[fossil-users] Feature slideshow on fossil homepage

[mario]

As followup to last month` Show time.. discussion:

→ http://fossilslideshow.tmp.include-once.org/

(Take in mind this ain't a mockup yet; just as example.)

Why oh why?
===========

Our current homepage is a bit wall of textish / too bland
I'd think. While it already gets all interesting features
across, it's not likely enticing to new users.

And such a slideshow (colors do draw eyes) would more easily
showcase the advantages of Fossil.

Pros & Cons
===========

Apart from really matching it up with the default theme,
all the usual drawbacks of a homepage slideshow apply:

· It's somewhat of a generic fad (every other pet project
homepage has one these days)
· Makes it harder to follow each point (slide timing…)
· Needs more trimming down of slides + repeating some links
in the doc section.
· Images might be quite large (→ static files).
· "CGI" is already too abstract for a concrete pictogram.
· I feel it's slightly betraying the documentation-nature
of the Fossil homepage.
· And if implemented, people would want to have it with their
own Fossil setup (= must to be slim enough to be embedded
with one of the skins).

On the other hand it's a cheap feature:

· No jQuery necessary (there's even CSS-only slideshows)
· Kept the HTML list with minor adaptions
· Looks ok in w3m or dillo still.
· I don't think we'd even need to hire a graphics people to
design something neat here.
· Allows for less shy comparisons with Git/Hub/Lab.
· With all the work and features that went into Fossil, it's
perfectly warranted to show off a bit.

Discussion
==========

Is this something the Fossil homepage should have?

Any strong opinions or thoughts on image bloat?

Who would want to partake / design one of the slideshow
images? (archeology-themed for obvious reasons!)

Cutting down on intro text / feature points.
→ How much is too much?
→ Or add *more* links even?

Can we also expand the homepage documentation list into
e.g. a three pane list (like the Apache manual):
→ users, → developers, → quick overview sections?

Rephrasing
==========
(This is going to become the lengthier discussion…)

There's a few headlines and key points which could be
adapted IMO (without overzealous hype/marketing).
For instance "mature + robust". Or "unobtrusive" in comparison
to Git.
And "fully customizable" instead of just themeable (because
we have TH1, and a JSON API, not just the skins).

One thing I'd also like to see more prominently are links to
Hydra, ChiselApp, or even fossilrepos.sourceforge.net perhaps.

Technical minutae
=================

Back to the example //fossilslideshow.tmp.include-once.org/
A few thoughts on simplifying:

· The img tags could be slashed by using background-image
and no-repeat instead.
· With transform and @keyframe, one could get rid of the
JavaScript entirely
· Not sure if back/forward buttons make sense. But a :hover
stop of the slides would make sense at least.
· If anyone is already using a simpler JS-snippet, please..
· Not sure if embedding SVG makes sense.
· I'd prefer the quick links floater to stay / not sure if the
logo needs to remain.

[David Mason]

I like it, though the timing is pretty fast, and some slides are truncated.

→ http://fossilslideshow.tmp.include-once.org/
(Take in mind this ain't a mockup yet; just as example.)
Why oh why?
===========
Our current homepage is a bit wall of textish / too bland
I'd think. While it already gets all interesting features
across, it's not likely enticing to new users.
And such a slideshow (colors do draw eyes) would more easily
showcase the advantages of Fossil.
Pros & Cons
===========
Apart from really matching it up with the default theme,
· It's somewhat of a generic fad (every other pet project
homepage has one these days)
· Makes it harder to follow each point (slide timing
)
· Needs more trimming down of slides + repeating some links
in the doc section.
· Images might be quite large (→ static files).
· "CGI" is already too abstract for a concrete pictogram.
· I feel it's slightly betraying the documentation-nature
of the Fossil homepage.
· And if implemented, people would want to have it with their
own Fossil setup (= must to be slim enough to be embedded
with one of the skins).
· No jQuery necessary (there's even CSS-only slideshows)
· Kept the HTML list with minor adaptions
· Looks ok in w3m or dillo still.
· I don't think we'd even need to hire a graphics people to
design something neat here.
· Allows for less shy comparisons with Git/Hub/Lab.
· With all the work and features that went into Fossil, it's
perfectly warranted to show off a bit.
Discussion
==========
Is this something the Fossil homepage should have?
Any strong opinions or thoughts on image bloat?
Who would want to partake / design one of the slideshow
images? (archeology-themed for obvious reasons!)
Cutting down on intro text / feature points.
→ How much is too much?
→ Or add *more* links even?
Can we also expand the homepage documentation list into
→ users, → developers, → quick overview sections?
Rephrasing
==========
(This is going to become the lengthier discussion
)
There's a few headlines and key points which could be
adapted IMO (without overzealous hype/marketing).
For instance "mature + robust". Or "unobtrusive" in comparison
to Git.
And "fully customizable" instead of just themeable (because
we have TH1, and a JSON API, not just the skins).
One thing I'd also like to see more prominently are links to
Hydra, ChiselApp, or even fossilrepos.sourceforge.net perhaps.
Technical minutae
=================
Back to the example //fossilslideshow.tmp.include-once.org/
· The img tags could be slashed by using background-image
and no-repeat instead.
JavaScript entirely
· Not sure if back/forward buttons make sense. But a :hover
stop of the slides would make sense at least.
· If anyone is already using a simpler JS-snippet, please..
· Not sure if embedding SVG makes sense.
· I'd prefer the quick links floater to stay / not sure if the
logo needs to remain.
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[Will Parsons]

Post by mario
→ http://fossilslideshow.tmp.include-once.org/
(Take in mind this ain't a mockup yet; just as example.)

<snip>

Post by mario
Discussion
==========
Is this something the Fossil homepage should have?
Any strong opinions or thoughts on image bloat?

I *hate* this! I find this sort of thing incredibly annoying on every
<expletive> webpage that I've ever seen that contains it! Please
don't!

[Offray Vladimir Luna Cárdenas]

Post by Will Parsons

Post by mario
→ http://fossilslideshow.tmp.include-once.org/
(Take in mind this ain't a mockup yet; just as example.)

<snip>

Post by mario
Discussion
==========
Is this something the Fossil homepage should have?
Any strong opinions or thoughts on image bloat?

I *hate* this! I find this sort of thing incredibly annoying on every
<expletive> webpage that I've ever seen that contains it! Please
don't!

I don't like it. A more lighter and visual explanation could be done
with a bootstrap or Material Design Lite theme included in the Fossil
site if the current front page seems to textish, without going into the
slideshow explanation, which I find distracting and not responsible in
variety of screens. For example, gitea[1] and Gogs[2] both have a light
text front page without going into the slideshow route (which I think is
making more harm that good presenting ideas to the general public and
particularly in conferences, courses and the educational sector)

[1] https://gitea.io/
[2] https://gogs.io/

Cheers,

Offray

[mario]

Post by Will Parsons

Post by mario
→ http://fossilslideshow.tmp.include-once.org/
Is this something the Fossil homepage should have?
Any strong opinions or thoughts on image bloat?

I *hate* this! I find this sort of thing incredibly annoying on every
<expletive> webpage that I've ever seen that contains it! Please
don't!

I sort of expected mixed feelings about this. And I agree it
can look a bit obnoxious and gimmicky. For the Fossil homepage
it's likely too distractive in either variant.

Which is why not much time had been spent on the example images ;)

G!

[jungle Boogie]

HI Mario,

Post by mario
→ http://fossilslideshow.tmp.include-once.org/
(Take in mind this ain't a mockup yet; just as example.)

I think it's a good first step. Thanks for your efforts!

The carousal might be a little too cookie cutter/modern for
programmers/developers, but might appeal to managers of those people.

What if the current 'What is Fossil' section had small graphical
bullet points, kind of like with git-scm.org's various sections:
https://git-scm.com

I agree that there is a large wall of text - but all very informative
- which would require the visitor to read for an understanding of
Fossil, kind of a large commitment in today's minds IMO.

[mario]

Post by jungle Boogie
I think it's a good first step. Thanks for your efforts!
The carousal might be a little too cookie cutter/modern for
programmers/developers, but might appeal to managers of those people.
What if the current 'What is Fossil' section had small graphical
https://git-scm.com

Hey JB!

That would have been my second choice. A slideshow is partly
tiresome to wait through, and might require overshortened
excerpts.

A few smaller pictograms in place of the <li> numbering might
look less out of place. Still could highlight the major featureset
for Fossil newcomers.

Post by jungle Boogie
I agree that there is a large wall of text - but all very informative
- which would require the visitor to read for an understanding of
Fossil, kind of a large commitment in today's minds IMO.

Of course. From our programmers point of view, the no-frills link
list is what you're looking for really. (I mostly find what I need
right on the homepage.)
Which is why I made this a cautious proposal:)

G!

[Richard Hipp]

Post by mario
Our current homepage is a bit wall of textish / too bland

"Bland" is a feature, not a bug. :-)

Nevertheless, it would be cool if you could come up with a skin or
demonstration project that showed people how to do the slide-show in
case they wanted to do something like that on their own projects.
Let's just not make that slide-show part of the default Fossil
website.

[mario]

Post by Richard Hipp

Post by mario
Our current homepage is a bit wall of textish / too bland

"Bland" is a feature, not a bug. :-)
Nevertheless, it would be cool if you could come up with a skin or
demonstration project that showed people how to do the slide-show in
case they wanted to do something like that on their own projects.
Let's just not make that slide-show part of the default Fossil
website.

It was sort of an experiment for one of my projects - where it
could fit slightly better (end-user audience et al.)
Gonna make it a general skin extension if it can be kept simple.

Also, no worries. It was mostly a flip idea for the official
homepage ;}

What about some mini pictograms for the <ol> list though?
(Less distraction, no needless text cuts, but lightens up the
feature list.)

[Andy Bradford]

Our current homepage is a bit wall of textish / too bland I'd think.
While it already gets all interesting features across, it's not likely
enticing to new users.

Here's a GIF animation of what it looks like in my browser:

Loading Image...

Does this look more enticing?

Thanks,

Andy

[Jungle Boogie]

Post by Andy Bradford

Our current homepage is a bit wall of textish / too bland I'd think.
While it already gets all interesting features across, it's not likely
enticing to new users.

http://fossil.bradfords.org/fossilthings.gif
Does this look more enticing?

That doesn't appear to establish a connection. Is your server down?

Post by Andy Bradford
Thanks,
Andy
--
TAI64 timestamp: 400000005b47aeee

[Andy Bradford]

Post by Jungle Boogie

Post by Andy Bradford
http://fossil.bradfords.org/fossilthings.gif
Does this look more enticing?

That doesn't appear to establish a connection. Is your server down?

The server was up, so is the firewall. :-)

Try this instead:

Loading Image...

Thanks for the note.

Andy