Post by Tom KunichUnions accomplished some marvelous things.
This could be a first!
Post by Tom KunichAnd then after doing that they
grew fat and smart-assed about their powers. One of the unions I belonged to
would go out on strike in a second to protect an illegal alien worker but
wouldn't support a smart woman union member who had seniority over a dumb
male worker who got promoted ahead of her.
That is "bad management, Union-style".
Post by Tom KunichThe unions kept pounding companies even after it was plain that such tactics
would destroy the companies that were the fortune for all. Have you EVER
been to the rust belt?
I lived in Bloomington-Normal (Illinois) from '64 until '84. Close
enough?
There is STILL 30% or more unemployment there and
Post by Tom Kunichwhile I was there working on medical instruments the Steelworkers Union had
"organized" the people cleaning motels and were on strike! The motel owners
simply took care of it themselves and left the workers penniless out in the
picket line.
Bad union management. A much, much better example would be the long,
painful strike of the Catepillar plant in Goodfield (Peoria), ca.
1980. Sorry, I'm not gonna look that one up right now. BAD.
Post by Tom KunichThe bottom line is that when the unions have intelligent goals they're fine.
When they have nothing more than slash and burn tactics for no good reason
that "I want MORE" they become nothing more than crap.
Bad management.
Post by Tom KunichJapan came to him.
Dang. OK, let's get this one straightened out. He went to Japan to
work on a census. While there, he was invited to teach statistical
control (production).
Post by Tom KunichAs I stated he was the one who wrote a book that
triggered the Japanese revival.
He went to Japan. Lectured, 1950; especially noted was his
presentation at the Mt. Hakone Conference Center. His refusal to
accept royalties led to institution of the Deming Prize.
Post by Tom KunichDeming was not saying anything that others
weren't. He simply had better advertising. This is NOT knocking him by the
way. I'm simply saying that he was not unique in concept, only in practice.
Didn't say "unique", said he was big influence, and was credited (long
before I got there) with large input into successful management in
Japanese industry, perhaps most notably auto (and I have no idea and
no time to check right now, trying to get out for the second loop),
possibly (probably) much more widespread.
Post by Tom KunichIt would probably make a whole lot more sense to you if you understood the
real differences between the US and Japan. Instead you believe that it is
the mean American industrialist who is the cause of it all. Fact is that it
happens to be a mutual problem between management and the unions.
Oh shit shit shit, as usual. But at least management took a hit from
you there.
I didn't say the "mean industrialist" anything. I said bad management.
And that, with the writing on the wall.
Post by Tom KunichWhen I worked for BART I was continuously harassed and threatened with
firing. Not from the management - from the Union. For one thing - you had to
stand in line with your timecard and couldn't punch in until the hour on the
dot. Understand - you couldn't punch in ONE minute early. Then 15 seconds
after the hour the punch time turned from blue to red. If you had red three
times in a row you were fired even though you were 16 seconds after the
starting time AND you were in a line with 20 other men. That was entirely
union.
And there was not an uproar at the next meeting? The bad managers
either straightened right out, or tossed out on their stupid ears?
I've done the punchcard thing, TK, similar stuff, with a union in
place. I broke the rules bigtime for a week or so (not intentional),
bad punches all over the place. The boss talked to me (a little red in
the face, kinda gruff, he was in a little hot water too <g>), I got
the protocols straightened out (one punch during lunch sometime????
Well, OK!) and life went on. Back to "good managers" on that one, the
way it should have been for the Battered Bastards of Bart, don't you
agree?
The punchcard thing was just another symbol of oppression to the
workers, like when they used to fudge our production figures to take
bonuses away from us. While sitting at a desk in plain view of the
work force.
Post by Tom KunichIn most of Japan the "unions" are owned and operated by the companies! So
perhaps you ought to understand the massive differences between here and
there before you start telling us how Deming would improve things here.
Hell, TK, I didn't even read all 14 points yet. May I go back? (file,
new tab...)
OK, I'm back. Here's a good 'un, number 8 on the list (Wiki):
<Drive out fear, so that everyone may work effectively for the
company. (See Ch. 3 of "Out of the Crisis")>
That would be pretty much the direct opposite of what I've seen to be
the new Golden Standard of USA employment: "at will" or by whatever
name, where THE COMPANY can fire you at any instant for no reason,
with your having no recourse, and perhaps not even being allowed to
retrieve personal effects from your desk or whatever-- "Call
Security!".
The bullies, since that's what they are, justify this (at least
sometimes, that I've heard) in various ways-- "That gives the worker
more rights", for example. Bullshit. It's a fear mechanism, meant to
cow employees into a subservient state of mind. It's part of a malaise
that took hold early in the Bush-Reagan years, which I refer to
sometimes as The War On People. Incl. "downsizing" (if you had one
job, now you have none, or you do two or three jobs now-- "working you
60, paying you 30").
Kind of ironic, the most forceful justification given for We Must Let
Management Run Things The Way They Want (incl. multimillion guaranteed
compensation packages, and golden parachutes not dependent on
performance or fulfillment of "hire-on" contracts) was: The Japanese
Are Coming!!! They're going to bury us!!! (Kruschev reference-
linkage?) And IMS, "they" [Japanese financial forces] were indeed
pulling some nasty "money stuff" aimed at undercutting US financial
wellness, but then they went poof pretty quickly and The War On People
continued because... because... People are the only thing left to
fight?
Another irony is, this kind of stuff could be seen as a drive toward
making the wild and freedom-lovin' cowboys (and cowgirls!) in the USA
work force more closely resemble the peasant class ("most everybody")
in Japan, who have as one of their few, if not only, inalienable
rights the freedom to cower at the feet of the Samurai. Speaking
figuratively, of course.
I guess we should look at how it was, and is, that Toyota and Honda
could construct new plants in areas perhaps not noted for a
specifically experienced work force here in the USA (Louisville Ky?
Baseball bats?) and succeed in making superior products using
heretofore untrained (at least, those sorts were the ones openly
sought after when the Mitsubishi plant opened in Normal, Ill.) USA
labor. I'd guess "good management" with Deming's gladly acknowledged
influence seen factoring strongly into the mix. --D-y