Biden Afghan Debacle

On Wed, 18 Aug 2021 11:04:48 -0700

Post by El Castor
"Joe Biden Loses Ground With Independents as Approval Rating Drops
Amid Afghanistan Debacle"
"Joe Biden's approval rating has sunk below 50 percent for the first
time in his presidency as he loses ground among independent voters."
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/joe-biden-loses-ground-with-independents-as-approval-rating-drops-amid-afghanistan-debacle/ar-AANsIv8
As I heard on the news this morning, this debacle wasn't the result of
a bad plan, it was no plan. As of this morning more than 10,000 US
citizens remain in Afghanistan and many more Afghans who worked with
them. What's next? Public executions? We are clearly so weak and
disorganized I wouldn't be surprised if China decided to "reunite"
Taiwan. Biden and his incompetent crew should be impeached.

Wouldn't it make sense to get the American civilians out of the country
first, and the military last?

I agree we need to get out of Afghanistan and never get into a similar
situation. Let countries solve their own problems.

It's seems strange to me that after twenty years of occupation,
Afghanistan didn't have an army capable of holding the country on their
own.

There wasn't even an army able to keep control of the Capitol, as can
be seen by the president fleeing the country.

Twenty five hundred Americans died for nothing.

El Castor

2021-08-19 01:46:48 UTC

Post by Johnny
On Wed, 18 Aug 2021 11:04:48 -0700

A few loads of bombs and a warning that we would be back with more if
they continued to support Al Qaeda would have been sufficient.

Post by Johnny
It's seems strange to me that after twenty years of occupation,
Afghanistan didn't have an army capable of holding the country on their
own.

Afghanistan is Islam, and so is the Taliban -- Islam owns both and a
few years of Infidel incursion is not going to change that.

Post by Johnny
There wasn't even an army able to keep control of the Capitol, as can
be seen by the president fleeing the country.

There was an Islamic army capable of controlling the country and it's
called the Taliban. This is nothing new. Invaders of Afganistan
traditionally leave with their tale between their legs. Invasion was a
huge mistake, rivaled only by Vietnam. We've just started paying the
price -- a price much higher because of Biden's stupidity. I tuned to
CNN tonite and saw something astonishing -- unabashed criticism of
Biden.

Post by Johnny
Twenty five hundred Americans died for nothing.

58,000 US soldiers died useless deaths in Vietnam, a war in which I
participated. That doesn't excuse Afghanistan, but it is time we woke
up.

Josh Rosenbluth

2021-08-19 01:55:53 UTC

Post by Johnny
On Wed, 18 Aug 2021 11:04:48 -0700

A few loads of bombs and a warning that we would be back with more if
they continued to support Al Qaeda would have been sufficient.

The deal included the Taliban pledging not to support international
terrorism.

Post by Johnny
It's seems strange to me that after twenty years of occupation,
Afghanistan didn't have an army capable of holding the country on their
own.

Afghanistan is Islam, and so is the Taliban -- Islam owns both and a
few years of Infidel incursion is not going to change that.

The Afghani victims of the Taliban are almost all Muslims.

El Castor

2021-08-19 05:54:49 UTC

On Wed, 18 Aug 2021 18:55:53 -0700, Josh Rosenbluth

Post by Johnny
On Wed, 18 Aug 2021 11:04:48 -0700

A few loads of bombs and a warning that we would be back with more if
they continued to support Al Qaeda would have been sufficient.

The deal included the Taliban pledging not to support international
terrorism.

Islam condones lies to the Infidel if those lies are told in the
interests of furthering the interests of Islam. They have a truce
strategy recommended by Mohamad -- the Hudna, a measured halt in
hostilities to allow the Muslims forces to re-group and re-arm.

"Does Islam permit Muslims to lie?
Muslim scholars teach that Muslims should generally be truthful to
each other, unless the purpose of lying is to "smooth over
differences" or "gain the upper-hand over an enemy."
There are several forms of lying to non-believers that are permitted
under certain circumstances, the best known being taqiyya (the Shia
name). These circumstances are typically those that advance the cause
of Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in
order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them."
https://www.thereligionofpeace.com/pages/quran/taqiyya.aspx

Post by Johnny
It's seems strange to me that after twenty years of occupation,
Afghanistan didn't have an army capable of holding the country on their
own.

Afghanistan is Islam, and so is the Taliban -- Islam owns both and a
few years of Infidel incursion is not going to change that.

The Afghani victims of the Taliban are almost all Muslims.

The pre-occupation Taliban is notorious for its soccer stadium
executions, but the fate of the 10,000+ Americans still in Afghanistan
is up in the air. I would guess (just a guess) that the Taliban would
ultimately encourage them to leave. Killing them would cause trouble,
and they most likely want to be rid of almost all of the Infidel
bastards. The Afghans who worked with the Infidels may be a much
different story.

Josh Rosenbluth

2021-08-18 23:57:01 UTC

The Taliban would be very foolish not to let all the Americans out
unharmed. That was the reason they signed on to Trump's deal: no war
with America in exchange for the Taliban getting to do whatever they
want to everyone else.

Johnny

2021-08-19 00:14:23 UTC

On Wed, 18 Aug 2021 16:57:01 -0700

Post by El Castor
"Joe Biden Loses Ground With Independents as Approval Rating Drops
Amid Afghanistan Debacle"
"Joe Biden's approval rating has sunk below 50 percent for the first
time in his presidency as he loses ground among independent voters."
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/joe-biden-loses-ground-with-independents-as-approval-rating-drops-amid-afghanistan-debacle/ar-AANsIv8
As I heard on the news this morning, this debacle wasn't the result
of a bad plan, it was no plan. As of this morning more than 10,000
US citizens remain in Afghanistan and many more Afghans who worked
with them. What's next? Public executions? We are clearly so weak
and disorganized I wouldn't be surprised if China decided to
"reunite" Taiwan. Biden and his incompetent crew should be
impeached.

I doubt Trump's deal said they could do anything they wanted to to
everyone else. That would have happened anyway.

We need to get out of Afghanistan, Trump could have done a better job
of that than what Biden has done.

Josh Rosenbluth

2021-08-19 00:37:36 UTC

Post by Johnny
On Wed, 18 Aug 2021 16:57:01 -0700

Post by El Castor
"Joe Biden Loses Ground With Independents as Approval Rating Drops
Amid Afghanistan Debacle"
"Joe Biden's approval rating has sunk below 50 percent for the first
time in his presidency as he loses ground among independent voters."
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/joe-biden-loses-ground-with-independents-as-approval-rating-drops-amid-afghanistan-debacle/ar-AANsIv8
As I heard on the news this morning, this debacle wasn't the result
of a bad plan, it was no plan. As of this morning more than 10,000
US citizens remain in Afghanistan and many more Afghans who worked
with them. What's next? Public executions? We are clearly so weak
and disorganized I wouldn't be surprised if China decided to
"reunite" Taiwan. Biden and his incompetent crew should be
impeached.

I doubt Trump's deal said they could do anything they wanted to to
everyone else. That would have happened anyway.

The deal didn't put any restraints on what the Taliban could to do others.

Post by Johnny
We need to get out of Afghanistan, Trump could have done a better job
of that than what Biden has done.

He could have, but I doubt he would have. As former defense secretary
Esper said this week, Trump wanted to pull the troops out by Christmas
of 2020 (the deal called for them out by May, 2021) and the quicker the
troops come out, the more likely the mess about getting people out
results. Also, Trump left no plan for Biden.

And, we have Pence blaming Biden (in a WSJ editorial) for the Taliban
takeover because the withdrawal was extended to September. It takes a
lot of chutzpah to claim an earlier withdrawal would have stopped a
Taliban takeover.

All that being said, Biden owns the consequences of not getting the
people out, especially since he gave himself more time. He fucked it up.
However, I predict at worst only a temporary political penalty. Folks
won't care in the long term so long as the Americans get safely out (and
as I said, the Taliban would be stupid not to allow that).

El Castor

2021-08-19 19:16:36 UTC

On Wed, 18 Aug 2021 17:37:36 -0700, Josh Rosenbluth

Post by Johnny
On Wed, 18 Aug 2021 16:57:01 -0700

Post by El Castor
"Joe Biden Loses Ground With Independents as Approval Rating Drops
Amid Afghanistan Debacle"
"Joe Biden's approval rating has sunk below 50 percent for the first
time in his presidency as he loses ground among independent voters."
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/joe-biden-loses-ground-with-independents-as-approval-rating-drops-amid-afghanistan-debacle/ar-AANsIv8
As I heard on the news this morning, this debacle wasn't the result
of a bad plan, it was no plan. As of this morning more than 10,000
US citizens remain in Afghanistan and many more Afghans who worked
with them. What's next? Public executions? We are clearly so weak
and disorganized I wouldn't be surprised if China decided to
"reunite" Taiwan. Biden and his incompetent crew should be
impeached.

I doubt Trump's deal said they could do anything they wanted to to
everyone else. That would have happened anyway.

The deal didn't put any restraints on what the Taliban could to do others.

Post by Johnny
We need to get out of Afghanistan, Trump could have done a better job
of that than what Biden has done.

He could have, but I doubt he would have. As former defense secretary
Esper said this week, Trump wanted to pull the troops out by Christmas
of 2020 (the deal called for them out by May, 2021) and the quicker the
troops come out, the more likely the mess about getting people out
results. Also, Trump left no plan for Biden.
And, we have Pence blaming Biden (in a WSJ editorial) for the Taliban
takeover because the withdrawal was extended to September. It takes a
lot of chutzpah to claim an earlier withdrawal would have stopped a
Taliban takeover.
All that being said, Biden owns the consequences of not getting the
people out, especially since he gave himself more time. He fucked it up.
However, I predict at worst only a temporary political penalty. Folks
won't care in the long term so long as the Americans get safely out (and
as I said, the Taliban would be stupid not to allow that).

Temporary? This collapse in Afghanistan is historic and leaves the US
looking weak and indecisive. Combine that with Biden's disastrous
border policies, out of control spending, an energy policy that
betrays agreements with Canada and our own production and leaves us
dependent on Middle Eastern oil, a deal with Iran that puts them back
on a nuclear track, etc, and what have we got to look forward to --
court packing and statehood for DC and Guam? Yikes!

Josh Rosenbluth

2021-08-19 23:39:12 UTC

Post by El Castor
On Wed, 18 Aug 2021 17:37:36 -0700, Josh Rosenbluth

Post by Johnny
On Wed, 18 Aug 2021 16:57:01 -0700

Post by El Castor
"Joe Biden Loses Ground With Independents as Approval Rating Drops
Amid Afghanistan Debacle"
"Joe Biden's approval rating has sunk below 50 percent for the first
time in his presidency as he loses ground among independent voters."
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/joe-biden-loses-ground-with-independents-as-approval-rating-drops-amid-afghanistan-debacle/ar-AANsIv8
As I heard on the news this morning, this debacle wasn't the result
of a bad plan, it was no plan. As of this morning more than 10,000
US citizens remain in Afghanistan and many more Afghans who worked
with them. What's next? Public executions? We are clearly so weak
and disorganized I wouldn't be surprised if China decided to
"reunite" Taiwan. Biden and his incompetent crew should be
impeached.

I doubt Trump's deal said they could do anything they wanted to to
everyone else. That would have happened anyway.

The deal didn't put any restraints on what the Taliban could to do others.

Post by Johnny
We need to get out of Afghanistan, Trump could have done a better job
of that than what Biden has done.

He could have, but I doubt he would have. As former defense secretary
Esper said this week, Trump wanted to pull the troops out by Christmas
of 2020 (the deal called for them out by May, 2021) and the quicker the
troops come out, the more likely the mess about getting people out
results. Also, Trump left no plan for Biden.
And, we have Pence blaming Biden (in a WSJ editorial) for the Taliban
takeover because the withdrawal was extended to September. It takes a
lot of chutzpah to claim an earlier withdrawal would have stopped a
Taliban takeover.
All that being said, Biden owns the consequences of not getting the
people out, especially since he gave himself more time. He fucked it up.
However, I predict at worst only a temporary political penalty. Folks
won't care in the long term so long as the Americans get safely out (and
as I said, the Taliban would be stupid not to allow that).

Temporary? This collapse in Afghanistan is historic and leaves the US
looking weak and indecisive.

The majority wanted out so they don't view withdrawal as weak indecisive.

El Castor

2021-08-20 05:54:55 UTC

On Thu, 19 Aug 2021 16:39:12 -0700, Josh Rosenbluth

Post by El Castor
On Wed, 18 Aug 2021 17:37:36 -0700, Josh Rosenbluth

Post by Johnny
On Wed, 18 Aug 2021 16:57:01 -0700

Post by El Castor
"Joe Biden Loses Ground With Independents as Approval Rating Drops
Amid Afghanistan Debacle"
"Joe Biden's approval rating has sunk below 50 percent for the first
time in his presidency as he loses ground among independent voters."
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/joe-biden-loses-ground-with-independents-as-approval-rating-drops-amid-afghanistan-debacle/ar-AANsIv8
As I heard on the news this morning, this debacle wasn't the result
of a bad plan, it was no plan. As of this morning more than 10,000
US citizens remain in Afghanistan and many more Afghans who worked
with them. What's next? Public executions? We are clearly so weak
and disorganized I wouldn't be surprised if China decided to
"reunite" Taiwan. Biden and his incompetent crew should be
impeached.

I doubt Trump's deal said they could do anything they wanted to to
everyone else. That would have happened anyway.

The deal didn't put any restraints on what the Taliban could to do others.

Post by Johnny
We need to get out of Afghanistan, Trump could have done a better job
of that than what Biden has done.

He could have, but I doubt he would have. As former defense secretary
Esper said this week, Trump wanted to pull the troops out by Christmas
of 2020 (the deal called for them out by May, 2021) and the quicker the
troops come out, the more likely the mess about getting people out
results. Also, Trump left no plan for Biden.
And, we have Pence blaming Biden (in a WSJ editorial) for the Taliban
takeover because the withdrawal was extended to September. It takes a
lot of chutzpah to claim an earlier withdrawal would have stopped a
Taliban takeover.
All that being said, Biden owns the consequences of not getting the
people out, especially since he gave himself more time. He fucked it up.
However, I predict at worst only a temporary political penalty. Folks
won't care in the long term so long as the Americans get safely out (and
as I said, the Taliban would be stupid not to allow that).

Temporary? This collapse in Afghanistan is historic and leaves the US
looking weak and indecisive.

The majority wanted out so they don't view withdrawal as weak indecisive.

I wanted out and don't think we should have gone there in the first
place. However, the way Biden went about it was appalling -- as you
said, he "fucked it up". Biden's fuck up makes us look weak and
indecisive -- unfortunate in a world in which Iran clearly wants one
or more nuclear weapons and a China that just seized control of Hong
Kong and is clearly interested in Taiwan, and who knows what else.

"China portrays the U.S. as weak and unreliable to draw Taiwan
closer, analyst says" ...
"Chinese state media said the countrys military conducted assault
drills near Taiwan on Tuesday in response to interference from
external forces.
Rodger Baker of Stratfor said the exercise coincided with Chinese
state media reports that attempted to paint the U.S. as a weak and
unreliable power in Afghanistan."
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/08/19/china-warns-taiwan-about-us-commitment-by-highlighting-afghanistan-retreat-analyst.html

Josh Rosenbluth

2021-08-20 15:47:10 UTC

Post by El Castor
On Thu, 19 Aug 2021 16:39:12 -0700, Josh Rosenbluth

Post by El Castor
On Wed, 18 Aug 2021 17:37:36 -0700, Josh Rosenbluth

Post by Johnny
On Wed, 18 Aug 2021 16:57:01 -0700

Post by El Castor
"Joe Biden Loses Ground With Independents as Approval Rating Drops
Amid Afghanistan Debacle"
"Joe Biden's approval rating has sunk below 50 percent for the first
time in his presidency as he loses ground among independent voters."
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/joe-biden-loses-ground-with-independents-as-approval-rating-drops-amid-afghanistan-debacle/ar-AANsIv8
As I heard on the news this morning, this debacle wasn't the result
of a bad plan, it was no plan. As of this morning more than 10,000
US citizens remain in Afghanistan and many more Afghans who worked
with them. What's next? Public executions? We are clearly so weak
and disorganized I wouldn't be surprised if China decided to
"reunite" Taiwan. Biden and his incompetent crew should be
impeached.

I doubt Trump's deal said they could do anything they wanted to to
everyone else. That would have happened anyway.

The deal didn't put any restraints on what the Taliban could to do others.

Post by Johnny
We need to get out of Afghanistan, Trump could have done a better job
of that than what Biden has done.

He could have, but I doubt he would have. As former defense secretary
Esper said this week, Trump wanted to pull the troops out by Christmas
of 2020 (the deal called for them out by May, 2021) and the quicker the
troops come out, the more likely the mess about getting people out
results. Also, Trump left no plan for Biden.
And, we have Pence blaming Biden (in a WSJ editorial) for the Taliban
takeover because the withdrawal was extended to September. It takes a
lot of chutzpah to claim an earlier withdrawal would have stopped a
Taliban takeover.
All that being said, Biden owns the consequences of not getting the
people out, especially since he gave himself more time. He fucked it up.
However, I predict at worst only a temporary political penalty. Folks
won't care in the long term so long as the Americans get safely out (and
as I said, the Taliban would be stupid not to allow that).

Temporary? This collapse in Afghanistan is historic and leaves the US
looking weak and indecisive.

The majority wanted out so they don't view withdrawal as weak indecisive.

Biden was resolute in his decision to withdraw. The fuckup calls into
question his competence.

Post by El Castor
"China portrays the U.S. as ‘weak and unreliable’ to draw Taiwan
closer, analyst says" ...
"Chinese state media said the country’s military conducted assault
drills near Taiwan on Tuesday in response to “interference from
external forces.”
Rodger Baker of Stratfor said the exercise coincided with Chinese
state media reports that attempted to paint the U.S. as a “weak and
unreliable power” in Afghanistan."
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/08/19/china-warns-taiwan-about-us-commitment-by-highlighting-afghanistan-retreat-analyst.html

I'm shocked, shocked that China would announce an unflattering
characterization of the US.

El Castor

2021-08-20 17:57:33 UTC