On Sat, 23 Dec 2017 10:40:48 -0600, Christopher A. Lee
Post by Christopher A. LeePost by defaultOn Sat, 23 Dec 2017 05:54:39 -0600, Christopher A. Lee
Post by Christopher A. LeePost by defaultOn Fri, 22 Dec 2017 17:38:05 -0800 (PST), Cloud Hobbit
Post by Cloud HobbitNobody here asks that people stop believing in God. We simply
explain why what theists claim as evidence is not.
We also ask that theists stop trolling here and discuss their beliefs
elsewhere. Just as we do not troll theist NG.
Speak for yourself kemosabi, I delight in posting to the RCC
newsgroup. Fair retribution for the 18 years of Catholic brainwashing
I received....
Then you lower yourself to the level of Puke, 'Drool, Mad Joe etc,
and encourage more trolls to come here.
Don't be such a jerk.
That's not going to change.
The atheist group wouldn't exist except for the theists that force
their beliefs on the rest of us. Even if you take the approach that
atheists should discuss amongst themselves, you might just as well be
a theist because that self-reinforcing behavior is exactly what they
do with religion.
Bollocks. The group was set up by atheists to discuss our own
business, like the issues we face living in a predominantly theistic
society.
Set up by atheists etc., sounds remarkably like there's some atheist
doctrine that we can all agree on.
Post by Christopher A. LeeHow the fuck is that "self-reinforcing"?
no new blood in the group
Post by Christopher A. LeeDo you imagine that not believing in UFO abductions is
"self-reinforcing"?
The subject of a belief is not germane, the idea is that the same
people will not venture outside their secure attitudes and beliefs if
allowed to stagnate.
Post by Christopher A. LeeAnd the putative existence of the god of somebody else's religion, is
hardly an issue for anybody except members of that religion.
Post by defaultUnless you get exposed to different ideas, you can't expect to grow.
We're exposed to theist bullshit masquerading as "ideas" all day and
every day. This was supposed to be a place to get away from that.
Or in other words, religion by design (in this case) hasn't found a
need to challenge those beliefs and have stagnated. I am a beacon of
light in the RCC group...
And getting people to think about the ridiculousness of their
unfounded beliefs can't be all bad, and would seem to be in our
interest.
Post by Christopher A. LeeIf one of them had something new, that they were prepared to discuss
honestly and intelligently, that might be different.
But none of them ever have.
Well yeah, that does get tiresome, but doesn't it make you feel
superior to ridicule them? Boost your ego? etc.
Post by Christopher A. LeeThey keep bringing up the same old lies about things that are nothing
to do with atheism, eg abiogenesis, evolution, the laws of
thermodynamics, etc. And in the twenty-six years I have been here, I
have never once seen any honest discussion from them about these.
And you may never have an "honest" discussion with the brainwashed,
they are dinosaurs and have to go extinct; but by railing against them
you just may influence some kid or newbie to question what the theists
are trying to tell him. When two sides are juxtaposed it allows one
to choose the more likely.
Post by Christopher A. LeePost by defaultOr to use an anecdote. I frequented the same barber shop for many
years, it was next door to where I worked. The owner was something of
a character and he'd have cronies in even when they weren't actually
waiting for a haircut. They talked about baseball, prize fighters,
the middle east conflict, women, etc.. I went in the navy for 6 years
and about a year after I left the navy I stopped in to the shop just
to say hello. Damn if the conversation hadn't changed one iota. The
same people, voicing the same opinions for 7 years? That's what
happens when you stay within an insular sub-culture.
Bad analogy noted.
When I lived in the Bay Area, I would not use one particular model
train etc store, because everybody who went in was treated to a tirade
about Slick Willy. Which was a pity, because they had the best range
of airbrush accessories.
non-sequitur
Post by Christopher A. LeeThis is a place for us to discuss our own business.
You can always drop my name, and the troll's names, in the bozo bin.
That is the ultimate in isolation, listen to only what you want to
hear...
Post by Christopher A. LeeThere is a difference between that, and chewing the breeze while
waiting for a haircut.
The behaviour of most of the theists who crash the group, would get
the fists flying if they did it in the meat world.
Ya think? Only on the side of the brainwashed maybe; doing god's work
and all... Rational people don't resort to violence when someone
disagrees with them. (one thing that makes Trump scary, IMO)
Post by Christopher A. LeePost by defaultJews? Same thing. I highly insular and intolerant sub-culture.
Catholics? Ditto.
I see. It's intolerant to tell stupid theists to fuck off, when they
keep repeating the same old unsolicited nonsense and outright lies,
expecting them to be taken seriously.
'True. The same people tend to think you are capitulating when you
don't challenge the same old nonsense.
Post by Christopher A. LeePost by defaultYou may not like the religious ninnies who post to alt.atheism, but I
figure they do us a service, if only to demonstrate how thoroughly
brainwashed they are.
We already know. And they piss off even mainstream theists.
Mainstream theists? Not sure what you mean. You mean those that keep
their mouths shut and don't pry you out of your comfort zone? Or
those nice guys that keep their mouths shut and just vote for stupid
religious ideologies?
Post by Christopher A. LeePost by defaultBut personally, I do it because I enjoy rubbing their noses in their
own lunacy.
Sounds sociopathic to me.
I didn't say it was noble. If I'm honest, I'm just stroking my ego
and feeling superior. It is a cheap "high." I can find lots of
things wrong with it from a logical viewpoint but I do it because it
makes me feel good, not because it makes sense.
Know yourself, to do that means you have to examine your motivations
and emotions.
Post by Christopher A. LeeIf you can't allow them to live and let live, they have an excuse for
doing the same to us.
Hmm, that is logical, but history tells it differently. These aren't
logical people, they are believing stuff based on their emotions. And
when their con men tell them to go out and makes converts, or war,
(for the greater glory of their god) they are only too happy to
oblige.
Post by Christopher A. LeeWhere I came from, there were three subjects that weren't brought up
in conversation unless you knew how the other person would react -
religion, politics and sport except in the most general way, because
these are polarising.
Yeah I got that too. Back in the days, before SSB and Packet, I grew
up listening to radio amateurs discussing things. But it gets boring
listening to them talk about their "rigs" or the merits of one antenna
over another. Sex, Politics, and Religion were never to be discussed.
But it was SPR that was interesting and that's where I learned that my
indoctrination was, in fact, indoctrination.
Post by Christopher A. LeePost by defaultPerhaps you'd tell me why you post to alt.atheism? What do you get
out of it? or where do you find the satisfaction or reward in posting
Originally to discuss the issues and problems atheists face living in
a predominantly theist culture, a bit like a mutual support group.
Little things like relationships with theists, how (and whether) to
come out as atheists to family, friends and co-workers, what to do
about coerced prayer, oaths, bigotry and discrimination against
atheists all the way up to the Bush1 White House, etc. Simple,
everyday things like weddings and funerals, etc.
But try talking about these without the religious loonies jumping in
and attacking us over them, threatening us with hellfire for refusing
to participate, etc.
Or what to do about creationism without the loonies lying about both
it, evolution and big bang cosmology.
Since then, I have met interesting and knowledgeable people here, who
have become friends - and we hold the kind of conversation friends do
about mutual interests. Eg many of us are layman science nerds,
railroad nerds, like the same music, have cats and dogs, swap recipes
etc.
People like the late and much missed Les Hellawell, Smiler, Mickey,
Jeanne, Seth and others.
Some time back, I was close to proposing to my Catholic Lady Friend
and wanted to talk with regulars who were in a similar relationship,
but I had to take this to private email because of the loonies who
infest the group.
I won't say they aren't irksome or tiresome, but I don't want to dwell
on that, because it is a negative feeling and hurts me more than it
does them.
So you're saying, in effect, that your sole motivations are based on
logical righteous academic reasons? But I'm still asking the question
from an emotional point of view - what is the payoff for you? What do
you feel, not how you justify it.
To me, that represents a better understanding of oneself.
You might say I do the right things for the wrong reasons. I think of
myself as honest, logical, intelligent, and "good," if a little too
narcist and egotistical. In order to feed my ego, I have to be
honest, logical etc..
Emotion isn't bad, without it life would be empty indeed, but it can
color and affect objectivity, so you have to allow for it and try to
understand it.
I wonder about RL Measures too, he's gone silent, but I can't find any
reasons by searching on line. His business web site is still up and
running.