Waaaay OT: Smoking ban in Ireland.

On Wed, 31 Mar 2004 13:30:39 GMT, escapee

I'll be in serious trouble soon.

What studies are you talking about?

Most recently, the study released by the CDC.....a Google search on
obesity death rates will return a rash of articles from earlier this
month detailing the CDC study:

http://www.wsbtv.com/health/2911188/detail.html

Study Links Obesity, Smoking Death Rates
Americans Encouraged to Increase Activity

POSTED: 10:07 am EST March 10, 2004
UPDATED: 2:37 pm EST March 10, 2004

The article is copyrighted, however it describes the increase in
obesity related deaths that is gaining on smoking related:

In 2000, 400,000 poor diet and obesity related deaths (more than 16%
of all deaths in the US and number 2 killer) compared to 435,000 for
tobacco or 18%.

In 1990, the gap was 300,000 poor diet and inactivity (14%) vs.
400,000 for tobacco (19%), and according to the CDC will overtake
tobacco if not stopped.

-----------------------

http://www.citizens.org/docUploads/Death%20Rate%20from%20Obesity%20Gains%20Fast%20on%20Smoking%2Epdf

An article in the New York times citing the same study as above.

-----------------------------------

Actually, I believe it should be banned inside your house too.

Before Mark quit, he never smoked in the house. That was his decision I never
forced him. I also don't ban smoking in my car for those people who smoke.
I'ven been there and know how hard it is to stop. Fortunately, I don't have any
friends who smoke, but when I did, I didn't ban them in my car.
Public places, and outside the doors of public places should not tolerate
smoking at the door. I personally get sick to my stomach when I smell the
stuff. I have no idea how I smoked all those years. Yuck!
V

--
Deb

WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

Deb Milner

2004-04-01 02:39:58 UTC

On Wed, 31 Mar 2004 13:42:26 -0600, Dianne Lewandowski

or eat. :-) We're doomed.
Also interesting is the huge increase in asthma at the same time that
cigarette smoking has declined enormously.

It is wierd. I developed asthma as a result of a gas leak exposure
while in the Navy, which then turned into chemical pneumonia.

I quit smoking for 3 years, and had severe asthma symptoms.

I started smoking (the problem is I actually enjoy smoking), and the
asthma improved considerably.

I quit again, the asthma kicked up royally for the year I was quit....

My pulmonologist doesn't get it either, but has confirmed that my
asthma is actually better when I'm smoking.....not that he condones my
continuing to do so.

When smoking, I can go a year or more without an acute attack. When
not smoking, I'm in the ER on average of once a month. Go figure.

--
Deb

WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply

2004-04-01 12:31:51 UTC

Post by Deb Milner
It is wierd. I developed asthma as a result of a gas leak exposure
while in the Navy, which then turned into chemical pneumonia. .......

And I was just diagnosed with asthma last month! Every year that I have
gone to New Orleans for Carnival, I come home and have what I *thought* was an
allergy attack. This year, the attack wasn't really an attack perse. It was
more a worsening of the one that started out *last year* after Mardi Gras and
never really went away.
Ever since moving to Magnoliaville, I have had some sort of upper
respiratory "thing" going on. I had thought it was allergies -- most likely to
mold since there ain't no such creature anywhere in Lizard Land! Last summer,
I started to sort of wheeze when exhaling and it was *really* bad when I was
laying down. So bad and noisy that the kitties would creep up to my face and
stare at me and sort of sniff around to see where the funny noise was coming
from!!!
I finally went to the Dr. because nothing was getting better and that is
when I was diagnosed with the asthma. He said I have "a-typical" asthma, not
"regular" asthma that bothers a person all the time. Mine is triggered by some
sort of environmental thing and will clear up and then go away until I am
exposed to the trigger. He also said I have probably always had the potential
for the asthma but never lived or visited anywhere that had my specific
"trigger".
What's funny is that I never felt like I was having touble breathing! I did
wonder how I got to be in such horrible shape that walking up the stair would
make me out of breath! I kept teling myself that I HAD to get back on my
regular exercise routine. Well, I started back to exercising and it didn't
help all that much. After going to the Dr. and taking the medication he gave
me, I could walk up the stairs and up the hill to my neighbor's home without
getting out of breath at all!
It's strange what our bodies do as we age. DH was just diagnosed with
adult onset diabetes! His mom has it so we aren't surprosed but it's very
strange to have it start up as an adult! thank heavens I made him go to the
Dr. about the same time I went!!!!!!! CiaoMeow >^;;^<
.

PAX, Tia Mary >^;;^< Queen of Kitties
Angels can't show their wings on earth but nothing was ever said about their
WHISKERS!!
Nothing is complete without a few cat hairs!

Alison

2004-04-01 13:25:12 UTC

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
It's strange what our bodies do as we age. DH was just diagnosed with
adult onset diabetes! His mom has it so we aren't surprosed but it's very
strange to have it start up as an adult! thank heavens I made him go to the
Dr. about the same time I went!!!!!!! CiaoMeow >^;;^<

Is this Type II (or 2) Diabetes? If so, it's not at all unusual to
have it start as an adult - in fact what's unusual is that children
seem to be starting very early with it. Anyway, my best wishes to you
and your DH. If it is Type 2, there's a great book out with keywords
"first year type 2" (I'll get more info at work.) - I highly recommend
it.

Alison

Seanette Blaylock

2004-04-01 20:45:37 UTC

Post by Alison

I can see it on my shelf from here, if I'm thinking of the same one
you are. The one I'm thinking of is "Type 2 Diabetes: The First Year",
by Gretchen Becker. DH found it quite useful [so did I]. We also liked
"Diabetes for Dummies" [can't recall the author's name, but I do
remember he's an endo specializing in diabetic patients].

--
"Don't mess with major appliances unless you know what you are doing
(or unless your life insurance policy is up-to-date)." - John, RCFL

Alison

2004-04-02 01:18:26 UTC

On Thu, 01 Apr 2004 12:45:37 -0800, Seanette Blaylock

Post by Seanette Blaylock

Post by Alison

Yes, that's the one (by Becker)!

alison

F.James Cripwell

2004-04-01 14:15:13 UTC

Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply (***@aol.comnekoluvr) writes:
(snip)

Some months ago, I had a slightly high blood sugar reading on an
annual check-up; 6.2 where the limit was 6.1 for fasting. As a result,
my doctor sent me on a diabetes education course, which was *very*
interesting and *informative*. I had had two more blood sugar readings
before I went on the course, and both were "normal", whatever this means.
I thought I was on the course under false pretenses.
Nothing could have been further from the truth. It turns out I am a
potential pre-diabetic, and the nurse and dietician giving the course
wished it were filled with people like me. As we age, for some of us the
pancreas simply doesn't work properly. It is a slow process, and the
sooner you find out about it, the more you can do to prolong the life of
your pancreas. At the moment I am taking 6 months worth of blood sugar
readings; on two days every week, and twice on those two days. At the
end of that time, my doctor should have enough information to decide what
the next step is.
Interestingly enough, here in Canada, the testing kits are free, and
the strips used to catch the blood and take the readings are about a
dollar each. However, for OAPs, the cost comes mainly out of our Health
Care System.
The course taught me that diabetes is, potentially, an *extremely*
dangerous condition, which can, however, be readily treated with
medication and/or diet. So dont let your DH ignore his condition. HTH.

--
Jim Cripwell.
The gods do not subtract from the allotted span of one's life, any
time that is spent in stitching.
Adapted from a sign on The Cobb, Lyme Regis, England.

Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply

2004-04-01 15:25:52 UTC

...... diabetes is, potentially, an *extremely*
dangerous condition, which can, however, be readily treated with
medication and/or diet. So dont let your DH ignore his condition.

DH is just barely over into the range for diabetes -- he's *almost* normal
but not quite. His is type 2 and he has already begun medication and even has
his little test kit and is testing his blood sugar daily. He's not overweight,
he is very active, doesn't smoke, drinks very little and isn't a junk food
eater except for popcorn.
When he went for his physical they ran blood tests. What's really strange
is that just about everything came back *almost* out of the normal range! For
someone who has always been healthy and lived a relatively healthy life-style,
his blood sugar is too high, his good cholesterol is at the low end of normal,
his bad cholesterol is at the high end of normal, results for prostate is on
the high end of normal -- just about *everything* is at one end or the other of
normal -- nothing is smack in the middle!!
Anyway, the Dr. sent him for a stress test and he had no problems with that
at all. EXCEPT (isn't there always an except -- LOL) he might have the
beginnings of a minor blockage in one of his arteries. Dh told the Dr. that
if he (the Dr.) keeps telling him (DH) about all the stuff that's "almost" bad,
then he (DH) WILL have a heart attack :-)))!
Anyway, now DH has to go to the Cardiologist just to have that strange
reading from the stress test checked in addition to going to the Urologist to
have those prostate thingie readings checked. Then we both will go to some
sort of diabetes class. I told him to ask the Dr. if I should go to the
diabetes class too and the Dr. said that was a good idea. Poor Guy, 2 years
ago he had a sigmoidoscopy and it showed a small polyp. He went for a
colonoscopy and they removed the polyp and said it was just fine. ALL of his
blood work done at that time came back OK, everything looked good, etc. With
these recent tests, I told him he's falling apart like a cheap tent.
Fortunately, he WILL take his meds properly and do everything he has been told
to do. He lives with MOI -- what other choice does he have if he plans on
staying alive -- LOLOL! CiaoMeow >^;;^<
.
PAX, Tia Mary >^;;^< Queen of Kitties
Angels can't show their wings on earth but nothing was ever said about their
WHISKERS!!
Nothing is complete without a few cat hairs!

Dianne Lewandowski

2004-04-01 16:11:58 UTC

It is "normal" <grin> for Type 2 diabetics to have problems with
cholesterol and arteries. Their bodies simply aren't functioning as
well. Sounds like your hubby is already a good eater. He just needs to
focus a little more and he should lead a productive life.

Hugs to him and to you.

Dianne

...... diabetes is, potentially, an *extremely*
dangerous condition, which can, however, be readily treated with
medication and/or diet. So dont let your DH ignore his condition.

Alison

2004-04-02 01:26:55 UTC

...... diabetes is, potentially, an *extremely*
dangerous condition, which can, however, be readily treated with
medication and/or diet. So dont let your DH ignore his condition.

Dear TM - one of the hardest things for me with diabetes is counting
carbs, not just sugar. I have to really watch my intake of such
staples as rice, pasta, bread, and, yes, popcorn, because they raise
the blood sugar as much as does sugar. The diabetes "class" should
help, you will probably get a meal suggestion hand-out, and the books
are helpful too.

Alison

Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply

2004-04-02 03:25:47 UTC

...... one of the hardest things for me with diabetes is counting
carbs, not just sugar ........

We have several friends who have Adult onset type 2 Diabetes so are well
aware of the food considerations. DH isn't really a big carb eater --
actually, ne's not a big eater at all and rarely has sweets. He does like his
popcorn a few times a week in the evenings. Last time we were in the grocery
store, he went and got the special low salt, low fat box of microwave papcorn
-- the one that has the smaller serving packages! He's such a good guy about
stuff like this -- LOL!
The only really heavy carbs he eats are in the bowl of instant oatmeal he
has each morning. For him, he would probably give up all carbs for the rest of
the day so that he can have his oatmeal! Rice, pasta & bread are not things we
eat very often -- if we do carbs, it is usually potatoes. He has a preliminary
diet outline and has been very good about following it.
I don't really think there are any foods he will need to eliminate. He will
need to cut back on the popcorn. What he WILL need to do -- and has started
doing already -- is to eat more veggies. He's not terribly fond of a lot of
cooked veggies so I have him eating salad that has raw broccoli & cauliflower,
etc. He *loves* all that stuff and only uses a minimum amount of salad
dressing. I am sure the food related classes or whatever will get more
specific but, all in all, I think he's doing good at watching his food.
CiaoMeow >^;;^<
.
PAX, Tia Mary >^;;^< Queen of Kitties
Angels can't show their wings on earth but nothing was ever said about their
WHISKERS!!
Nothing is complete without a few cat hairs!

Seanette Blaylock

2004-04-02 04:09:45 UTC

***@aol.comnekoluvr (Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply ) had
some very interesting things to say about Re: OT: Type II diabetes.

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
The only really heavy carbs he eats are in the bowl of instant oatmeal he
has each morning. For him, he would probably give up all carbs for the rest of
the day so that he can have his oatmeal! Rice, pasta & bread are not things we
eat very often -- if we do carbs, it is usually potatoes. He has a preliminary
diet outline and has been very good about following it.
I don't really think there are any foods he will need to eliminate. He will
need to cut back on the popcorn. What he WILL need to do -- and has started
doing already -- is to eat more veggies. He's not terribly fond of a lot of
cooked veggies so I have him eating salad that has raw broccoli & cauliflower,
etc. He *loves* all that stuff and only uses a minimum amount of salad
dressing. I am sure the food related classes or whatever will get more
specific but, all in all, I think he's doing good at watching his food.

One thing we've read about as helpful [and it does seem to work for
DH, whose cholesterol levels, etc., are fine] is adding fat and/or
protein [butter, cheese, etc.] to high-carb items. What I've seen as
the explanation is that fat or protein slows down carb breakdown so
the sugar release is spread out longer and not dumping so much into
the system at once, and reduces spikes.

--
"Don't mess with major appliances unless you know what you are doing
(or unless your life insurance policy is up-to-date)." - John, RCFL

Seanette Blaylock

2004-04-01 20:44:18 UTC

***@aol.comnekoluvr (Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply ) had
some very interesting things to say about Re: Waaaay OT: Smoking ban

Type 2 diabetes usually*does* show up in the patient's middle years.
DH was 39 when diagnosed. His father had been diagnosed a few weeks
earlier at 68.

--
"Don't mess with major appliances unless you know what you are doing
(or unless your life insurance policy is up-to-date)." - John, RCFL

Deb

2004-04-02 01:08:19 UTC

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
And I was just diagnosed with asthma last month! Every year that I have

Welcome to the club. Have you made it through denial yet? It took me
awhile, I just couldn't get used to the idea that I could NOT do some
of the things I've done all my life with no problem, then suddenly now
when I get pigheaded and try it anyway, I wind up in the ER on the
nebulizer.....DH says there is NOTHING "cute" about an asthma attack,
so whey are they called "acute"......

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
"regular" asthma that bothers a person all the time. Mine is triggered by some
sort of environmental thing and will clear up and then go away until I am
exposed to the trigger. He also said I have probably always had the potential

Same here....my triggers are any very strong odor, especially certain
perumes and almost any type of petrochemical based odors (pesticides,
diesel exhaust, etc)

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
help all that much. After going to the Dr. and taking the medication he gave
me, I could walk up the stairs and up the hill to my neighbor's home without
getting out of breath at all!

Once the doc put me on Singulair, it was almost like having the "old
lungs" back......far, far fewer attacks.

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
It's strange what our bodies do as we age. DH was just diagnosed with
adult onset diabetes! His mom has it so we aren't surprosed but it's very

DH has to go in for a glucose tolerance test, his fasting sugar was at
122 last week, they think he has pre-diabetes.

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
strange to have it start up as an adult! thank heavens I made him go to the
Dr. about the same time I went!!!!!!! CiaoMeow >^;;^<

Ayup.

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
.
PAX, Tia Mary >^;;^< Queen of Kitties
Angels can't show their wings on earth but nothing was ever said about their
WHISKERS!!
Nothing is complete without a few cat hairs!

--
Deb

WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

Seanette Blaylock

2004-04-02 04:04:40 UTC

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
It's strange what our bodies do as we age. DH was just diagnosed with
adult onset diabetes! His mom has it so we aren't surprosed but it's very

DH has to go in for a glucose tolerance test, his fasting sugar was at
122 last week, they think he has pre-diabetes.

Normal fasting range is 70-110. IIRC, 125 is the "official" threshold
for diagnosis. Is he having any symptoms, such as thirst, going to the
bathroom a lot, etc.? [Note: I am not a medical professional. I am,
however, the spouse, daughter, daughter-in-law, and sister-in-law of a
total of 5 Type 2 diabetics.]

--
"Don't mess with major appliances unless you know what you are doing
(or unless your life insurance policy is up-to-date)." - John, RCFL

Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply

2004-04-02 11:56:51 UTC

Post by Seanette Blaylock
Normal fasting range is 70-110. IIRC, 125 is the "official" threshold
for diagnosis. Is he having any symptoms, such as thirst, going to the
bathroom a lot, etc.? .......

DH had absolutely NONE of the"classic" symptoms of diabetes -- thirst,
frequent urination, excessive hunger. I asked him what his fasting level was
the other morning (he's out of town right now) and it was in the mid-120's. He
said the Dr. told him it should be 110 or lower. CiaoMeow >^;;^<
.

PAX, Tia Mary >^;;^< Queen of Kitties
Angels can't show their wings on earth but nothing was ever said about their
WHISKERS!!
Nothing is complete without a few cat hairs!

Dianne Lewandowski

2004-04-02 14:14:15 UTC

Actually, when I was diagnosed (fasting 276), I wasn't hungry at all.
In fact, one meal a day was all I could tolerate.

But I was soooo thirsty that I growled if anyone took the last cup of
coffee and didn't make another pot. I didn't realize what was going on.
It crept up so gradually.

I also wasn't "thin". I had gained considerable weight. It came off
within months of diagnosis. Not because I ate less, either. I actually
eat more, now.

Different people respond differently.
Dianne

Post by Seanette Blaylock
Normal fasting range is 70-110. IIRC, 125 is the "official" threshold
for diagnosis. Is he having any symptoms, such as thirst, going to the
bathroom a lot, etc.? .......

DH had absolutely NONE of the"classic" symptoms of diabetes -- thirst,
frequent urination, excessive hunger. I asked him what his fasting level was
the other morning (he's out of town right now) and it was in the mid-120's. He
said the Dr. told him it should be 110 or lower. CiaoMeow >^;;^<
.
PAX, Tia Mary >^;;^< Queen of Kitties
Angels can't show their wings on earth but nothing was ever said about their
WHISKERS!!
Nothing is complete without a few cat hairs!

Deb

2004-04-03 03:58:08 UTC

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
DH had absolutely NONE of the"classic" symptoms of diabetes -- thirst,
frequent urination, excessive hunger. I asked him what his fasting level was
the other morning (he's out of town right now) and it was in the mid-120's. He
said the Dr. told him it should be 110 or lower. CiaoMeow >^;;^<
.

My DH has had no symptoms at all until recently. Unfortunately, the
symptoms he is having are past the "warning stage", and fall into the
"we now have damage" category. He will probably wind up with a full
circulatory workup.

--
Deb

WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

Deb

2004-04-03 03:56:40 UTC

On Thu, 01 Apr 2004 20:04:40 -0800, Seanette Blaylock

Post by Seanette Blaylock

Post by Deb
DH has to go in for a glucose tolerance test, his fasting sugar was at
122 last week, they think he has pre-diabetes.

Normal fasting range is 70-110. IIRC, 125 is the "official" threshold
for diagnosis. Is he having any symptoms, such as thirst, going to the

Yes, he had some symptoms that led him to the doctor, but not the
common warning signs you would expect. Doc said it could be a number
of different things, and ran a slew of blood work. DH said he thinks
they took a gallon or so..<grin>

Then, I find out from him that a number of years ago in the Navy, he
had another fasting test that was in the same range, but the doc told
him then it was just "he wasn't used to eating sweets"......if that
was not a "fluke" and he's been in pre-diabetes that long, it looks
like he already has some long term damage.....

--
Deb

WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

mickey

2004-04-02 15:31:37 UTC

Post by Deb Milner
On Wed, 31 Mar 2004 13:42:26 -0600, Dianne Lewandowski

or eat. :-) We're doomed.
Also interesting is the huge increase in asthma at the same time that
cigarette smoking has declined enormously.

It is wierd. I developed asthma as a result of a gas leak exposure
while in the Navy, which then turned into chemical pneumonia.
I quit smoking for 3 years, and had severe asthma symptoms.
I started smoking (the problem is I actually enjoy smoking), and the
asthma improved considerably.
I quit again, the asthma kicked up royally for the year I was quit....
My pulmonologist doesn't get it either, but has confirmed that my
asthma is actually better when I'm smoking.....not that he condones my
continuing to do so.
When smoking, I can go a year or more without an acute attack. When
not smoking, I'm in the ER on average of once a month. Go figure.
--
Deb
WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

Deb, could you help me understand what chemical pneumonia is? I have
mild asthma (and have had it my entire life), and I'm a chemist. If
there's a potential of getting pneumonia from chemicals, I want to know
about it!

As for the smoking helping asthma, while it's certainly not the norm, I
don't think it's entirely unheard of. DH has recently begun smoking
cigars on occasion (as in once every month or two, and never, ever, near
me! LOL!), thus he researched the effects of an occasional cigar,
cigarette, pipe, etc. There haven't been many of these studies
conducted, but most of them came to the conclusion that there's a
prophylactic effect of occasional exposure to the "stuff" in tobacco
smoke. A small amount, it seems, can help *prevent* cancer and other
ailments. Weird. What doesn't kill you makes you stronger, indeed! ;-)

And, hey, you can't do much when you can't breath! So, if smoking help,
I say go for it!

--Mickey
Mansfield, MA

to reply remove "nospam"
mickey18385 at yahoo dot com

Susan Hartman/Dirty Linen

2004-04-02 21:51:17 UTC

Post by mickey
As for the smoking helping asthma, while it's certainly not the norm, I
don't think it's entirely unheard of. DH has recently begun smoking
cigars on occasion (as in once every month or two, and never, ever, near
me! LOL!), thus he researched the effects of an occasional cigar,
cigarette, pipe, etc. There haven't been many of these studies
conducted, but most of them came to the conclusion that there's a
prophylactic effect of occasional exposure to the "stuff" in tobacco
smoke. A small amount, it seems, can help *prevent* cancer and other
ailments. Weird. What doesn't kill you makes you stronger, indeed! ;-)
And, hey, you can't do much when you can't breath! So, if smoking help,
I say go for it!

I've heard that smoking marijuana helps asthma, too. But I don't know of
any studies about it. And I'm sure not telling 16 y.o. DD, who has
asthma! <vbg>

Sue

Darla

2004-04-03 16:54:14 UTC

Post by Susan Hartman/Dirty Linen

On Fri, 02 Apr 2004 16:51:17 -0500, Susan Hartman/Dirty Linen

I've heard that smoking marijuana helps asthma, too. But I don't know of
any studies about it. And I'm sure not telling 16 y.o. DD, who has
asthma! <vbg>
Sue

We didn't know until the toxicology tests and talks with his friends
after his death, but meth helped my youngest brother's asthma.
Darla
Sacred cows make great hamburgers.

Lucille

2004-04-03 17:14:01 UTC

Post by Darla
On Fri, 02 Apr 2004 16:51:17 -0500, Susan Hartman/Dirty Linen

;-)

Post by mickey
And, hey, you can't do much when you can't breath! So, if smoking help,
I say go for it!

I swore to myself I wouldn't mix in on this discussion, but------------ I
have COPD, which is a euphuism for Emphysema. I can tell you without any
doubt in my mind that my problem is from heavy smoking for a lot of years.
It's unpleasant and it's eventually going to kill me. Hopefully later
rather than sooner.

If you want a short term fix for an asthma attack use Albuterol. It does
have some side effects, as nearly everything in life does, but it's been
used for years and so far research says it won't kill you. It may not be a
permanent fix, or in some cases not work very well, but smoking will
definitely do you harm and in the long run it just aint worth it.

I'm not saying all lung problems are from smoking, I'm just stating the fact
that smoking causes a lot of lung problems that can't be fixed.

Lucille

Lucille

2004-04-03 19:27:06 UTC

I just want to correct my spelling in my previous note before the spelling
police get me--- "euphemism."

Post by Darla
On Fri, 02 Apr 2004 16:51:17 -0500, Susan Hartman/Dirty Linen

near

Post by mickey
me! LOL!), thus he researched the effects of an occasional cigar,
cigarette, pipe, etc. There haven't been many of these studies
conducted, but most of them came to the conclusion that there's a
prophylactic effect of occasional exposure to the "stuff" in tobacco
smoke. A small amount, it seems, can help *prevent* cancer and other
ailments. Weird. What doesn't kill you makes you stronger, indeed!

;-)

Post by mickey
And, hey, you can't do much when you can't breath! So, if smoking

help,

Post by mickey
I say go for it!

I swore to myself I wouldn't mix in on this discussion, but------------ I
have COPD, which is a euphuism for Emphysema. I can tell you without any
doubt in my mind that my problem is from heavy smoking for a lot of years.
It's unpleasant and it's eventually going to kill me. Hopefully later
rather than sooner.
If you want a short term fix for an asthma attack use Albuterol. It does
have some side effects, as nearly everything in life does, but it's been
used for years and so far research says it won't kill you. It may not be a
permanent fix, or in some cases not work very well, but smoking will
definitely do you harm and in the long run it just aint worth it.
I'm not saying all lung problems are from smoking, I'm just stating the fact
that smoking causes a lot of lung problems that can't be fixed.
Lucille

Dawne Peterson

2004-04-04 01:48:24 UTC

Post by Lucille
I just want to correct my spelling in my previous note before the spelling
police get me--- "euphemism."

woh, just in time!! You would have had to type it out 100 times if they'd
caught you..
Dawne

Lucille

2004-04-04 01:49:30 UTC

phew--Sometimes life is good, isn't it?
Lucille

Post by Lucille
I just want to correct my spelling in my previous note before the

spelling

Post by Lucille
police get me--- "euphemism."

woh, just in time!! You would have had to type it out 100 times if they'd
caught you..
Dawne

Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply

2004-04-04 02:22:24 UTC

Post by Lucille
phew--Sometimes life is good, isn't it?

Yeah, but can you spell Mary Poppins' favourite word? I'm just lucky I can SAY
the durned thing -- LOL! CiaoMeow >^;;^<
PAX, Tia Mary >^;;^< Queen of Kitties
Angels can't show their wings on earth but nothing was ever said about their
WHISKERS!!
Nothing is complete without a few cat hairs!

Lucille

2004-04-04 02:39:34 UTC

Do you mean "superfragilisticaspialidocious?"

I wonder if that's right--hold on tight. I'm going to look it up and be
surprised if it is.

Lucille

Post by Lucille
phew--Sometimes life is good, isn't it?

Lucille

2004-04-04 02:44:21 UTC

Okay--I looked it up on the IMDB (for those who don't know that's the
Internet Movie Data Base) and came up with:

"supercalifragilisticexpialidocious"

I was close, but no cigar--at least I was in the same ballpark. Now this is
strictly for myself--Repeat after me, go slow and say it out loud before you
try to win the spelling bee..

Lucille

Post by Lucille
Do you mean "superfragilisticaspialidocious?"
I wonder if that's right--hold on tight. I'm going to look it up and be
surprised if it is.
Lucille

Post by Lucille
phew--Sometimes life is good, isn't it?

Yeah, but can you spell Mary Poppins' favourite word? I'm just lucky I

can SAY

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
the durned thing -- LOL! CiaoMeow >^;;^<
PAX, Tia Mary >^;;^< Queen of Kitties
Angels can't show their wings on earth but nothing was ever said about

their

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
WHISKERS!!
Nothing is complete without a few cat hairs!

Deb

2004-04-04 05:13:12 UTC

On Sat, 3 Apr 2004 21:39:34 -0500, "Lucille"

Post by Lucille
Do you mean "superfragilisticaspialidocious?"

supercalifragilisticexpialidocious

Post by Lucille
I wonder if that's right--hold on tight. I'm going to look it up and be
surprised if it is.
Lucille

Post by Lucille
phew--Sometimes life is good, isn't it?

Yeah, but can you spell Mary Poppins' favourite word? I'm just lucky I

can SAY

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
the durned thing -- LOL! CiaoMeow >^;;^<
PAX, Tia Mary >^;;^< Queen of Kitties
Angels can't show their wings on earth but nothing was ever said about

their

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
WHISKERS!!
Nothing is complete without a few cat hairs!

--
Deb

WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

Jenn Liace

2004-04-04 02:53:30 UTC

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
Yeah, but can you spell Mary Poppins' favourite word? I'm just lucky I can SAY
the durned thing -- LOL! CiaoMeow >^;;^<

supercalifragilisticexpialodocious? <snicker>

Jenn L.
--
http://community.webshots.com/user/jaliace
http://sewu9corn.blogspot.com
Current projects:
Lady Scarlet's Journey (Just Nan)
Just Nan Round Robin - currently Creativity
Lady of the Flag (Mirabilia)

Deb

2004-04-04 05:12:27 UTC

On Sat, 3 Apr 2004 12:14:01 -0500, "Lucille"

Post by Lucille
If you want a short term fix for an asthma attack use Albuterol. It does
have some side effects, as nearly everything in life does, but it's been
used for years and so far research says it won't kill you. It may not be a
permanent fix, or in some cases not work very well, but smoking will
definitely do you harm and in the long run it just aint worth it.

I agree with you, that smoking is going to harm the lungs. What
you've missed in my discussion, is that so far, smoking has been the
long term "fix" for my asthma. It is ironic, that while it helps my
bronchial tubes, I'm sure it's trashing my lungs.

When I quit smoking the last time, my use of Albuterol went from a 2 -
3 times year basis to several times a day on the inhaler, plus
nebulizer treatments almost daily. It's just ironic.

--
Deb

WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

Lucille

2004-04-04 13:57:01 UTC

Sorry Deb but I'm still fighting a very severe case of bronchial pneumonia.
It's been 3 months and it's still not completely gone. I think smoking
irritates the bronchial tubes as well as trashing the lungs. You might want
to rethink the very, very short term effect of the smoke.

Incidentally, I will admit that there was hardly an excuse that I didn't
think of, or use, to stop me from quitting smoking. Again I repeat, it just
aint worth it.

Lucille

Post by Deb
On Sat, 3 Apr 2004 12:14:01 -0500, "Lucille"

I agree with you, that smoking is going to harm the lungs. What
you've missed in my discussion, is that so far, smoking has been the
long term "fix" for my asthma. It is ironic, that while it helps my
bronchial tubes, I'm sure it's trashing my lungs.
When I quit smoking the last time, my use of Albuterol went from a 2 -
3 times year basis to several times a day on the inhaler, plus
nebulizer treatments almost daily. It's just ironic.
--
Deb
WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

Deb

2004-04-04 19:08:18 UTC

On Sun, 4 Apr 2004 09:57:01 -0400, "Lucille"

Post by Lucille
Sorry Deb but I'm still fighting a very severe case of bronchial pneumonia.

{{{{{{{{{{{{hugs}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

Post by Lucille
It's been 3 months and it's still not completely gone. I think smoking
irritates the bronchial tubes as well as trashing the lungs. You might want
to rethink the very, very short term effect of the smoke.

All we can go on is that when I am smoking, the asthma is only a
problem a few times a year, and I can breathe normally 95% of the
time. When I'm not, I constantly wheeze and have acute attacks
several times a month at a minimum.......even the pulmonologist sees
the difference.

Post by Lucille
Incidentally, I will admit that there was hardly an excuse that I didn't
think of, or use, to stop me from quitting smoking. Again I repeat, it just
aint worth it.

No argument there at all. DH and I quit cold turkey the first of
November last year, but did not "plan" well enough and things were
quite ugly at home and at work within a few weeks. We got so bad, our
bosses who are adamant non-smokers practially ordered us to go have a
cigarette..<wry grin>

We have since discussed it with our doctor, and will be quitting again
very soon, however this time, the doc wants us to use the inhalers
when "things get ugly", and taper down....we are currently in the
"phase down" mode, monitoring when/where we smoke. Next, we started
cutting 3 cigarettes a day on a weekly basis, (cut by 3 of what we
normally smoke on week 1, 3 more on week 2, etc.) When we get to the
point where we are only smoking 4 per day, doc says that's when we
quit.....same effect as the patch, but less expensive.

Post by Lucille
Lucille

Post by Deb
On Sat, 3 Apr 2004 12:14:01 -0500, "Lucille"

Post by Lucille
permanent fix, or in some cases not work very well, but smoking will
definitely do you harm and in the long run it just aint worth it.

I agree with you, that smoking is going to harm the lungs. What
you've missed in my discussion, is that so far, smoking has been the
long term "fix" for my asthma. It is ironic, that while it helps my
bronchial tubes, I'm sure it's trashing my lungs.
When I quit smoking the last time, my use of Albuterol went from a 2 -
3 times year basis to several times a day on the inhaler, plus
nebulizer treatments almost daily. It's just ironic.
--
Deb
WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

--
Deb

WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

Lucille

2004-04-04 19:25:18 UTC

Thanks for the hugs.

I wish you the very best on quitting. I was finally able to do so using the
nicorette gum. I used that rather than the patch because I thought I would
be able to control when and how I used it. I was scared of the patch
because I felt that if I "fell off the wagon" I might kill myself with an
overdoes of nicotine. I also moved shortly before I quit and I made a deal
with myself that since I didn't want my new house to smell of smoke I
couldn't smoke inside and had to go out, rain or shine. If you have
experienced shine in hot, humid Florida you would know that's not
particularly comfortable. Nobody loved smoking more than I did and I'm not
going to say I don't miss it sometimes, but it's definitely worth the
struggle to stop.

Good luck to both of you. I promise you that in the long run it is a worthy
thing to do.

Lucille

Post by Deb
On Sun, 4 Apr 2004 09:57:01 -0400, "Lucille"

Post by Lucille
Sorry Deb but I'm still fighting a very severe case of bronchial pneumonia.

{{{{{{{{{{{{hugs}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

Post by Lucille
Incidentally, I will admit that there was hardly an excuse that I didn't
think of, or use, to stop me from quitting smoking. Again I repeat, it just
aint worth it.

No argument there at all. DH and I quit cold turkey the first of
November last year, but did not "plan" well enough and things were
quite ugly at home and at work within a few weeks. We got so bad, our
bosses who are adamant non-smokers practially ordered us to go have a
cigarette..<wry grin>
We have since discussed it with our doctor, and will be quitting again
very soon, however this time, the doc wants us to use the inhalers
when "things get ugly", and taper down....we are currently in the
"phase down" mode, monitoring when/where we smoke. Next, we started
cutting 3 cigarettes a day on a weekly basis, (cut by 3 of what we
normally smoke on week 1, 3 more on week 2, etc.) When we get to the
point where we are only smoking 4 per day, doc says that's when we
quit.....same effect as the patch, but less expensive.

Post by Lucille
Lucille

Post by Deb
On Sat, 3 Apr 2004 12:14:01 -0500, "Lucille"

Post by Lucille
permanent fix, or in some cases not work very well, but smoking will
definitely do you harm and in the long run it just aint worth it.

I agree with you, that smoking is going to harm the lungs. What
you've missed in my discussion, is that so far, smoking has been the
long term "fix" for my asthma. It is ironic, that while it helps my
bronchial tubes, I'm sure it's trashing my lungs.
When I quit smoking the last time, my use of Albuterol went from a 2 -
3 times year basis to several times a day on the inhaler, plus
nebulizer treatments almost daily. It's just ironic.
--
Deb
WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

--
Deb
WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

LTuros41

2004-04-04 21:33:39 UTC

<Love Singular, Zyrtec, and Advair-- keeps the asthma mainly at bay unless
exposed to a trigger!!> Linda

Deb

2004-04-04 23:33:39 UTC

On Sun, 4 Apr 2004 15:25:18 -0400, "Lucille"

Post by Lucille
overdoes of nicotine. I also moved shortly before I quit and I made a deal
with myself that since I didn't want my new house to smell of smoke I
couldn't smoke inside and had to go out, rain or shine. If you have

DH and I made the same decision in '95.

Post by Lucille
experienced shine in hot, humid Florida you would know that's not
particularly comfortable. Nobody loved smoking more than I did and I'm not

I live just west of Jacksonville.....

Post by Lucille
going to say I don't miss it sometimes, but it's definitely worth the
struggle to stop.

Oh, I know. I've quit several times before, once for 7 years, another
for 1 and the last (not counting November) for 3 years.

Post by Lucille
Good luck to both of you. I promise you that in the long run it is a worthy
thing to do.

Thanks.

Post by Lucille
Lucille

Post by Deb
On Sun, 4 Apr 2004 09:57:01 -0400, "Lucille"

Post by Lucille
Sorry Deb but I'm still fighting a very severe case of bronchial

pneumonia.

Post by Deb
{{{{{{{{{{{{hugs}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

Post by Lucille
It's been 3 months and it's still not completely gone. I think smoking
irritates the bronchial tubes as well as trashing the lungs. You might

want

Post by Lucille
to rethink the very, very short term effect of the smoke.

Post by Lucille
Incidentally, I will admit that there was hardly an excuse that I didn't
think of, or use, to stop me from quitting smoking. Again I repeat, it

just

Post by Lucille
aint worth it.

No argument there at all. DH and I quit cold turkey the first of
November last year, but did not "plan" well enough and things were
quite ugly at home and at work within a few weeks. We got so bad, our
bosses who are adamant non-smokers practially ordered us to go have a
cigarette..<wry grin>
We have since discussed it with our doctor, and will be quitting again
very soon, however this time, the doc wants us to use the inhalers
when "things get ugly", and taper down....we are currently in the
"phase down" mode, monitoring when/where we smoke. Next, we started
cutting 3 cigarettes a day on a weekly basis, (cut by 3 of what we
normally smoke on week 1, 3 more on week 2, etc.) When we get to the
point where we are only smoking 4 per day, doc says that's when we
quit.....same effect as the patch, but less expensive.

Post by Lucille
Lucille

Post by Deb
On Sat, 3 Apr 2004 12:14:01 -0500, "Lucille"

Post by Lucille
If you want a short term fix for an asthma attack use Albuterol. It

does

Post by Lucille
have some side effects, as nearly everything in life does, but it's

been

Post by Lucille
used for years and so far research says it won't kill you. It may not

Post by Lucille
a

Post by Lucille
permanent fix, or in some cases not work very well, but smoking will
definitely do you harm and in the long run it just aint worth it.

I agree with you, that smoking is going to harm the lungs. What
you've missed in my discussion, is that so far, smoking has been the
long term "fix" for my asthma. It is ironic, that while it helps my
bronchial tubes, I'm sure it's trashing my lungs.
When I quit smoking the last time, my use of Albuterol went from a 2 -
3 times year basis to several times a day on the inhaler, plus
nebulizer treatments almost daily. It's just ironic.
--
Deb
WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

--
Deb
WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

--
Deb

WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

Darla

2004-04-05 01:52:54 UTC

Post by Deb
will be quitting again
very soon

All my best to you both, Deb. I'm an ex-smoker myself, so I know well
what you're going through. I'll keep you both in my thoughts.
Darla
Sacred cows make great hamburgers.

Linda D.

2004-04-05 06:39:21 UTC

Good luck to all of you on your quest to quit smoking. I wish
that everyone would quit, but preferably never start smoking in the
first place.

My Dad was a heavy smoker, but quit 15 yrs. ago, unfortunately
the damage was already done. He has now been diagnosed with lung
cancer at the age of 79. We are just in the beginning stages of this
journey and will find out more about his condition in the coming
weeks.

I hope all of the smokers realize it can happen to them, so
please, please quite today.

take care, Linda

Post by Deb
will be quitting again
very soon

All my best to you both, Deb. I'm an ex-smoker myself, so I know well
what you're going through. I'll keep you both in my thoughts.
Darla
Sacred cows make great hamburgers.

Deb

2004-04-03 04:18:23 UTC

On Fri, 02 Apr 2004 15:31:37 GMT, mickey

Post by mickey
Deb, could you help me understand what chemical pneumonia is? I have
mild asthma (and have had it my entire life), and I'm a chemist. If
there's a potential of getting pneumonia from chemicals, I want to know
about it!

As it was explained to me....

When exposed to a strong respiratory irritant, the lungs can get
inflamed, and if not treated properly, will start to fill with fluid
with all the earmarks of pneumonia, but no viral or bacterial cause,
it's strictly the irritation. My pulmonologist described it as
similar to a smoke inhalation type of thing, the lungs go into
overdrive and are extremely irritated. If treated properly, with the
correct type of respiratatory and inhalation therapy, for me, it would
possibly have been nothing more than a bad case of bronchitis, but I
wasn't treated by the base's branch clinic doctors, they pretty much
blew me off and claimed it was all in my head or just a bad
bronchitis. This was in July, the *height* of bronchitis season
<tongue firmly planted in cheek>

I was exposed on a Wednesday, into bronchitis by late Thursday, and
had pneumonia and could not breathe by Monday. The pneumonia was not
caused by any virus or bacteria, it was the lungs inability to recover
from the chemically induced irritation. Even the, the branch clinic
doctors just tossed a few antibiotics at me, with a single inhaler and
told me to go to bed for a day or two.

The next year was so bad, I could not walk the 1/2 acre from my porch
to the mailbox and back without stopping to catch my breath. By the
time they finally sent me to the pulmonologist, he was livid, and I
had permanent damage to my lungs.

Post by mickey
As for the smoking helping asthma, while it's certainly not the norm, I
don't think it's entirely unheard of. DH has recently begun smoking

It drives my pulmonologist crazy, when I don't smoke, my airway kicks
into overdrive, when I smoke, my airway doesn't produce as much crud.
I HAVE to quit, I know that, and DH and I are making the plans now.
When I do, I will be well stocked with nebulizer supplies....

Post by mickey
And, hey, you can't do much when you can't breath! So, if smoking help,
I say go for it!

Until I had my first acute asthma attack, I did not truly understand
the terror my son went through when he had his. The problem is,
smoking helps my bronchial tubes, but it's going to play h*** with my
lungs if I don't..DH and I are hoping that mayby after a few years, it
will be better.

Post by mickey
--Mickey
Mansfield, MA
to reply remove "nospam"
mickey18385 at yahoo dot com

--
Deb

WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

mickey

2004-04-04 16:38:57 UTC

Post by Deb
On Fri, 02 Apr 2004 15:31:37 GMT, mickey

As it was explained to me....
When exposed to a strong respiratory irritant, the lungs can get
inflamed, and if not treated properly, will start to fill with fluid
with all the earmarks of pneumonia, but no viral or bacterial cause,
it's strictly the irritation. My pulmonologist described it as
similar to a smoke inhalation type of thing, the lungs go into
overdrive and are extremely irritated. If treated properly, with the
correct type of respiratatory and inhalation therapy, for me, it would
possibly have been nothing more than a bad case of bronchitis, but I
wasn't treated by the base's branch clinic doctors, they pretty much
blew me off and claimed it was all in my head or just a bad
bronchitis. This was in July, the *height* of bronchitis season
<tongue firmly planted in cheek>
I was exposed on a Wednesday, into bronchitis by late Thursday, and
had pneumonia and could not breathe by Monday. The pneumonia was not
caused by any virus or bacteria, it was the lungs inability to recover
from the chemically induced irritation. Even the, the branch clinic
doctors just tossed a few antibiotics at me, with a single inhaler and
told me to go to bed for a day or two.
The next year was so bad, I could not walk the 1/2 acre from my porch
to the mailbox and back without stopping to catch my breath. By the
time they finally sent me to the pulmonologist, he was livid, and I
had permanent damage to my lungs.

Thanks for the explanation. Makes sense to me. And it sounds similar
to a much lesser episode of asthma/bronchitis that I had brough on by
inhaling bromine gas, acidentally of course. I do not recommend that!

Deb, you have my full sympathy. I know when my asthma gets bad I have
to rest after going up a flight of stairs. I simply cannot imagine
having pneumonia for over a year! ((((((HUGS)))))

Post by mickey
As for the smoking helping asthma, while it's certainly not the norm, I
don't think it's entirely unheard of. DH has recently begun smoking

Have you tried some of the newer inhaled drugs for asthma? I'm thinking
of Advair, in particular. It is a combination of 2 drugs - one combats
inflamation and the other combats airway constriction. It's helped both
my mother and I, and a lot of the inhaled steroids make my asthma worse
(go figure!). I'm not a medical professional, but it seems to me that
before you quit smoking, it might be a good idea to be on an effective
drug regimen first. You may have already discussed this with your
doctor(s), though.

Post by mickey
And, hey, you can't do much when you can't breath! So, if smoking help,
I say go for it!

Best of luck!!!

Post by Deb
--
Deb
WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

--Mickey
Mansfield, MA

to reply remove "nospam"
mickey18385 at yahoo dot com

Deb

2004-04-04 19:15:42 UTC

On Sun, 04 Apr 2004 16:38:57 GMT, mickey

Post by mickey
Deb, you have my full sympathy. I know when my asthma gets bad I have
to rest after going up a flight of stairs. I simply cannot imagine
having pneumonia for over a year! ((((((HUGS)))))

I don't think the pneumonia lasted that long, but the effects did. It
was quite depressing, and I was in a huge denial phase. I just
wouldn't admit that there was anything wrong, and kept trying to keep
on as I always had. Drove DH up a wall. Cover my face in cold
weather? Naaaah, I'm fine.....until I can't breath. Other things
like that. DH could tell just by listening to my breathing when I was
coming on an attack, and I finally learned that when he pushed an
inhaler at me, I'd better use it.....especially if I didn't want him
holding me down to make sure I did....

Post by mickey
Have you tried some of the newer inhaled drugs for asthma? I'm thinking

I'm back on Singulair in preparation, but don't want to use the
steroid inhalers if I can help it. The last time, I was on Azmacort,
and the pounds piled on (there were other mitigating circumstances
also, for example depression, quit smoking, no physical acivity and
the cholocate binge from another world)....

Post by mickey
of Advair, in particular. It is a combination of 2 drugs - one combats
inflamation and the other combats airway constriction. It's helped both

If I have to, doc will do it.....<sigh>

Post by mickey
my mother and I, and a lot of the inhaled steroids make my asthma worse
(go figure!). I'm not a medical professional, but it seems to me that
before you quit smoking, it might be a good idea to be on an effective
drug regimen first. You may have already discussed this with your
doctor(s), though.

Ayup. We're laying the ground work now.. He wants me on singulair
again for a full month first.

--
Deb

WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

Rachel Janzen

2004-04-06 01:35:09 UTC

Boy, do I know this feeling well. My asthma is almost completely under
control right now. I have mild exertion asthma, which means if I don't
let myself get giddy on an overcast day and then try to run down the
street, I'm usually okay. I've had a couple bad incidents though. The
worst and most recent was about 8 years ago when I was away at college.
I was living in dorm and eating in the careteria. A good day was a day
that I didn't blow through the daily minimum on my inhaler before noon.
By late afternoon, I was exhausted. I skipped supper a lot that month
because to get to the cafeteria, you went into the basement (student
lounge) and then back up the stairs to the cafeteria. By the time I did
that, picked up my food, etc. and went and sat down, I would be so out
of breath, my food would be cold by the time I could eat. Not to mention
the two flights down the stairs and back up again to get to my room on
the third floor. My mother wonders why I can't stand Lipton SideKicks -
I could make them in the hot pot in my room, and would have that for
supper a lot that summer. Also, being away from my regular doctor, meant
dealing with the campus doctor, who's solution was to prescribe
steriods. Which didn't help. The solution for me was taking a herbal
supplement - can't remember what is was called - phyto something or
other. I got it back under control, and episodes have been much more
manageable ever since.

Rachel

Deb

2004-04-06 02:26:25 UTC

On Tue, 06 Apr 2004 01:35:09 GMT, Rachel Janzen

Post by Rachel Janzen
Boy, do I know this feeling well. My asthma is almost completely under
control right now. I have mild exertion asthma, which means if I don't

Wonderful!

Post by Rachel Janzen
let myself get giddy on an overcast day and then try to run down the
street, I'm usually okay. I've had a couple bad incidents though. The

One of the first attacks DH ever witnessed, we were down at Church
Street in Orlando. It was very cold, and we were walking around with
both sons and DDIL, taking frequent rests at their insistence, since I
was still in pigheaded denial....and I started to cough now and then.
DH kept asking me if I was alright, I kept insisting "I'M FINE!". He
wanted me to use the inhaler. I kept insiting "I'M FINE!". Finally,
as my coughing got worse, he moved us all towards the car to
leave.....and right about the time we got to the car, I went into a
full blown and severe acute attack.

Fortunately, youngest son recognized what was going on with my sudden
choking and flailing about of the arms trying to get to my purse and
get my inhaler out (he had asthma when he was younger) and started
digging for my inhaler, which of course, by that time was not going to
do me a lick of good, and which I also, since I was in full blown
denial at that point, had not brought with me.

Poor DH stood there with a stunned and anguished look on his face, and
I'll never forget it. That look said "what the **** is happening, why
don't I know what to do, and why can't I make this stop for her?"

As it happened, an ambulance was parked right in front of our car, and
the other son, hearing his brother declare "ASTHMA ATTACK! SHE CAN'T
BREATH!", ran up to the rig, pounded on the door and screamed that his
mother was dying of an asthma attack and needed their help. Two of
the most wonderful paramedics came with my best friend, the wonderful
nebulizer.

One started taking my vitals as the other shoved the "pipe" in my
mouth while telling the family what we already knew "she's having an
acute asthma attack".

DH just looked at the paramedic like he was crazy, and practically
yelled at him: "Why are you calling it cute?!? There's not a da**
thing cute about it!".

After that, DH practially does body searches whenever we leave the
house to make sure I have my inhaler with me, and if I cough more than
twice in 10 minutes, insists I use it....

Post by Rachel Janzen
By late afternoon, I was exhausted. I skipped supper a lot that month
because to get to the cafeteria, you went into the basement (student
lounge) and then back up the stairs to the cafeteria. By the time I did

Ooohhhh, how awful.

Post by Rachel Janzen
that, picked up my food, etc. and went and sat down, I would be so out
of breath, my food would be cold by the time I could eat. Not to mention
the two flights down the stairs and back up again to get to my room on
the third floor. My mother wonders why I can't stand Lipton SideKicks -

Ouch. And they didn't have an elevator?

Post by Rachel Janzen
I could make them in the hot pot in my room, and would have that for
supper a lot that summer. Also, being away from my regular doctor, meant
dealing with the campus doctor, who's solution was to prescribe
steriods. Which didn't help. The solution for me was taking a herbal
supplement - can't remember what is was called - phyto something or
other. I got it back under control, and episodes have been much more
manageable ever since.
Rachel

--
Deb

WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

Darla

2004-04-03 16:53:06 UTC

On Fri, 02 Apr 2004 15:31:37 GMT, mickey

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
breath

Just so everyone is clear on the topic:
breath is what you take. (soft th, vowel diphthong rhymes with bet)
breathe is what you do. (hard th, vowel diphthong rhymes with beat)
Darla
Sacred cows make great hamburgers.

Deb

2004-04-04 05:13:56 UTC

Post by Deb
On Fri, 02 Apr 2004 15:31:37 GMT, mickey

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
breath

breath is what you take. (soft th, vowel diphthong rhymes with bet)
breathe is what you do. (hard th, vowel diphthong rhymes with beat)

And, with asthma, sometimes you are doing neither.

--
Deb

WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

mickey

2004-04-04 16:26:33 UTC

Post by Deb
On Fri, 02 Apr 2004 15:31:37 GMT, mickey

Post by Tia Mary-remove nekoluvr to reply
breath

breath is what you take. (soft th, vowel diphthong rhymes with bet)
breathe is what you do. (hard th, vowel diphthong rhymes with beat)
Darla
Sacred cows make great hamburgers.

Absolutely correct, as usual, Darla. My mistake. :-)

--Mickey
Mansfield, MA

to reply remove "nospam"
mickey18385 at yahoo dot com

emerald

2004-04-01 08:28:53 UTC

matter.

What I am interested in is how the ban affects the Irish Parliament.
Presumably Irish MPs ( or whatever they are called) passed the ban, and
presumably the ban must apply in some measure to the Irish Houses of
Parliament. So what I am trying to find out is where Irish MPs now smoke
when they are working around their Parliament Buildings.

Jim,
Irish MPs are called TDs.
Apparently there are three designated smoking areas in the Dail (parliament)
and all members are expected to follw the rules. The opposition's Justice
Spokesman has been relieved of that position after lighting up a few times
in the lounge or bar the other night.

http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/stories.php3?ca=9&si=1155594

hth,
emerald

escapee

2004-04-01 14:00:13 UTC

I saw predictions in that article, but no mention of any scientific study. Only
proposed studies by the NIH.

I'm not saying obesity is good. I'm saying that smoking kills many thouands of
people early. All, for the most part, preventable deaths.

V, there has been a spate of recent research papers about the effects of
obesity, which will overtake smoking as the #1 killer within the next
year. Dianne's not making this up.
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04070/283728.stm
Meredith

"escapee"

You are flat out wrong, Dianne. Obesity is not the number one killer,

nor is it

about to be. It's a lot of hype. If you think you can convince me

fatness

kills more people than does smoking, guess again.

I am not sure about which is the number one killer--but having a fat family
member is unlikely to kill someone else in the household-- living with a
smoker can.
Dawne

Any way you cut it, smoking kills many times more people than does obesity.
Hands down, no contest. It can be rationalized, but it cannot be made untrue.
I have never seen or heard of any study which states fat people die more than
smokers. Maybe fat smokers? I'm no skinny person, that's a fact. I do yoga
and I am in better physical condition than my husband who is the same weight he
was in college. His cholesterol is high, and he has gum disease...smoking and
no exercise. Finally, after me begging him, he stopped smoking. I hope to the
Universe he can stay stopped. I want him around.

Meredith

2004-04-01 17:24:02 UTC

Did you miss the sentence where it says smoking kills 430,000
people/year and obesity kills 400,000 and rising? And they expect
obesity deaths to overtake smoking deaths withing the next year?
http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/collection/obesity

Meredith

Post by escapee
I saw predictions in that article, but no mention of any scientific study. Only
proposed studies by the NIH.
I'm not saying obesity is good. I'm saying that smoking kills many thouands of
people early. All, for the most part, preventable deaths.

"escapee"

You are flat out wrong, Dianne. Obesity is not the number one killer,

nor is it

about to be. It's a lot of hype. If you think you can convince me

fatness

kills more people than does smoking, guess again.

I am not sure about which is the number one killer--but having a fat family
member is unlikely to kill someone else in the household-- living with a
smoker can.
Dawne

Meredith

2004-04-01 17:29:06 UTC

Check out (Journal of Occupational & Environmental Medicine
2004;46:19–25) if you care to do more research.

Post by Meredith
Did you miss the sentence where it says smoking kills 430,000
people/year and obesity kills 400,000 and rising? And they expect
obesity deaths to overtake smoking deaths withing the next year?
http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/collection/obesity
Meredith

V, there has been a spate of recent research papers about the effects
of obesity, which will overtake smoking as the #1 killer within the
next year. Dianne's not making this up.
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04070/283728.stm
Meredith

On Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:58:36 -0600, "Dawne Peterson"

"escapee"

You are flat out wrong, Dianne. Obesity is not the number one killer,

nor is it

about to be. It's a lot of hype. If you think you can convince me

fatness

kills more people than does smoking, guess again.

I am not sure about which is the number one killer--but having a fat family
member is unlikely to kill someone else in the household-- living with a
smoker can.
Dawne

Any way you cut it, smoking kills many times more people than does obesity.
Hands down, no contest. It can be rationalized, but it cannot be made untrue.
I have never seen or heard of any study which states fat people die more than
smokers. Maybe fat smokers? I'm no skinny person, that's a fact.
I do yoga
and I am in better physical condition than my husband who is the same weight he
was in college. His cholesterol is high, and he has gum
disease...smoking and
no exercise. Finally, after me begging him, he stopped smoking. I hope to the
Universe he can stay stopped. I want him around.

Dianne Lewandowski

2004-04-01 19:13:56 UTC

What amuses me about all this is that Swedish Researchers and the CDC
just released data that said [ paraphrased] the chemical in fried foods
that was linked to so many different cancers is now found in a great
many foods, including black olives. AND cigarettes. They also said
that further research into this chemical has shown that it doesn't cause
any cancer whatsoever. So, I guess at least that chemical in cigarettes
doesn't cause cancer. <gg>

The death rates also intrigue me . . . since many of these people would
have died of old age anyway. We look at death rates as if they are
something out of the ordinary. Of course, I don't mean to imply that
someone who dies of cancer at 8 or 30 doesn't constitute a tragedy for
their families. I lost a dear friend to Type I diabetes at the age of
36. It was heart wrenching to say the least. She had been with me
through some pretty tough times and I think of her often.

But we forget the statistics on childhood deaths to burns and disease at
the turn of the 20th century. We always tend to look at death
statistics as if, we only would just do something different, we could
live forever. If only we would eat right, take Lipitor, take Prozac,
take a baby aspirin every day, exercise judiciously, we would not die.

The sad truth is, we are born, we die. One way or another. The cost of
death is a cost we all bear thanks to medical science. It both gives us
a few more years, or prolongs the inevitable in sometimes grueling ways.
I would hate to think of my fate had I been born 100 years ago and
faced what I'm facing now. It would have been years of torture.
Medical science has allowed me more time, and a better quality of life
during that time. I often wonder if all that radiation from the 1940's
and 1950's atomic testing was the culprit behind my disease - since I
was born in a pocket where a lot of it fell to the earth.

We get cancer for many reasons. We get many diseases for many reasons,
sometimes because of our own genetic code. It's just a fact of being
born, the environment we live in - most of which we have no immediate
control. I don't see people up in arms about reckless behavior that
causes untold health care dollars every year. And also can cause direct
consequences to others. The truth is, life is just out of most of our
control whether we like it or not.

Dianne

V, there has been a spate of recent research papers about the effects
of obesity, which will overtake smoking as the #1 killer within the
next year. Dianne's not making this up.
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04070/283728.stm
Meredith

On Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:58:36 -0600, "Dawne Peterson"

"escapee"

You are flat out wrong, Dianne. Obesity is not the number one killer,

nor is it

about to be. It's a lot of hype. If you think you can convince me

fatness

kills more people than does smoking, guess again.

I am not sure about which is the number one killer--but having a fat family
member is unlikely to kill someone else in the household-- living with a
smoker can.
Dawne

Any way you cut it, smoking kills many times more people than does obesity.
Hands down, no contest. It can be rationalized, but it cannot be made untrue.
I have never seen or heard of any study which states fat people die more than
smokers. Maybe fat smokers? I'm no skinny person, that's a fact.
I do yoga
and I am in better physical condition than my husband who is the same weight he
was in college. His cholesterol is high, and he has gum
disease...smoking and
no exercise. Finally, after me begging him, he stopped smoking. I hope to the
Universe he can stay stopped. I want him around.

Johanna Koski

2004-04-01 20:19:07 UTC

Well, I wouldn't put too much weight on Swedish Researchers....
It's not long ago, when Swedish thought that they had Russians'
spying on them in a submarine, in coast of Stocholm... It was
some kind of otter or such... :)

Johanna

--
Johanna Koski
Finland, Europe

Meredith

2004-04-01 20:35:11 UTC

Sorry, I think I overreacted a bit. I've been in a horrible mood this week.

But the thing is, Dianne, these are _preventable_ causes of death, and
that's why there is such a furor.

Meredith

Post by Dianne Lewandowski
What amuses me about all this is that Swedish Researchers and the CDC
just released data that said [ paraphrased] the chemical in fried foods
that was linked to so many different cancers is now found in a great
many foods, including black olives. AND cigarettes. They also said
that further research into this chemical has shown that it doesn't cause
any cancer whatsoever. So, I guess at least that chemical in cigarettes
doesn't cause cancer. <gg>
The death rates also intrigue me . . . since many of these people would
have died of old age anyway. We look at death rates as if they are
something out of the ordinary. Of course, I don't mean to imply that
someone who dies of cancer at 8 or 30 doesn't constitute a tragedy for
their families. I lost a dear friend to Type I diabetes at the age of
36. It was heart wrenching to say the least. She had been with me
through some pretty tough times and I think of her often.
But we forget the statistics on childhood deaths to burns and disease at
the turn of the 20th century. We always tend to look at death
statistics as if, we only would just do something different, we could
live forever. If only we would eat right, take Lipitor, take Prozac,
take a baby aspirin every day, exercise judiciously, we would not die.
The sad truth is, we are born, we die. One way or another. The cost of
death is a cost we all bear thanks to medical science. It both gives us
a few more years, or prolongs the inevitable in sometimes grueling ways.
I would hate to think of my fate had I been born 100 years ago and
faced what I'm facing now. It would have been years of torture. Medical
science has allowed me more time, and a better quality of life during
that time. I often wonder if all that radiation from the 1940's and
1950's atomic testing was the culprit behind my disease - since I was
born in a pocket where a lot of it fell to the earth.
We get cancer for many reasons. We get many diseases for many reasons,
sometimes because of our own genetic code. It's just a fact of being
born, the environment we live in - most of which we have no immediate
control. I don't see people up in arms about reckless behavior that
causes untold health care dollars every year. And also can cause direct
consequences to others. The truth is, life is just out of most of our
control whether we like it or not.
Dianne

Post by escapee
I saw predictions in that article, but no mention of any scientific study. Only
proposed studies by the NIH. I'm not saying obesity is good. I'm
saying that smoking kills many thouands of
people early. All, for the most part, preventable deaths.

V, there has been a spate of recent research papers about the
effects of obesity, which will overtake smoking as the #1 killer
within the next year. Dianne's not making this up.
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04070/283728.stm
Meredith

On Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:58:36 -0600, "Dawne Peterson"

"escapee"

You are flat out wrong, Dianne. Obesity is not the number one killer,

nor is it

about to be. It's a lot of hype. If you think you can convince me

fatness

kills more people than does smoking, guess again.

I am not sure about which is the number one killer--but having a fat family
member is unlikely to kill someone else in the household-- living with a
smoker can.
Dawne

Any way you cut it, smoking kills many times more people than does obesity.
Hands down, no contest. It can be rationalized, but it cannot be made untrue.
I have never seen or heard of any study which states fat people die more than
smokers. Maybe fat smokers? I'm no skinny person, that's a fact.
I do yoga
and I am in better physical condition than my husband who is the same weight he
was in college. His cholesterol is high, and he has gum
disease...smoking and
no exercise. Finally, after me begging him, he stopped smoking. I hope to the
Universe he can stay stopped. I want him around.

Dianne Lewandowski

2004-04-01 22:46:48 UTC

Being a reckless driver is potentially doing serious harm to others.
Nobody worries about it as they speed along 6 inches behind the car in
front of them amongst other obnoxious behaviors. Drinking or other drug
use and driving. Not having a good enough social culture that keeps kids
from doing drugs. Not hiking, rafting, etc. etc. without adequate
safety gear and knowledge. It costs us hundreds of thousands every year
in man hours and medical costs.

Not taking care of the poor adequately costs us untold lives and medical
dollars.

These are all preventable.

Still, the fact is: we are born, we die. Of one thing or another. At
one time or another. Some of it will cost a fortune, some of it will be
sudden, painless and cost little in comparison.

We make choices every day: how we eat, how we drive, how we treat our
fellow man. It can't be legislated. Everything my neighbor does
affects me, from music too loud that affects my hearing, to drinking too
much and smashing into my fence. (Figuratively speaking). We have
chosen to hold up cigarettes as the "evil" while we look the other way
at tons of other evils.

I didn't notice you over reacting. Hugs.

Dianne

Post by Meredith
Sorry, I think I overreacted a bit. I've been in a horrible mood this week.
But the thing is, Dianne, these are _preventable_ causes of death, and
that's why there is such a furor.
Meredith

Post by Dianne Lewandowski
What amuses me about all this is that Swedish Researchers and the CDC
just released data that said [ paraphrased] the chemical in fried
foods that was linked to so many different cancers is now found in a
great many foods, including black olives. AND cigarettes. They also
said that further research into this chemical has shown that it
doesn't cause any cancer whatsoever. So, I guess at least that
chemical in cigarettes doesn't cause cancer. <gg>
The death rates also intrigue me . . . since many of these people
would have died of old age anyway. We look at death rates as if they
are something out of the ordinary. Of course, I don't mean to imply
that someone who dies of cancer at 8 or 30 doesn't constitute a
tragedy for their families. I lost a dear friend to Type I diabetes
at the age of 36. It was heart wrenching to say the least. She had
been with me through some pretty tough times and I think of her often.
But we forget the statistics on childhood deaths to burns and disease
at the turn of the 20th century. We always tend to look at death
statistics as if, we only would just do something different, we could
live forever. If only we would eat right, take Lipitor, take Prozac,
take a baby aspirin every day, exercise judiciously, we would not die.
The sad truth is, we are born, we die. One way or another. The cost
of death is a cost we all bear thanks to medical science. It both
gives us a few more years, or prolongs the inevitable in sometimes
grueling ways. I would hate to think of my fate had I been born 100
years ago and faced what I'm facing now. It would have been years of
torture. Medical science has allowed me more time, and a better
quality of life during that time. I often wonder if all that
radiation from the 1940's and 1950's atomic testing was the culprit
behind my disease - since I was born in a pocket where a lot of it
fell to the earth.
We get cancer for many reasons. We get many diseases for many
reasons, sometimes because of our own genetic code. It's just a fact
of being born, the environment we live in - most of which we have no
immediate control. I don't see people up in arms about reckless
behavior that causes untold health care dollars every year. And also
can cause direct consequences to others. The truth is, life is just
out of most of our control whether we like it or not.
Dianne

Post by escapee
I saw predictions in that article, but no mention of any scientific study. Only
proposed studies by the NIH. I'm not saying obesity is good. I'm
saying that smoking kills many thouands of
people early. All, for the most part, preventable deaths.

V, there has been a spate of recent research papers about the
effects of obesity, which will overtake smoking as the #1 killer
within the next year. Dianne's not making this up.
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04070/283728.stm
Meredith

On Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:58:36 -0600, "Dawne Peterson"

"escapee"

You are flat out wrong, Dianne. Obesity is not the number one killer,

nor is it

about to be. It's a lot of hype. If you think you can convince me

fatness

kills more people than does smoking, guess again.

I am not sure about which is the number one killer--but having a fat family
member is unlikely to kill someone else in the household-- living with a
smoker can.
Dawne

Any way you cut it, smoking kills many times more people than does obesity.
Hands down, no contest. It can be rationalized, but it cannot be made untrue.
I have never seen or heard of any study which states fat people die more than
smokers. Maybe fat smokers? I'm no skinny person, that's a fact. I do yoga
and I am in better physical condition than my husband who is the same weight he
was in college. His cholesterol is high, and he has gum
disease...smoking and
no exercise. Finally, after me begging him, he stopped smoking.
I hope to the
Universe he can stay stopped. I want him around.

F.James Cripwell

2004-04-01 20:41:51 UTC

Dianne Lewandowski (***@heritageshoppe.com) writes:
(snip)

Post by Dianne Lewandowski
The truth is, life is just out of most of our
control whether we like it or not.
Dianne

I saw this and for some reason it reminded me of a bit of doggerel I
learned many years ago. Very tongue in cheek, and I hope people find it
amusing.

Left to itself, the lamp of life may flicker,
At worst the patient sinks in slow decline.
The doctor merely takes him by a quicker route,
And puts him underground before his time.
--
Jim Cripwell.
The gods do not subtract from the allotted span of one's life, any
time that is spent in stitching.
Adapted from a sign on The Cobb, Lyme Regis, England.

Ruthie

2004-04-01 23:16:51 UTC

Post by F.James Cripwell
Left to itself, the lamp of life may flicker,
At worst the patient sinks in slow decline.
The doctor merely takes him by a quicker route,
And puts him underground before his time.

Reminds me of Dorothy Parker's

"Life is a glorious cycle of song,
A medley of extemporanea;
And love is a thing that can never go wrong;
- and I am Marie of Roumania!"

Ruthie in Colorado
alowan atty earthlink dotty net

Jan Lennie

2004-04-01 23:59:04 UTC

Or one my dad loved to quote 'It wasn't the cough that carried 'im off , but
the coffin they carried 'im off in !!!
Jan

Post by Ruthie

Reminds me of Dorothy Parker's
"Life is a glorious cycle of song,
A medley of extemporanea;
And love is a thing that can never go wrong;
- and I am Marie of Roumania!"
Ruthie in Colorado
alowan atty earthlink dotty net

Linda D.

2004-04-01 22:19:12 UTC

Dianne, you've said it very well :) I believe in destiny and
what will happen 'will happen'. I don't currently have a lot of faith
in the medical profession. A friend of mine had been seeing her Dr.
and had mentioned how tired she was, etc. He diagnosed it as
'lifestyle'. Yeah, right...when they finally did tests she was two
years into a 5 yr. disease. She has gone through a year and a half of
he**. But we are happy she is still with us.

I went to my Dr. on Wed. for a Pap test, I mentioned I was
sure my blood pressure was very high. He said he was behind and
didn't have time to check it. I then mentioned I had been having
problems with my left arm. He said I should make another appointment
and he would check these things out. Would you believe I then went to
a local drug store and checked my blood pressure...uh huh...170 over
99! Yes, just a little high (snort) .so now what do I just go to
emergency and say 'do something because my Dr. won't!"

Arggghhhhhhh!!!! I really feel that some issues about my
health are out of my control :(

take care, Linda :)
(who guesses she better make that other appointment soon)

On Thu, 01 Apr 2004 13:13:56 -0600, Dianne Lewandowski

<snipped>
The sad truth is, we are born, we die. One way or another. The cost of
death is a cost we all bear thanks to medical science. It both gives us
a few more years, or prolongs the inevitable in sometimes grueling ways.
I would hate to think of my fate had I been born 100 years ago and
faced what I'm facing now. It would have been years of torture.
Medical science has allowed me more time, and a better quality of life
during that time. I often wonder if all that radiation from the 1940's
and 1950's atomic testing was the culprit behind my disease - since I
was born in a pocket where a lot of it fell to the earth.
We get cancer for many reasons. We get many diseases for many reasons,
sometimes because of our own genetic code. It's just a fact of being
born, the environment we live in - most of which we have no immediate
control. I don't see people up in arms about reckless behavior that
causes untold health care dollars every year. And also can cause direct
consequences to others. The truth is, life is just out of most of our
control whether we like it or not.
Dianne

Dianne Lewandowski

2004-04-01 22:55:07 UTC

Well, I'm not sure I'd leave it all up to "destiny". (huge grin)

Finding the right doctor is something you *do* have control over. I
don't stay with a doctor who won't listen. That doesn't mean doctor's
know everything. They don't. But if they take me seriously, go over
test results and tell me what else they might pursue, then they have my
vote. If they dismiss me, I don't go back.

Now, that can be a problem if you are in some HMO's. And in some PPO's,
it can get very expensive. So, if you're on a tight budget, you may
have to do some soul searching. But don't stay with a doctor who won't
listen. That's what he gets the big bucks for.

Hugs to you. 170 over 99 doesn't sound right - but it could be for
something other than high blood pressure. Thyroid disease causes this
as well. So, find another doctor.

Dianne

Post by Linda D.
Dianne, you've said it very well :) I believe in destiny and
what will happen 'will happen'. I don't currently have a lot of faith
in the medical profession. A friend of mine had been seeing her Dr.
and had mentioned how tired she was, etc. He diagnosed it as
'lifestyle'. Yeah, right...when they finally did tests she was two
years into a 5 yr. disease. She has gone through a year and a half of
he**. But we are happy she is still with us.
I went to my Dr. on Wed. for a Pap test, I mentioned I was
sure my blood pressure was very high. He said he was behind and
didn't have time to check it. I then mentioned I had been having
problems with my left arm. He said I should make another appointment
and he would check these things out. Would you believe I then went to
a local drug store and checked my blood pressure...uh huh...170 over
99! Yes, just a little high (snort) .so now what do I just go to
emergency and say 'do something because my Dr. won't!"
Arggghhhhhhh!!!! I really feel that some issues about my
health are out of my control :(

emerald

2004-04-02 01:09:33 UTC

X-No-Archive: yes

Post by Dianne Lewandowski
So, find another doctor.

It's not quite that simple, Dianne. Many family doctors in this area (I live
about 25 miles from Linda) are not taking any new patients, because they
simply can't accommodate them, time-wise. For most people, switching is not
an easy option.

I don't know if Linda's doctor's office does this but mine always asks for
the purpose of the visit. If you list off a number of concerns they will
give you a longer appointment than if you mention only one.

emerald

Karen C - California

2004-04-02 03:38:39 UTC

Post by emerald
Many family doctors in this area (I live
about 25 miles from Linda) are not taking any new patients

When we first moved here, my employer gave me the health insurance book, and I
asked DH's sister go through it and mark every doctor within a couple miles of
home and a couple miles of work. We called every one of them, and not one was
taking new patients. The insurance company suggested two doctors who were
taking patients: one an hour east of here and one an hour west of here.

So, it's not just your area.

And it's also not just family doctors. There are two specialists whom I've
been calling since 1991, and neither is ever taking new patients when I call.

--
Finished 3/17/04 -- Elmo
WIP: Fireman's Prayer, Amid Amish Life, Angel of Autumn, Calif Sampler, Holiday
Snowglobe

Paralegal - Writer - Editor - Researcher
http://hometown.aol.com/kmc528/KMC.html

Dianne Lewandowski

2004-04-02 14:06:34 UTC

That is truly a dilemma, then. I've fired two doctors this past year.
:-) I'm having to wait for insurance "approval" for another - will have
to travel 2 hours to see her, and it will cost me a bundle. A bundle we
don't have. But if you're sick, ya gotta be able to work with the
professional caring for you. We're going to take these "extra" measures.

But as you say: if you can't even get in to "see" one . . . you're in a
pickle. I will have Linda in my thoughts in the coming weeks, hoping
she gets "in" and gets "diagnosed". Her symptoms are nothing to fool
with. Been there. Been ignored. Been wrongly diagnosed. Been
dismissed summarily. So-called migrains aren't migrains.
Dianne

Post by emerald
X-No-Archive: yes

Post by Dianne Lewandowski
So, find another doctor.

It's not quite that simple, Dianne. Many family doctors in this area (I live
about 25 miles from Linda) are not taking any new patients, because they
simply can't accommodate them, time-wise. For most people, switching is not
an easy option.
I don't know if Linda's doctor's office does this but mine always asks for
the purpose of the visit. If you list off a number of concerns they will
give you a longer appointment than if you mention only one.
emerald

Linda D.

2004-04-02 16:07:32 UTC

In response to Emerald's comments. When I made the
appointment I didn't think to mention that I would like my blood
pressure taken because in the past the Dr. has *always* taken my blood
pressure. When I went on Wed. the Dr. even said, "I usually check
your blood pressure and do a breast exam at these appointments, but
I'm behind today, so you will have to make another appointment." I
said, "Okay, but I'm pretty sure my blood pressure is very, very high,
and I've been having a problem with my left arm." He just repeated
that I would need another appointment. Wouldn't one think that my
comments would indicate he should take the extra 2 min. to do the
blood pressure. Heck I'd already waited a 1/2 hr. past my appointment
time, what's another 2 min.?

Thanks for the reminder about the migraine I had two weeks
ago. I guess it was a migraine 'cause I have never experienced the
same kind of pain from a headache before. I felt nauseated and when I
got home from work went to bed, but the pain was so bad it took me
over an hour to get to sleep.

Btw, Dianne you mentioned thryroid problems, they tested me
for that a few years ago, but nope, at least it wasn't a problem back
then.

take care, Linda :)

On Fri, 02 Apr 2004 08:06:34 -0600, Dianne Lewandowski

Post by Dianne Lewandowski
That is truly a dilemma, then. I've fired two doctors this past year.
:-) I'm having to wait for insurance "approval" for another - will have
to travel 2 hours to see her, and it will cost me a bundle. A bundle we
don't have. But if you're sick, ya gotta be able to work with the
professional caring for you. We're going to take these "extra" measures.
But as you say: if you can't even get in to "see" one . . . you're in a
pickle. I will have Linda in my thoughts in the coming weeks, hoping
she gets "in" and gets "diagnosed". Her symptoms are nothing to fool
with. Been there. Been ignored. Been wrongly diagnosed. Been
dismissed summarily. So-called migrains aren't migrains.
Dianne

Post by emerald
X-No-Archive: yes

Post by Dianne Lewandowski
So, find another doctor.

It's not quite that simple, Dianne. Many family doctors in this area (I live
about 25 miles from Linda) are not taking any new patients, because they
simply can't accommodate them, time-wise. For most people, switching is not
an easy option.
I don't know if Linda's doctor's office does this but mine always asks for
the purpose of the visit. If you list off a number of concerns they will
give you a longer appointment than if you mention only one.
emerald

Meredith

2004-04-02 17:38:55 UTC

Nausea can definitely be a symptom of migraines - happens to me often.
When I get one, it usually feels like there's a nail being driven into
my temple and my stomach gets upset.

Meredith

Post by Linda D.
In response to Emerald's comments. When I made the
appointment I didn't think to mention that I would like my blood
pressure taken because in the past the Dr. has *always* taken my blood
pressure. When I went on Wed. the Dr. even said, "I usually check
your blood pressure and do a breast exam at these appointments, but
I'm behind today, so you will have to make another appointment." I
said, "Okay, but I'm pretty sure my blood pressure is very, very high,
and I've been having a problem with my left arm." He just repeated
that I would need another appointment. Wouldn't one think that my
comments would indicate he should take the extra 2 min. to do the
blood pressure. Heck I'd already waited a 1/2 hr. past my appointment
time, what's another 2 min.?
Thanks for the reminder about the migraine I had two weeks
ago. I guess it was a migraine 'cause I have never experienced the
same kind of pain from a headache before. I felt nauseated and when I
got home from work went to bed, but the pain was so bad it took me
over an hour to get to sleep.
Btw, Dianne you mentioned thryroid problems, they tested me
for that a few years ago, but nope, at least it wasn't a problem back
then.
take care, Linda :)
On Fri, 02 Apr 2004 08:06:34 -0600, Dianne Lewandowski

Post by emerald
X-No-Archive: yes

Post by Dianne Lewandowski
So, find another doctor.

It's not quite that simple, Dianne. Many family doctors in this area (I live
about 25 miles from Linda) are not taking any new patients, because they
simply can't accommodate them, time-wise. For most people, switching is not
an easy option.
I don't know if Linda's doctor's office does this but mine always asks for
the purpose of the visit. If you list off a number of concerns they will
give you a longer appointment than if you mention only one.
emerald

Deb

2004-04-03 04:23:58 UTC

Post by Meredith
Nausea can definitely be a symptom of migraines - happens to me often.
When I get one, it usually feels like there's a nail being driven into
my temple and my stomach gets upset.

Ever had them so bad that banging your head against something helps?
I was having one of those when the ER doc wanted to try something
new....instead of Demerol, would I be willing to try something that
he'd just read about? Heck, he could have amputated at the neck if it
would have stopped it, and I told him so.

Compazine. Wonderful, wonderful compazine. When I get the head
bangers, I take 30 - 40 mg of compazine, go to sleep and it's gone
(not just lurking, but the cycle broken) when I wake up.

Post by Meredith
Meredith

Post by emerald
X-No-Archive: yes

Post by Dianne Lewandowski
So, find another doctor.

It's not quite that simple, Dianne. Many family doctors in this area (I live
about 25 miles from Linda) are not taking any new patients, because they
simply can't accommodate them, time-wise. For most people, switching is not
an easy option.
I don't know if Linda's doctor's office does this but mine always asks for
the purpose of the visit. If you list off a number of concerns they will
give you a longer appointment than if you mention only one.
emerald

--
Deb

WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

Karen C - California

2004-04-03 19:35:57 UTC

Post by Deb
Ever had them so bad that banging your head against something helps?

Yes! Most of the three months that we lived in Redding. May be the only time
a husband has lost his job and his wife has been ecstatic.

--
Finished 3/17/04 -- Elmo
WIP: Fireman's Prayer, Amid Amish Life, Angel of Autumn, Calif Sampler, Holiday
Snowglobe

Paralegal - Writer - Editor - Researcher
http://hometown.aol.com/kmc528/KMC.html

Seanette Blaylock

2004-04-03 23:37:35 UTC

Post by Karen C - California

Post by Deb
Ever had them so bad that banging your head against something helps?

Yes! Most of the three months that we lived in Redding. May be the only time
a husband has lost his job and his wife has been ecstatic.

Should I remember this story?

--
"Don't mess with major appliances unless you know what you are doing
(or unless your life insurance policy is up-to-date)." - John, RCFL

Deb

2004-04-04 05:15:56 UTC

Post by Karen C - California

Post by Deb
Ever had them so bad that banging your head against something helps?

Yes! Most of the three months that we lived in Redding. May be the only time
a husband has lost his job and his wife has been ecstatic.

DH could not understand it, and would try to stop me. On the last
migraine trip to the ER, when the doc turned me on to the compazine
treatment, I was whacking the head against the wall next to the
gurney..The doc walked in, stopped and just looked for a minute, then
turned to DH and said "So, she's at about 12 on the scale of 1 - 10,
right?"

--
Deb

WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

Dianne Lewandowski

2004-04-02 18:35:26 UTC

You are in my thoughts. Diseases can "hide". Blood tests aren't
infallable. Ask me how I know that. <grin> Hugs and hugs and hugs
until you know for sure. May it be benign and easily treated.

Yeah, I would have been miffed at that doctor. Hope you get in soon.

Dianne

Post by emerald
X-No-Archive: yes

Post by Dianne Lewandowski
So, find another doctor.

It's not quite that simple, Dianne. Many family doctors in this area (I live
about 25 miles from Linda) are not taking any new patients, because they
simply can't accommodate them, time-wise. For most people, switching is not
an easy option.
I don't know if Linda's doctor's office does this but mine always asks for
the purpose of the visit. If you list off a number of concerns they will
give you a longer appointment than if you mention only one.
emerald

Deb

2004-04-03 04:21:54 UTC

At my doctor, while he is still in with the previous patient, the
nurse takes my bp and vitals as soon as I'm in the exam room....

Post by Linda D.
that I would need another appointment. Wouldn't one think that my
comments would indicate he should take the extra 2 min. to do the
blood pressure. Heck I'd already waited a 1/2 hr. past my appointment
time, what's another 2 min.?

Agreed. For that matter, why can't his nurse or aid take it when they
get you into the room?

Post by Linda D.
ago. I guess it was a migraine 'cause I have never experienced the
same kind of pain from a headache before. I felt nauseated and when I
got home from work went to bed, but the pain was so bad it took me
over an hour to get to sleep.

Sounds like one to me (nausea). Did you also have sensitivity to
light?

--
Deb

WIP: How Great Thou Art (Leisure Arts Best Loved Hymns II)
EarthDancer (Butternut Road)

Darla

2004-04-03 17:03:47 UTC

Isn't there a nurse or some other qualified assistant who does that
stuff for the doctor? Even at Kaiser we get all of that (BP, pulse,
temp, weight, among other things) before we're taken to an exam room.
Darla
Sacred cows make great hamburgers.

Linda D.

2004-04-03 22:07:22 UTC

No, there isn't a nurse or aid. The only thing the 'nurse'
does is prep the examination room, and put whatever it is the Dr.
needs on a metal tray, that's it. I've never had my temperature taken
at the Dr.'s office, and have only once had them check my weight and
height.

take care, Linda :)

Post by Darla
Isn't there a nurse or some other qualified assistant who does that
stuff for the doctor? Even at Kaiser we get all of that (BP, pulse,
temp, weight, among other things) before we're taken to an exam room.
Darla
Sacred cows make great hamburgers.

clancy

2004-04-02 02:40:34 UTC

You're very lucky Dianne to be able to pick and choose your doctors ....
some of us are not that fortunate. If we do have a family doctor, we
consider ourselves very lucky. We have a terrible shortage of doctors here
in New Brunswick - many people are without doctors and depend on after-hour
clinics and emergency rooms to be taken care of no matter what the problem.
It's much too easy for someone to say 'find the right doctor, if you don't
like him/her, go to someone else' ... there is no one else. So before you
go passing out advice like that (okay, not your exact words), stop and think
that many people are not so lucky as you are apparently.

Sharon (N.B.)
............................................................................
.......

Post by Dianne Lewandowski
Well, I'm not sure I'd leave it all up to "destiny". (huge grin)
Finding the right doctor is something you *do* have control over. I
don't stay with a doctor who won't listen. That doesn't mean doctor's
know everything. They don't. But if they take me seriously, go over
test results and tell me what else they might pursue, then they have my
vote. If they dismiss me, I don't go back.
Now, that can be a problem if you are in some HMO's. And in some PPO's,
it can get very expensive. So, if you're on a tight budget, you may
have to do some soul searching. But don't stay with a doctor who won't
listen. That's what he gets the big bucks for.
Hugs to you. 170 over 99 doesn't sound right - but it could be for
something other than high blood pressure. Thyroid disease causes this
as well. So, find another doctor.
Dianne

Dianne Lewandowski

2004-04-02 14:09:01 UTC

I did say that it is not always easy. I apologize if I sounded
"dismissive." See my other post on this subject. :-)
Dianne

Post by clancy
You're very lucky Dianne to be able to pick and choose your doctors ....
some of us are not that fortunate. If we do have a family doctor, we
consider ourselves very lucky. We have a terrible shortage of doctors here
in New Brunswick - many people are without doctors and depend on after-hour
clinics and emergency rooms to be taken care of no matter what the problem.
It's much too easy for someone to say 'find the right doctor, if you don't
like him/her, go to someone else' ... there is no one else. So before you
go passing out advice like that (okay, not your exact words), stop and think
that many people are not so lucky as you are apparently.
Sharon (N.B.)
............................................................................
.......

Linda D.

2004-04-02 07:24:35 UTC

I would love to find another Dr., but would you believe there
is not a single Dr. in our city taking new patients? People who move
here are having to find Dr.'s in other towns in order to have a family
Dr. at all. It's crazy! Btw, if you recall I live in Canada, so
that's how great our health system is :(

take care, Linda :)

On Thu, 01 Apr 2004 16:55:07 -0600, Dianne Lewandowski

escapee

2004-04-03 00:17:57 UTC

Get rid of that doctor immediately.

COL. BILL KILGORE

2004-04-03 20:59:04 UTC

You are flat out wrong, Dianne. Obesity is not the number one killer, nor is it
about to be. It's a lot of hype. If you think you can convince me fatness
kills more people than does smoking, guess again.

.....and a 200-pounder like yourself should know.

emer

2004-04-05 13:06:40 UTC

From my previous posts, some rctners will recognize that I have a
considerable interest in smoking bans. The latest, coming into force
today, is the one in Ireland. As has been noted many times, passing the
legislation is the easy part; enforcing it is an entirely different matter.
What I am interested in is how the ban affects the Irish Parliament.
Presumably Irish MPs ( or whatever they are called) passed the ban, and
presumably the ban must apply in some measure to the Irish Houses of
Parliament. So what I am trying to find out is where Irish MPs now smoke
when they are working around their Parliament Buildings.
I gathered the other day what Canadian MPs have to do. Apparently
their is a private entrance at the back of The Houses of Parliament,
reserved for MPs in some form or other. Between the entrance and the road
is a canvas awning. When MPs want to smoke they huddle under the awning
close the the entrance in all Canadian weather. Apparently this is a good
place for members of the media to go, when they would like to get
off-the-record comments from MPs.
So, are there any rctners who live in Ireland, and/or who know how to
answer my question? How does the smoking ban in Ireland affect Irish
Members of Parliament when they are in their Houses of Parliament?

Hi Jim greetings from Ireland.

Regarding the houses of parliment or Dail Eireann. There is a no
smoking policy in place which restrict smoking in enclosed work
environments. The Dail is no different and smokers must leave the
building in order to enjoy a cigarette. There was an opposition TD
(mp to you) who lost his portfolio for insisting on smoking in the bar
on the Dail after the ban came into place. The enforcement will be
the key as the onus is on the business owner to enforce the ban and
they are subject to a fine is caught out. There will be lines of
people outside pubs and nite clubs smoking and publicans chave
reported a 30% drop in takings on the previous weekends takings which
was an unfair weekend to use as that was a big sporting weekend
(ireland won the rugby triple crown). It will be interesting to see
if it is enforced. The general wish is that it will be self policing
and making it a health and safety issue puts it on a different
footing.
Any further questions on it i will be glad to answer.
Emer

F.James Cripwell

2004-04-05 15:40:01 UTC