. In our state elections there
is a question to vote on to outlaw discrimination against trans.
You should read it and see if you can figure out the wording.
Then: what about? What about Herms? What about Neuters?
Etc.
How about just no discrimination against ANYBODY FOR ANY REASON?
How about no discrimination against pregnant women?

Post by Bud
they are these fragile, crystalline creatures that shatter into a million
pieces when they get upset, so we have to pass special laws to prevent
that from happening. I just wanted to know what I can`t say, I don`t want
to accidentally make one of these folk explode by saying the wrong thing.
And "homophobe" makes it seem like it is my problem, when I`m not the one
who needs special laws passed to prevent me from shattering.

It IS your problem, but you can take comfort in the fact that you're not
the only one with that problem. Being politically correct is extremely
difficult as the words keep changing. It used to be that you couldn't
say Queer. Now you're supposed to say Queer.

Post by Anthony Marsh
Then McAdams won't let me point out when someone
here is acting like a Nazi.

I want to call a poster here an idiot, but I doubt he will let that fly
either.

Depends. I keep trying different variations and sometimes I can slip a
very obscure word past his Cockney filter. Usually words like moron,
idiot and imbecile will not go through.
Try Dobber.

You got "Mary" past (and I`m glad McAdams allowed it to pass), that must
make you happy.

Yes, my point is that most of the time McAdams doesn't even notice and
doesn't bother to read carefully. He relies on his Cockney filter.
I can pass highly classified information and he wouldn't even understand
it. NAOMI.

Bud

2018-10-01 15:43:06 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...

Correction: Dershowitz is a righteing nut who supports Trump.

It is not Free Speech they are trying to promote.

That is exactly what we are trying to promote.

Post by Anthony Marsh
It is hate speech that
they are defending.

That, too.

Post by Anthony Marsh
They defend the right of the students to make
homophobic comments.

What the hell is a homophobic comment? What does one look like?

I am not allowed to post them here, Mary.

Then how can I know what not to say around a trans person? Apparently

Yes, progressives have been playing silly games with the language.

Post by Anthony Marsh
How about just no discrimination against ANYBODY FOR ANY REASON?

You don`t want that. You want to assume things without showing them and
then you want the things you assume to be treated as fact.

Post by Anthony Marsh
How about no discrimination against pregnant women?

It IS your problem,

No, it isn`t, because it is a made up and meaningless word. If I had
arachnophobia and I got on an elevator and saw a spider I would freak out.
If I got on a elevator with a trans person, it would have no effect on me
(possibly some mild amusement depending on how well they were pulling of
the disguise), so your application of the word is bogus.

Post by Anthony Marsh
but you can take comfort in the fact that you're not
the only one with that problem. Being politically correct is extremely
difficult as the words keep changing. It used to be that you couldn't
say Queer. Now you're supposed to say Queer.

Post by Anthony Marsh
Then McAdams won't let me point out when someone
here is acting like a Nazi.

I want to call a poster here an idiot, but I doubt he will let that fly
either.

Depends. I keep trying different variations and sometimes I can slip a
very obscure word past his Cockney filter. Usually words like moron,
idiot and imbecile will not go through.
Try Dobber.

You got "Mary" past (and I`m glad McAdams allowed it to pass), that must
make you happy.

Mark

2018-09-29 02:57:17 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...

Correction: Dershowitz is a righteing nut who supports Trump.

Here's the big problem with your argument.

Who decides what is hate speech?

Right now the Left does. Someday the Right might.

Is that how you want it? Mark

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-30 18:10:13 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...

Correction: Dershowitz is a righteing nut who supports Trump.

Here's the big problem with your argument.
Who decides what is hate speech?

Ever hear of common decency?
Nope, didn't think so?

Post by Mark
Right now the Left does. Someday the Right might.

They often do. They do now. McAdams does.
I can call Obama a liar, but I can't call Trump a liar.
You are allowed to call me a liar, but I am not allowed to call YOU a liar.

Post by Mark
Is that how you want it? Mark

Nope. What I had in mind was more like what the founders thought.

Bud

2018-10-01 15:43:39 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...

Correction: Dershowitz is a righteing nut who supports Trump.

Here's the big problem with your argument.
Who decides what is hate speech?

Ever hear of common decency?

Ever heard of civility? Common courtesy? Do you think government should
be in the business of enforcing these things?

And you are avoiding the question. Who decides what is hate speech? Is
calling someone a Nazi hate speech?

Post by Anthony Marsh
Nope, didn't think so?

Post by Mark
Right now the Left does. Someday the Right might.

They often do. They do now. McAdams does.
I can call Obama a liar, but I can't call Trump a liar.
You are allowed to call me a liar, but I am not allowed to call YOU a liar.

Post by Mark
Is that how you want it? Mark

Nope. What I had in mind was more like what the founders thought.

Mark

2018-09-27 19:20:15 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

I didn't mean to imply that there are no more good liberals left. But
on the issue of cultural war free speech, why are the ones who stand up in
such a minority? Dershowitz says the Hamptons crowd has disowned him.
Where are all the ACLU Civil Libertarians?

Mark

bigdog

2018-09-28 03:25:23 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

Dershowitz is a liberal I have tremendous respect for. He has principles
which sometimes is at odds with his politics but he holds true to those
principles. There was a time I had a similar respect for the ACLU but more
recently they put their politics above their principles.

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-29 02:44:07 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

Dershowitz is a liberal I have tremendous respect for. He has principles

He's not a Liberal, he's a conservative Jew.

Post by bigdog
which sometimes is at odds with his politics but he holds true to those
principles. There was a time I had a similar respect for the ACLU but more
recently they put their politics above their principles.

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-28 20:18:19 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

They might not post here, but there are leftists fighting the good fight
for free speech.
Alan Dershowitz...
https://www.businessinsider.com/alan-dershowitz-thinks-free-speech-is-in-danger-on-college-campuses-2015-11
Steven Pinker...
http://youtu.be/uxVZ3REHVNs
Stephen Fry...
http://youtu.be/tPEHbJgomgA

New York?

bigdog

2018-09-27 01:48:43 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

What is truly appalling is that polls have shown that 40% of millennials
don't agree with the concept of free speech. They believe the government
should be able to place limits on speech which it deems is offensive. They
are so stupid that don't realize that once you give government the power
to determine what is or is not acceptable speech, it is those in power who
will get to make that judgement. Who in government would make such a
judgement as to what is acceptable speech. The President? Congress? Would
they want Donald Trump to have the power to limit what they have to say?
What about Mitch McConnell or Paul Ryan?

BT George

2018-09-25 23:32:28 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

I saw that and wanted to comment on it so bad, I even went to this
thread to put it here, but I thought it wouldn`t be allowed. Liberals
never learn, and they never admit they are wrong (they didn`t learn from
Trump getting elected and they certainly never admitted their role in it,
they just spin it into a form they are comfortable with, like calling
people racists). It is just a matter of rigging the game so they win next
time. If you say things the left doesn`t like, they`ll label you a bully
and silence you. I just saw that the left is trying to get most of the
right leaning discussion on youtube shut down.
http://youtu.be/Ypt_pnpJLzY
Since the left has no chance in a discussion of ideas they are forced to
shut down dialog. Notice when they talk about dangerous speech, they don`t
mention the left whipping up the BLM furor, which got cops killed in NY,
Dallas and other places.

Of course Comrade! The strict application of Communist principles. We
must control the press and the messages the people hear against "wrong"
thinking. Wrong thinking must be made punishable till everyone learns
only "correct" (i.e., "leftist") thinking.

Dah. And soon ze dream vill finally kum true!

1***@mail.com

2018-09-25 23:29:23 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

Yes. Congratulations to the Professor. It's a real shame that we can't see
the CPAC trousers, but I'm sure they will define the Republican fashion
taste well into the next century. Future presidents will thank our humble
professor for his foresight and his vision thing. This might even tip the
scales in favor of his legacy, outweighing his being dead wrong about the
Kennedy assassination for all these years. All hail to the professorly
trousers of the newsgroup's dear leader!

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-26 21:20:46 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

I saw them. I can't figure out where he bought them. Big and Tall?

Jason Burke

2018-09-27 16:14:31 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

I saw them. I can't figure out where he bought them. Big and Tall?

Certainly wasn't your favorite store, Confused and Wussy...

Mark

2018-09-27 16:15:06 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

I saw them. I can't figure out where he bought them. Big and Tall?

I'm thinking you wish you were big and tall.

Mark

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-28 03:22:50 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

I saw them. I can't figure out where he bought them. Big and Tall?

I'm thinking you wish you were big and tall.
Mark

What kind of an insult is that, Pee-Wee Herman?
Have you ever seen .John in person? No, so shut up.

Bud

2018-09-27 16:18:23 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

I saw them. I can't figure out where he bought them. Big and Tall?

Our foremost liberal commentator weighs in on.... pants?

1***@mail.com

2018-09-28 02:48:37 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

I saw them. I can't figure out where he bought them. Big and Tall?

I have seen the trousers. I think the Professor and I use the same valet
service. He's got a very libertarian look, which is way better than a
Republican look. The insane hair is very convincing. Yes. One might be
tempted to think he is a real person.

Anthony Marsh

2018-09-29 02:44:21 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

I saw them. I can't figure out where he bought them. Big and Tall?

I have seen the trousers. I think the Professor and I use the same valet
service. He's got a very libertarian look, which is way better than a

zi like that. So that's the Libertarian line for hobos?

Post by 1***@mail.com
Republican look. The insane hair is very convincing. Yes. One might be
tempted to think he is a real person.

He hair wasn't that bad.
I met him, he's a real person, not really Bigfoot.

1***@mail.com

2018-09-29 15:37:21 UTC

Post by c***@gmail.com
Keep up the good fight.

I saw them. I can't figure out where he bought them. Big and Tall?

I have seen the trousers. I think the Professor and I use the same valet
service. He's got a very libertarian look, which is way better than a

zi like that. So that's the Libertarian line for hobos?

Post by 1***@mail.com
Republican look. The insane hair is very convincing. Yes. One might be
tempted to think he is a real person.

He hair wasn't that bad.
I met him, he's a real person, not really Bigfoot.

Hobos can be libertarians, but not Republicans. Libertarians are devoted
to their ideology, and even though I'm not a fan of ideologues, I think
there is some virtue in such idealism. But Republicans (and Democrats)
have no virtue in them at all. They exist merely to exploit the population
every which way they can. But the Professor does seem somewhat truthy. I
can imagine him sitting in a cabin somewhere, scraping the heads off
matches or whatever. Perhaps in another life.

1***@mail.com

2018-10-02 02:28:53 UTC