So NZ is going electric?

[John Bowes]

Wonder when they're going to start building power stations rather than concentrating on unreliable solar and wind? Before Rich gets all whiney both of these have serious shortcomings when it comes to reliability. One has to remember solar is only any good during sunny days and doesn't provide anything at peak hours during winter! Turbines need wind and funnily enough produce nothing in calm weather.
The thing the government seems to be ignoring is plans (yeah I know planning ain't one of this governments strong points) to build new power stations that use one resource we have plenty of and that's geothermal energy. New Zealand should be taking a leaf out of Iceland's book and be hell bent on finding good sights to build these. Auckland, Taupo and the volcanic plateau are perfect places to do this and should be used!
Hell if we want to keep all our electrical devices running plus encouraging the use of electric cars we should have the first holes being drilled and foundations for geothermal stations being laid now! After all 2030 is an important date and it's only nine years away and the government has failed to actually do anything which is no surprise to many here :)

[Gordon]

Post by John Bowes
Wonder when they're going to start building power stations rather
than concentrating on unreliable solar and wind? Before Rich gets
all whiney both of these have serious shortcomings when it comes
to reliability. One has to remember solar is only any good during
sunny days and doesn't provide anything at peak hours during winter!
Turbines need wind and funnily enough produce nothing in calm weather.

It is imprtant to remember that NZ has a mix of generation methods. Okay so
wind and solar are not 24/7 but while they are working the hydro stations
can ease off and save the water for when the solar and wind go to zero.

NZ does have already have 1096MW of geothermal generation.

Remember also that NZ is one of the windest country on the planet. It sits
in the roaring forties.

So lets talk about the elephant in the room. Nuclear power. No CO2 emissions
while in use, goes 24/7 for years and if we get rid of the water cooling
with some sodium salts melt down risk gone.

Post by John Bowes
The thing the government seems to be ignoring is plans (yeah
I know planning ain't one of this governments strong points) to
build new power stations that use one resource we have plenty of
and that's geothermal energy. New Zealand should be taking a leaf
out of Iceland's book and be hell bent on finding good sights to
build these. Auckland, Taupo and the volcanic plateau are perfect
places to do this and should be used!
Hell if we want to keep all our electrical devices running plus encouraging the use of electric cars we should have the first holes being drilled and foundations for geothermal stations being laid now! After all 2030 is an important date and it's only nine years away and the government has failed to actually do anything which is no surprise to many here :)

[Tony]

Post by Gordon

Post by John Bowes
Wonder when they're going to start building power stations rather
than concentrating on unreliable solar and wind? Before Rich gets
all whiney both of these have serious shortcomings when it comes
to reliability. One has to remember solar is only any good during
sunny days and doesn't provide anything at peak hours during winter!
Turbines need wind and funnily enough produce nothing in calm weather.

It is imprtant to remember that NZ has a mix of generation methods. Okay so
wind and solar are not 24/7 but while they are working the hydro stations
can ease off and save the water for when the solar and wind go to zero.
NZ does have already have 1096MW of geothermal generation.
Remember also that NZ is one of the windest country on the planet. It sits
in the roaring forties.
So lets talk about the elephant in the room. Nuclear power. No CO2 emissions
while in use, goes 24/7 for years and if we get rid of the water cooling
with some sodium salts melt down risk gone.

Gordon it is not the elephant in the room except for those that do not
understand the technology.
Current fission nuclear plants are not ever going to be acceptable here, and
that is smart.
Fusion plants however will one day fairly soon be possible and then nuclear
generation is possible, safe and appropriate. Not at risk by earthquakes.
We need to keep the nuclear power discussion on the right lines by
differentiating between the two types.

Post by Gordon

Post by John Bowes
The thing the government seems to be ignoring is plans (yeah
I know planning ain't one of this governments strong points) to
build new power stations that use one resource we have plenty of
and that's geothermal energy. New Zealand should be taking a leaf
out of Iceland's book and be hell bent on finding good sights to
build these. Auckland, Taupo and the volcanic plateau are perfect
places to do this and should be used!
Hell if we want to keep all our electrical devices running plus encouraging
the use of electric cars we should have the first holes being drilled and
foundations for geothermal stations being laid now! After all 2030 is an
important date and it's only nine years away and the government has failed to
actually do anything which is no surprise to many here :)

[Rich80105]

On Thu, 27 May 2021 01:58:45 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net

Post by Tony

Post by Gordon

Post by John Bowes
Wonder when they're going to start building power stations rather
than concentrating on unreliable solar and wind? Before Rich gets
all whiney both of these have serious shortcomings when it comes
to reliability. One has to remember solar is only any good during
sunny days and doesn't provide anything at peak hours during winter!
Turbines need wind and funnily enough produce nothing in calm weather.

It is imprtant to remember that NZ has a mix of generation methods. Okay so
wind and solar are not 24/7 but while they are working the hydro stations
can ease off and save the water for when the solar and wind go to zero.
NZ does have already have 1096MW of geothermal generation.
Remember also that NZ is one of the windest country on the planet. It sits
in the roaring forties.
So lets talk about the elephant in the room. Nuclear power. No CO2 emissions
while in use, goes 24/7 for years and if we get rid of the water cooling
with some sodium salts melt down risk gone.

Gordon it is not the elephant in the room except for those that do not
understand the technology.
Current fission nuclear plants are not ever going to be acceptable here, and
that is smart.
Fusion plants however will one day fairly soon be possible and then nuclear
generation is possible, safe and appropriate. Not at risk by earthquakes.
We need to keep the nuclear power discussion on the right lines by
differentiating between the two types.

There has been talk of fusion generation for a very long time, but it
may be getting closer:
https://www.livescience.com/nuclear-fusion-reactor-sparc-2025.html

2035 for the first plant may mean a few more years after that for New
Zealand.

I am not sure why you say they would not be at risk from earthquakes -
can you explain, Tony?

Post by Tony

Post by Gordon

Post by John Bowes
The thing the government seems to be ignoring is plans (yeah
I know planning ain't one of this governments strong points) to
build new power stations that use one resource we have plenty of
and that's geothermal energy. New Zealand should be taking a leaf
out of Iceland's book and be hell bent on finding good sights to
build these. Auckland, Taupo and the volcanic plateau are perfect
places to do this and should be used!
Hell if we want to keep all our electrical devices running plus encouraging
the use of electric cars we should have the first holes being drilled and
foundations for geothermal stations being laid now! After all 2030 is an
important date and it's only nine years away and the government has failed to
actually do anything which is no surprise to many here :)

[Tony]

Post by Rich80105
On Thu, 27 May 2021 01:58:45 -0500, Tony <lizandtony at orcon dot net

Post by Tony

Post by Gordon

Post by John Bowes
Wonder when they're going to start building power stations rather
than concentrating on unreliable solar and wind? Before Rich gets
all whiney both of these have serious shortcomings when it comes
to reliability. One has to remember solar is only any good during
sunny days and doesn't provide anything at peak hours during winter!
Turbines need wind and funnily enough produce nothing in calm weather.

It is imprtant to remember that NZ has a mix of generation methods. Okay so
wind and solar are not 24/7 but while they are working the hydro stations
can ease off and save the water for when the solar and wind go to zero.
NZ does have already have 1096MW of geothermal generation.
Remember also that NZ is one of the windest country on the planet. It sits
in the roaring forties.
So lets talk about the elephant in the room. Nuclear power. No CO2 emissions
while in use, goes 24/7 for years and if we get rid of the water cooling
with some sodium salts melt down risk gone.

Gordon it is not the elephant in the room except for those that do not
understand the technology.
Current fission nuclear plants are not ever going to be acceptable here, and
that is smart.
Fusion plants however will one day fairly soon be possible and then nuclear
generation is possible, safe and appropriate. Not at risk by earthquakes.
We need to keep the nuclear power discussion on the right lines by
differentiating between the two types.

There has been talk of fusion generation for a very long time, but it
https://www.livescience.com/nuclear-fusion-reactor-sparc-2025.html
2035 for the first plant may mean a few more years after that for New
Zealand.
I am not sure why you say they would not be at risk from earthquakes -
can you explain, Tony?

Not hard, I think it is obvious.
The issue with fission reactors in an earthquake is that the containment can be
ruptured and very nasty stuff gets out. There is none of that nasty stuff in a
fusion reactor (there is a little low level stuff only).
Put another way. Just about anything we build can be destroyed by an earthquake
and for a fusion reactor the consequences are little different to that of a
supermarket for example. A fission reactor in an earthquake would have much
worse consequences.

Post by Rich80105

Post by Tony

Post by Gordon

Post by John Bowes
The thing the government seems to be ignoring is plans (yeah
I know planning ain't one of this governments strong points) to
build new power stations that use one resource we have plenty of
and that's geothermal energy. New Zealand should be taking a leaf
out of Iceland's book and be hell bent on finding good sights to
build these. Auckland, Taupo and the volcanic plateau are perfect
places to do this and should be used!
Hell if we want to keep all our electrical devices running plus encouraging
the use of electric cars we should have the first holes being drilled and
foundations for geothermal stations being laid now! After all 2030 is an
important date and it's only nine years away and the government has failed to
actually do anything which is no surprise to many here :)

[BR]

On Wed, 26 May 2021 15:04:48 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes

Post by John Bowes
Wonder when they're going to start building power stations rather than concentrating on unreliable solar and wind? Before Rich gets all whiney both of these have serious shortcomings when it comes to reliability. One has to remember solar is only any good during sunny days and doesn't provide anything at peak hours during winter! Turbines need wind and funnily enough produce nothing in calm weather.
The thing the government seems to be ignoring is plans (yeah I know planning ain't one of this governments strong points) to build new power stations that use one resource we have plenty of and that's geothermal energy. New Zealand should be taking a leaf out of Iceland's book and be hell bent on finding good sights to build these. Auckland, Taupo and the volcanic plateau are perfect places to do this and should be used!
Hell if we want to keep all our electrical devices running plus encouraging the use of electric cars we should have the first holes being drilled and foundations for geothermal stations being laid now! After all 2030 is an important date and it's only nine years away and the government has failed to actually do anything which is no surprise to many here :)

Electric cars are a waste of time and money.

Petrol and diesel are cheap and plentiful, and have been proven
technology for more than 100 years.

If electric cars start to become fashionable, the price of power will
rise significantly as the country's generating capacity fails to keep
up with demand. Nowhere are there plans to build more power stations
to take up the slack, and wind and solar will never cut it. Not only
that, but what will the government's response be to the loss of the
excise taxes they currently extort from petrol sales? There are plans
to introduce road user charges on electric cars. It is has not yet
been revealed how much the RUCs are going to be, but if petrol taxes
are anything to go by, they will be substantial. They will likely
start off quite low, but they will rapidly increase if enough fools
abandon their petrol and diesel vehicles for an EV. Can anyone see
where this is going?

Electric vehicles are promoted as a way to offset "climate change".
All that stuff is just an excuse to frighten people into surrendering
their freedom and their money to power hungry politicians. There is no
evidence that there is any sort of climate problem, just a lot of
pseudo-scientific nonsense and a history of failed predictions going
back decades. If electric vehicles are so damn terrific, they would
sell themselves without the government baiting the hook with special
privileges and cost exemptions.

Bill.

[Tony]

Post by BR
On Wed, 26 May 2021 15:04:48 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes

Post by John Bowes
Wonder when they're going to start building power stations rather than
concentrating on unreliable solar and wind? Before Rich gets all whiney both of
these have serious shortcomings when it comes to reliability. One has to
remember solar is only any good during sunny days and doesn't provide anything
at peak hours during winter! Turbines need wind and funnily enough produce
nothing in calm weather.
The thing the government seems to be ignoring is plans (yeah I know planning
ain't one of this governments strong points) to build new power stations that
use one resource we have plenty of and that's geothermal energy. New Zealand
should be taking a leaf out of Iceland's book and be hell bent on finding good
sights to build these. Auckland, Taupo and the volcanic plateau are perfect
places to do this and should be used!
Hell if we want to keep all our electrical devices running plus encouraging
the use of electric cars we should have the first holes being drilled and
foundations for geothermal stations being laid now! After all 2030 is an
important date and it's only nine years away and the government has failed to
actually do anything which is no surprise to many here :)

Electric cars are a waste of time and money.
Petrol and diesel are cheap and plentiful, and have been proven
technology for more than 100 years.
If electric cars start to become fashionable, the price of power will
rise significantly as the country's generating capacity fails to keep
up with demand. Nowhere are there plans to build more power stations
to take up the slack, and wind and solar will never cut it. Not only
that, but what will the government's response be to the loss of the
excise taxes they currently extort from petrol sales? There are plans
to introduce road user charges on electric cars. It is has not yet
been revealed how much the RUCs are going to be, but if petrol taxes
are anything to go by, they will be substantial. They will likely
start off quite low, but they will rapidly increase if enough fools
abandon their petrol and diesel vehicles for an EV. Can anyone see
where this is going?
Electric vehicles are promoted as a way to offset "climate change".
All that stuff is just an excuse to frighten people into surrendering
their freedom and their money to power hungry politicians. There is no
evidence that there is any sort of climate problem, just a lot of
pseudo-scientific nonsense and a history of failed predictions going
back decades. If electric vehicles are so damn terrific, they would
sell themselves without the government baiting the hook with special
privileges and cost exemptions.
Bill.
--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

There are hundreds of EVs sitting in a field in France that cannot be repaired
because the essential replacement batteries will cost twice as much as the
car's original price and they cannot go to a landfill because the issues with
reclaiming lithium are yet to be resolved.
Here is something along the same lines but with humour.
https://www.iceagenow.info/why-this-frenchman-regrets-buying-an-electric-car/

[Rich80105]

Post by BR
On Wed, 26 May 2021 15:04:48 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes

Post by John Bowes
Wonder when they're going to start building power stations rather than concentrating on unreliable solar and wind? Before Rich gets all whiney both of these have serious shortcomings when it comes to reliability. One has to remember solar is only any good during sunny days and doesn't provide anything at peak hours during winter! Turbines need wind and funnily enough produce nothing in calm weather.
The thing the government seems to be ignoring is plans (yeah I know planning ain't one of this governments strong points) to build new power stations that use one resource we have plenty of and that's geothermal energy. New Zealand should be taking a leaf out of Iceland's book and be hell bent on finding good sights to build these. Auckland, Taupo and the volcanic plateau are perfect places to do this and should be used!
Hell if we want to keep all our electrical devices running plus encouraging the use of electric cars we should have the first holes being drilled and foundations for geothermal stations being laid now! After all 2030 is an important date and it's only nine years away and the government has failed to actually do anything which is no surprise to many here :)

Electric cars are a waste of time and money.
Petrol and diesel are cheap and plentiful, and have been proven
technology for more than 100 years.
If electric cars start to become fashionable, the price of power will
rise significantly as the country's generating capacity fails to keep
up with demand. Nowhere are there plans to build more power stations
to take up the slack, and wind and solar will never cut it. Not only
that, but what will the government's response be to the loss of the
excise taxes they currently extort from petrol sales? There are plans
to introduce road user charges on electric cars. It is has not yet
been revealed how much the RUCs are going to be, but if petrol taxes
are anything to go by, they will be substantial. They will likely
start off quite low, but they will rapidly increase if enough fools
abandon their petrol and diesel vehicles for an EV. Can anyone see
where this is going?
Electric vehicles are promoted as a way to offset "climate change".
All that stuff is just an excuse to frighten people into surrendering
their freedom and their money to power hungry politicians. There is no
evidence that there is any sort of climate problem, just a lot of
pseudo-scientific nonsense and a history of failed predictions going
back decades. If electric vehicles are so damn terrific, they would
sell themselves without the government baiting the hook with special
privileges and cost exemptions.
Bill.

A duty of care to ensure that we do protect the next generation from
the dangers of climate change?
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/may/27/australian-court-finds-government-has-duty-to-protect-young-people-from-climate-crisis

[John Bowes]

Post by Rich80105

Post by BR
On Wed, 26 May 2021 15:04:48 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes

Post by John Bowes
Wonder when they're going to start building power stations rather than concentrating on unreliable solar and wind? Before Rich gets all whiney both of these have serious shortcomings when it comes to reliability. One has to remember solar is only any good during sunny days and doesn't provide anything at peak hours during winter! Turbines need wind and funnily enough produce nothing in calm weather.
The thing the government seems to be ignoring is plans (yeah I know planning ain't one of this governments strong points) to build new power stations that use one resource we have plenty of and that's geothermal energy. New Zealand should be taking a leaf out of Iceland's book and be hell bent on finding good sights to build these. Auckland, Taupo and the volcanic plateau are perfect places to do this and should be used!
Hell if we want to keep all our electrical devices running plus encouraging the use of electric cars we should have the first holes being drilled and foundations for geothermal stations being laid now! After all 2030 is an important date and it's only nine years away and the government has failed to actually do anything which is no surprise to many here :)

Electric cars are a waste of time and money.
Petrol and diesel are cheap and plentiful, and have been proven
technology for more than 100 years.
If electric cars start to become fashionable, the price of power will
rise significantly as the country's generating capacity fails to keep
up with demand. Nowhere are there plans to build more power stations
to take up the slack, and wind and solar will never cut it. Not only
that, but what will the government's response be to the loss of the
excise taxes they currently extort from petrol sales? There are plans
to introduce road user charges on electric cars. It is has not yet
been revealed how much the RUCs are going to be, but if petrol taxes
are anything to go by, they will be substantial. They will likely
start off quite low, but they will rapidly increase if enough fools
abandon their petrol and diesel vehicles for an EV. Can anyone see
where this is going?
Electric vehicles are promoted as a way to offset "climate change".
All that stuff is just an excuse to frighten people into surrendering
their freedom and their money to power hungry politicians. There is no
evidence that there is any sort of climate problem, just a lot of
pseudo-scientific nonsense and a history of failed predictions going
back decades. If electric vehicles are so damn terrific, they would
sell themselves without the government baiting the hook with special
privileges and cost exemptions.
Bill.

A duty of care to ensure that we do protect the next generation from
the dangers of climate change?
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/may/27/australian-court-finds-government-has-duty-to-protect-young-people-from-climate-crisis

Nothing about proposed power stations in your off topic link Rich. how about getting back on topic and maybe explain why, even though we're going to need more reliable electricity generation facilities to cover the extra need when your circus stops natural gas forever. Or are you believing they'll never follow through and it'll be business as usual because in the real world the CO2 New Zealand creates is next to nothing compared with your hero's in China?

[George Black]

Post by John Bowes
Nothing about proposed power stations in your off topic link Rich. how about getting back on topic and maybe explain why, even though we're going to need more reliable electricity generation facilities to cover the extra need when your circus stops natural gas forever. Or are you believing they'll never follow through and it'll be business as usual because in the real world the CO2 New Zealand creates is next to nothing compared with your hero's in China?

Just checked up on battery powered tools around home.
Drill/saw/light Hedge trimmer smoke alarm radio torch shaver vacuum
cleaner..
I'm a goner at that rate

[Rich80105]

On Fri, 28 May 2021 05:20:55 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes

Post by John Bowes

Post by Rich80105

Post by BR
On Wed, 26 May 2021 15:04:48 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes

Post by John Bowes
Wonder when they're going to start building power stations rather than concentrating on unreliable solar and wind? Before Rich gets all whiney both of these have serious shortcomings when it comes to reliability. One has to remember solar is only any good during sunny days and doesn't provide anything at peak hours during winter! Turbines need wind and funnily enough produce nothing in calm weather.
The thing the government seems to be ignoring is plans (yeah I know planning ain't one of this governments strong points) to build new power stations that use one resource we have plenty of and that's geothermal energy. New Zealand should be taking a leaf out of Iceland's book and be hell bent on finding good sights to build these. Auckland, Taupo and the volcanic plateau are perfect places to do this and should be used!
Hell if we want to keep all our electrical devices running plus encouraging the use of electric cars we should have the first holes being drilled and foundations for geothermal stations being laid now! After all 2030 is an important date and it's only nine years away and the government has failed to actually do anything which is no surprise to many here :)

Electric cars are a waste of time and money.
Petrol and diesel are cheap and plentiful, and have been proven
technology for more than 100 years.
If electric cars start to become fashionable, the price of power will
rise significantly as the country's generating capacity fails to keep
up with demand. Nowhere are there plans to build more power stations
to take up the slack, and wind and solar will never cut it. Not only
that, but what will the government's response be to the loss of the
excise taxes they currently extort from petrol sales? There are plans
to introduce road user charges on electric cars. It is has not yet
been revealed how much the RUCs are going to be, but if petrol taxes
are anything to go by, they will be substantial. They will likely
start off quite low, but they will rapidly increase if enough fools
abandon their petrol and diesel vehicles for an EV. Can anyone see
where this is going?
Electric vehicles are promoted as a way to offset "climate change".
All that stuff is just an excuse to frighten people into surrendering
their freedom and their money to power hungry politicians. There is no
evidence that there is any sort of climate problem, just a lot of
pseudo-scientific nonsense and a history of failed predictions going
back decades. If electric vehicles are so damn terrific, they would
sell themselves without the government baiting the hook with special
privileges and cost exemptions.
Bill.

A duty of care to ensure that we do protect the next generation from
the dangers of climate change?
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/may/27/australian-court-finds-government-has-duty-to-protect-young-people-from-climate-crisis

Nothing about proposed power stations in your off topic link Rich. how about getting back on topic and maybe explain why, even though we're going to need more reliable electricity generation facilities to cover the extra need when your circus stops natural gas forever. Or are you believing they'll never follow through and it'll be business as usual because in the real world the CO2 New Zealand creates is next to nothing compared with your hero's in China?

Nobody has stopped natural gas, iot is just that we have not found
more, and it is going to run out. There were also a lot of licenses
for looking for more gas or oil - eventually all of the owners of
those permits voluntarily surrendered them due to their assessment of
a low chance of a successful strike. Similarly oil companies are
trying to develop other sources of energy as oilsupplies are becoming
more difficut to find. I remember when it was thought that the 1990s
would see peak oil shale in the USA changed that a little bit, but I
suspect we are now past peak oil for the world . . .

[John Bowes]

Post by Rich80105
On Fri, 28 May 2021 05:20:55 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes

Post by Rich80105

Post by BR
On Wed, 26 May 2021 15:04:48 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes

Post by John Bowes
Wonder when they're going to start building power stations rather than concentrating on unreliable solar and wind? Before Rich gets all whiney both of these have serious shortcomings when it comes to reliability. One has to remember solar is only any good during sunny days and doesn't provide anything at peak hours during winter! Turbines need wind and funnily enough produce nothing in calm weather.
The thing the government seems to be ignoring is plans (yeah I know planning ain't one of this governments strong points) to build new power stations that use one resource we have plenty of and that's geothermal energy. New Zealand should be taking a leaf out of Iceland's book and be hell bent on finding good sights to build these. Auckland, Taupo and the volcanic plateau are perfect places to do this and should be used!
Hell if we want to keep all our electrical devices running plus encouraging the use of electric cars we should have the first holes being drilled and foundations for geothermal stations being laid now! After all 2030 is an important date and it's only nine years away and the government has failed to actually do anything which is no surprise to many here :)

Electric cars are a waste of time and money.
Petrol and diesel are cheap and plentiful, and have been proven
technology for more than 100 years.
If electric cars start to become fashionable, the price of power will
rise significantly as the country's generating capacity fails to keep
up with demand. Nowhere are there plans to build more power stations
to take up the slack, and wind and solar will never cut it. Not only
that, but what will the government's response be to the loss of the
excise taxes they currently extort from petrol sales? There are plans
to introduce road user charges on electric cars. It is has not yet
been revealed how much the RUCs are going to be, but if petrol taxes
are anything to go by, they will be substantial. They will likely
start off quite low, but they will rapidly increase if enough fools
abandon their petrol and diesel vehicles for an EV. Can anyone see
where this is going?
Electric vehicles are promoted as a way to offset "climate change".
All that stuff is just an excuse to frighten people into surrendering
their freedom and their money to power hungry politicians. There is no
evidence that there is any sort of climate problem, just a lot of
pseudo-scientific nonsense and a history of failed predictions going
back decades. If electric vehicles are so damn terrific, they would
sell themselves without the government baiting the hook with special
privileges and cost exemptions.
Bill.

A duty of care to ensure that we do protect the next generation from
the dangers of climate change?
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/may/27/australian-court-finds-government-has-duty-to-protect-young-people-from-climate-crisis

Nothing about proposed power stations in your off topic link Rich. how about getting back on topic and maybe explain why, even though we're going to need more reliable electricity generation facilities to cover the extra need when your circus stops natural gas forever. Or are you believing they'll never follow through and it'll be business as usual because in the real world the CO2 New Zealand creates is next to nothing compared with your hero's in China?

Nobody has stopped natural gas, iot is just that we have not found
more, and it is going to run out. There were also a lot of licenses
for looking for more gas or oil - eventually all of the owners of
those permits voluntarily surrendered them due to their assessment of
a low chance of a successful strike. Similarly oil companies are
trying to develop other sources of energy as oilsupplies are becoming
more difficut to find. I remember when it was thought that the 1990s
would see peak oil shale in the USA changed that a little bit, but I
suspect we are now past peak oil for the world . . .

BULLSHIT! Your glorious fucking leader stopped any new exploration for gas after getting orders from fucking Greenpeace! The companies that still had permits didn't bother to do any checking on the areas they had rights to. Why? Because your fucking government slammed the door on them you lying rat!

[Rich80105]

On Fri, 28 May 2021 16:55:09 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes

Post by John Bowes

Post by Rich80105
On Fri, 28 May 2021 05:20:55 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes

Post by Rich80105

Post by BR
On Wed, 26 May 2021 15:04:48 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes

Post by John Bowes
Wonder when they're going to start building power stations rather than concentrating on unreliable solar and wind? Before Rich gets all whiney both of these have serious shortcomings when it comes to reliability. One has to remember solar is only any good during sunny days and doesn't provide anything at peak hours during winter! Turbines need wind and funnily enough produce nothing in calm weather.
The thing the government seems to be ignoring is plans (yeah I know planning ain't one of this governments strong points) to build new power stations that use one resource we have plenty of and that's geothermal energy. New Zealand should be taking a leaf out of Iceland's book and be hell bent on finding good sights to build these. Auckland, Taupo and the volcanic plateau are perfect places to do this and should be used!
Hell if we want to keep all our electrical devices running plus encouraging the use of electric cars we should have the first holes being drilled and foundations for geothermal stations being laid now! After all 2030 is an important date and it's only nine years away and the government has failed to actually do anything which is no surprise to many here :)

Electric cars are a waste of time and money.
Petrol and diesel are cheap and plentiful, and have been proven
technology for more than 100 years.
If electric cars start to become fashionable, the price of power will
rise significantly as the country's generating capacity fails to keep
up with demand. Nowhere are there plans to build more power stations
to take up the slack, and wind and solar will never cut it. Not only
that, but what will the government's response be to the loss of the
excise taxes they currently extort from petrol sales? There are plans
to introduce road user charges on electric cars. It is has not yet
been revealed how much the RUCs are going to be, but if petrol taxes
are anything to go by, they will be substantial. They will likely
start off quite low, but they will rapidly increase if enough fools
abandon their petrol and diesel vehicles for an EV. Can anyone see
where this is going?
Electric vehicles are promoted as a way to offset "climate change".
All that stuff is just an excuse to frighten people into surrendering
their freedom and their money to power hungry politicians. There is no
evidence that there is any sort of climate problem, just a lot of
pseudo-scientific nonsense and a history of failed predictions going
back decades. If electric vehicles are so damn terrific, they would
sell themselves without the government baiting the hook with special
privileges and cost exemptions.
Bill.

A duty of care to ensure that we do protect the next generation from
the dangers of climate change?
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/may/27/australian-court-finds-government-has-duty-to-protect-young-people-from-climate-crisis

Nothing about proposed power stations in your off topic link Rich. how about getting back on topic and maybe explain why, even though we're going to need more reliable electricity generation facilities to cover the extra need when your circus stops natural gas forever. Or are you believing they'll never follow through and it'll be business as usual because in the real world the CO2 New Zealand creates is next to nothing compared with your hero's in China?

Nobody has stopped natural gas, iot is just that we have not found
more, and it is going to run out. There were also a lot of licenses
for looking for more gas or oil - eventually all of the owners of
those permits voluntarily surrendered them due to their assessment of
a low chance of a successful strike. Similarly oil companies are
trying to develop other sources of energy as oilsupplies are becoming
more difficut to find. I remember when it was thought that the 1990s
would see peak oil shale in the USA changed that a little bit, but I
suspect we are now past peak oil for the world . . .

BULLSHIT! Your glorious fucking leader stopped any new exploration for gas after getting orders from fucking Greenpeace! The companies that still had permits didn't bother to do any checking on the areas they had rights to. Why? Because your fucking government slammed the door on them you lying rat!

You are confusing yourself again, John. There is at least one field
currently producing natural gas. The government did not stop
exploration under any existing contracts at the time they were
elected; your reference to shutting the gate is just wrong. What they
did do however was take note of the inadequacy of some existing
contracts with respect to clean up following exploration or production
arising from events in the Gulf and problems the USA experienced. They
could not however change existing contracts; but in any event the
prices offered under offers that they did made were stated to be
insufficient to cover government costs - the exploration industry was
already walking away from the risk at that stage. Normal commercial
dealing, John; and the govrnment later announced that they did not
propose to offer further exploration permits. Existing exploration
permits did however continue with no changes to contract terms; permit
holders did however over time relinquish them - or the term expired -
and from memory one of those lasted into the last 12 months. You can
be as rude as you like John, but unless you have evidence tot he
contrary all you have done is branded yourself as the lying rat . . .

[John Bowes]

Post by Rich80105
On Fri, 28 May 2021 16:55:09 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes

Post by John Bowes

Post by Rich80105
On Fri, 28 May 2021 05:20:55 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes

Post by Rich80105

Post by BR
On Wed, 26 May 2021 15:04:48 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes

Post by John Bowes
Wonder when they're going to start building power stations rather than concentrating on unreliable solar and wind? Before Rich gets all whiney both of these have serious shortcomings when it comes to reliability. One has to remember solar is only any good during sunny days and doesn't provide anything at peak hours during winter! Turbines need wind and funnily enough produce nothing in calm weather.
The thing the government seems to be ignoring is plans (yeah I know planning ain't one of this governments strong points) to build new power stations that use one resource we have plenty of and that's geothermal energy. New Zealand should be taking a leaf out of Iceland's book and be hell bent on finding good sights to build these. Auckland, Taupo and the volcanic plateau are perfect places to do this and should be used!
Hell if we want to keep all our electrical devices running plus encouraging the use of electric cars we should have the first holes being drilled and foundations for geothermal stations being laid now! After all 2030 is an important date and it's only nine years away and the government has failed to actually do anything which is no surprise to many here :)

Electric cars are a waste of time and money.
Petrol and diesel are cheap and plentiful, and have been proven
technology for more than 100 years.
If electric cars start to become fashionable, the price of power will
rise significantly as the country's generating capacity fails to keep
up with demand. Nowhere are there plans to build more power stations
to take up the slack, and wind and solar will never cut it. Not only
that, but what will the government's response be to the loss of the
excise taxes they currently extort from petrol sales? There are plans
to introduce road user charges on electric cars. It is has not yet
been revealed how much the RUCs are going to be, but if petrol taxes
are anything to go by, they will be substantial. They will likely
start off quite low, but they will rapidly increase if enough fools
abandon their petrol and diesel vehicles for an EV. Can anyone see
where this is going?
Electric vehicles are promoted as a way to offset "climate change".
All that stuff is just an excuse to frighten people into surrendering
their freedom and their money to power hungry politicians. There is no
evidence that there is any sort of climate problem, just a lot of
pseudo-scientific nonsense and a history of failed predictions going
back decades. If electric vehicles are so damn terrific, they would
sell themselves without the government baiting the hook with special
privileges and cost exemptions.
Bill.

A duty of care to ensure that we do protect the next generation from
the dangers of climate change?
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/may/27/australian-court-finds-government-has-duty-to-protect-young-people-from-climate-crisis

Nothing about proposed power stations in your off topic link Rich. how about getting back on topic and maybe explain why, even though we're going to need more reliable electricity generation facilities to cover the extra need when your circus stops natural gas forever. Or are you believing they'll never follow through and it'll be business as usual because in the real world the CO2 New Zealand creates is next to nothing compared with your hero's in China?

Nobody has stopped natural gas, iot is just that we have not found
more, and it is going to run out. There were also a lot of licenses
for looking for more gas or oil - eventually all of the owners of
those permits voluntarily surrendered them due to their assessment of
a low chance of a successful strike. Similarly oil companies are
trying to develop other sources of energy as oilsupplies are becoming
more difficut to find. I remember when it was thought that the 1990s
would see peak oil shale in the USA changed that a little bit, but I
suspect we are now past peak oil for the world . . .

BULLSHIT! Your glorious fucking leader stopped any new exploration for gas after getting orders from fucking Greenpeace! The companies that still had permits didn't bother to do any checking on the areas they had rights to. Why? Because your fucking government slammed the door on them you lying rat!

You are confusing yourself again, John. There is at least one field
currently producing natural gas. The government did not stop
exploration under any existing contracts at the time they were
elected; your reference to shutting the gate is just wrong. What they
did do however was take note of the inadequacy of some existing
contracts with respect to clean up following exploration or production
arising from events in the Gulf and problems the USA experienced. They
could not however change existing contracts; but in any event the
prices offered under offers that they did made were stated to be
insufficient to cover government costs - the exploration industry was
already walking away from the risk at that stage. Normal commercial
dealing, John; and the govrnment later announced that they did not
propose to offer further exploration permits. Existing exploration
permits did however continue with no changes to contract terms; permit
holders did however over time relinquish them - or the term expired -
and from memory one of those lasted into the last 12 months. You can
be as rude as you like John, but unless you have evidence tot he
contrary all you have done is branded yourself as the lying rat . . .

Nothing of the sort you compressionless fool! You accuse me of being the lying rat yet all we have is typical bullshit from you without anything to back it up but your own worthless opinion! Provide some evidence or climb into your rathole my friend!
As to the problems in the Gulf of Mexico and USA you've already had the difference between oil drilled in NZ and that from the Gulf. You're just repeating the Green party bullshit there and it IS bullshit!

[BR]

Post by Rich80105

Post by BR
On Wed, 26 May 2021 15:04:48 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes

Post by John Bowes
Wonder when they're going to start building power stations rather than concentrating on unreliable solar and wind? Before Rich gets all whiney both of these have serious shortcomings when it comes to reliability. One has to remember solar is only any good during sunny days and doesn't provide anything at peak hours during winter! Turbines need wind and funnily enough produce nothing in calm weather.
The thing the government seems to be ignoring is plans (yeah I know planning ain't one of this governments strong points) to build new power stations that use one resource we have plenty of and that's geothermal energy. New Zealand should be taking a leaf out of Iceland's book and be hell bent on finding good sights to build these. Auckland, Taupo and the volcanic plateau are perfect places to do this and should be used!
Hell if we want to keep all our electrical devices running plus encouraging the use of electric cars we should have the first holes being drilled and foundations for geothermal stations being laid now! After all 2030 is an important date and it's only nine years away and the government has failed to actually do anything which is no surprise to many here :)

Electric cars are a waste of time and money.
Petrol and diesel are cheap and plentiful, and have been proven
technology for more than 100 years.
If electric cars start to become fashionable, the price of power will
rise significantly as the country's generating capacity fails to keep
up with demand. Nowhere are there plans to build more power stations
to take up the slack, and wind and solar will never cut it. Not only
that, but what will the government's response be to the loss of the
excise taxes they currently extort from petrol sales? There are plans
to introduce road user charges on electric cars. It is has not yet
been revealed how much the RUCs are going to be, but if petrol taxes
are anything to go by, they will be substantial. They will likely
start off quite low, but they will rapidly increase if enough fools
abandon their petrol and diesel vehicles for an EV. Can anyone see
where this is going?
Electric vehicles are promoted as a way to offset "climate change".
All that stuff is just an excuse to frighten people into surrendering
their freedom and their money to power hungry politicians. There is no
evidence that there is any sort of climate problem, just a lot of
pseudo-scientific nonsense and a history of failed predictions going
back decades. If electric vehicles are so damn terrific, they would
sell themselves without the government baiting the hook with special
privileges and cost exemptions.
Bill.

A duty of care to ensure that we do protect the next generation from
the dangers of climate change?

What dangers?

Post by Rich80105
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/may/27/australian-court-finds-government-has-duty-to-protect-young-people-from-climate-crisis

"Eight teenagers, along with 86-year-old nun, launched case to prevent
the approval of a massive coalmine"

What rubbish. "Eight teenagers" would never have believed this
nonsense if it hadn't been rammed down their throats by members of the
militant teachers' union. This is nothing but political indoctrination
of school children.

Bill.

[Rich80105]

Post by BR

Post by Rich80105

Post by BR
On Wed, 26 May 2021 15:04:48 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes

Post by John Bowes
Wonder when they're going to start building power stations rather than concentrating on unreliable solar and wind? Before Rich gets all whiney both of these have serious shortcomings when it comes to reliability. One has to remember solar is only any good during sunny days and doesn't provide anything at peak hours during winter! Turbines need wind and funnily enough produce nothing in calm weather.
The thing the government seems to be ignoring is plans (yeah I know planning ain't one of this governments strong points) to build new power stations that use one resource we have plenty of and that's geothermal energy. New Zealand should be taking a leaf out of Iceland's book and be hell bent on finding good sights to build these. Auckland, Taupo and the volcanic plateau are perfect places to do this and should be used!
Hell if we want to keep all our electrical devices running plus encouraging the use of electric cars we should have the first holes being drilled and foundations for geothermal stations being laid now! After all 2030 is an important date and it's only nine years away and the government has failed to actually do anything which is no surprise to many here :)

Electric cars are a waste of time and money.
Petrol and diesel are cheap and plentiful, and have been proven
technology for more than 100 years.
If electric cars start to become fashionable, the price of power will
rise significantly as the country's generating capacity fails to keep
up with demand. Nowhere are there plans to build more power stations
to take up the slack, and wind and solar will never cut it. Not only
that, but what will the government's response be to the loss of the
excise taxes they currently extort from petrol sales? There are plans
to introduce road user charges on electric cars. It is has not yet
been revealed how much the RUCs are going to be, but if petrol taxes
are anything to go by, they will be substantial. They will likely
start off quite low, but they will rapidly increase if enough fools
abandon their petrol and diesel vehicles for an EV. Can anyone see
where this is going?
Electric vehicles are promoted as a way to offset "climate change".
All that stuff is just an excuse to frighten people into surrendering
their freedom and their money to power hungry politicians. There is no
evidence that there is any sort of climate problem, just a lot of
pseudo-scientific nonsense and a history of failed predictions going
back decades. If electric vehicles are so damn terrific, they would
sell themselves without the government baiting the hook with special
privileges and cost exemptions.
Bill.

A duty of care to ensure that we do protect the next generation from
the dangers of climate change?

What dangers?

Post by Rich80105
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/may/27/australian-court-finds-government-has-duty-to-protect-young-people-from-climate-crisis

"Eight teenagers, along with 86-year-old nun, launched case to prevent
the approval of a massive coalmine"
What rubbish. "Eight teenagers" would never have believed this
nonsense if it hadn't been rammed down their throats by members of the
militant teachers' union. This is nothing but political indoctrination
of school children.
Bill.

Its only 8 of them, Bill - probably Greta Thunberg and the Green
Party, but they were taking the case on a point of law and won - blame
the Australian Law - probably a Liberal politician; just as in Nw
Zealand it was a National Government that signed the first treaty
regarding taking action to limit Climate Change.

[John Bowes]

Post by Rich80105

Post by BR

Post by Rich80105

Post by BR
On Wed, 26 May 2021 15:04:48 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes

Post by John Bowes
Wonder when they're going to start building power stations rather than concentrating on unreliable solar and wind? Before Rich gets all whiney both of these have serious shortcomings when it comes to reliability. One has to remember solar is only any good during sunny days and doesn't provide anything at peak hours during winter! Turbines need wind and funnily enough produce nothing in calm weather.
The thing the government seems to be ignoring is plans (yeah I know planning ain't one of this governments strong points) to build new power stations that use one resource we have plenty of and that's geothermal energy. New Zealand should be taking a leaf out of Iceland's book and be hell bent on finding good sights to build these. Auckland, Taupo and the volcanic plateau are perfect places to do this and should be used!
Hell if we want to keep all our electrical devices running plus encouraging the use of electric cars we should have the first holes being drilled and foundations for geothermal stations being laid now! After all 2030 is an important date and it's only nine years away and the government has failed to actually do anything which is no surprise to many here :)

Electric cars are a waste of time and money.
Petrol and diesel are cheap and plentiful, and have been proven
technology for more than 100 years.
If electric cars start to become fashionable, the price of power will
rise significantly as the country's generating capacity fails to keep
up with demand. Nowhere are there plans to build more power stations
to take up the slack, and wind and solar will never cut it. Not only
that, but what will the government's response be to the loss of the
excise taxes they currently extort from petrol sales? There are plans
to introduce road user charges on electric cars. It is has not yet
been revealed how much the RUCs are going to be, but if petrol taxes
are anything to go by, they will be substantial. They will likely
start off quite low, but they will rapidly increase if enough fools
abandon their petrol and diesel vehicles for an EV. Can anyone see
where this is going?
Electric vehicles are promoted as a way to offset "climate change".
All that stuff is just an excuse to frighten people into surrendering
their freedom and their money to power hungry politicians. There is no
evidence that there is any sort of climate problem, just a lot of
pseudo-scientific nonsense and a history of failed predictions going
back decades. If electric vehicles are so damn terrific, they would
sell themselves without the government baiting the hook with special
privileges and cost exemptions.
Bill.

A duty of care to ensure that we do protect the next generation from
the dangers of climate change?

What dangers?

Post by Rich80105
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/may/27/australian-court-finds-government-has-duty-to-protect-young-people-from-climate-crisis

"Eight teenagers, along with 86-year-old nun, launched case to prevent
the approval of a massive coalmine"
What rubbish. "Eight teenagers" would never have believed this
nonsense if it hadn't been rammed down their throats by members of the
militant teachers' union. This is nothing but political indoctrination
of school children.
Bill.

Its only 8 of them, Bill - probably Greta Thunberg and the Green
Party, but they were taking the case on a point of law and won - blame
the Australian Law - probably a Liberal politician; just as in Nw
Zealand it was a National Government that signed the first treaty
regarding taking action to limit Climate Change.

New Zealand signed up to the first part of the Koyot Protocols but not the second Rich. so guess this is just half a lie from you. Well done! :)