Corbyn Voice Coaching

[Yellow]

Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to the
budget a couple of weeks ago.

Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost
straining, shouting even.

It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she
took up coaching.

Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

[Graham T]

Post by Yellow
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she
took up coaching.

They also gave Maggie a hair-do to try and give her a 'softer' look
same as they did with that Susan Boyle woman.

[Mike Swift]

Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has definitely
changed and I have noticed this since his response to the budget a couple
of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the want
of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost straining,
shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she took
up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

You've got one thing correct, he's certainly barking.

Mike

[Ophelia]

Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has definitely
changed and I have noticed this since his response to the budget a couple
of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the want
of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost straining,
shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she took
up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

You've got one thing correct, he's certainly barking.

Mike

==

lol

[Ophelia]

"Yellow" wrote in message news:***@News.Individual.NET...


Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to the
budget a couple of weeks ago.

Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost
straining, shouting even.

It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she
took up coaching.

Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

==

<g> TBH he always sounds gormless to me:)

[Let It Be]

Post by Yellow
Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to the
budget a couple of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost
straining, shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she
took up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.
==
<g> TBH he always sounds gormless to me:)

Well I suppose philly, it just takes one gormless idiot of a brexitidiot
(such yourself) to misread someone of a superior intelligence than yourself.

Just take stock of what the brexitidiots have done to this country as a
result of spreading fake information and parroting the downright lies of
others in the vain hope that by doing so, you can fool all of the people all
of the time!

Have a nice day parroting the information that has been supplied by others.

[pamela]

Post by Yellow
Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to
the budget a couple of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking
for the want of another description. He is injecting an "angry"
tone, almost straining, shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when
she took up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Never mind Corbyn because hunchback Theresa May needs lessons in
deportment. She looks like an elderly dowager unable to smile.

[Graham T]

Post by pamela
Never mind Corbyn because hunchback Theresa May needs lessons in
deportment. She looks like an elderly dowager unable to smile.

I doubt we have ever had such a fucking ugly PM. Try eating your dinner
when she's on tv.

[R. Mark Clayton]

Post by Graham T

Post by pamela
Never mind Corbyn because hunchback Theresa May needs lessons in
deportment. She looks like an elderly dowager unable to smile.

I doubt we have ever had such a fucking ugly PM. Try eating your dinner
when she's on tv.

I managed to eat lunch sat opposite her once, but that was twenty years ago before she was even an MP.

[pamela]

Post by R. Mark Clayton

Post by Graham T

Post by pamela
Never mind Corbyn because hunchback Theresa May needs lessons
in deportment. She looks like an elderly dowager unable to
smile.

I doubt we have ever had such a fucking ugly PM. Try eating
your dinner when she's on tv.

I managed to eat lunch sat opposite her once, but that was
twenty years ago before she was even an MP.

Her slim, even thin, figure makes a welcome change from so many
overfed politicians but her stoop needs works and she needs some
humour.

At the opposite end of the scale(s), is rotund Ken Clarke who's
always got some joviality in him.

[Graham T]

Post by pamela

Post by R. Mark Clayton

Post by Graham T
I doubt we have ever had such a fucking ugly PM. Try eating
your dinner when she's on tv.

I managed to eat lunch sat opposite her once, but that was
twenty years ago before she was even an MP.

Her slim, even thin, figure makes a welcome change from so many
overfed politicians but her stoop needs works and she needs some
humour.

Thank fuck she can't breed.

[James Wilkinson Sword]

Post by Yellow
Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to the
budget a couple of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost
straining, shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she
took up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Who cares? He's an arsehole nobody will ever vote for.

[The Peeler]

On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 18:52:54 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Who cares? He's an arsehole nobody will ever vote for.

Even he isn't an arsehole like you, Birdbrain!

[Yellow]

On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 18:52:54 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to the
budget a couple of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost
straining, shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she
took up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Who cares?

Many of us made the mistake of under estimating the organisation behind
Corbyn before.

Post by James Wilkinson Sword
He's an arsehole nobody will ever vote for.

See above.

[James Wilkinson Sword]

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 18:52:54 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to the
budget a couple of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost
straining, shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she
took up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Who cares?

Many of us made the mistake of under estimating the organisation behind
Corbyn before.

Post by James Wilkinson Sword
He's an arsehole nobody will ever vote for.

See above.

He is not going to achieve anything if nobody votes for him. I'm surprised he's still the leader of the Labour Party.

[Yellow]

On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 21:23:20 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 18:52:54 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to the
budget a couple of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost
straining, shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she
took up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Who cares?

Many of us made the mistake of under estimating the organisation behind
Corbyn before.

Post by James Wilkinson Sword
He's an arsehole nobody will ever vote for.

See above.

He is not going to achieve anything if nobody votes for him. I'm surprised he's still the leader of the Labour Party.

Then (and I am not trying to be rude) you have not been paying
attention.

[James Wilkinson Sword]

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 21:23:20 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 18:52:54 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to the
budget a couple of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost
straining, shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she
took up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Who cares?

Many of us made the mistake of under estimating the organisation behind
Corbyn before.

Post by James Wilkinson Sword
He's an arsehole nobody will ever vote for.

See above.

He is not going to achieve anything if nobody votes for him. I'm surprised he's still the leader of the Labour Party.

Then (and I am not trying to be rude) you have not been paying
attention.

Why would I pay attention to an absolute utter arsehole? I voted Labour in the past (stupidly), but not with Corbyn in charge, I've lost al faith in the Labour Party.

[The Peeler]

On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 21:59:24 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
Then (and I am not trying to be rude) you have not been paying
attention.

Why would I pay attention to an absolute utter arsehole? I voted Labour
in the past (stupidly), but not with Corbyn in charge, I've lost al faith
in the Labour Party.

Who in his right mind would care who you vote for, Birdbrain? Everyone, but
really everyone, thinks you are a complete idiot! <BG>
--
ItsJoanNotJoann addressing Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
"You're an annoying troll and I'm done with you and your
stupidity."
MID: <e39a6a7f-9677-4e78-a866-***@googlegroups.com>
--
AndyW addressing Birdbrain:
"Troll or idiot?...
You have been presented with a viewpoint with information, reasoning,
historical cases, citations and references to back it up and wilfully
ignore all going back to your idea which has no supporting information."
MID: <KaToA.263621$***@fx10.am4>
--
Phil Lee adressing Birdbrain Macaw:
"You are too stupid to be wasting oxygen."
MID: <***@4ax.com>
--
Phil Lee describing Birdbrain Macaw:
"I've never seen such misplaced pride in being a fucking moronic motorist."
MID: <***@4ax.com>
--
Tony944 addressing Birdbrain Macaw:
"I seen and heard many people but you are on top of list being first class
ass hole jerk. ...You fit under unconditional Idiot and should be put in
mental institution.
MID: <VLCdnYC5HK1Z4S3FnZ2dnUU7-***@giganews.com>
--
Pelican to Birdbrain Macaw:
"Ok. I'm persuaded . You are an idiot."
MID: <obru31$nao$***@dont-email.me>
--
DerbyDad03 addressing Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
"Frigging Idiot. Get the hell out of my thread."
MID: <4d907253-b3b9-40d4-be4d-***@googlegroups.com>
--
Kerr Mudd-John about Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
"It's like arguing with a demented frog."
MID: <***@dell3100.workgroup>
--
Mr Pounder Esquire about Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
"the piss poor delivery boy with no hot running water, 11 cats and
several parrots living in his hovel."
MID: <odqtgc$iug$***@dont-email.me>
--
Rob Morley about Birdbrain:
"He's a perennial idiot"
MID: <***@Mars>
--
JoeyDee to Birdbrain
"I apologize for thinking you were a jerk. You're just someone with an IQ
lower than your age, and I accept that as a reason for your comments."
MID: <***@news.eternal-september.org>
--
Sam Plusnet about Birdbrain (now "James Wilkinson Sword" LOL):
"He's just desperate to be noticed. Any attention will do, no matter how
negative it may be."
MID: <***@brightview.co.uk>
--
***@gmail.com asking Birdbrain:
"What, were you dropped on your head as a child?"
MID: <58ddfad5-d9a5-4031-b91f-***@googlegroups.com>
--
Christie addressing endlessly driveling Birdbrain Macaw (now "James
Wilkinson" LOL):
"What are you resurrecting that old post of mine for? It's from last
month some time. You're like a dog who's just dug up an old bone they
hid in the garden until they were ready to have another go at it."
MID: <***@news.eternal-september.org>
--
Mr Pounder's fitting description of Birdbrain Macaw:
"You are a well known fool, a tosser, a pillock, a stupid unemployable
sponging failure who will always live alone and will die alone. You will not
be missed."
MID: <orree6$on2$***@dont-email.me>

[The Todal]

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 21:23:20 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 18:52:54 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to

the

Post by Yellow

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
budget a couple of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking

for the

Post by Yellow

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone,

almost

Post by Yellow

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
straining, shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when

she

Post by Yellow

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
took up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Who cares?

Many of us made the mistake of under estimating the organisation

behind

Post by Yellow
Corbyn before.

Post by James Wilkinson Sword
He's an arsehole nobody will ever vote for.

See above.

He is not going to achieve anything if nobody votes for him.  I'm
surprised he's still the leader of the Labour Party.

Then (and I am not trying to be rude) you have not been paying
attention.

Why would I pay attention to an absolute utter arsehole?  I voted Labour
in the past (stupidly), but not with Corbyn in charge, I've lost al
faith in the Labour Party.

You're off message. Terminate self.

[James Wilkinson Sword]

Post by The Todal

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 21:23:20 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 18:52:54 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to

the

Post by Yellow

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
budget a couple of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking

for the

Post by Yellow

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone,

almost

Post by Yellow

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
straining, shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when

she

Post by Yellow

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
took up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Who cares?

Many of us made the mistake of under estimating the organisation

behind

Post by Yellow
Corbyn before.

Post by James Wilkinson Sword
He's an arsehole nobody will ever vote for.

See above.

He is not going to achieve anything if nobody votes for him. I'm
surprised he's still the leader of the Labour Party.

Then (and I am not trying to be rude) you have not been paying
attention.

Why would I pay attention to an absolute utter arsehole? I voted Labour
in the past (stupidly), but not with Corbyn in charge, I've lost al
faith in the Labour Party.

You're off message. Terminate self.

What is "off message"?

[Vidcapper]

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 21:23:20 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by James Wilkinson Sword
He is not going to achieve anything if nobody votes for him. I'm
surprised he's still the leader of the Labour Party.

Then (and I am not trying to be rude) you have not been paying
attention.

IMO it is the sinister 'Momentum' that puts people off Labour. In trying
to sideline moderates, they are likely to put off many traditional
Labour voters,

[The Todal]

Post by Vidcapper

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 21:23:20 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
He is not going to achieve anything if nobody votes for him.  I'm
surprised he's still the leader of the Labour Party.

Then (and I am not trying to be rude) you have not been paying
attention.

IMO it is the sinister 'Momentum' that puts people off Labour. In trying
to sideline moderates, they are likely to put off many traditional
Labour voters,

Not at all. It's only "sinister" to the journalists of the Daily Mail,
trying to spread scare stories.

As a Momentum member, I've been to quite a few meetings. They actually
don't try to "sideline moderates" at all.

[Yellow]

Post by The Todal

Post by Vidcapper

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 21:23:20 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
He is not going to achieve anything if nobody votes for him.  I'm
surprised he's still the leader of the Labour Party.

Then (and I am not trying to be rude) you have not been paying
attention.

IMO it is the sinister 'Momentum' that puts people off Labour. In trying
to sideline moderates, they are likely to put off many traditional
Labour voters,

Not at all. It's only "sinister" to the journalists of the Daily Mail,
trying to spread scare stories.

Sinister is not really a word I would use either but I do see the powers
behind Momentum as being extremely clever. Someone has looked at how
religious movements work and have then applied the same to a political
movement.

Whether it will survive beyond Jeremy Corbyn's leadership is the more
question.

Post by The Todal
As a Momentum member, I've been to quite a few meetings. They actually
don't try to "sideline moderates" at all.

I think time will tell as they certainly have been allegations of it and
if there is a pattern of it, then is will be more obvious over time.

[The Todal]

Post by Yellow

Post by The Todal

Post by Vidcapper

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 21:23:20 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
He is not going to achieve anything if nobody votes for him.  I'm
surprised he's still the leader of the Labour Party.

Then (and I am not trying to be rude) you have not been paying
attention.

IMO it is the sinister 'Momentum' that puts people off Labour. In trying
to sideline moderates, they are likely to put off many traditional
Labour voters,

Not at all. It's only "sinister" to the journalists of the Daily Mail,
trying to spread scare stories.

Sinister is not really a word I would use either but I do see the powers
behind Momentum as being extremely clever. Someone has looked at how
religious movements work and have then applied the same to a political
movement.

That's certainly how Trump has got the Presidency. Some would say that
most American presidential campaigns rely on a pseudo-religious fervour
among audience members, reminiscent of Hitler's torchlit processions.

I think you're wrong if you're saying that the same applies to Corbyn.
He isn't regarded as a messiah figure, not by anyone at all except maybe
cynical Tory journalists. Nobody looks to him for any words of wisdom,
any parables, any sermons. His speeches tend to be relatively banal.

Instead, his support is from a huge swathe of Labour members who believe
that Corbyn's leadership gives us a voice. Nobody would say that Blair
gave members a voice. Blair's was a dictatorship.

Post by Yellow
Whether it will survive beyond Jeremy Corbyn's leadership is the more
question.

Post by The Todal
As a Momentum member, I've been to quite a few meetings. They actually
don't try to "sideline moderates" at all.

I think time will tell as they certainly have been allegations of it and
if there is a pattern of it, then is will be more obvious over time.

[Yellow]

Post by The Todal

Post by Yellow

Post by The Todal

Post by Vidcapper

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 21:23:20 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
He is not going to achieve anything if nobody votes for him.  I'm
surprised he's still the leader of the Labour Party.

Then (and I am not trying to be rude) you have not been paying
attention.

IMO it is the sinister 'Momentum' that puts people off Labour. In trying
to sideline moderates, they are likely to put off many traditional
Labour voters,

Not at all. It's only "sinister" to the journalists of the Daily Mail,
trying to spread scare stories.

Sinister is not really a word I would use either but I do see the powers
behind Momentum as being extremely clever. Someone has looked at how
religious movements work and have then applied the same to a political
movement.

That's certainly how Trump has got the Presidency. Some would say that
most American presidential campaigns rely on a pseudo-religious fervour
among audience members, reminiscent of Hitler's torchlit processions.
I think you're wrong if you're saying that the same applies to Corbyn.

I may not know about Kruschev but I do know a lot about how religion
works, especially but not limited to what many would call cults, and it
is the same. Scientology is a fantastic example.

Post by The Todal
He isn't regarded as a messiah figure, not by anyone at all except maybe
cynical Tory journalists.

You need a focus for sure but the central figure does not need to be
"the son of god". It just needs to be someone who will supply everything
that the members of the group desire and who appears to have the power
to do so.

Post by The Todal
Nobody looks to him for any words of wisdom,
any parables, any sermons. His speeches tend to be relatively banal.

I didn't say that Momentum was a religion, and of course it is not, I
simply claim that it is using the same mechanisms to entice people in.

Post by The Todal
Instead, his support is from a huge swathe of Labour members who believe
that Corbyn's leadership gives us a voice. Nobody would say that Blair
gave members a voice. Blair's was a dictatorship.

Blair became leader of the Labour Party because it realised it would
never get power all the while it was so left wing. Momentum and Jeremy
Corbyn is something else entirely - a door was accidentally opened by a
series of actions from various Labour MPs and Jeremy Corbyn stepped
through it.

[The Todal]

Post by Yellow

Post by The Todal

Post by Yellow
Sinister is not really a word I would use either but I do see the powers
behind Momentum as being extremely clever. Someone has looked at how
religious movements work and have then applied the same to a political
movement.

That's certainly how Trump has got the Presidency. Some would say that
most American presidential campaigns rely on a pseudo-religious fervour
among audience members, reminiscent of Hitler's torchlit processions.
I think you're wrong if you're saying that the same applies to Corbyn.

I may not know about Kruschev but I do know a lot about how religion
works, especially but not limited to what many would call cults, and it
is the same. Scientology is a fantastic example.

There has been an excellent four-part series about Donald Trump, worth
seeing on catch-up if you haven't seen it.

Trump relied on advice from a canny PR person who said that the public
won't remember what you said, only the way you said it.

Post by Yellow

Post by The Todal
He isn't regarded as a messiah figure, not by anyone at all except maybe
cynical Tory journalists.

You need a focus for sure but the central figure does not need to be
"the son of god". It just needs to be someone who will supply everything
that the members of the group desire and who appears to have the power
to do so.

And Corbyn doesn't fit that job description, which is why I respectfully
disagree with you. He was plucked from relative obscurity, a man with a
reputation for being "too nice for politics" in the eyes of most MPs,
but that was quickly portrayed by the Tory Press as "supporter of
terrorism".

If he has an image it is of a gentle old man who is the underdog, the
Iain Lee among a bunch of dick-swinging alpha males in the Labour Party
(Iain Lee is the chap on "I'm A Celebrity" who is currently being bullied).

Corbyn was chosen by us, the Labour Party members, because we disliked
the other candidates who were standing for the leadership - a bunch of
stuffed shirts whose main policies were to prove that Labour could do
austerity just as effectively as the Conservatives. Corbyn was then
rejected by his MPs because they were convinced he couldn't supply what
the group required and didn't have the charisma or support required to
win elections.

Post by Yellow

Post by The Todal
Nobody looks to him for any words of wisdom,
any parables, any sermons. His speeches tend to be relatively banal.

I didn't say that Momentum was a religion, and of course it is not, I
simply claim that it is using the same mechanisms to entice people in.

There is some truth in that. I attended a Momentum training course in
how to canvass on the doorsteps. The advice, given by mainstream US
Democratic Party advisers, was to engage with the elector, show that you
understand his/her concerns and reservations and use the techiques of a
salesman to guide them towards voting for your candidate. Without
hectoring or lecturing them, show that you can answer their concerns so
that they feel that logic leads them towards voting for your candidate.

It's bollocks in my opinion, because my experience as a canvasser is
that the elector does not want to discuss his/her political opinions or
to listen to any sales pitch. Maybe it's different in America.

Post by Yellow

Post by The Todal
Instead, his support is from a huge swathe of Labour members who believe
that Corbyn's leadership gives us a voice. Nobody would say that Blair
gave members a voice. Blair's was a dictatorship.

Blair became leader of the Labour Party because it realised it would
never get power all the while it was so left wing. Momentum and Jeremy
Corbyn is something else entirely - a door was accidentally opened by a
series of actions from various Labour MPs and Jeremy Corbyn stepped
through it.

Many people put their faith in Blair. I always thought he was a phoney,
strutting around victoriously after his big general election victory,
waving to a grateful audience and shaking hands.

Blair accomplished some useful things (mainly forgettable stuff such as
minimum wage) but the Iraq invasion meant that most of us could no
longer support him or his followers. After all, Hitler made the trains
run on time and solved the unemployment problem but he did also embark
on unlawful invasions of independent sovereign states. Corbyn's main
asset is being the antithesis of Blair. Not a warmonger, not a slavish
supporter of American warmongers, not a domineering alpha male.

[James Wilkinson Sword]

Post by The Todal

Post by Yellow

Post by The Todal

Post by Yellow
Sinister is not really a word I would use either but I do see the powers
behind Momentum as being extremely clever. Someone has looked at how
religious movements work and have then applied the same to a political
movement.

That's certainly how Trump has got the Presidency. Some would say that
most American presidential campaigns rely on a pseudo-religious fervour
among audience members, reminiscent of Hitler's torchlit processions.
I think you're wrong if you're saying that the same applies to Corbyn.

I may not know about Kruschev but I do know a lot about how religion
works, especially but not limited to what many would call cults, and it
is the same. Scientology is a fantastic example.

There has been an excellent four-part series about Donald Trump, worth
seeing on catch-up if you haven't seen it.
Trump relied on advice from a canny PR person who said that the public
won't remember what you said, only the way you said it.

Post by Yellow

Post by The Todal
He isn't regarded as a messiah figure, not by anyone at all except maybe
cynical Tory journalists.

You need a focus for sure but the central figure does not need to be
"the son of god". It just needs to be someone who will supply everything
that the members of the group desire and who appears to have the power
to do so.

And Corbyn doesn't fit that job description, which is why I respectfully
disagree with you. He was plucked from relative obscurity, a man with a
reputation for being "too nice for politics" in the eyes of most MPs,
but that was quickly portrayed by the Tory Press as "supporter of
terrorism".
If he has an image it is of a gentle old man who is the underdog, the
Iain Lee among a bunch of dick-swinging alpha males in the Labour Party
(Iain Lee is the chap on "I'm A Celebrity" who is currently being bullied).

Corbyn does not look gentle whatsoever. If I saw him in a pub I'd be wary of him starting a brawl.

Post by The Todal
Corbyn was chosen by us, the Labour Party members, because we disliked
the other candidates who were standing for the leadership

Then the Labour Party members haven't a fucking clue.

Post by The Todal

Post by Yellow

Post by The Todal
Instead, his support is from a huge swathe of Labour members who believe
that Corbyn's leadership gives us a voice. Nobody would say that Blair
gave members a voice. Blair's was a dictatorship.

Blair became leader of the Labour Party because it realised it would
never get power all the while it was so left wing. Momentum and Jeremy
Corbyn is something else entirely - a door was accidentally opened by a
series of actions from various Labour MPs and Jeremy Corbyn stepped
through it.

Many people put their faith in Blair. I always thought he was a phoney,
strutting around victoriously after his big general election victory,
waving to a grateful audience and shaking hands.
Blair accomplished some useful things (mainly forgettable stuff such as
minimum wage)

How is that useful?

Post by The Todal
but the Iraq invasion meant that most of us could no
longer support him or his followers. After all, Hitler made the trains
run on time and solved the unemployment problem but he did also embark
on unlawful invasions of independent sovereign states. Corbyn's main
asset is being the antithesis of Blair. Not a warmonger, not a slavish
supporter of American warmongers, not a domineering alpha male.

Why do you care about subhuman filth in the middle east?

[The Peeler]

On Thu, 07 Dec 2017 22:14:53 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
the pathological attention whore of all the uk ngs, blathered again:

<FLUSH the sociopathic wanker's usual sick shit>

[Yellow]

Post by The Todal

Post by Yellow

Post by The Todal

Post by Yellow
Sinister is not really a word I would use either but I do see the powers
behind Momentum as being extremely clever. Someone has looked at how
religious movements work and have then applied the same to a political
movement.

That's certainly how Trump has got the Presidency. Some would say that
most American presidential campaigns rely on a pseudo-religious fervour
among audience members, reminiscent of Hitler's torchlit processions.
I think you're wrong if you're saying that the same applies to Corbyn.

No not at all - as I said in my last post, Corbyn walked in through an
open door.

I am however saying that Momentum is being operated as per a religious
movement. I am not however saying it *is* a religious movement as I
again clarified in my previous post.

Post by The Todal

Post by Yellow
I may not know about Kruschev but I do know a lot about how religion
works, especially but not limited to what many would call cults, and it
is the same. Scientology is a fantastic example.

There has been an excellent four-part series about Donald Trump, worth
seeing on catch-up if you haven't seen it.
Trump relied on advice from a canny PR person who said that the public
won't remember what you said, only the way you said it.

The USA is a different country with a different political system that is
corrupt beyond words, making a 'non-establishment' candidate attractive.
On top of that, the other Republican candidates would not stand down,
allowing Trump through the open door, and THEN he was put up against a
very unpopular Democrat candidate.

That is why I believe Trump got in.

So I am not equating either Corbyn or Momentum with Trump. And I never
have have.

Post by The Todal

Post by Yellow

Post by The Todal
He isn't regarded as a messiah figure, not by anyone at all except maybe
cynical Tory journalists.

You need a focus for sure but the central figure does not need to be
"the son of god". It just needs to be someone who will supply everything
that the members of the group desire and who appears to have the power
to do so.

And Corbyn doesn't fit that job description, which is why I respectfully
disagree with you.

Of course he does.

Post by The Todal
He was plucked from relative obscurity, a man with a
reputation for being "too nice for politics" in the eyes of most MPs,
but that was quickly portrayed by the Tory Press as "supporter of
terrorism".

You are mistakenly mixing up what he is to his supporters and what the
opposition to him have painted him as.

Post by The Todal
If he has an image it is of a gentle old man who is the underdog, the
Iain Lee among a bunch of dick-swinging alpha males in the Labour Party
(Iain Lee is the chap on "I'm A Celebrity" who is currently being bullied).

I do not watch I'm A Celebrity or follow it in any way so that one is a
whoosh for me.

Post by The Todal
Corbyn was chosen by us, the Labour Party members, because we disliked
the other candidates who were standing for the leadership - a bunch of
stuffed shirts whose main policies were to prove that Labour could do
austerity just as effectively as the Conservatives. Corbyn was then
rejected by his MPs because they were convinced he couldn't supply what
the group required and didn't have the charisma or support required to
win elections.

Yes - I know all that but what you have omitted is that behind him, come
last election, he had the power of Momentum. And power it was indeed - I
saw it in the streets that day and bloody impressive it was too.

Post by The Todal

Post by Yellow

Post by The Todal
Nobody looks to him for any words of wisdom,
any parables, any sermons. His speeches tend to be relatively banal.

I didn't say that Momentum was a religion, and of course it is not, I
simply claim that it is using the same mechanisms to entice people in.

There is some truth in that. I attended a Momentum training course in
how to canvass on the doorsteps. The advice, given by mainstream US
Democratic Party advisers, was to engage with the elector, show that you
understand his/her concerns and reservations and use the techiques of a
salesman to guide them towards voting for your candidate. Without
hectoring or lecturing them, show that you can answer their concerns so
that they feel that logic leads them towards voting for your candidate.

There was a programme on the telly a few weeks back about the Labour
Party and they featured a bit of one of Momentum's training courses and
what you describe above is what they showed.

Post by The Todal
It's bollocks in my opinion, because my experience as a canvasser is
that the elector does not want to discuss his/her political opinions or
to listen to any sales pitch. Maybe it's different in America.

I think it might if you are already leaning in that direction but are
not quite there yet.

My friend who lives in a seat that went from Tory to Labour last
election said he was very impressed with the three different callers he
had from Momentum, while not having a single knock on the door from a
Tory. It would never have changed his vote but the Greens have already
proven in this neck of the woods what knocking on doors can achieve.

My seat is on the Momentum hit list for next time, the Tory now having a
much reduced majority, so I might then be able to report from personal
experience.

Post by The Todal

Post by Yellow

Post by The Todal
Instead, his support is from a huge swathe of Labour members who believe
that Corbyn's leadership gives us a voice. Nobody would say that Blair
gave members a voice. Blair's was a dictatorship.

Blair became leader of the Labour Party because it realised it would
never get power all the while it was so left wing. Momentum and Jeremy
Corbyn is something else entirely - a door was accidentally opened by a
series of actions from various Labour MPs and Jeremy Corbyn stepped
through it.

Many people put their faith in Blair. I always thought he was a phoney,
strutting around victoriously after his big general election victory,
waving to a grateful audience and shaking hands.
Blair accomplished some useful things (mainly forgettable stuff such as
minimum wage) but the Iraq invasion meant that most of us could no
longer support him or his followers. After all, Hitler made the trains
run on time and solved the unemployment problem but he did also embark
on unlawful invasions of independent sovereign states. Corbyn's main
asset is being the antithesis of Blair. Not a warmonger, not a slavish
supporter of American warmongers, not a domineering alpha male.

Blair will never be forgive, or forgotten, because of the Iraq War but
Corbyn's particular brand of pacifism is extremely unnerving. I do not
ever want to see our country go to war, but I do however wish for it to
be run by someone who is at least prepared to take that step.

[The Todal]

Post by Yellow
Sinister is not really a word I would use either but I do see the powers
behind Momentum as being extremely clever.

Alternatively they might be stupid and careless. We'll find out in due
course!

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/dec/07/momentum-faces-election-spending-investigation-corbyn-campaign


Momentum is to be investigated by the Electoral Commission over its role
campaigning for Labour during the 2017 general election, including
whether it breached campaign spending rules.

The leftwing grassroots movement, which sprang up in support of the
Labour leader, Jeremy Corbyn, has been given much of the credit for the
party’s success in the June election, during which it deployed thousands
of activists and volunteers in key marginal seats.

The commission said it would look at whether Momentum had breached
spending limits for an unauthorised, non-party campaigner, and that any
contravention risked damaging voters’ confidence in the result of the poll.

[Yellow]

Post by The Todal

Post by Yellow
Sinister is not really a word I would use either but I do see the powers
behind Momentum as being extremely clever.

Alternatively they might be stupid and careless. We'll find out in due
course!
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/dec/07/momentum-faces-election-spending-investigation-corbyn-campaign
Momentum is to be investigated by the Electoral Commission over its role
campaigning for Labour during the 2017 general election, including
whether it breached campaign spending rules.
The leftwing grassroots movement, which sprang up in support of the
Labour leader, Jeremy Corbyn, has been given much of the credit for the
party?s success in the June election, during which it deployed thousands
of activists and volunteers in key marginal seats.
The commission said it would look at whether Momentum had breached
spending limits for an unauthorised, non-party campaigner, and that any
contravention risked damaging voters? confidence in the result of the poll.

Yes, I saw the news on The Daily Politics. They had a chap from Momentum
on, dunno his name but he has been on before, who got quite defensive
and tried to turn the interview round to discuss the Tories and UKIP and
their 'alleged' over spending.

One thing he said that I did not know is that when a snap election is
called, they include all the spending for the 12 months up to the
election date in the calculation. That struck me as being rather unfair,
or at the very least, difficult to manage.

[Altroy1]

[....]

Post by Yellow
You need a focus for sure but the central figure does not need to be
"the son of god". It just needs to be someone who will supply everything
that the members of the group desire and who appears to have the power
to do so.

Problem with that is that it could describe almost any religion.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cult

Post by Yellow

Post by The Todal
Nobody looks to him for any words of wisdom,
any parables, any sermons. His speeches tend to be relatively banal.

I didn't say that Momentum was a religion, and of course it is not, I
simply claim that it is using the same mechanisms to entice people in.

Post by The Todal
Instead, his support is from a huge swathe of Labour members who believe
that Corbyn's leadership gives us a voice. Nobody would say that Blair
gave members a voice. Blair's was a dictatorship.

Blair became leader of the Labour Party because it realised it would
never get power all the while it was so left wing.

Blair made met the needs of a political narrative back in 1997: the left wing
was "unelectable". Unless the Labour party agreed with Rupert Murdoch, and the
other key players, election success there would be none. So Blair flew out to
Australia armed with key assurances for Mr Murdoch.

Similar message in 2016/17 Corbyn was unelectable. The majority of the PLP
agreed with this analysis.

Post by Yellow
Momentum and Jeremy
Corbyn is something else entirely - a door was accidentally opened by a
series of actions from various Labour MPs and Jeremy Corbyn stepped
through it.

A repeat of the Trump phenomenon. Unelectable Trump could neither win the
primaries (the Republican party faithful would not nominate him) nor the
presidential election (the American people would never elect him). Since Trump
couldn't be elected, key opponents such as Jeb Bush concentrated their campaigns
elsewhere until too late.

Likewise, the PLP were happy enough to conjure up 35 nominations needed to place
Corbyn on the ballot. They were comfortable with that because Corbyn would help
the debate by representing the left whilst the party faithful, after listening,
would no doubt in their thinking turn to one of the so called mainstream candidates.

The BBC and other nominated guardians of orthodoxy since then have helped us
make up our minds by making up our minds for us. That is why they refer to the
anti-Corbyn MPs as "moderate" MPs. That is them telling us that their subjective
definition of moderate is really society's objective and accepted definition. I
beg to differ. The MPs who voted for the Iraq disaster, the Libya folly and
attempted to repeat the same regime change agenda for Syria were by no sane
objective definition "moderates".

[James Wilkinson Sword]

Post by Yellow

Post by The Todal

Post by Vidcapper

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 21:23:20 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by James Wilkinson Sword
He is not going to achieve anything if nobody votes for him. I'm
surprised he's still the leader of the Labour Party.

Then (and I am not trying to be rude) you have not been paying
attention.

IMO it is the sinister 'Momentum' that puts people off Labour. In trying
to sideline moderates, they are likely to put off many traditional
Labour voters,

Not at all. It's only "sinister" to the journalists of the Daily Mail,
trying to spread scare stories.

Sinister is not really a word I would use either but I do see the powers
behind Momentum as being extremely clever. Someone has looked at how
religious movements work and have then applied the same to a political
movement.

Which is enough reason to stay well clear.

Post by Yellow
Whether it will survive beyond Jeremy Corbyn's leadership is the more
question.

Post by The Todal
As a Momentum member, I've been to quite a few meetings. They actually
don't try to "sideline moderates" at all.

I think time will tell as they certainly have been allegations of it and
if there is a pattern of it, then is will be more obvious over time.

[The Peeler]

On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 21:23:20 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
See above.

He is not going to achieve anything if nobody votes for him. I'm
surprised he's still the leader of the Labour Party.

I'm surprised to see that you doggedly refuse to accept that everyone, but
everyone, thinks you are a prize idiot, Birdbrain! <BG>

[The Todal]

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 18:52:54 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to the
budget a couple of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost
straining, shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she
took up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Who cares?

Many of us made the mistake of under estimating the organisation behind
Corbyn before.

We will bury you.

[Yellow]

Post by The Todal

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 18:52:54 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to the
budget a couple of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost
straining, shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she
took up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Who cares?

Many of us made the mistake of under estimating the organisation behind
Corbyn before.

We will bury you.

Please wait until I am dead.

[The Todal]

Post by Yellow

Post by The Todal

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 18:52:54 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to the
budget a couple of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost
straining, shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she
took up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Who cares?

Many of us made the mistake of under estimating the organisation behind
Corbyn before.

We will bury you.

Please wait until I am dead.

As you'll probably know, the phrase "we will bury you" was used by
Kruschev in 1956. It wasn't a threat, rather a prediction that Communism
would eventually triumph over capitalism. Which turned out to be an
inaccurate prediction.

[Yellow]

Post by The Todal

Post by Yellow

Post by The Todal

Post by Yellow
On Wed, 06 Dec 2017 18:52:54 -0000, James Wilkinson Sword

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to the
budget a couple of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost
straining, shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she
took up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Who cares?

Many of us made the mistake of under estimating the organisation behind
Corbyn before.

We will bury you.

Please wait until I am dead.

As you'll probably know, the phrase "we will bury you" was used by
Kruschev in 1956. It wasn't a threat, rather a prediction that Communism
would eventually triumph over capitalism. Which turned out to be an
inaccurate prediction.

No, I have never heard that one before - but I have now.

[Mike Swift]

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Who cares? He's an arsehole nobody will ever vote for.

Don't underestimate the stupidity of the great British electorate.

Mike

[James Wilkinson Sword]

Post by Mike Swift

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Yellow
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Who cares? He's an arsehole nobody will ever vote for.

Don't underestimate the stupidity of the great British electorate.

Well if you let Scottish people and Muslims vote....

[The Peeler]

On Thu, 07 Dec 2017 22:05:00 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),

Post by James Wilkinson Sword

Post by Mike Swift
Don't underestimate the stupidity of the great British electorate.

Well if you let Scottish people and Muslims vote....

I'm surprised that a mentally handicapped wanker like you IS allowed to
vote, Birdbrain!

[R. Mark Clayton]

Post by Yellow
Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to the
budget a couple of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost
straining, shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she
took up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Just did - sounds pretty much the same to me. Spouting pretty much the same *****cks too, although obviously just at the moment the average schoolchild could make jokes at the government's expense.

[Yellow]

On Thu, 7 Dec 2017 02:20:09 -0800 (PST), R. Mark Clayton

Post by R. Mark Clayton

Post by Yellow
Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to the
budget a couple of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost
straining, shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she
took up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Just did - sounds pretty much the same to me. Spouting pretty much
the same *****cks too, although obviously just at the moment
the average schoolchild could make jokes at the government's expense.

I was not referring to what he says, but how he says it. But OK - one
vote for "I am imagining it". :-)

[R. Mark Clayton]

Post by Yellow
On Thu, 7 Dec 2017 02:20:09 -0800 (PST), R. Mark Clayton

Post by R. Mark Clayton

Post by Yellow
Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to the
budget a couple of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost
straining, shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she
took up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Just did - sounds pretty much the same to me. Spouting pretty much
the same *****cks too, although obviously just at the moment
the average schoolchild could make jokes at the government's expense.

I was not referring to what he says, but how he says it. But OK - one
vote for "I am imagining it". :-)

Not necessarily, he might have head cold or other winter ailment. His confidence seems a bit higher, which might alter his voice slight;y sub consciously.

[Yellow]

On Fri, 8 Dec 2017 03:11:01 -0800 (PST), R. Mark Clayton

Post by R. Mark Clayton

Post by Yellow
On Thu, 7 Dec 2017 02:20:09 -0800 (PST), R. Mark Clayton

Post by R. Mark Clayton

Post by Yellow
Just watching Prime Ministers Questions and Corbyn's voice has
definitely changed and I have noticed this since his response to the
budget a couple of weeks ago.
Gone is the calm, laid back tone and instead he is now barking for the
want of another description. He is injecting an "angry" tone, almost
straining, shouting even.
It just reminds me of how Margaret Thatcher's voice altered when she
took up coaching.
Keep your ears open and see if you agree.

Just did - sounds pretty much the same to me. Spouting pretty much
the same *****cks too, although obviously just at the moment
the average schoolchild could make jokes at the government's expense.

I was not referring to what he says, but how he says it. But OK - one
vote for "I am imagining it". :-)

Not necessarily, he might have head cold or other winter ailment. His confidence seems a bit higher, which might alter his voice slight;y sub consciously.

Yes, it might just be a confidence thing.

[R. Mark Clayton]

Post by Yellow
On Fri, 8 Dec 2017 03:11:01 -0800 (PST), R. Mark Clayton

SNIP

Post by Yellow

Post by R. Mark Clayton

Post by Yellow
I was not referring to what he says, but how he says it. But OK - one
vote for "I am imagining it". :-)

Not necessarily, he might have head cold or other winter ailment. His confidence seems a bit higher, which might alter his voice slight;y sub consciously.

Yes, it might just be a confidence thing.

I think he whines a bit when he knows he is talking ******cks, but hammers his point home when he knows he is onto a cert'.

OTOH what about May's body language - looks like her doctor has just told her it's terminal...