Post by YellowOn Mon, 7 May 2018 13:59:20 +0100, Ian Jackson
Post by Ian JacksonThe problem is that there no solution to Irish Border is under the
present EU rules, the Good Friday Agreement, and what the majority of
the people of NI would accept in the way of having a different customs
system from the rest of the UK.
Of course there are solutions as there are always solutions if people
are prepared to compromise. The problem of course is getting those with
a vested interest in us staying in the EU to stop using the border as a
way to try to keep us in the EU, in deed if not in name.
Post by Ian JacksonDespite this, many Brexiteers still argue that there IS a solution
And despite this, all remoaners still argue there there is NO solution.
But I didn't say there was NO solution. What I said was "The problem is
that there no solution to Irish Border is under the present EU rules,
the Good Friday Agreement, and what the majority of the people of NI
would accept in the way of having a different customs system from the
rest of the UK."
Post by YellowPost by Ian Jacksonranging from those who claim that the is no problem ("so what's all the
fuss about") to those who agree that there certainly is a difficult
problem - but by some stroke of genius and using advanced technology
that hasn't been invented yet, everything will turn out fine in the end.
Chew on this - if neither the UK or Eire were in the EU and one or other
wanted to join, then a solution to this problem would magically be found
and agreed to. Yes or no?
The problem is hypothetical, and I don't know any more than you do. It's
obviously fortunate (and presumably was considered a pretty good idea by
both governments) if we joined together.
Post by YellowPost by Ian JacksonHowever, when pressed for a precise explanation of how all this will
actually work, any explanation they give can immediately be seen to be
impracticable under the requirements I gave above.
That is just an O'Brien-esque straw man - get your coconuts ready to
knock down any suggestion anyone makes as "impossible" so we will have
to simply stay in the EU instead. :-)
All he (and lots of other people) ask is just what IS the solution that
will be acceptable to the EU, the ROI, the UK and the people of NI? It's
not a trick question, but it's certainly going to be a tricky answer.
Post by YellowWe are leaving the EU; that is a fact.
But you and your fellow-Brexiteers need to suggest a practical,
realistic way of doing it. Or are you going to say (like I've certainly
heard a number of in-phoners saying) "Not my responsibility. We were
told that if we voted to leave, then we WOULD leave - no Ifs, no Buts.
It's now up to the Government to find a way of doing what I voted for".
Post by YellowStaying in the/a customs union I do not believe would be acceptable to
the people and in any case, as a stand-alone solution would not be
enough to resolve the border issue as it is currently being painted
which would require staying in the Single Market too. But I do not
believe staying in the Single Market would be acceptable to the people
either.
The ability to make our own trade deals and the end of freedom of
movement are pivotal requirements, in my view, and somehow that has to
be balanced against EU rules and the Good Friday Agreement.
But can you expand on "somehow"? Like several Brexiteers I've heard, you
understand the problem - but can you suggest an acceptable solution?
Post by YellowBut what cannot be allowed to happen though, again in my view, is that
one group is allowed to run roughshod over the another group by
threatening the return to violence to force all the compromise to come
from the UK and none at all from the EU.
In that case, would it help if you had a quiet word with those
concerned, and tell them not to even think about being naughty boys
again?
Post by YellowAnd this is where I believe we
are at, at the moment.
At the risk of being boring, can I ask you again to suggest a workable,
acceptable solution?
--
Ian