Post by k***@gmail.comPost by ZodPost by George J. DancePost by ZodPost by George J. DancePost by Gilad TimmingsPost by ZodPost by George J. DanceLeonard Cohen, Villanelle for Our Time
(lyrics by F.R. Scott)
From bitter searching of the heart,
Quickened with passion and with pain
We rise to play a greater part
[...]
pennyspoetry.fandom.com/wiki/F.R._Scott?file=Leonard_Cohen_-_Villanelle_For_Our_Time
Interesting back story,,,,
Do you ever analyze these poems based off the schemas by which their
written?
I do, of course. That's a villanelle; it can be a powerful form. (i've written 2 of them. You?)
Post by Gilad TimmingsAre you here to study other’s verse to get better?
I came here to do that. nowadaya I still try to, but don't often succeed; I hope that's due to me getting better, not the group getting worse.
Post by Gilad TimmingsWho is really
trying to improve here? I see much stagnation of thought and imagination;
very little in the way of broadening oneself, or at least trying something
new for you...
When I was trying to keep up with the poem-a-week thing (Nov-Mar), I set myself a task of a different form each week, but I had to let the content dictate it. It worked out well, I thought.
Post by Gilad TimmingsPlease, let me know where I’m wrong and give me some examples I am missing
of this betterment...
--
Gilad
I thought at first G.T. was asking me,,,,,
i thought he was, too, but I wanted to answer him. i'm probably the person most interested in poetic forms here; if he is, too, I'd be happy to talk to him about them. Up to now he and I haven't really talked about anything.
I'm pretty much strictly modern free form of course, could be why G.T. was needling me...
I think GT is gently prodding Zod to analyze a poem in more detail. What does he like about it? What does he think a poem is about? Did the poet convey his ideas effectively in the poem and why?
I suspect you're right; but, as you probably also realize, I was gently prodding GT to discuss the subject with me. He seems to be quite interested in poetics, but he seems to be trying to work it all out by himself, wasting time trying to reinvent the wheel in my mind.
In that way he reminds me a lot of a facebook friend of mine, Richard Oakley, who used to post here - he had much the same concerns, but seemed to want to discuss them with everyone but me. It's frustrating to go down the same road with GT.
Post by k***@gmail.comI find form interesting, sort of like a puzzle.
Yes indeed. Nowadays I see a form as a template; the challenge being to fit what I want to say, and only that much, to exactly fill the template. It is very much like a puzzle, but with the bonus that it's a puzzle with a unique solution every time.
Post by k***@gmail.comVillanelles, with the repeated 1st and 3rd lines, is usually better suited to light verse than a serious subject as in Scott's poem.
I can give you several counterexamples - forget my two villanelles, but look at "Do Not Go Gentle..." or Robinson's "House on the Hill."
Or this one; I think it's wonderful that the poet tried to make it look like a modern, free-verse poem, so that most readers don't even know it's a villanelle - yet the power of the form is still there; I've had many readers (mainly youth without much background reading of poetry, admittedly) tell me how disturbing, even haunting, they found the poem:
R.S. Mallari, "Ghosts of Uncertainties"
https://gdancesbetty.blogspot.com/2014/11/ghosts-of-uncertainties-rs-mallari.html
Post by k***@gmail.comI think Zod just enjoys reading poetry and lets us know.
I do agree with that. While he's always bumped Will's work, the bulk of what he used to do here, when he first came, was bumping lost poems from the archives, many if not most of which I enjoyed reading. I also enjoy talking poetics with him, as he's s also keenly interested in writing better poetry - so he lets me lecture him about poetics. I suspect he's tolerating me as much as learning from me, but it's all good, as it gets me to set my own thoughts down in writing.