Discovery of a royal Anglo-Saxon cemetery in NE England

[Peter Alaca]

"A real gem of a find

A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.

The 109 burials arranged in a rectangular pattern and
dating from around the middle of the Seventh Century,
have been unearthed on farmland near Loftus on Teesside.

"This is the only known Anglo-Saxon royal burial site in
the North of England. It is the most dramatic find of
Anglo-Saxon material for generations - certainly something
to get Beowulf excited about," said Robin Daniels,
archaeological officer with Hartlepool-based Teesside
Archaeology.

What is mystifying archaeologists is that the sumptuous
gems are all of a style found in the south of England.
The speculation is that the royals buried on Teesside are
linked to the Kentish princess Ethelburga, who travelled
north to marry Edwin, King of Northumbria."

Read more
<http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-east-news/todays-news/2007/11/20/a-real-gem-of-a-find-61634-20131683/>

[Matt Giwer]

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.

Have I missed something or were not the Anglo-Saxons two different peoples?

[John Briggs]

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.

Have I missed something or were not the Anglo-Saxons two different peoples?

You missed something :-)

[sprocket]

Post by John Briggs

Post by Matt Giwer
Have I missed something or were not the Anglo-Saxons two different peoples?

You missed something :-)

Don't remind him of the Jutes... he'll think they are Hebrutes...

[Matt Giwer]

Post by John Briggs

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.

Have I missed something or were not the Anglo-Saxons two different peoples?

You missed something :-)

Which is? How many kinds of Saxons were there?

[Peter Alaca]

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by John Briggs

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.

Have I missed something or were not the Anglo-Saxons two different peoples?

You missed something :-)

Which is? How many kinds of Saxons were there?

Depends on your timeframe
Saxons, East-Saxons, West-Saxons, Anglo-Saxons, Lower-Saxons

[Renia]

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by John Briggs

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.

Have I missed something or were not the Anglo-Saxons two different peoples?

You missed something :-)

Which is? How many kinds of Saxons were there?

Depends on your timeframe
Saxons, East-Saxons, West-Saxons, Anglo-Saxons, Lower-Saxons

And Middle Saxons

[David Rorer]

Post by Renia

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by John Briggs

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.

Have I missed something or were not the Anglo-Saxons two different peoples?

You missed something :-)

Which is? How many kinds of Saxons were there?

Depends on your timeframe
Saxons, East-Saxons, West-Saxons, Anglo-Saxons, Lower-Saxons

And Middle Saxons

Don't forget the little known and short lived kingdom of the North Saxons -
known as Nosex!

[John Briggs]

Post by David Rorer

Post by Renia

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by John Briggs

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.

Have I missed something or were not the Anglo-Saxons two
different peoples?

You missed something :-)

Which is? How many kinds of Saxons were there?

Depends on your timeframe
Saxons, East-Saxons, West-Saxons, Anglo-Saxons, Lower-Saxons

And Middle Saxons

Don't forget the little known and short lived kingdom of the North
Saxons - known as Nosex!

I thought they were really British? (But polite...)

[John Briggs]

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by John Briggs

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.

Have I missed something or were not the Anglo-Saxons two different peoples?

You missed something :-)

Which is? How many kinds of Saxons were there?

Depends on your timeframe
Saxons, East-Saxons, West-Saxons, Anglo-Saxons, Lower-Saxons

The West Saxons didn't actually exist - they invented themselves later. But
more fundamentally, the founding myth that there were Angles, Saxons and
Jutes is just that - a myth. There may have been something different about
the "Jutes", but there was in reality no tidy division into Angles and
Saxons, which seem to be labels adopted more or less at random. Whether the
disparate settlers thought of themselves as Angles or Saxons, they had no
doubt that they all spoke "Angle-ish" - but the neighbours were convinced
that we were all "Saxons" (Sassenach, Seis).

[Matt Giwer]

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by John Briggs

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.

Have I missed something or were not the Anglo-Saxons two different peoples?

You missed something :-)

Which is? How many kinds of Saxons were there?

Depends on your timeframe
Saxons, East-Saxons, West-Saxons, Anglo-Saxons, Lower-Saxons

If I were to ask how many kinds of Americans there are and you started listing
states would that be any different from your answer?

And as the original post made a point of the geographic distance of this
particular A-S find how does that fit with all these variations you propose?
Would they not be Upper-Saxons instead of Anglo-Saxons?

[Hovite]

Post by Matt Giwer
Would they not be Upper-Saxons instead of Anglo-Saxons?

Upper and Lower refer to elevation, whereas Anglo-Saxons usually named
themselves by reference to direction: West Saxons, South Saxons, North
Folk, South Folk, East Angles, East Saxons, Middle Angles, Middle
Saxons. The area North of the Humber wasn't Upper Anything, it was
(and part still is) Northumbria or Northumberland:

"It was called "North - Humber - Land" simply because it was the land
north of the Humber (river). ... Northumberland was at its largest
extent in the 7th century when it stretched from the River Humber in
the south to Edinburgh and the River Forth."

http://www.northumberland.gov.uk/vg/name-of-county.html

[Matt Giwer]

Post by Hovite

Post by Matt Giwer
Would they not be Upper-Saxons instead of Anglo-Saxons?

Upper and Lower refer to elevation,

In my experience upper most always refers to up stream as North was not up
before compass times.

But my point was the article made a point of this find being far removed. That
there were many kinds of Saxons does not compute.

Post by Hovite
whereas Anglo-Saxons usually named
themselves by reference to direction: West Saxons, South Saxons, North
Folk, South Folk, East Angles, East Saxons, Middle Angles, Middle
Saxons. The area North of the Humber wasn't Upper Anything, it was

So there you mention both Angles and Saxons. That is where I came in.

Post by Hovite
"It was called "North - Humber - Land" simply because it was the land
north of the Humber (river). ... Northumberland was at its largest
extent in the 7th century when it stretched from the River Humber in
the south to Edinburgh and the River Forth."
http://www.northumberland.gov.uk/vg/name-of-county.html

[Hovite]

Post by Matt Giwer
In my experience upper most always refers to up stream as North was not up
before compass times.

It is possible to work out North, South, East, West without a compass.

Post by Matt Giwer
But my point was the article made a point of this find being far removed.

Britain is smaller than Oregon.

That

Post by Matt Giwer
there were many kinds of Saxons does not compute.

There were a dozen or so kingdoms at one time, later three, then one.
Therefore there were different kinds of Saxons, in the same way as
there are different kinds of Americans in different states.

Post by Matt Giwer
So there you mention both Angles and Saxons. That is where I came in.

Well, that comes from a Christian monk named Bede:

'Bede states that the people of the Angles or Saxons came from three
strong Germanic tribes, the Angles, the Saxons, and the Jutes. There
were doubtless many other peoples involved: Bede himself gives a
longer list towards the end of his History (V.ix), naming the
Frisians, the Rugini, the Danes, the Huns, the Old Saxons and the
Boructari (probabaly Franks); a 6th-century Byzantine historian,
Procopius, thought that Britain was inhabited by Britons, Angles, and
Frisians. But the fact that contemporaries tended to refer to them
indiscriminately as "the Angles" or "the Saxons" suggests that these
two groups were predominant. The compound "Anglo-Saxon" appears in
some Continental sources as a vague synonym of "Angles" or "Saxons",
or as a term to differentiate the Saxons in Britain from those on the
Continent, but it is introduced in England as a term meaning "all of
the English" at King Alfred's court at the end of the 9th century.'

http://www.anglo-saxons.net/hwaet/?do=seek&query=450-550

[Peter Alaca]

Post by Hovite

Post by Matt Giwer
In my experience upper most always refers to up stream as North was not up
before compass times.

It is possible to work out North, South, East, West without a
compass.

Post by Matt Giwer
But my point was the article made a point of this find being far removed.

Britain is smaller than Oregon.
That

Post by Matt Giwer
there were many kinds of Saxons does not compute.

There were a dozen or so kingdoms at one time, later three, then one.
Therefore there were different kinds of Saxons, in the same way as
there are different kinds of Americans in different states.

Post by Matt Giwer
So there you mention both Angles and Saxons. That is where I came in.

'Bede states that the people of the Angles or Saxons came from three
strong Germanic tribes, the Angles, the Saxons, and the Jutes. There
were doubtless many other peoples involved: Bede himself gives a
longer list towards the end of his History (V.ix), naming the
Frisians, the Rugini, the Danes, the Huns, the Old Saxons and the
Boructari (probabaly Franks); a 6th-century Byzantine historian,
Procopius, thought that Britain was inhabited by Britons, Angles, and
Frisians. But the fact that contemporaries tended to refer to them
indiscriminately as "the Angles" or "the Saxons" suggests that these
two groups were predominant. The compound "Anglo-Saxon" appears in
some Continental sources as a vague synonym of "Angles" or "Saxons",
or as a term to differentiate the Saxons in Britain from those on the
Continent, but it is introduced in England as a term meaning "all of
the English" at King Alfred's court at the end of the 9th century.'
http://www.anglo-saxons.net/hwaet/?do=seek&query=450-550

Bede is online available
http://www.fordham.edu/Halsall/basis/bede-book1.html

[Matt Giwer]

Post by Hovite

Post by Matt Giwer
In my experience upper most always refers to up stream as North was not up
before compass times.

It is possible to work out North, South, East, West without a compass.

It is not possible to assign an up until the map convention of north being the
top of the map appears. That is rather late.

Post by Hovite

Post by Matt Giwer
But my point was the article made a point of this find being far removed.

Britain is smaller than Oregon.

Does not matter how big it is geographic defines the type of Saxons.

Post by Hovite

Post by Matt Giwer
That
there were many kinds of Saxons does not compute.

There were a dozen or so kingdoms at one time, later three, then one.
Therefore there were different kinds of Saxons, in the same way as
there are different kinds of Americans in different states.

So tell me how one determines ANGLO-Saxons in widely disparate locations if the
ANGLO part is a geographic designator.

Post by Hovite

Post by Matt Giwer
So there you mention both Angles and Saxons. That is where I came in.

As long as the source is to an expert in ethology ...

Post by Hovite
'Bede states that the people of the Angles or Saxons came from three
strong Germanic tribes, the Angles, the Saxons, and the Jutes. There
were doubtless many other peoples involved: Bede himself gives a
longer list towards the end of his History (V.ix), naming the
Frisians, the Rugini, the Danes, the Huns, the Old Saxons and the
Boructari (probabaly Franks); a 6th-century Byzantine historian,
Procopius, thought that Britain was inhabited by Britons, Angles, and
Frisians. But the fact that contemporaries tended to refer to them
indiscriminately as "the Angles" or "the Saxons" suggests that these
two groups were predominant. The compound "Anglo-Saxon" appears in
some Continental sources as a vague synonym of "Angles" or "Saxons",
or as a term to differentiate the Saxons in Britain from those on the
Continent, but it is introduced in England as a term meaning "all of
the English" at King Alfred's court at the end of the 9th century.'
http://www.anglo-saxons.net/hwaet/?do=seek&query=450-550

[Hovite]

Post by Matt Giwer
It is not possible to assign an up until the map convention of north being the
top of the map appears. That is rather late.

Then why did you mention "Upper" at all? You appear to have introduced
an irrelevance for the sole purpose of confusing yourself.

Post by Matt Giwer
So tell me how one determines ANGLO-Saxons in widely disparate locations if the
ANGLO part is a geographic designator.

Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were
Angles:

"From the Jutes are descended the people of Kent, and of the Isle of
Wight, and those also in the province of the West Saxons who are to
this day called Jutes, seated opposite to the Isle of Wight. From the
Saxons, that is, the country which is now called Old Saxony, came the
East Saxons, the South Saxons, and the West Saxons. From the Angles,
that is, the country which is called Anglia, and which is said, from
that time, to remain desert to this day, between the provinces of the
Jutes and the Saxons, are descended the East Angles, the Midland
Angles, Mercians, all the race of the Northumbrians, that is, of those
nations that dwell on the north side of the river Humber, and the
other nations of the English."

http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/basis/bede-book1.html

[John Briggs]

Post by Hovite

Post by Matt Giwer
It is not possible to assign an up until the map convention
of north being the top of the map appears. That is rather late.

Then why did you mention "Upper" at all? You appear to have introduced
an irrelevance for the sole purpose of confusing yourself.

I assumed it was a joke - based on the irrelevant intrusion of Lower Saxons.

Post by Hovite

Post by Matt Giwer
So tell me how one determines ANGLO-Saxons in widely
disparate locations if the ANGLO part is a geographic designator.

Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were

Bede stating it doesn't make it true. It was just a founding myth.

[Matt Giwer]

Post by Hovite

Post by Matt Giwer
It is not possible to assign an up until the map convention of north being the
top of the map appears. That is rather late.

Then why did you mention "Upper" at all? You appear to have introduced
an irrelevance for the sole purpose of confusing yourself.

Post by Matt Giwer
So tell me how one determines ANGLO-Saxons in widely disparate locations if the
ANGLO part is a geographic designator.

Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were

And this is where I came in.

Post by Hovite
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.

Have I missed something or were not the Anglo-Saxons two different peoples?

Post by Hovite
"From the Jutes are descended the people of Kent, and of the Isle of
Wight, and those also in the province of the West Saxons who are to
this day called Jutes, seated opposite to the Isle of Wight. From the
Saxons, that is, the country which is now called Old Saxony, came the
East Saxons, the South Saxons, and the West Saxons. From the Angles,
that is, the country which is called Anglia, and which is said, from
that time, to remain desert to this day, between the provinces of the
Jutes and the Saxons, are descended the East Angles, the Midland
Angles, Mercians, all the race of the Northumbrians, that is, of those
nations that dwell on the north side of the river Humber, and the
other nations of the English."

So he agrees with me. Back to my original issue then, no?

[John Briggs]

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by Hovite

Post by Matt Giwer
It is not possible to assign an up until the map convention
of north being the top of the map appears. That is rather late.

Then why did you mention "Upper" at all? You appear to have
introduced an irrelevance for the sole purpose of confusing yourself.

Post by Matt Giwer
So tell me how one determines ANGLO-Saxons in widely
disparate locations if the ANGLO part is a geographic designator.

Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were

And this is where I came in.

Post by Hovite
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.

Have I missed something or were not the Anglo-Saxons two
different peoples?

No, they were not.

[Matt Giwer]

Post by John Briggs

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by Hovite

Post by Matt Giwer
It is not possible to assign an up until the map convention
of north being the top of the map appears. That is rather late.

Then why did you mention "Upper" at all? You appear to have
introduced an irrelevance for the sole purpose of confusing yourself.

Post by Matt Giwer
So tell me how one determines ANGLO-Saxons in widely
disparate locations if the ANGLO part is a geographic designator.

Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were

And this is where I came in.

Post by Hovite
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.

Have I missed something or were not the Anglo-Saxons two
different peoples?

No, they were not.

"Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were
Angles:"

Please explain.

[William Black]

Post by Matt Giwer
"Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were
Angles:"

So where do all those place names ending in -by and -borough come from?

[John Briggs]

Post by William Black

Post by Matt Giwer
"Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were
Angles:"

So where do all those place names ending in -by and -borough come from?

Ignore -borough - that's just as likely to be OE. All those ON -bys are
later. Has it ever ocurred to you that the Synod of Whitby didn't take place
at Whitby?

[William Black]

Post by John Briggs

Post by William Black

Post by Matt Giwer
"Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were
Angles:"

So where do all those place names ending in -by and -borough come from?

Ignore -borough - that's just as likely to be OE.

Even when assocciated with Viking place names?

All those ON -bys are

Post by John Briggs
later. Has it ever ocurred to you that the Synod of Whitby didn't take
place at Whitby?

So where did it take place.

The ruins at Whitby have a sign that claims it did take place there...

[John Briggs]

Post by William Black

Post by John Briggs

Post by William Black

Post by Matt Giwer
"Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were
Angles:"

So where do all those place names ending in -by and -borough come from?

Ignore -borough - that's just as likely to be OE.

Even when assocciated with Viking place names?

Yes. For example, it is generally agreed that "Scarborough" contains OE
'burh'.

Post by William Black

Post by John Briggs
All those ON -bys are later. Has it ever ocurred to you that the Synod of
Whitby didn't take place at Whitby?

So where did it take place.

It took place at Streanaeshalch.

Post by William Black
The ruins at Whitby have a sign that claims it did take place there...

It probably did take place there (although this is not certain). But 'there'
was not called Whitby at the time.

[William Black]

Post by John Briggs

Post by William Black

Post by John Briggs

Post by William Black

Post by Matt Giwer
"Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were
Angles:"

So where do all those place names ending in -by and -borough come from?

Ignore -borough - that's just as likely to be OE.

Even when assocciated with Viking place names?

Yes. For example, it is generally agreed that "Scarborough" contains OE
'burh'.

Ah yes.

I had managed to work out that old Skathi was probably a Victorian fiction.

The place isn't in Domesday either, when other, smaller, places are.

Post by John Briggs

Post by William Black

Post by John Briggs
All those ON -bys are later. Has it ever ocurred to you that the Synod
of Whitby didn't take place at Whitby?

So where did it take place.

It took place at Streanaeshalch.

Post by William Black
The ruins at Whitby have a sign that claims it did take place there...

It probably did take place there (although this is not certain). But
'there' was not called Whitby at the time.

Right, got you now.

[John Briggs]

Post by William Black

Post by John Briggs

Post by William Black

Post by John Briggs

Post by William Black

Post by Matt Giwer
"Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were
Angles:"

So where do all those place names ending in -by and -borough come from?

Ignore -borough - that's just as likely to be OE.

Even when assocciated with Viking place names?

Yes. For example, it is generally agreed that "Scarborough" contains
OE 'burh'.

Ah yes.
I had managed to work out that old Skathi was probably a Victorian fiction.
The place isn't in Domesday either, when other, smaller, places are.

That probably doesn't matter. No, Skarthi seems quite genuine - and him
building a fort at Scarborough around 965 is mentioned in Kormak's Saga.

Post by William Black

Post by John Briggs

Post by William Black

Post by John Briggs
All those ON -bys are later. Has it ever ocurred to you that the
Synod of Whitby didn't take place at Whitby?

So where did it take place.

It took place at Streanaeshalch.

Post by William Black
The ruins at Whitby have a sign that claims it did take place there...

It probably did take place there (although this is not certain). But
'there' was not called Whitby at the time.

Right, got you now.

As far as we can tell, it was Symeon of Durham in the 12th century who first
called it the "Synod of Whitby".

[William Black]

Post by John Briggs

Post by William Black
Ah yes.
I had managed to work out that old Skathi was probably a Victorian fiction.
The place isn't in Domesday either, when other, smaller, places are.

That probably doesn't matter. No, Skarthi seems quite genuine - and him
building a fort at Scarborough around 965 is mentioned in Kormak's Saga.

So why is he almost invariably referred to as 'legendary'.

[John Briggs]

Post by William Black

Post by John Briggs

Post by William Black
Ah yes.
I had managed to work out that old Skathi was probably a Victorian fiction.
The place isn't in Domesday either, when other, smaller, places are.

That probably doesn't matter. No, Skarthi seems quite genuine - and
him building a fort at Scarborough around 965 is mentioned in
Kormak's Saga.

So why is he almost invariably referred to as 'legendary'.

Because "sagary" isn't a word?
:-)

[sprocket]

Post by John Briggs
Because "sagary" isn't a word?
:-)

Sagacious?

[John Briggs]

Post by John Briggs

Post by William Black

Post by John Briggs

Post by William Black

Post by John Briggs

Post by William Black

Post by Matt Giwer
"Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people
were Angles:"

So where do all those place names ending in -by and -borough come from?

Ignore -borough - that's just as likely to be OE.

Even when assocciated with Viking place names?

Yes. For example, it is generally agreed that "Scarborough" contains
OE 'burh'.

Ah yes.
I had managed to work out that old Skathi was probably a Victorian fiction.
The place isn't in Domesday either, when other, smaller, places are.

That probably doesn't matter. No, Skarthi seems quite genuine - and
him building a fort at Scarborough around 965 is mentioned in
Kormak's Saga.

Actually, I have now read Kormáks saga, and I am now more doubtful. Having
consulted experts on the English Place-Name List, we wonder if it doesn't
rather mean something like 'fort at gaps/indentations in the landscape'.
Kormáks saga may well postdate Scarborough by a considerable margin.

[Matt Giwer]

Post by William Black

Post by Matt Giwer
"Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were
Angles:"

So where do all those place names ending in -by and -borough come from?

Begging the question is a logical fallacy.

[William Black]

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by William Black

Post by Matt Giwer
"Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were
Angles:"

So where do all those place names ending in -by and -borough come from?

Begging the question is a logical fallacy.

But you are Matt Giwer, a man (for a given value of man anyway) who is
convinced the Holocaust didn't happen and a well known racist and liar, so
nobody cares what you think.

[Matt Giwer]

Post by William Black

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by William Black

Post by Matt Giwer
"Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were
Angles:"

So where do all those place names ending in -by and -borough come from?

Begging the question is a logical fallacy.

But you are Matt Giwer, a man (for a given value of man anyway) who is
convinced the Holocaust didn't happen and a well known racist and liar,
so nobody cares what you think.

Why must you gullible idiots always lie about me?

I correctly state there is no physical evidence of gas chambers and that is no
physical evidence of mass extermination. And as Israel has officially claimed
there were _*at least*_ four million holocaust survivors alive in 1945 I would
have thought you dumber than dog shit liars would have dropped it by now.

[William Black]

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by William Black

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by William Black

Post by Matt Giwer
"Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were
Angles:"

So where do all those place names ending in -by and -borough come from?

Begging the question is a logical fallacy.

But you are Matt Giwer, a man (for a given value of man anyway) who is
convinced the Holocaust didn't happen and a well known racist and liar,
so nobody cares what you think.

Why must you gullible idiots always lie about me?
I correctly state there is no physical evidence of gas chambers and that
is no physical evidence of mass extermination. And as Israel has
officially claimed there were _*at least*_ four million holocaust
survivors alive in 1945 I would have thought you dumber than dog shit
liars would have dropped it by now.

Condemned from his own mouth.

No further comment necessary.

[John Briggs]

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by John Briggs

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by Hovite

Post by Matt Giwer
It is not possible to assign an up until the map
convention of north being the top of the map appears. That is
rather late.

Then why did you mention "Upper" at all? You appear to have
introduced an irrelevance for the sole purpose of confusing
yourself.

Post by Matt Giwer
So tell me how one determines ANGLO-Saxons in widely
disparate locations if the ANGLO part is a geographic designator.

Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were

And this is where I came in.

Post by Hovite
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.

Have I missed something or were not the Anglo-Saxons two
different peoples?

No, they were not.

"Bede was a native of Northumbria. He stated that its people were
Angles:"
Please explain.

Certainly. It's a Founding Myth. The Anglo-Saxons believed that they were
originally three tribes: Angles, Saxons and Jutes. This was a myth - they
were a random collection of people from many Germanic tribes. Actually,
there may have been something different about the Jutes, but otherwise they
all spoke "Angle-ish" and were called by their neighbours "Saxons"
(Sassenach, Seis). There is a geographical distribution to kingdoms labelled
"Anglian" and "Saxon" (ignore Wessex - that is a later invention), but they
really have no significance.

[James Hogg]

On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 17:34:05 -0500, Matt Giwer

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.

Have I missed something or were not the Anglo-Saxons two different peoples?

Aye, there were two neatly demarcated Germanic peoples living on the
continent, the ethnically pure Angles and the racially unmixed Saxons.
In the Dark Ages they migrated to England, where they remained two
neatly demarcated peoples for several centuries before merging to
become the Anglo-Saxons. Needless to say, they avoided all contact
with the racially inferior Celts living in England. Instead they
practised apartheid and genocide. As a result all the Celtic people
disappeared from England (except Cornwall), leaving it to that
wonderful people now known as the English.

James

[Soren Larsen]

Post by James Hogg
On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 17:34:05 -0500, Matt Giwer

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.

Have I missed something or were not the Anglo-Saxons two different peoples?

Aye, there were two neatly demarcated Germanic peoples living on the
continent, the ethnically pure Angles and the racially unmixed Saxons.
In the Dark Ages they migrated to England, where they remained two
neatly demarcated peoples for several centuries before merging to
become the Anglo-Saxons. Needless to say, they avoided all contact
with the racially inferior Celts living in England. Instead they
practised apartheid and genocide. As a result all the Celtic people
disappeared from England (except Cornwall), leaving it to that
wonderful people now known as the English.
James

Nah it didn't happen that way.

I believe the current story goes something like this:

All the English and other inhabitants of the isles descent from reindeers
who migrated to Britain just after the icecover retreated and no substantial
migration into Britain by man nor beast happened after that - ever.

They only adapted Germanic/Celtic ways and language because it at various
points in time was the hippest thing among the really cool dudes on
continent, and the Brits wanted to be hip and cool too.

So they simply changed their ways and language accordingly and claimed to
have
migrated from the continent.

Soren Larsen

[Kathy]

Post by Soren Larsen

Post by James Hogg
On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 17:34:05 -0500, Matt Giwer

Post by Matt Giwer

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.

Have I missed something or were not the Anglo-Saxons two different peoples?

Aye, there were two neatly demarcated Germanic peoples living on the
continent, the ethnically pure Angles and the racially unmixed Saxons.
In the Dark Ages they migrated to England, where they remained two
neatly demarcated peoples for several centuries before merging to
become the Anglo-Saxons. Needless to say, they avoided all contact
with the racially inferior Celts living in England. Instead they
practised apartheid and genocide. As a result all the Celtic people
disappeared from England (except Cornwall), leaving it to that
wonderful people now known as the English.
James

Nah it didn't happen that way.
All the English and other inhabitants of the isles descent from reindeers
who migrated to Britain just after the icecover retreated and no substantial
migration into Britain by man nor beast happened after that - ever.
They only adapted Germanic/Celtic ways and language because it at various
points in time was the hippest thing among the really cool dudes on
continent, and the Brits wanted to be hip and cool too.
So they simply changed their ways and language accordingly and claimed to
have
migrated from the continent.
Soren Larsen

No. no. no! You are all wrong!

Everyone in the whole wide world is descended from Norwegians.

Must be true cos Inger says so, and she has seen the proof in some very
old papers that a retired professor who knows her daughter's friend's
cousin has, but they are secret papers so she cant give us a reference.

[erilar]

Post by James Hogg
Aye, there were two neatly demarcated Germanic peoples living on the
continent, the ethnically pure Angles and the racially unmixed Saxons.
In the Dark Ages they migrated to England, where they remained two
neatly demarcated peoples for several centuries before merging to
become the Anglo-Saxons. Needless to say, they avoided all contact
with the racially inferior Celts living in England. Instead they
practised apartheid and genocide. As a result all the Celtic people
disappeared from England (except Cornwall), leaving it to that
wonderful people now known as the English.

Loud giggles 8-)

But watch out! Inger may take this for gospel!

[Johansson I E]

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.
The 109 burials arranged in a rectangular pattern and
dating from around the middle of the Seventh Century,
have been unearthed on farmland near Loftus on Teesside.
"This is the only known Anglo-Saxon royal burial site in
the North of England. It is the most dramatic find of
Anglo-Saxon material for generations - certainly something
to get Beowulf excited about," said Robin Daniels,
archaeological officer with Hartlepool-based Teesside
Archaeology.
What is mystifying archaeologists is that the sumptuous
gems are all of a style found in the south of England.
The speculation is that the royals buried on Teesside are
linked to the Kentish princess Ethelburga, who travelled
north to marry Edwin, King of Northumbria."
Read more

<http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-east-news/todays-news/2007/11/20/a-real-
gem-of-a-find-61634-20131683/>

The article say that "Mr Daniels said that one of several gold pendants
found was comparable to the famous Sutton Hoo treasure find. "Nothing like
this pendant has been found in this country and we are struggling to find a
European parallel," IF they refer to those on the photo there are at least
some comparable artifact works, one found in Skane and one in
Vendel(Uppland) and some in an area from Skönberg to Grebo. (In one of the
places English coin from 9th and 10th century been found).

Inger E

Post by Peter Alaca
--
p.a.

[Peter Alaca]

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.
The 109 burials arranged in a rectangular pattern and
dating from around the middle of the Seventh Century,
have been unearthed on farmland near Loftus on Teesside.
"This is the only known Anglo-Saxon royal burial site in
the North of England. It is the most dramatic find of
Anglo-Saxon material for generations - certainly something
to get Beowulf excited about," said Robin Daniels,
archaeological officer with Hartlepool-based Teesside
Archaeology.
What is mystifying archaeologists is that the sumptuous
gems are all of a style found in the south of England.
The speculation is that the royals buried on Teesside are
linked to the Kentish princess Ethelburga, who travelled
north to marry Edwin, King of Northumbria."
Read more

<http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-east-news/todays-news/2007/11/20/a-real-
gem-of-a-find-61634-20131683/>
The article say that "Mr Daniels said that one of several gold
pendants
found was comparable to the famous Sutton Hoo treasure find. "Nothing like
this pendant has been found in this country and we are struggling to find a
European parallel," IF they refer to those on the photo there are at least
some comparable artifact works, one found in Skane and one in
Vendel(Uppland) and some in an area from Skönberg to Grebo. (In one of the
places English coin from 9th and 10th century been found).
Inger E

Where can we find those 'comparable artefacts' illustrated?

[Soren Larsen]

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.
The 109 burials arranged in a rectangular pattern and
dating from around the middle of the Seventh Century,
have been unearthed on farmland near Loftus on Teesside.
"This is the only known Anglo-Saxon royal burial site in
the North of England. It is the most dramatic find of
Anglo-Saxon material for generations - certainly something
to get Beowulf excited about," said Robin Daniels,
archaeological officer with Hartlepool-based Teesside
Archaeology.
What is mystifying archaeologists is that the sumptuous
gems are all of a style found in the south of England.
The speculation is that the royals buried on Teesside are
linked to the Kentish princess Ethelburga, who travelled
north to marry Edwin, King of Northumbria."
Read more

<http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-east-news/todays-news/2007/11/20/a-real-
gem-of-a-find-61634-20131683/>
The article say that "Mr Daniels said that one of several gold pendants
found was comparable to the famous Sutton Hoo treasure find. "Nothing like
this pendant has been found in this country and we are struggling to find a
European parallel," IF they refer to those on the photo there are at least
some comparable artifact works, one found in Skane and one in
Vendel(Uppland) and some in an area from Skönberg to Grebo. (In one of the
places English coin from 9th and 10th century been found).
Inger E

Where can we find those 'comparable artefacts' illustrated?

I'm guessing that the pendant in question is the cloisonne thingie.

It is certainly not without parralel in Europe but
it absolutely an indicator of the presence of high level people when
found in a germanic context.

Perhaps even royalty.

Soren Larsen

[Peter Alaca]

Post by Soren Larsen

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.
The 109 burials arranged in a rectangular pattern and
dating from around the middle of the Seventh Century,
have been unearthed on farmland near Loftus on Teesside.
"This is the only known Anglo-Saxon royal burial site in
the North of England. It is the most dramatic find of
Anglo-Saxon material for generations - certainly something
to get Beowulf excited about," said Robin Daniels,
archaeological officer with Hartlepool-based Teesside
Archaeology.
What is mystifying archaeologists is that the sumptuous
gems are all of a style found in the south of England.
The speculation is that the royals buried on Teesside are
linked to the Kentish princess Ethelburga, who travelled
north to marry Edwin, King of Northumbria."
Read more

<http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-east-news/todays-news/2007/11/20/a-real-
gem-of-a-find-61634-20131683/>
The article say that "Mr Daniels said that one of several gold pendants
found was comparable to the famous Sutton Hoo treasure find.
"Nothing
like
this pendant has been found in this country and we are struggling
to
find a
European parallel," IF they refer to those on the photo there are
at
least
some comparable artifact works, one found in Skane and one in
Vendel(Uppland) and some in an area from Skönberg to Grebo. (In one of the
places English coin from 9th and 10th century been found).

Where can we find those 'comparable artefacts' illustrated?

I'm guessing that the pendant in question is the cloisonne thingie.

Yes, that is clear, the gold cloisonne garnet thingy

Post by Soren Larsen
It is certainly not without parralel in Europe

No, I am thinking eg of many Merovingian examples.
But I think Inger interpretated "struggling to find a
European parallel" as 'no parallel', and of course
says that there are Swedish parallels.
Well, we have seen 'Swedish parallels' before,
that's why I asked her to show them.

Post by Soren Larsen
but it absolutely an indicator of the presence of high level
people when found in a germanic context.
Perhaps even royalty.

Yes. But I think the location is in this case
the most important aspect of the find.

[Soren Larsen]

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Soren Larsen

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.
The 109 burials arranged in a rectangular pattern and
dating from around the middle of the Seventh Century,
have been unearthed on farmland near Loftus on Teesside.
"This is the only known Anglo-Saxon royal burial site in
the North of England. It is the most dramatic find of
Anglo-Saxon material for generations - certainly something
to get Beowulf excited about," said Robin Daniels,
archaeological officer with Hartlepool-based Teesside
Archaeology.
What is mystifying archaeologists is that the sumptuous
gems are all of a style found in the south of England.
The speculation is that the royals buried on Teesside are
linked to the Kentish princess Ethelburga, who travelled
north to marry Edwin, King of Northumbria."
Read more

<http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-east-news/todays-news/2007/11/20/a-real-
gem-of-a-find-61634-20131683/>
The article say that "Mr Daniels said that one of several gold pendants
found was comparable to the famous Sutton Hoo treasure find.
"Nothing
like
this pendant has been found in this country and we are struggling
to
find a
European parallel," IF they refer to those on the photo there are
at
least
some comparable artifact works, one found in Skane and one in
Vendel(Uppland) and some in an area from Skönberg to Grebo. (In one of the
places English coin from 9th and 10th century been found).

Where can we find those 'comparable artefacts' illustrated?

I'm guessing that the pendant in question is the cloisonne thingie.

Yes, that is clear, the gold cloisonne garnet thingy

Post by Soren Larsen
It is certainly not without parralel in Europe

No, I am thinking eg of many Merovingian examples.
But I think Inger interpretated "struggling to find a
European parallel" as 'no parallel', and of course
says that there are Swedish parallels.
Well, we have seen 'Swedish parallels' before,
that's why I asked her to show them.

Even a blind hen can pick a grain (of truth) sometimes.

There is actually a bit of the stuff up here.

Norway: Cloisonne brooch in Vendel style

http://www.photographersdirect.com/buyers/stockphoto.asp?imageid=130143

There is also a biy of cloisonne work as you would expect at the actual
Vendel and Valsgarde sites.

And we have some from Danish sites as well but it is always connected
with high rank.

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Soren Larsen
but it absolutely an indicator of the presence of high level
people when found in a germanic context.
Perhaps even royalty.

Yes. But I think the location is in this case
the most important aspect of the find.

Yup

Soren

[Peter Alaca]

Post by Soren Larsen

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Soren Larsen

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.
The 109 burials arranged in a rectangular pattern and
dating from around the middle of the Seventh Century,
have been unearthed on farmland near Loftus on Teesside.
"This is the only known Anglo-Saxon royal burial site in
the North of England. It is the most dramatic find of
Anglo-Saxon material for generations - certainly something
to get Beowulf excited about," said Robin Daniels,
archaeological officer with Hartlepool-based Teesside
Archaeology.
What is mystifying archaeologists is that the sumptuous
gems are all of a style found in the south of England.
The speculation is that the royals buried on Teesside are
linked to the Kentish princess Ethelburga, who travelled
north to marry Edwin, King of Northumbria."
Read more

<http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-east-news/todays-news/2007/11/20/a-real-
gem-of-a-find-61634-20131683/>
The article say that "Mr Daniels said that one of several gold pendants
found was comparable to the famous Sutton Hoo treasure find.
"Nothing
like
this pendant has been found in this country and we are struggling
to
find a
European parallel," IF they refer to those on the photo there are
at
least
some comparable artifact works, one found in Skane and one in
Vendel(Uppland) and some in an area from Skönberg to Grebo. (In
one
of the
places English coin from 9th and 10th century been found).

Where can we find those 'comparable artefacts' illustrated?

I'm guessing that the pendant in question is the cloisonne thingie.

Yes, that is clear, the gold cloisonne garnet thingy

Post by Soren Larsen
It is certainly not without parralel in Europe

No, I am thinking eg of many Merovingian examples.
But I think Inger interpretated "struggling to find a
European parallel" as 'no parallel', and of course
says that there are Swedish parallels.
Well, we have seen 'Swedish parallels' before,
that's why I asked her to show them.

Even a blind hen can pick a grain (of truth) sometimes.
There is actually a bit of the stuff up here.
Norway: Cloisonne brooch in Vendel style
http://www.photographersdirect.com/buyers/stockphoto.asp?imageid=130143
There is also a biy of cloisonne work as you would expect at the actual
Vendel and Valsgarde sites.
And we have some from Danish sites as well but it is always connected
with high rank.

I have a photo of a very nice disc-on-bow
brooch from Gotland, but I lost the source.

Post by Soren Larsen

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Soren Larsen
but it absolutely an indicator of the presence of high level
people when found in a germanic context.
Perhaps even royalty.

Yes. But I think the location is in this case
the most important aspect of the find.

Yup
Soren
--
History is not what it used to be.

[erilar]

Post by Peter Alaca
I have a photo of a very nice disc-on-bow
brooch from Gotland, but I lost the source.

Just claim it belongs to someone no one knows. . . .

[Peter Alaca]

Post by erilar

Post by Peter Alaca
I have a photo of a very nice disc-on-bow
brooch from Gotland, but I lost the source.

Just claim it belongs to someone no one knows. . . .

Yeah, a former Professor of Open Minded Theories
of Science, and Unknown Icelandic Anals my daughters
husbands friend once met on a bench at the harbor, who
had known the Elderly when he was six.

[Inger E]

Post by Soren Larsen

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.
The 109 burials arranged in a rectangular pattern and
dating from around the middle of the Seventh Century,
have been unearthed on farmland near Loftus on Teesside.
"This is the only known Anglo-Saxon royal burial site in
the North of England. It is the most dramatic find of
Anglo-Saxon material for generations - certainly something
to get Beowulf excited about," said Robin Daniels,
archaeological officer with Hartlepool-based Teesside
Archaeology.
What is mystifying archaeologists is that the sumptuous
gems are all of a style found in the south of England.
The speculation is that the royals buried on Teesside are
linked to the Kentish princess Ethelburga, who travelled
north to marry Edwin, King of Northumbria."
Read more

<http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-east-news/todays-news/2007/11/20/a-real-

Post by Soren Larsen

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Peter Alaca
gem-of-a-find-61634-20131683/>
The article say that "Mr Daniels said that one of several gold pendants
found was comparable to the famous Sutton Hoo treasure find. "Nothing like
this pendant has been found in this country and we are struggling to find a
European parallel," IF they refer to those on the photo there are at least
some comparable artifact works, one found in Skane and one in
Vendel(Uppland) and some in an area from Skönberg to Grebo. (In one of the
places English coin from 9th and 10th century been found).
Inger E

Where can we find those 'comparable artefacts' illustrated?

I'm guessing that the pendant in question is the cloisonne thingie.

IN one of the cases, since the article compared with Sutton-Hoo it's highly
relevant, there is a photo of the sword-'button' (Alan? is that the correct
word for 'svärdknapp'? photos can be found in more than one English of the
works re. Sutton-Hoo comparing that with the finding in Vendel and the other
way round. (I can't go into the room where one of the books is in this. A
guest there)

In the case of Skane the easiest thing is starting with the ref. to the
golden and silver artifacts in question is presented by Märtha Strömberg in
a small popular-archaeology book "Järnåldersguld i Skåne, Lund 1963 " The
artifacts found are among other gilden silver with niello-inlay artifacts
from expensive horse bridles, saddles and warman's armoury + weapons. Found
during excavations along a line from Sösdala to Häglinge (Ringsjön). Dated
to 5th century.

In the Östergötland cases some can be read about in works of Cnattingius
Bengt; Harald Stale's and other old archaeologists works. The artifacts in
question swords and warman's armoury found in Skärkind's and Skönberga's
parish from late 19th century.Where the artifacts are to be found now, I
can't remember from my notes.

Post by Soren Larsen
It is certainly not without parralel in Europe but
it absolutely an indicator of the presence of high level people when
found in a germanic context.

Not as exclusive as the Golden necklaces from Migration Age found in
Västergötland, Östergötland and Tjust, Småland.

But still good high level work.

Comparable with SHM3163 found in Kville, Bohuslän:
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=14757
more of those findings can be seen here:
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=16634

Comparable also with SHM32480 found in Spelvik, Södermanland:
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=15446

Also comparable with SHM6295 found on island Gotland:
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=15521


For further comparing you also can look closer on the artifacts from Vendel.
With closer I mean starting by looking at enlarged photos of the findings
from Vendel.
Bronze as well as gilden and gold artifacts to look closer at:
SHM 9785:XII
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=226591

SHM 9785:XIV
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=226052

SHM 7250:1
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=16487

SHM 7250:III
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=226198
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=226196
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=226197
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=226201

More for those who can read and write a Swedish to be found in
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/sok.asp?qtype=bild of course chosing
accurate Swedish word to help the search.

Some of the artifacts found during excavation form late 18th to mid 20th
century are unfortunalty not to be found i Statens Historiska Museums
photoarchieve. Reasons might in some cases be that they got lost over the
years or that they are privately owned.
Inger E

[Peter Alaca]

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Soren Larsen

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.
The 109 burials arranged in a rectangular pattern and
dating from around the middle of the Seventh Century,
have been unearthed on farmland near Loftus on Teesside.
"This is the only known Anglo-Saxon royal burial site in
the North of England. It is the most dramatic find of
Anglo-Saxon material for generations - certainly something
to get Beowulf excited about," said Robin Daniels,
archaeological officer with Hartlepool-based Teesside
Archaeology.
What is mystifying archaeologists is that the sumptuous
gems are all of a style found in the south of England.
The speculation is that the royals buried on Teesside are
linked to the Kentish princess Ethelburga, who travelled
north to marry Edwin, King of Northumbria."
Read more

<http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-east-news/todays-news/2007/11/20/a-real-

Post by Soren Larsen

Post by Peter Alaca

Post by Peter Alaca
gem-of-a-find-61634-20131683/>
The article say that "Mr Daniels said that one of several gold pendants
found was comparable to the famous Sutton Hoo treasure find.
"Nothing
like
this pendant has been found in this country and we are struggling
to
find a
European parallel," IF they refer to those on the photo there are
at
least
some comparable artifact works, one found in Skane and one in
Vendel(Uppland) and some in an area from Skönberg to Grebo. (In
one
of the
places English coin from 9th and 10th century been found).
Inger E

Where can we find those 'comparable artefacts' illustrated?

I'm guessing that the pendant in question is the cloisonne thingie.

IN one of the cases, since the article compared with Sutton-Hoo it's highly
relevant, there is a photo of the sword-'button' (Alan? is that the correct
word for 'svärdknapp'? photos can be found in more than one English of the
works re. Sutton-Hoo comparing that with the finding in Vendel and the other
way round. (I can't go into the room where one of the books is in this. A
guest there)
In the case of Skane the easiest thing is starting with the ref. to the
golden and silver artifacts in question is presented by Märtha Strömberg in
a small popular-archaeology book "Järnåldersguld i Skåne, Lund 1963 " The
artifacts found are among other gilden silver with niello-inlay artifacts
from expensive horse bridles, saddles and warman's armoury + weapons. Found
during excavations along a line from Sösdala to Häglinge (Ringsjön). Dated
to 5th century.

What we have seen untill now of the Loftus finds
is not silver niello, which is a completedly different
technique.
Most of the pictures you give below are pieces
made in a different technique, style, or quality,
and IMO cannot be seen as parallels to the
shown Loftus finds.

Post by Peter Alaca
In the Östergötland cases some can be read about in works of
Cnattingius
Bengt; Harald Stale's and other old archaeologists works. The
artifacts in
question swords and warman's armoury found in Skärkind's and
Skönberga's
parish from late 19th century.Where the artifacts are to be found now, I
can't remember from my notes.

Post by Soren Larsen
It is certainly not without parralel in Europe but
it absolutely an indicator of the presence of high level people when
found in a germanic context.

Not as exclusive as the Golden necklaces from Migration Age found in
Västergötland, Östergötland and Tjust, Småland.
But still good high level work.
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=14757

OK

Post by Peter Alaca
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=16634
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=15446
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=15521
For further comparing you also can look closer on the artifacts from Vendel.
With closer I mean starting by looking at enlarged photos of the findings
from Vendel.
SHM 9785:XII
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=226591

NO

Post by Peter Alaca
SHM 9785:XIV
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=226052

NO

Post by Peter Alaca
SHM 7250:1
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=16487
SHM 7250:III
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=226198
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=226196
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=226197
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/bild.asp?uid=226201
More for those who can read and write a Swedish to be found in
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/sok.asp?qtype=bild of course chosing
accurate Swedish word to help the search.
Some of the artifacts found during excavation form late 18th to mid 20th
century are unfortunalty not to be found i Statens Historiska Museums
photoarchieve. Reasons might in some cases be that they got lost over the
years or that they are privately owned.
Inger E

[Odysseus]

In article <va93j.939$***@newsb.telia.net>,
"Inger E" <***@telia.com> wrote:

<snip>

Post by Inger E
IN one of the cases, since the article compared with Sutton-Hoo it's highly
relevant, there is a photo of the sword-'button' (Alan? is that the correct
word for 'svärdknapp'?

"Pommel"? (A knob or enlargement at the opposite end of the hilt from
the blade.)

[Inger E]

Post by Odysseus
<snip>

Post by Inger E
IN one of the cases, since the article compared with Sutton-Hoo it's highly
relevant, there is a photo of the sword-'button' (Alan? is that the correct
word for 'svärdknapp'?

"Pommel"? (A knob or enlargement at the opposite end of the hilt from
the blade.)
--
Odysseus

Thanks!

Inger E

[Soren Larsen]

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
Read more
http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-east-news/todays-news/2007/11/20/a-real-gem-of-a-find-61634-20131683/

A bit more here:

http://www.24hourmuseum.org.uk/nwh_gfx_en/ART52061.html

Soren Larsen

[The Kat]

On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 18:48:11 +0100, "Soren Larsen"

Post by Soren Larsen

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
Read more
http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-east-news/todays-news/2007/11/20/a-real-gem-of-a-find-61634-20131683/

http://www.24hourmuseum.org.uk/nwh_gfx_en/ART52061.html

But THIS makes no sense to me at all...

Post by Soren Larsen
“It’s the most spectacular site I have ever worked on,” said Steve,
“On one site I have an Iron Age settlement with the remains of houses
and floor surfaces, and underneath it a high status Anglo Saxon cemetery
– two fantastic sites rolled into one.”

HOW can you have a 7th century site BELOW an iron age site??

[Soren Larsen]

Post by The Kat
On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 18:48:11 +0100, "Soren Larsen"

Post by Soren Larsen

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
Read more
http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-east-news/todays-news/2007/11/20/a-real-gem-of-a-find-61634-20131683/

http://www.24hourmuseum.org.uk/nwh_gfx_en/ART52061.html

But THIS makes no sense to me at all...

Post by Soren Larsen
"It's the most spectacular site I have ever worked on," said Steve,
"On one site I have an Iron Age settlement with the remains of houses
and floor surfaces, and underneath it a high status Anglo Saxon
cemetery - two fantastic sites rolled into one."

HOW can you have a 7th century site BELOW an iron age site??

Depends on your limitation of 'iron age' I guess.

Soren

[Uwe Müller]

Post by The Kat
On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 18:48:11 +0100, "Soren Larsen"

Post by Soren Larsen

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
Read more
http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-east-news/todays-news/2007/11/20/a-real-gem-of-a-find-61634-20131683/

http://www.24hourmuseum.org.uk/nwh_gfx_en/ART52061.html

But THIS makes no sense to me at all...

Post by Soren Larsen
"It's the most spectacular site I have ever worked on," said Steve,
"On one site I have an Iron Age settlement with the remains of houses
and floor surfaces, and underneath it a high status Anglo Saxon cemetery
- two fantastic sites rolled into one."

HOW can you have a 7th century site BELOW an iron age site??

If the iron age floor surfaces are 20 cm below ground level, and the
Anglo-Saxon burials are at 1,5 m depth (both figures are guessed by me), the
younger site is actually beneath the older site.
The actual single burial pit of course destroyed the iron age feature in its
way, when it was dug down.
Stratigraphically the AS burials are therefore above the iron age
settlement.

OK?
have fun

Uwe Mueller

Post by The Kat
--
Lumber Cartel (tinlc) #2063. Spam this account at your own risk.
This sig censored by the Office of Home, Land & Planet Insecurity...
Remove XYZ to email me

[Peter Alaca]

Post by Peter Alaca
"A real gem of a find
A ROYAL Anglo-Saxon cemetery with some of the
finest gold jewellery to be found in Britain has been
discovered in the North-East.
The 109 burials arranged in a rectangular pattern and
dating from around the middle of the Seventh Century,
have been unearthed on farmland near Loftus on Teesside.
"This is the only known Anglo-Saxon royal burial site in
the North of England. It is the most dramatic find of
Anglo-Saxon material for generations - certainly something
to get Beowulf excited about," said Robin Daniels,
archaeological officer with Hartlepool-based Teesside
Archaeology.
What is mystifying archaeologists is that the sumptuous
gems are all of a style found in the south of England.
The speculation is that the royals buried on Teesside are
linked to the Kentish princess Ethelburga, who travelled
north to marry Edwin, King of Northumbria."
Read more
<http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-east-news/todays-news/2007/11/20/a-real-gem-of-a-find-61634-20131683/>

See also
http://www.bbc.co.uk/tees/content/articles/2007/11/20/loftus_hoard_video_feature.shtml