r***@yahoo.com
2018-07-11 17:27:38 UTC
My past postings here on the ancestry of Gov. Shirley's wife, Frances Barker, is available here:
http://soc.genealogy.medieval.narkive.com/nkPsgnws/possible-line-from-sir-walter-raleigh-s-sister-to-frances-barker-d-1746-wife-of-gov-william-shirley-
This showed that the four generations of Frances' immediate ancestry were probably:
Cavendish Sanderson, m. _______
Elizabeth Sanderson, m. William Gomeldon
Elizabeth Gomeldon, m. Francis Barker (d. 1710)
Frances Barker
It now looks like she might have some interesting lines through a Sanderson ancestress, Mary Ludlow, wife of (1) Giovanni da Ponte; (2) Sir Lewis Orrell; (3) Thomas Parker. The mother of Cavendish Sandersion was a niece of the half-blood of Sir Walter Raleigh the explorer. She and her husband William Saunderson named their sons after Raleigh and other explorers: Raleigh Saunderson, Carew Saunderson, and Cavendish Saunderson.
Margaret Snedall/ Snedale, mother of Cavendish and wife of William Saunderson, was the daughter of the half-sister of the famous Sir Walter Raleigh (Mary Raleigh, wife of Hugh Snedale).
https://books.google.com/books?id=9--2AAAAIAAJ&q=%22margaret+snedall%22&dq=%22margaret+snedall%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiLgsGshJPcAhUSn-AKHT-KDzoQ6AEITjAH
https://books.google.com/books?id=pdw5AQAAMAAJ&pg=PA289&dq=%22at+st+mary+arches+to+hugh%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjSlpX3kJPcAhXK61MKHVuUCBkQ6AEIKzAA#v=onepage&q=%22at%20st%20mary%20arches%20to%20hugh%22&f=false
For many years, everyone thought Mary (Raleigh) Snedale's mother was a Darrell/ Dorrell, but in 1981, an article seems to have established that Mary's mother, the second wife of Walter Rawley/ Raleigh the elder, was Elizabeth da Ponte, daughter of Giovanni da Ponte of London, by his "English wife." This English wife, mother-in-law of the first Walter Raleigh, after the death of da Ponte, "then remarried first Sir Lewis Orrell and then a London merchant named Parker, and was living in St. Helens Bishopgate."
https://www.google.com/search?tbm=bks&hl=en&q=%22walter+rawley+married+about%22+%22sir+lewis%22
https://books.google.com/books?id=d1VJAAAAMAAJ&q=%22walter+rawley+married+about%22+%22sir+lewis%22&dq=%22walter+rawley+married+about%22+%22sir+lewis%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwijsrGhkpPcAhXRvVMKHV8LClsQ6AEIKTAA
I suppose "Darrell/ Dorrell" was a mistake from her step-father being Sir Lewis Orrell.
Some background on the Saundersons:
https://books.google.com/books?id=BAoVAAAAQAAJ&pg=PR13&dq=%22william+sanderson%22+cavendish&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiHzrWKg5PcAhXDnOAKHVc5C1oQ6AEINTAC#v=onepage&q=%22william%20sanderson%22%20cavendish&f=false
Statement that Giovanni da Ponte's widow was an "English" woman:
https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&tbm=bks&ei=qOxDW7nnJdDbzwKru7X4DA&q=%22married+Mary%2C+English+widow%22&oq=%22married+Mary%2C+English+widow%22&gs_l=psy-ab.3...17838.19100.0.19370.2.2.0.0.0.0.54.98.2.2.0....0...1c.1.64.psy-ab..0.0.0....0.NcDpWdWIOvY
Lady Orrell, widow of Sir Lewis Orrell, and her last husband (Parker):
https://books.google.com/books?id=CXBGAAAAQBAJ&pg=PA93&dq=%22lady+orell+the+widow%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwit2rjgk5PcAhWK61MKHSW7D8MQ6AEIKTAA#v=onepage&q=%22lady%20orell%20the%20widow%22&f=false
Interestingly the Shropshire Visitation shows an Elizabeth (? sic) Ludlow, daughter of Maurice Ludlow, who married (1) ... "Pount of London"; (2) Sir Lewis Orrell; (3) unknown husband (apparently Parker).
https://books.google.com/books?id=HC8EAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA341&dq=%22moris+ludlow%22+stoaks+orrell&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjEn9aIlJPcAhWKyVMKHb2BA5kQ6AEIKzAA#v=onepage&q=%22moris%20ludlow%22%20stoaks%20orrell&f=false
This is a very similar pattern to the names and sequence of husbands of the Lady Orrell who was supposed to be mother to Walter Raleigh's second wife, Elizabeth da Ponte.
The same lady, under Christian name of Mary, but shown as daughter of Maurice Ludlow, and assigned marriages to Pount, Orrell, & Parker, in that precise order, is shown in genealogics.org as a descendant of Sancha de Ayala:
https://genealogics.org/pedigree.php?personID=I00689738&tree=LEO
Does anybody have thoughts on the validity of this whole descent (Sancha de Ayala to Frances Barker Shirley)?
__________
I noticed that a "Candidge Saunderson" had a son William baptized at St. Vedast, London, in 1619:
https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=nyp.33433081829446;view=1up;seq=59
Cavendish Saunderson was apparently still living in 1621:
https://books.google.com/books?id=bIhAAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA322&dq=%22cavendish+sanderson%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiVlY_klZPcAhVI0FMKHUfjCwUQ6AEIKTAA#v=onepage&q=%22cavendish%20sanderson%22&f=false
The source below adds the following details on Cavendish and daughter Elizabeth: "Elizabeth Sanders (or Sanderson or Saunderson) was the daughter of Cavendish and Elizabeth Saunderson. She was baptised 28 Mar 1621 at St Bartholomew the Less, Middlesex. Her parents' marriage: Candishe Sandersole, gent married Elizabeth Whethers maiden 18 Jan 1616 at St Bride Fleet Street."
http://martleweb.co.uk/gumbleton/people/H0002a.html
http://soc.genealogy.medieval.narkive.com/nkPsgnws/possible-line-from-sir-walter-raleigh-s-sister-to-frances-barker-d-1746-wife-of-gov-william-shirley-
This showed that the four generations of Frances' immediate ancestry were probably:
Cavendish Sanderson, m. _______
Elizabeth Sanderson, m. William Gomeldon
Elizabeth Gomeldon, m. Francis Barker (d. 1710)
Frances Barker
It now looks like she might have some interesting lines through a Sanderson ancestress, Mary Ludlow, wife of (1) Giovanni da Ponte; (2) Sir Lewis Orrell; (3) Thomas Parker. The mother of Cavendish Sandersion was a niece of the half-blood of Sir Walter Raleigh the explorer. She and her husband William Saunderson named their sons after Raleigh and other explorers: Raleigh Saunderson, Carew Saunderson, and Cavendish Saunderson.
Margaret Snedall/ Snedale, mother of Cavendish and wife of William Saunderson, was the daughter of the half-sister of the famous Sir Walter Raleigh (Mary Raleigh, wife of Hugh Snedale).
https://books.google.com/books?id=9--2AAAAIAAJ&q=%22margaret+snedall%22&dq=%22margaret+snedall%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiLgsGshJPcAhUSn-AKHT-KDzoQ6AEITjAH
https://books.google.com/books?id=pdw5AQAAMAAJ&pg=PA289&dq=%22at+st+mary+arches+to+hugh%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjSlpX3kJPcAhXK61MKHVuUCBkQ6AEIKzAA#v=onepage&q=%22at%20st%20mary%20arches%20to%20hugh%22&f=false
For many years, everyone thought Mary (Raleigh) Snedale's mother was a Darrell/ Dorrell, but in 1981, an article seems to have established that Mary's mother, the second wife of Walter Rawley/ Raleigh the elder, was Elizabeth da Ponte, daughter of Giovanni da Ponte of London, by his "English wife." This English wife, mother-in-law of the first Walter Raleigh, after the death of da Ponte, "then remarried first Sir Lewis Orrell and then a London merchant named Parker, and was living in St. Helens Bishopgate."
https://www.google.com/search?tbm=bks&hl=en&q=%22walter+rawley+married+about%22+%22sir+lewis%22
https://books.google.com/books?id=d1VJAAAAMAAJ&q=%22walter+rawley+married+about%22+%22sir+lewis%22&dq=%22walter+rawley+married+about%22+%22sir+lewis%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwijsrGhkpPcAhXRvVMKHV8LClsQ6AEIKTAA
I suppose "Darrell/ Dorrell" was a mistake from her step-father being Sir Lewis Orrell.
Some background on the Saundersons:
https://books.google.com/books?id=BAoVAAAAQAAJ&pg=PR13&dq=%22william+sanderson%22+cavendish&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiHzrWKg5PcAhXDnOAKHVc5C1oQ6AEINTAC#v=onepage&q=%22william%20sanderson%22%20cavendish&f=false
Statement that Giovanni da Ponte's widow was an "English" woman:
https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&tbm=bks&ei=qOxDW7nnJdDbzwKru7X4DA&q=%22married+Mary%2C+English+widow%22&oq=%22married+Mary%2C+English+widow%22&gs_l=psy-ab.3...17838.19100.0.19370.2.2.0.0.0.0.54.98.2.2.0....0...1c.1.64.psy-ab..0.0.0....0.NcDpWdWIOvY
Lady Orrell, widow of Sir Lewis Orrell, and her last husband (Parker):
https://books.google.com/books?id=CXBGAAAAQBAJ&pg=PA93&dq=%22lady+orell+the+widow%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwit2rjgk5PcAhWK61MKHSW7D8MQ6AEIKTAA#v=onepage&q=%22lady%20orell%20the%20widow%22&f=false
Interestingly the Shropshire Visitation shows an Elizabeth (? sic) Ludlow, daughter of Maurice Ludlow, who married (1) ... "Pount of London"; (2) Sir Lewis Orrell; (3) unknown husband (apparently Parker).
https://books.google.com/books?id=HC8EAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA341&dq=%22moris+ludlow%22+stoaks+orrell&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjEn9aIlJPcAhWKyVMKHb2BA5kQ6AEIKzAA#v=onepage&q=%22moris%20ludlow%22%20stoaks%20orrell&f=false
This is a very similar pattern to the names and sequence of husbands of the Lady Orrell who was supposed to be mother to Walter Raleigh's second wife, Elizabeth da Ponte.
The same lady, under Christian name of Mary, but shown as daughter of Maurice Ludlow, and assigned marriages to Pount, Orrell, & Parker, in that precise order, is shown in genealogics.org as a descendant of Sancha de Ayala:
https://genealogics.org/pedigree.php?personID=I00689738&tree=LEO
Does anybody have thoughts on the validity of this whole descent (Sancha de Ayala to Frances Barker Shirley)?
__________
I noticed that a "Candidge Saunderson" had a son William baptized at St. Vedast, London, in 1619:
https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=nyp.33433081829446;view=1up;seq=59
Cavendish Saunderson was apparently still living in 1621:
https://books.google.com/books?id=bIhAAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA322&dq=%22cavendish+sanderson%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiVlY_klZPcAhVI0FMKHUfjCwUQ6AEIKTAA#v=onepage&q=%22cavendish%20sanderson%22&f=false
The source below adds the following details on Cavendish and daughter Elizabeth: "Elizabeth Sanders (or Sanderson or Saunderson) was the daughter of Cavendish and Elizabeth Saunderson. She was baptised 28 Mar 1621 at St Bartholomew the Less, Middlesex. Her parents' marriage: Candishe Sandersole, gent married Elizabeth Whethers maiden 18 Jan 1616 at St Bride Fleet Street."
http://martleweb.co.uk/gumbleton/people/H0002a.html