Alls Well at CMD-key

[Joseph Fenn]

Maurice just notified me he is not in a Hospital or anything like that,
he merely is swamped with 100 orders and running at top speed to get
the stuff out in shipment.
Joe (aka Kokomo Joe)


****************************************************
* Ham KH6JF AARS/MARS ABM6JF QCWA WW2 VET WD RADIO *
****************************************************

[Dixon Ranch]

That is good to hear that he has that much business.

Post by Joseph Fenn
Maurice just notified me he is not in a Hospital or anything like that,
he merely is swamped with 100 orders and running at top speed to get
the stuff out in shipment.
Joe (aka Kokomo Joe

[silverdr]

Post by Dixon Ranch

Post by Joseph Fenn
Maurice just notified me he is not in a Hospital or anything like that,
he merely is swamped with 100 orders and running at top speed to get
the stuff out in shipment.

That is good to hear that he has that much business.

Probably he could have even more if the orders were regularly and timely
fulfilled. I am still holding my bucks until I see nobody complaining
about tens of months of wait-time...

[MagerValp]

s> Probably he could have even more if the orders were regularly and
s> timely fulfilled.

He's a single person fulfilling orders as fast as he can.

But yep, hope he catches up.

[Clockmeister]

Post by MagerValp
s> Probably he could have even more if the orders were regularly and
s> timely fulfilled.
He's a single person fulfilling orders as fast as he can.

Excuses.

Post by MagerValp
But yep, hope he catches up.

No-one more then those who have already been waiting for nearly a year.

[Rick Balkins]

Post by Clockmeister
Excuses.

Do it yourself if you think you can do better.
Remember CMD was built around a team of 5-10 people. 3 of which are the main
people plus the few extra people involved there. Though Maurice had some bit
of work. Given CMD was dedicated 8 hours in which during the time was quite
dedicated to this. Maurice is getting the hang of it but if you have 1
person processing orders and another doing the business paperwork and a
person dedicated to working on product orders. Ok. You see things get more
efficiently done but remeber Maurice was upgrading the ROMs and other stuff
as well as running his automotive business and hell he has to have some time
for break and if he has a wife then yeah - that too.

I doubt you can do all that much better either. I am not going to claim
myself to anything. I may or maynot. It really depends. I would be modest
enough to likely say not but I may be able to do much of the stuff
reasonably well if I had the CMD training and the other works but then again
my background has been totally in computers. This is just misc. variables
that may have an effect but I will say - Maurice is doing his best and
please consider that in your judgement. Remember CMD had a whole entire
facility roughly the size of the WHOLE building that Software Support
International resided in. Ok. A building roughly the size of a "city" block.
In other words 4-5 acres lot.

Now that is given the years and the fact that they use to publish, produce
hardware and did a variety of things that required space.

Post by Clockmeister
No-one more then those who have already been waiting for nearly a year.

[Dr. Video]

I'm thankful he is still doing this, else would all be at the mercy of ebay
auctions. It amazes this guy who knows how to fix cars, build hardware AND
program! Where he finds the time, I have no idea!

If it were me, I would try to stock at least 3-4 items of everything I am
selling. That way, the customer is satisfied quicker, and I would know
exactly at what pace I need to keep up with things. Just like a good UART,
I would want a FIFO buffer in place to handle the load.

But that is just my opinion and I don't know his exact situation...I placed
an order with him a little over a week ago, I will just patiently wait for
it to be fulfilled.

[Alan Reed]

Post by Rick Balkins

Post by Clockmeister
Excuses.

Do it yourself if you think you can do better.
Remember CMD was built around a team of 5-10 people. . . . .

(etc. deleted)

While I can agree with much of your description of how complicated and time
consuming taking over the CMD line could be (or should be, maybe), the point
is that Maurice isn't delivering ANYTHING. I could buy his talk about how
busy he is and how he's swamped with filling orders if someone, somewhere,
was receiving product. Through my conversations, I don't know of of anyone
who has successfully purchased anything from the old CMD catalog. What's he
doing? I've been waiting for a JiffyDOS ROM since March 15th. I bought it
with Maurice's assurance that there was no waiting list. And here I am, 6
weeks later, still waiting. And this is just a ROM. You people out there
who think you're on a waiting list for a SuperCPU are fooling yourselves.
I'll be playing Doom64 on my C-1 handheld before he'll be able to actually
ship a SCPU. Perhaps Maurice should look for some additional
partners/investors to give him the help he needs to actually produce
something. Or maybe he should sell out to any interested parties (if there
are any) if he can't handle the job. From reading the newsgroups I can't
believe there wouldn't be tremendous interest in most of the CMD line if
only people could really buy it.

[Michael Hunter]

Hello Alan,

Through my conversations, I don't know of of anyone who has
successfully purchased anything from the old CMD catalog. What's
he doing? I've been waiting for a JiffyDOS ROM since March 15th.

I usually stay out of this recurring conversation, but this time I'll
jump in to at least say that he has delivered product since taking
over the CMD product line.

I ordered a CMD FD-2000 and JiffyDOS 64 + 1571 +1541 set from CMD
about a day before their cut-off for orders. They assured me that
they themselves would be filling the orders, and that the shell for my
FD-2000 was sitting right there.

They immediately shipped my JiffyDOS set, but not my FD-2000 drive.

Several months went by, and I hadn't received anything. One day my
wife received a call from Maurice saying that he needed our address
and that the drive was ready. Within a month or so my new FD-2000
arrived.

A few months after that, I ordered a replacement set of GEOS 128 v2.0
floppy disks, a replacement 6526 chip, geoMakeBoot, and a few other
small items. A month or so later, they arrived.

After that, I went ahead and ordered Wheels 128, a replacement
inductor coil (looks similar to a resistor) to replace one that had
been damaged on one of my 64c systems, and a CMD hard drive (1 gig).
That order probably arrived in about 6 or 7 months. From what I hear,
many of you got to see my hard drive at some of the Commodore shows
that he went to right before shipping it off to me.

In November or December of 2002, I ordered a SuperCPU 128 w/ 16 MB of
RAM. I still have not received that yet, but am confident that it
will arrive. Since placing that order, I have continued to add to
that order.

As time went on and other things occurred to me, I have added to that
order: a CMD Parallel cable to go from my RAMLink to my Hard Drive
(with those hard to find 14-pin DIN plugs), a second Turbo 232
cartridge, a few power switches (OEM replacements), Big Blue Reader
(he had a few with German manuals that I wanted to get), and several
other misc. items. Most recently, I have added the new CMD Utilities
disk to the order.

Obviously, I have been waiting for a while for the last order I
described, but I am confident that it will arrive. Yes, I am getting
anxious to put my new SuperCPU to use (I have many plans for it). But
I am sure it will arrive in time. Hopefully it will be in the near
future.

Anyway, the main purpose behind my post here is to show that he has
delivered product to myself (and even others that I have spoken with).
Everything that I have received from him has arrived in good working
order, and I am still using all of it today. When my current order
arrives, I'll definitely have enough to keep me busy for a while ;-)

Hope this helps to encourage others out there, who like myself, are
currently waiting for items on order.

Michael Hunter
***@videocam.net.au

[Joseph Fenn]

Well Michael I wish I had seen your msg along with the others before
I ordered a C128 (not super cpu) with 64k VDC ram installed.
I probably would still have ordered it but would not have pestered
him about non delivery. Its been about 3 months now and no joy.
He did say he was swamped with about 100 backorders. But he is the
only source left that we can depend on.
Joe (aka kokomo Joe)


****************************************************
* Ham KH6JF AARS/MARS ABM6JF QCWA WW2 VET WD RADIO *
****************************************************

[RajW]

Post by Joseph Fenn
Well Michael I wish I had seen your msg along with the others before
I ordered a C128 (not super cpu) with 64k VDC ram installed.
I probably would still have ordered it but would not have pestered
him about non delivery. Its been about 3 months now and no joy.
He did say he was swamped with about 100 backorders. But he is the
only source left that we can depend on.

Just an FYI... I am modifying C128's for the 64k video RAM for $20
USD. That price is 99% labor... I get the 64k chips off old PC ISA
video cards. :) You send me a working C128 with 16K of video RAM and
$20 and you get a C128 with 64k of video RAM back.

I've been laying low lately... chest pains have had me in the hospital
and many doctors visits have occupied my spare time. I'm only 34...
Grrr!. :p To young for this crap.

/*Raj*/
***@c64.net
/* Remove the intel and Change */
/* the [net] to [us] to e-mail me */

[Sam Gillett]

Post by RajW
I've been laying low lately... chest pains have had me in the hospital
and many doctors visits have occupied my spare time. I'm only 34...
Grrr!. :p To young for this crap.

Sorry to hear that. If your blood pressure and cholestrol are both OK it
might not be anything serious. But if they aren't, time to get both under
control so you can make it to a ripe old age!

[RajW]

On Sat, 01 May 2004 00:16:49 GMT, "Sam Gillett"

Post by Sam Gillett
Sorry to hear that. If your blood pressure and cholestrol are both OK it
might not be anything serious. But if they aren't, time to get both under
control so you can make it to a ripe old age!

My blood pressure and EKG were good. Still waiting on the results
from the various blood tests for the cholesterol.

/*Raj*/

[Cameron Kaiser]

Post by RajW
I've been laying low lately... chest pains have had me in the hospital
and many doctors visits have occupied my spare time. I'm only 34...
Grrr!. :p To young for this crap.

Egad. Have they stuck you on a treadmill yet?

--
Cameron Kaiser * ***@floodgap.com * posting with a Commodore 128
personal page: http://www.armory.com/%7Espectre/
** Computer Workshops: games, productivity software and more for C64/128! **
** http://www.armory.com/%7Espectre/cwi/ **

[Matthew Montchalin]

Cameron Kaiser wrote:
|RajW <***@c64.net> writes:
|
|>I've been laying low lately... chest pains have had me in the hospital
|>and many doctors visits have occupied my spare time. I'm only 34...
|>Grrr!. :p To young for this crap.
|
|Egad. Have they stuck you on a treadmill yet?

Are treadmills really that much better than exercycles?

[Jack]

On Fri, 30 Apr 2004 19:48:13 -0700, Matthew Montchalin

Post by Matthew Montchalin
|
|>I've been laying low lately... chest pains have had me in the hospital
|>and many doctors visits have occupied my spare time. I'm only 34...
|>Grrr!. :p To young for this crap.
|
|Egad. Have they stuck you on a treadmill yet?
Are treadmills really that much better than exercycles?

How the hell should we know? We are talking about medical testing
equipment, not gymnasium and excercise stuff. There's a worls of
difference, ya know!

[Matthew Montchalin]

Jack wrote:
|>|Egad. Have they stuck you on a treadmill yet?
|>
|>Are treadmills really that much better than exercycles?
|
|How the hell should we know? We are talking about medical testing
|equipment, not gymnasium and excercise stuff. There's a worls of
|difference, ya know!

Um, no, not really. I put in 3 or 4 miles a day on my exercycle.
(Don't like having to go out much.)

[Jack]

On Sat, 1 May 2004 06:49:05 -0700, Matthew Montchalin

Post by Matthew Montchalin
|>|Egad. Have they stuck you on a treadmill yet?
|>
|>Are treadmills really that much better than exercycles?
|
|How the hell should we know? We are talking about medical testing
|equipment, not gymnasium and excercise stuff. There's a worls of
|difference, ya know!
Um, no, not really. I put in 3 or 4 miles a day on my exercycle.

Matthew M. fails Reading Comprehension once again. (Or his daily
exercycle ride involves his being attached to an electrocardiograph
and breathing measurement apparatus with a high-priced cardiologist
present taking readings and a nurse asking his pain levels.)

Post by Matthew Montchalin
(Don't like having to go out much.)

More likely this is the case:

<Dissolve to Rod Serling, standing onstage>
"...Another comp.sys.cbm thread takes a strange twist into the
Twilight Zone..."

[RajW]

Post by Cameron Kaiser
Egad. Have they stuck you on a treadmill yet?

You're talking about that stress test thing aren't you? No, but one of
my friends has told me about it. Yech!

/*Raj*/

[Jack]

Post by RajW

Post by Cameron Kaiser
Egad. Have they stuck you on a treadmill yet?

You're talking about that stress test thing aren't you? No, but one of
my friends has told me about it. Yech!
/*Raj*/

Oh lord! That the treadmill was torture. When they cranked it up to
a moderate pace, the chest cramps hit hard and I was in agony...

That was in my second day in ER. They moved me into a critical room so
they could monitor me. After the blood work came back ( BAD!) and they
did the CAT scan on my arteries, I was scheduled for surgery at 9AM on
my 3rd day in the hospital. Everything happened so fast that it was a
truly frightening experience!

[Jack]

Post by RajW
Just an FYI... I am modifying C128's for the 64k video RAM for $20
USD. That price is 99% labor... I get the 64k chips off old PC ISA
video cards. :) You send me a working C128 with 16K of video RAM and
$20 and you get a C128 with 64k of video RAM back.

Just out of curiousity... Are you desoldering and saving the original
RAMs? I found it too much bother so I just use my nippers, cut the
body from the pins. It's much easier to desolder the individual pins
and use a sucker/wick to clean the holes afterward.

Post by RajW
I've been laying low lately... chest pains have had me in the hospital
and many doctors visits have occupied my spare time. I'm only 34...
Grrr!. :p To young for this crap.

ACCHHH!! Watch out. I was saying the same thing just before I went
to my doctor for chest pains at 43. I thought my hectic lifestyle and
the weather had brought on walking pnemonia. He sent me dirctly to ER
and they refused to let me out until they performed a triple bypass.
Yes... at 43!!! I hope you don't smoke! At 49, things got
particularly frustrating during a bout with throat cancer...

Take care of yerself!!!

And I hope Maurice doesn't work himself into the hospital. It sounds
like he's well on his way. I really think he has to learn to
delegate/contract some of the work out, or cut back on accepting
orders. When you have people waiting that many months for their
orders, it really says something. (As much as it hurt my pride, I
completely retired recently rather than make people wait until I could
fill orders)...

Regards,

Jack

[RajW]

On Sat, 01 May 2004 10:27:57 GMT, Jack

Post by Jack
Just out of curiousity... Are you desoldering and saving the original
RAMs? I found it too much bother so I just use my nippers, cut the
body from the pins. It's much easier to desolder the individual pins
and use a sucker/wick to clean the holes afterward.

I always _try_ to save the original chips but because of the tight
space around the chip it is not always possible. I tried a slightly
different technique that has been very successful lately. After
desoldering (I use a Hakko desoldering station by the way) I use a
soldering tip with a flat blade and push the chip pins in toward the
chip (from the top). I have had almost a 100% "pop-right-out" removal
rate lately. :)

Post by Jack
I really think he has to learn to delegate/contract some of the
work out, or cut back on accepting orders.

That is one thing I found particularly frustrating lately. I want to
buy one of those cool 1750XL REU cartridges from Maurice/ClickHere but
he says he doesn't have any circuit boards. So I searched around and
found a place where he can get them made for like $25 a piece. I sent
him the info but never heard back. (sigh)

/*Raj*/

[Jack]

Post by RajW
I always _try_ to save the original chips but because of the tight
space around the chip it is not always possible. I tried a slightly
different technique that has been very successful lately. After
desoldering (I use a Hakko desoldering station by the way) I use a
soldering tip with a flat blade and push the chip pins in toward the
chip (from the top). I have had almost a 100% "pop-right-out" removal
rate lately. :)

That tight space is why I went to the quick and dirty nipper
technique. I may be on a short income, but those RAM's are cheap
enough and if need to pull used ones, there are easier places to get
them.

I'd love to have a decent desoldering station, and some other needed
test equipment. Back when I was working, I could borrow them from the
shop or take my projects in and do them over breaktime. But now I
can't afford more then the basic tools... 30 watt iron, nippers,
dykes and needlenose, and a cheapo DVOM. I *really need* a scope,
but every time I've saved enough to consider a used one, my money is
needed for more urgent reasons. :-(

Post by RajW

Post by Jack
I really think he has to learn to delegate/contract some of the
work out, or cut back on accepting orders.

That is one thing I found particularly frustrating lately. I want to
buy one of those cool 1750XL REU cartridges from Maurice/ClickHere but
he says he doesn't have any circuit boards. So I searched around and
found a place where he can get them made for like $25 a piece. I sent
him the info but never heard back. (sigh)

Don't I know. I'd like to order a few of his items, but I'm nowhere
near patient enough to pay out money, knowing the wait is indefinite.

Take care,

-Jack-

[Rick Balkins]

Post by RajW
I've been laying low lately... chest pains have had me in the hospital
and many doctors visits have occupied my spare time. I'm only 34...
Grrr!. :p To young for this crap.

Hope you the best Raj.

[RajW]

On Sat, 1 May 2004 09:05:12 -0700, "Rick Balkins"

Post by Rick Balkins
Hope you the best Raj.

Thanks Rick. :)

/*Raj*/

[mikec]

Hi RajW,

Post by RajW
I've been laying low lately... chest pains have had me in the hospital

Definitely sorry to hear that. I can somewhat relate as a guy who's
about to turn 33 in a few weeks...I was in the kitchen two days ago
moving some stuff around and I must have twisted my back in some funny
way. Well, now I have these side and back pains that are just killing
and keeping me awake at nights. Sad to say, this is something that
seems to happen at least twice a year.

Post by RajW
I'm only 34...Grrr!. :p To young for this crap.

An old guy once told me...once you hit 30, it's all downhill. ;)

All the best!

MikeC

[Sam Gillett]

Post by mikec
An old guy once told me...once you hit 30, it's all downhill. ;)

He missed it by a few years. 30 to 40 is straight and level. At _40_ you
start the downhill slide. When you pass 50 the incline keeps getting
steeper! ;-)

[mikec]

Hi Alan,

Perhaps Maurice should look for some additional partners/investors

This would probably be a "Band-Aid" solution.

I assume that CMD products, such as a SuperCPU, require a certain
level of technical expertise to build, test, troubleshoot, etc. Adding
more people to build them might prove to be problematic in terms of
quality control. Throwing additional money isn't going to have an
impact in terms of production speed, although it might help bring the
costs down by enabling Maurice to buy components in bulk.

Without knowing the way these things are build, it's difficult to
offer credible suggestions. Does he build them one at a time or in a
factory line sort of way? I suspect this is where the problem
lies...the process in which CMD products are built.

Besides, I'm also assuming that this isn't his "day job" so that might
cause numerous delays.

Maurice should implement a system similar to what on-line retailers
do. For example, I've order a few books from Amazon and they're really
good at letting me know how my order is being fulfilled. I get an
e-mail to acknowledge my order. I then get another confirming stock,
confirming my credit card has been processed and the shipping ETA. I
finally get a last one saying that my order has shipped along with a
tracking number. I don't think it would be that difficult for Maurice
to provide a similar type of notification. I'm sure they'd be no
shortage of people here that would be willing to help him to so.

Simple methods of communication go a long way to instill customer
confidence. The worst thing that he can do is not keep people informed
in a detailed and timely manner as to the progress of their order, as
is in your case.

MikeC

[Pheuque]

I don't know anything about Maurice's operation, but from what I know
abou tthe CMD line of products I can see 2 possible problems. Circut
board runs, and finding parts.

Circut board runs are the easiest, but require a certain number of
orders to be worth doing. I figure with the low turn around Maurice
probably needs at least 3/4 of the order to be sold in order to place
an order.

Asuming he has enough ready made boards on hand...remeber that the
entire CMD line is about a decade old. Even finding 4MB SIMM's for a
RAMlink might be a chore, and they were a common part. Other more
esoteric parts might be very hard to find at a resonable price, or
worse, might only exist as surplus that must be found in some deep
dark recess of an electronics liquidator.

If this is the case, all the employee's in the world won't help
production.

I would hope that if either of these were the case, Maurice might
consider making some info on exactly what and how these units did on a
schematic level might become an option so we can move some of the
design on to more modern FPGA.

But I doubt he's even recouped what he spent on purchasing everything
from CMD. So I think he'll keep his trade secrets until he at least
breaks even.

Maybe we can pool our funds and pay Maurice off to release the info on
things like the PLA, PAL, and GAL programing used in the CMD HD's,
FD's, RAMlink and SuperCPU.

It's really up to Maurice. Maybe he's happy with how things are
running.

Post by mikec
Hi Alan,

Perhaps Maurice should look for some additional partners/investors

This would probably be a "Band-Aid" solution.
I assume that CMD products, such as a SuperCPU, require a certain
level of technical expertise to build, test, troubleshoot, etc. Adding
more people to build them might prove to be problematic in terms of
quality control. Throwing additional money isn't going to have an
impact in terms of production speed, although it might help bring the
costs down by enabling Maurice to buy components in bulk.
Without knowing the way these things are build, it's difficult to
offer credible suggestions. Does he build them one at a time or in a
factory line sort of way? I suspect this is where the problem
lies...the process in which CMD products are built.
Besides, I'm also assuming that this isn't his "day job" so that might
cause numerous delays.
Maurice should implement a system similar to what on-line retailers
do. For example, I've order a few books from Amazon and they're really
good at letting me know how my order is being fulfilled. I get an
e-mail to acknowledge my order. I then get another confirming stock,
confirming my credit card has been processed and the shipping ETA. I
finally get a last one saying that my order has shipped along with a
tracking number. I don't think it would be that difficult for Maurice
to provide a similar type of notification. I'm sure they'd be no
shortage of people here that would be willing to help him to so.
Simple methods of communication go a long way to instill customer
confidence. The worst thing that he can do is not keep people informed
in a detailed and timely manner as to the progress of their order, as
is in your case.
MikeC

[mikec]

Hi Pheuque,

Post by Pheuque
Circut board runs are the easiest, but require a certain number of

True...but maybe we're making a lot of assumptions. I think it all
depends on exactly how many orders he has at any one time.

I just think it would it be faster to put these together using an
assembly line process. For all I know, maybe that's what he's doing.

Post by Pheuque
entire CMD line is about a decade old. Even finding 4MB SIMM's for a
RAMlink might be a chore, and they were a common part. Other more

Good points! Although, I stumbled across a place a few years back
where they had boxes of 72-pin and 30-pin RAM. They wanted a $1 each
stick but they were willing to cut a deal. I'm sure there are many
similar places all over the world.

Post by Pheuque
So I think he'll keep his trade secrets until he at least breaks even.

I dunno...he has a pretty good thing going and he probably builds
these things in his spare time. I'm sure he's making a decent amount
on each unit so I don't think he has any intest in releasing the info.

Besides, if and when the C-One comes out, it'll spark some serious
competition. He'll either have to "ante up" and get things really
rolling or bail out.

Post by Pheuque
Maybe we can pool our funds and pay Maurice off to release the info on

Yeah, right...you go ahead and do that. ;)

The way I see it, the SuperCPU is a fairly specialized piece of
hardware. I'm sure a majority of C-64 owners wouldn't take advantage
of it.

MikeC

[Rick Balkins]

If you have 25 orders a month then you got enough for assembly line.
CMD products use to be on an assembly line like fashion but the quantity has
been a bit low for that to work. If you have a consistant level of orders
then yeah.

Post by mikec
Hi Pheuque,

Post by Pheuque
Circut board runs are the easiest, but require a certain number of

True...but maybe we're making a lot of assumptions. I think it all
depends on exactly how many orders he has at any one time.

<<< snip >>>

[Alan Reed]

Post by mikec
Hi Alan,

Perhaps Maurice should look for some additional partners/investors

This would probably be a "Band-Aid" solution.
I assume that CMD products, such as a SuperCPU, require a certain
level of technical expertise to build, test, troubleshoot, etc. Adding
more people to build them might prove to be problematic in terms of
quality control. Throwing additional money isn't going to have an
impact in terms of production speed, although it might help bring the
costs down by enabling Maurice to buy components in bulk.

You're probably right. On the other hand, I can't get something as simple
as a JiffyDOS ROM. I don't have a burner myself, but my understanding is
that it's a fairly quick, simple process. I wonder how long it would take to
get software from him. Anyone order GEOS/Wheels lately? I think I'll go
the Ebay route. I'd love to buy stuff from his catalog, if he brings
anything to sell to the Expo I'll be ready. But I don't trust him enough to
order anything from him again. I'm sure Maurice is a nice guy--seeing how
eager people are to defend him is a testament to that. But two months for a
ROM chip? 2 years (and counting) for a SCPU?

[Charles Houck]

Post by Alan Reed
You're probably right. On the other hand, I can't get something as simple
as a JiffyDOS ROM. I don't have a burner myself, but my understanding is
that it's a fairly quick, simple process. I wonder how long it would take to
get software from him. Anyone order GEOS/Wheels lately?

I called Maurice and ordered GOES64 and WHEELS64 a few weeks ago and
recieved them in a few days. I have since then ordered a SmartMouse and a
SCPU64 and am waiting for them to be finished and shipped. Harware being
built one at a time and in ones's <spare> time requires much more time. And
Maurice is the only game in town for this equipment. If he weren't doing it
then my guess is it would not be available at all. The waiting is slightly
annoying but still better than not being able to get any of this hardware at
all.

Cheers,

Charles Houck

[Alan Reed]

Post by Charles Houck

Post by Alan Reed
You're probably right. On the other hand, I can't get something as simple
as a JiffyDOS ROM. I don't have a burner myself, but my understanding is
that it's a fairly quick, simple process. I wonder how long it would

take

Post by Charles Houck
to

Post by Alan Reed
get software from him. Anyone order GEOS/Wheels lately?

I called Maurice and ordered GOES64 and WHEELS64 a few weeks ago and
recieved them in a few days. I have since then ordered a SmartMouse and a
SCPU64 and am waiting for them to be finished and shipped. Harware being
built one at a time and in ones's <spare> time requires much more time. And
Maurice is the only game in town for this equipment. If he weren't doing it
then my guess is it would not be available at all. The waiting is slightly
annoying but still better than not being able to get any of this hardware at
all.

Well, maybe I'm over-reacting a bit, then. My specific gripe is that when I
asked about delays getting JiffyDOS I was told that it was available, so I
went ahead and purchased it via his site. Six weeks (and counting), no
ROM. No responses to a recent email (I did get a response to one about a
month ago saying it would be another day or two). I think I'm as
reasonable and patient as the next guy, but this is bad business and just
generally Not Cool.

[bud]

Harware being built one at a time and
in ones's <spare> time requires much
more time. And Maurice is the only
game in town for this equipment.

Hmm, maybe he should consider offering hardware kits of his stuff.
Those (few?) of us with soldering skills could at least build our own,
and reduce his load, slightly.

salaam,
dowcom

[Peter van Merkerk]

Post by bud
Hmm, maybe he should consider offering hardware kits of his stuff.
Those (few?) of us with soldering skills could at least build our own,
and reduce his load, slightly.

The time he would save building, he would lose (and more so) with
providing support. Troubleshooting over the phone/e-mail isn't exactly
easy, and you would like to have support when things don't work would you?

--
Peter van Merkerk
peter.van.merkerk(at)dse.nl

[bud]

Post by Peter van Merkerk
The time he would save building, he
would lose (and more so) with
providing support. Troubleshooting
over the phone/e-mail isn't exactly
easy, and you would like to have
support when things don't work
would you?

Uuff! Didn't think of that. I've never used support on the kits I've
built. Only the first one gave me trouble. (When I was about 14 years
old. Wired the electrolytics in backwards. Doh!)

Come to think of it, most of them had good docs. That would be another
thing that he would have to do.

Forget it. ;-))

salaam,
dowcom

[Sam Gillett]

Post by bud
Uuff! Didn't think of that. I've never used support on the kits I've
built. Only the first one gave me trouble. (When I was about 14 years
old. Wired the electrolytics in backwards. Doh!)

Don't feel bad about it. :-) First kit I built I connected one wire to
the wrong pin on one of the tube sockets. First time I turned it on, the
filament blew on the rectifier tube.

From that, I learned something that served me well for the rest of my life.
When making electrical, or electronic connections, check every connection at
least twice against the wiring diagram. Once _before_ making the connection,
and again _after_ making the connection.

Post by bud
Come to think of it, most of them had good docs. That would be another
thing that he would have to do.

Those kits _had_ to have good docs. Otherwise, they would have had a lot of
dissatisfied customers!

[Rick Balkins]

Post by Alan Reed
You're probably right. On the other hand, I can't get something as simple
as a JiffyDOS ROM. I don't have a burner myself, but my understanding is
that it's a fairly quick, simple process. I wonder how long it would take to
get software from him. Anyone order GEOS/Wheels lately? I think I'll go
the Ebay route. I'd love to buy stuff from his catalog, if he brings
anything to sell to the Expo I'll be ready. But I don't trust him enough to
order anything from him again. I'm sure Maurice is a nice guy--seeing how
eager people are to defend him is a testament to that. But two months for a
ROM chip? 2 years (and counting) for a SCPU?

Maurice needs to order at least $100 worth of WDC parts due to WDC minimum
order policy and he also would need to order at least the minimum amount of
any vendor for the other chips.

If there is no FD-2000 or CMD HD being ordered then at least 17 SuperCPUs
would need to be ordered before he can produce a run of them. Since you need
to have the 65c816 in order for the SCPU to work.

[Alan Reed]

Post by Rick Balkins
Maurice needs to order at least $100 worth of WDC parts due to WDC minimum
order policy and he also would need to order at least the minimum amount of
any vendor for the other chips.
If there is no FD-2000 or CMD HD being ordered then at least 17 SuperCPUs
would need to be ordered before he can produce a run of them. Since you need
to have the 65c816 in order for the SCPU to work.

You seem to know an awful lot about it.
So, does any of this explain why it takes 2 month to get a JiffyDOS ROM?

[Rick Balkins]

Post by Alan Reed
You seem to know an awful lot about it.
So, does any of this explain why it takes 2 month to get a JiffyDOS ROM?

I can say a rough figure on the 65c816 and other WDC parts but as for the
ROM, it may be a another factor. I don't say for sure on that. Given the
size of the ROM chip (EEPROM/EPROM).

The ROMs will depend on the availability of the chips themselves.

[Peter van Merkerk]

Post by Alan Reed

Post by Rick Balkins
Maurice needs to order at least $100 worth of WDC parts due to WDC minimum
order policy and he also would need to order at least the minimum amount

of

Post by Rick Balkins
any vendor for the other chips.
If there is no FD-2000 or CMD HD being ordered then at least 17 SuperCPUs
would need to be ordered before he can produce a run of them. Since you

need

Post by Rick Balkins
to have the 65c816 in order for the SCPU to work.

You seem to know an awful lot about it.

He doesn't, but he likes to pretend he does.
All semiconductor manufactures have a minimum order policy. And unless
you are a big player you don't deal directly with the manufacturer.
Normally you get the parts from an middleman which doesn't have a
minimum order policy (but that service comes at a price).

That being said it would be cheaper and faster to produce 20 SCPUs (or
whatever) in one go, than one SCPU at a time times twenty.

Post by Alan Reed
So, does any of this explain why it takes 2 month to get a JiffyDOS ROM?

No. In fact considering the cost of an EPROM and time it takes to
program them it would make sense to stock those.

--
Peter van Merkerk
peter.van.merkerk(at)dse.nl

[Rick Balkins]

That is what is known as batch production. You order at least to the minimum
$$$$ amount. WDC doesn't have a minimum number of 65c816 you must order
persay but a minimum amount of money like a $100 minimum order.

So in fact you can go direct from WDC and buy a batch of SCPUs for so many
SCPUs. Then you produce the SCPUs as the orders go and then you buy another
batch.

Post by Peter van Merkerk
He doesn't, but he likes to pretend he does.
All semiconductor manufactures have a minimum order policy. And unless
you are a big player you don't deal directly with the manufacturer.
Normally you get the parts from an middleman which doesn't have a
minimum order policy (but that service comes at a price).
That being said it would be cheaper and faster to produce 20 SCPUs (or
whatever) in one go, than one SCPU at a time times twenty.

Post by Alan Reed
So, does any of this explain why it takes 2 month to get a JiffyDOS ROM?

No. In fact considering the cost of an EPROM and time it takes to
program them it would make sense to stock those.
--
Peter van Merkerk
peter.van.merkerk(at)dse.nl

[Nick Coplin]

Post by Rick Balkins
Maurice needs to order at least $100 worth of WDC parts due to WDC minimum
order policy and he also would need to order at least the minimum amount of
any vendor for the other chips.

Rubbish! First, there are other vendors for the 65816 parts. For
example, the guys at www.6502.org try to run an annual "group
purchase" allowing individuals to pool orders for 1-2 chips to get
over the $100 minimum! Hey, I even got a few chips this way ;)

I would suspect assembly and test time is the limitation, given it's
an after hours operation. Just not enough hours...

[mikec]

Hi Nick,

Post by Nick Coplin
Rubbish! First, there are other vendors for the 65816 parts. For
example, the guys at www.6502.org try to run an annual "group

I think Rick's problem is that he's never actually built anything.
He's all talk so his knowledge is based on reading instead of doing.

On an interesting sidenote, I recently read that HP just release a new
RPN calculator (the HP 33S). I decided to take a look at the specs and
noticed that it uses a 6502! Interesting...

MikeC

[Rick Balkins]

Now, how do you think they do that MikeC. A synthesizable core so they can
fit the core in a special microcontroller but technically for a calculator,
they can simply use the 65c134 which is a 6502 based microcontroller
(basically a controller that integrates the I/O.

Keep in mind that there is more things with the 6502.

BTW: Didn't you know you get discounts when you buy the parts in bulk. In
other words - the more you buy the less it costs until it reaches a certain
point. Also didn't you know that the less transistors and all - the smaller
the chip core is and the smaller the chip core - the more chips per wafer
board. Also if you go to even smaller die fabrication like .13um - the more
chips can be fitted on a single wafer. In other words - lower price in the
long run. 6502 has been established in the embedded marketplace.

Post by mikec
Hi Nick,

Post by Nick Coplin
Rubbish! First, there are other vendors for the 65816 parts. For
example, the guys at www.6502.org try to run an annual "group

I think Rick's problem is that he's never actually built anything.
He's all talk so his knowledge is based on reading instead of doing.
On an interesting sidenote, I recently read that HP just release a new
RPN calculator (the HP 33S). I decided to take a look at the specs and
noticed that it uses a 6502! Interesting...
MikeC

[Sam Gillett]

Post by mikec
On an interesting sidenote, I recently read that HP just release a new
RPN calculator (the HP 33S). I decided to take a look at the specs and
noticed that it uses a 6502! Interesting...

IIRC, the original 6502 was designed for use in a calculator. Interesting
that it is returning to its beginnings.

[Rick Balkins]

It always was available for calculators for quite some time.

Post by Sam Gillett
IIRC, the original 6502 was designed for use in a calculator. Interesting
that it is returning to its beginnings.

[Michael J. Schülke]

Post by Sam Gillett
IIRC, the original 6502 was designed for use in a calculator. Interesting
that it is returning to its beginnings.

Are you sure? AFAIK, the 6502 was designed as a low-cost alternative to
the 6800 (as witnessed by the Apple I motherboard, among others).
Intel's 4004, OTOH, was originally developed as a calculator chip for
Busicom.

Regards,
Michael

[Peter van Merkerk]

Post by Michael J. Schülke

Post by Sam Gillett
IIRC, the original 6502 was designed for use in a calculator. Interesting
that it is returning to its beginnings.

Are you sure? AFAIK, the 6502 was designed as a low-cost alternative to
the 6800 (as witnessed by the Apple I motherboard, among others).
Intel's 4004, OTOH, was originally developed as a calculator chip for
Busicom.

Yes, that how I remember it too.

--
Peter van Merkerk
peter.van.merkerk(at)dse.nl

[Peter van Merkerk]

Post by Michael J. Schülke

Post by Sam Gillett
IIRC, the original 6502 was designed for use in a calculator. Interesting
that it is returning to its beginnings.

Are you sure? AFAIK, the 6502 was designed as a low-cost alternative to
the 6800 (as witnessed by the Apple I motherboard, among others).
Intel's 4004, OTOH, was originally developed as a calculator chip for
Busicom.

IIRC MOS was started by couple of ex-Motorola employees. The first
product was the 6500 processor, which was pin compatible with the
Motorola 6800. Motorola didn't like that, and to avoid legal actions the
6500 was taken from the market and replaced by the 6502, which was not
pin compatible.

--
Peter van Merkerk
peter.van.merkerk(at)dse.nl

[Rick Balkins]

Of course that can happen but if that isn't happening then WDC is the main
source to get them. I probably should have phrased it better like "...direct
from WDC".

Post by Nick Coplin
Rubbish! First, there are other vendors for the 65816 parts. For
example, the guys at www.6502.org try to run an annual "group
purchase" allowing individuals to pool orders for 1-2 chips to get
over the $100 minimum! Hey, I even got a few chips this way ;)
I would suspect assembly and test time is the limitation, given it's
an after hours operation. Just not enough hours...

[RajW]

On Sat, 1 May 2004 14:15:13 -0700, "Rick Balkins"

Post by Rick Balkins
Maurice needs to order at least $100 worth of WDC parts due to WDC minimum
order policy and he also would need to order at least the minimum amount of
any vendor for the other chips.
If there is no FD-2000 or CMD HD being ordered then at least 17 SuperCPUs
would need to be ordered before he can produce a run of them. Since you need
to have the 65c816 in order for the SCPU to work.

Maurice should give the customer the alternative to supply their own
65c816. You can get an Apple //gs on eBay for $10 USD and pull the
65c816 chip out (it's socketed). I did. :)

/*Raj*/

[Rick Balkins]

I can pick up 20 65c816s if people wish to pool the funds for them.

For example I can get a batch of 25 CPUs for $160-165 roughly. In fact they
be the same model as the 65c816 in the SuperCPU. So 20 Mhz.

The figure would be the CPU plus s&h.

Post by RajW
Maurice should give the customer the alternative to supply their own
65c816. You can get an Apple //gs on eBay for $10 USD and pull the
65c816 chip out (it's socketed). I did. :)

[MagerValp]

R> Maurice should give the customer the alternative to supply their
R> own 65c816.

Why should he do that? What would he possibly gain from doing so?

R> You can get an Apple //gs on eBay for $10 USD and pull the 65c816
R> chip out (it's socketed). I did. :)

That's a 4 MHz part. The odds of it working at 20 MHz aren't too high.

[RajW]

Post by MagerValp
That's a 4 MHz part. The odds of it working at 20 MHz aren't too high.

True... Valid point. I had forgotten about that. :)

/*Raj*/

[Rick Balkins]

Post by RajW

Post by MagerValp
That's a 4 MHz part. The odds of it working at 20 MHz aren't too high.

True... Valid point. I had forgotten about that. :)

But people can pool and buy a bunch of 65c816s at 20 MHz.

It depends on what you wish to hack apart. There are plenty of 65c816
devices at 20 MHz out there. Just have to get the part.

As for the rest of MV's statement - seems valid. What would Maurice gain
????

Don't know.

[mikec]

Hi RajW,

You can get an Apple //gs on eBay for $10 USD and pull the 65c816 chip

You can get a IIGS for $10? Wow! With all due respect, the IIGS is a
fantastic system. I certainly wouldn't cannibalize parts for the sake
of building a SuperCPU. If I could get a working IIGS for $10, I'd
definitely grab one (I'd pay more for a Woz Edition).

Here are the specs:

2.8 MHz 65C816 CPU (I've heard of 18 MHz upgrades)
256 KB RAM, expandable to 8 MB
320 x 200 / 640 x 200 resolution
4096 color palette
16 (15+1 beep) voices via Ensoniq audio
7 expansion slots
3.5" 800K FDD
GS/OS (similar to Mac OS)
Uses "standard" old-Mac ADB ports (for mouse, keyboard)

To be fair, the IIGS was Apple's answer to the Atari ST and the Amiga
line and probably inferior to both but it was an interesting platform.
It kind of reminds me of Commodore's C-65 effort. I'm sure that in a
parallel universe, these two would have fought it out in the
marketplace.

There's a site I found that features a lot of great IIGS games:

www.inwards.com/~fairway/

I've played some of them using an emulator and they're quite good.
It's almost a hint of what the C-65 could have been.

MikeC

[Alan Reed]

Post by mikec
Hi RajW,

You can get an Apple //gs on eBay for $10 USD and pull the 65c816 chip

You can get a IIGS for $10? Wow! With all due respect, the IIGS is a
fantastic system. I certainly wouldn't cannibalize parts for the sake
of building a SuperCPU. If I could get a working IIGS for $10, I'd
definitely grab one (I'd pay more for a Woz Edition).

The IIgs was an awesome system. Really a far better machine than the Mac
that was available at the same time. I haven't checked ebay prices for a
year or two, but they used to sell for substantially more than $10.

[RajW]

Post by Alan Reed
The IIgs was an awesome system. Really a far better machine than the Mac
that was available at the same time. I haven't checked ebay prices for a
year or two, but they used to sell for substantially more than $10.

Oh I completely agree with you. I actually bought one in 1986/7? after
my C64 (skipped the 128) and was completely blown away by the sound.
Big improvement over my Apple //e. :)

As for the going price... I was dead-on. Here are two recently closed
eBay auctions:

4125060706 US $10.50
4125823672 US $10.49

/*Raj*/

[Alan Reed]

Post by RajW

Post by Alan Reed
The IIgs was an awesome system. Really a far better machine than the Mac
that was available at the same time. I haven't checked ebay prices for a
year or two, but they used to sell for substantially more than $10.

Oh I completely agree with you. I actually bought one in 1986/7? after
my C64 (skipped the 128) and was completely blown away by the sound.
Big improvement over my Apple //e. :)
As for the going price... I was dead-on. Here are two recently closed
4125060706 US $10.50
4125823672 US $10.49

Wow, that's pretty cheap. I might start shopping for one. Thanks for
checking...

[Sam Gillett]

Post by mikec
To be fair, the IIGS was Apple's answer to the Atari ST and the Amiga
line and probably inferior to both but it was an interesting platform.
It kind of reminds me of Commodore's C-65 effort. I'm sure that in a
parallel universe, these two would have fought it out in the
marketplace.

In _this_ universe the C128 gave the IIGS competition in the marketplace. In
spite of the IIGS having better specs, the much lower price of the C128 cost
Apple quite a few sales.

In some of their advertising campaigns Commodore pitted the C128 against the
Apple IIGS, and the Amiga against the Atari ST. If the C65 had ever come to
market, I guess it would have been somewhere in between the C128 and the
Amiga.

[Anders Carlsson]

If the C65 had ever come to market, I guess it would have been
somewhere in between the C128 and the Amiga.

IMHO, if the C65 had ever been planned to come to market, it had
BEEN the C128. That is based upon the illusion that the C65 would
be ready for sale in 1987, not 1991.

Here's my imaginary timeline:

1980 The VIC-20 is released
1982 The C64 is released
1984 The VIC-40 (kind of backwards compatible C16) replaces VIC-20
1986 The Amiga 1000 is introduced
1987 The C128/65 is released, finally replacing the C64
1991 The Amiga CDPlayStation is introduced, a dedicated,
improved game machine in collaboration with Sony
1992 The 8-bit line is EOLed
1994 Commodore gets a financial crisis, and Sony buys it all
1995 The PlayStation II is introduced.
1997 Sony issues a "fair use" license for emulating and using
ROM images from the 8-bit line of computers

Not that it in any way helps the distribution of SuperCPUs...

[Matthew Montchalin]

Anders Carlsson wrote:
|"Sam Gillett" <***@diespammermsn.com> writes:
|
|> If the C65 had ever come to market, I guess it would have been
|> somewhere in between the C128 and the Amiga.
|
|IMHO, if the C65 had ever been planned to come to market, it had
|BEEN the C128. That is based upon the illusion that the C65 would
|be ready for sale in 1987, not 1991.
|
|Here's my imaginary timeline:
|
|1980 The VIC-20 is released
|1982 The C64 is released
|1984 The VIC-40 (kind of backwards compatible C16) replaces VIC-20

Maybe the VIC-40 could have been saddled with the Z80?

|1986 The Amiga 1000 is introduced
|1987 The C128/65 is released, finally replacing the C64
|1991 The Amiga CDPlayStation is introduced, a dedicated,
| improved game machine in collaboration with Sony
|1992 The 8-bit line is EOLed

Nah, just maxing out the possible number of serial devices
you could conceivably hang off the C-64:

CBM Super-Math Engine for crunching 80 bit floating point
CBM Super-Graphics Engine for 256 planes of 256 bit colors
CBM Laserprinter
CBM photocopy machine

The market would buy into it, especially since almost nobody
moved over to the PC.

[Anders Carlsson]

Post by Matthew Montchalin
Maybe the VIC-40 could have been saddled with the Z80?

Not sure why. The Commodore 16 was said to replace the VIC-20 for
those who didn't want or couldn't afford to get a Commodore 64. It
also was meant as a cheaper alternative on the European where the
ZX Spectrum among others was a strong competitor.

Adding a Z80 to a budget machine at that time would've been daring,
but maybe a way to sell it as both a VIC-20 replacement AND a CP/M
compatible machine. It had better not become too expensive though.

[Matthew Montchalin]

Anders Carlsson wrote:
|> Maybe the VIC-40 could have been saddled with the Z80?
|
|Not sure why.

I was hoping the timing might have been easier to deal with, seeing
as how the VIC-II presented engineers with a phi2 timing problem.

|The Commodore 16 was said to replace the VIC-20 for those who didn't
|want or couldn't afford to get a Commodore 64. It also was meant as a
|cheaper alternative on the European where the ZX Spectrum among others
|was a strong competitor.

What kind of graphics did most CP/M machines have? Wasn't it much
more similar to the Vic-20 than the C-64?

|Adding a Z80 to a budget machine at that time would've been daring,
|but maybe a way to sell it as both a VIC-20 replacement AND a CP/M
|compatible machine. It had better not become too expensive though.

Didn't the Vic-20 have an expansion port that a Z80 card was already
available for?

[Anders Carlsson]

Post by Matthew Montchalin
I was hoping the timing might have been easier to deal with, seeing
as how the VIC-II presented engineers with a phi2 timing problem.

Ah. How does the TED compare, with its own clock generator?

I don't know if the 6562 would've had a 6561 resolution mode, which
is one of the key points behind my reasoning with introducing an
improved budget model which was compatible with something else for
which there already was software, much like how the C128 turned out
to be. Surely Commodore would've solved it to its best by 2-3 years
of development.

Post by Matthew Montchalin
What kind of graphics did most CP/M machines have?

I don't think CP/M as an operating system defines any graphic
capabilities, but I'm sure there were several Z80 (and later X86)
machines with graphics on par with the VIC-II, at least when it
came to static resolution (i.e. not sprites, soft scrolling etc).

Post by Matthew Montchalin
Didn't the Vic-20 have an expansion port that a Z80 card was already
available for?

The C64 had a CP/M cartridge with a Z80, but I'm not sure if the
VIC ever had.

An alternative is of course to completely skip all budget machines
between the C64 and the super-C128. The peripherals still would be
expensive, especially if Commodore decided to make every machine
use different sets of peripherals, and the technical platform was
more or less the same (for those who preferred e.g. a Speccy on
technical reasons).

The C64 already had a lot of users, software publishers and support,
which should've been a good argument to sell on compared to cheap
newcomers. Established brands in the cheaper price levels would
already have the same user support as Commodore had, so difficult
to make an impact there with a brand new budget model.

[Rick Balkins]

Post by Anders Carlsson

Post by Matthew Montchalin
Didn't the Vic-20 have an expansion port that a Z80 card was already
available for?

The C64 had a CP/M cartridge with a Z80, but I'm not sure if the
VIC ever had.

<<< snip >>>

It is probably possible to stick a z80 to the VIC-20.

[Anders Carlsson]

Post by Rick Balkins
It is probably possible to stick a z80 to the VIC-20.

I'm sure you could interface POKEY with a PET 4032 too, but only
because it may be technically possible today, it didn't exist as
a commercially or otherwise available gadget 20 years ago.

[Rick Balkins]

Probably it may existed then - it was a matter of marketing more than
anything. Back when VIC-20 was in the market - it was primarily an issue of
Commodore was strong in its proprietary system and CP/M was merely
competition. Politics of Marketing.

Keep in mind 8 bit = 30 year old technology. The z80 has been around for
some time. They did do it on the C64 in a matter of a few years but the CP/M
didn't really catch on highly until 1984/1985 and when Commodore decided to
do a little convergence play by adding the z80 and CP/M. It is because there
were many C64 users that came over from CP/M based systems and other systems
and they were ready for an upgrade and by the C128 days, C= felt they could
expand their customer base by bringing over some of the CP/M users over to
Commodore if a Commodore can run their software. Well... this was probably
limited though.

This was probably a minor part of the marketing anyway but part of the
larger picture.

The gadget for a z80 cartridge existed in 1983 for the c64 and was really
within means but this is still 20 years ago but many VIC-20 users upgraded
to C64 anyway. We are talking marketing and technologically. It was
technically possible then and is today but the demands are not there then in
a commercial level.

Post by Anders Carlsson
I'm sure you could interface POKEY with a PET 4032 too, but only
because it may be technically possible today, it didn't exist as
a commercially or otherwise available gadget 20 years ago.

[Matthew Montchalin]

Rick Balkins wrote:
|"Anders Carlsson" <***@mds.mdh.se> wrote in message
|news:***@legolas.mdh.se...
|
|> > Didn't the Vic-20 have an expansion port that a Z80 card was already
|> > available for?
|>
|> The C64 had a CP/M cartridge with a Z80, but I'm not sure if the
|> VIC ever had.
|<<< snip >>>
|
|It is probably possible to stick a z80 to the VIC-20.

Well, there was an 80 column card for the Vic-20, and there were memory
expanders for the Vic-20, so I naturally supposed there to have been a
Z80 card for the thing as well.

If the C-64 had never been issued, Commodore would have offered all
kinds of expansion cards for the Vic-20. Including 80 column graphics
cards with sprites, maybe a sound effects card, and so on.

[Matthew Montchalin]

||It is probably possible to stick a z80 to the VIC-20.
|
|Well, there was an 80 column card for the Vic-20, and there were memory
|expanders for the Vic-20, so I naturally supposed there to have been a
|Z80 card for the thing as well.
|
|If the C-64 had never been issued, Commodore would have offered all
|kinds of expansion cards for the Vic-20. Including 80 column graphics
|cards with sprites, maybe a sound effects card, and so on.

I seem to notice that Transactor magazine (Volume 5, Issue 02) has a
blurb about a Commodore 64 Memory Expander from LETCO, a company in
Plain City, Ohio. Was their memory expander similar to the 1700, 1764,
1750 REU series from Commodore?

As for their memory expander for the Vic-20, it got banked into an 8K
slot $8000-9ffff. By poking a particular address, you could flip this
8K slot into any of 8 other external banks, but they were always
addressed in the same place.

Do you know who the engineers were that worked for LETCO, and designed
this ram card?

[Anders Carlsson]

Post by Matthew Montchalin
As for their memory expander for the Vic-20, it got banked into
an 8K slot $8000-9ffff.

ITYM $A000-$BFFF, which is the normal RAM/ROM slot for cartridges.
It is interesting to hear that the expander itself could be made to
switch contents of the slot, but as usual, 64K software written for
this expansion would have a hard time to run on any other computer
which doesn't have the same expansion.

Theoretically, they could've banked in 16, 24 or even 32K at a time
by using memory blocks 1-3 plus 5 in combinations. Maybe even block
4 works, but I'm not up to date with internal addressing and what
happens if an external unit "listens" to the same addresses as the
ROM and I/O chips.

[mikec]

Hi Anders,

Post by Anders Carlsson
IMHO, if the C65 had ever been planned to come to market, it had
BEEN the C128. That is based upon the illusion that the C65 would
be ready for sale in 1987, not 1991.

Commodore could have saved everyone the trouble and just (somehow)
built C-64 emulation or compatibility into the Amiga (and
specifically, the A500). After all, the A500 was released in 1987,
right? So why even bother with a product like the C-65? Obviously,
they didn't...

There are advantages and disadvantages for building a C-64 into a
A500. It certainly would have provided a lot of incentive and an extra
push for C-64/C-128 owners to upgrade to the Amiga. The down side is
maybe suffering a similar fate to the C-128 where developers ignore
the advanced tech and keep developing for the legacy side. In other
words, maybe people wouldn't have focused so much on the Amiga side if
it was C-64 compatible. However, I'm sure it wouldn't have been that
bad since the Amiga was a fairly compelling platform.

Whatever the case, it just seems that Commodore squandered a lot of
time, money and resources on too many technologies, chips and products
that just never saw the light of day. The TED, the LCD 128, VIC-40,
ColorPET's, etc.

Hindsight is 20/20. ;)

MikeC

[mikec]

Hi Sam,

Post by Sam Gillett
In _this_ universe the C128 gave the IIGS competition in the marketplace.

I believe you are mistaken. The C-128's main competition was the Apple
IIc. If you look at the timing of release and the specs on both
systems, the C-128 was a response to the IIc.

The IIgs was, clearly, a direct response to the Amiga and ST lines and
not the C-128. The IIgs was well supported by software developers who
happily ported Amiga and ST games over to it. Most games looked pretty
similar, if not the exact same, on the IIgs when compared to the Amiga
or ST.

Post by Sam Gillett
In some of their advertising campaigns Commodore pitted the C128 against the
Apple IIgs, and the Amiga against the Atari ST.

I vaguely recall these ads...are you sure they weren't comparing the
C-128 to the Apple IIe or IIc? If they did compare it to the IIGS, it
would have been a mistake to compare a technically inferior C-128 to
the IIgs.

After all, the IIgs featured a "16-bit processor" vs. the C-128's
8-bit, had a faster clock speed, had 5x as many voices (15) and the
superior Ensoniq sound chip, later versions of the IIgs came with the
double the RAM (256 KB), had a 4096 color palette vs. the C-128's 16
colors, and let's not forget the 7 slots. The IIgs also provide a
factory-installed hard drive option and even shipped with a mouse.

MikeC

[Greg Nacu]

On 4/5/04 11:41 AM, in article

Post by mikec
After all, the IIgs featured a "16-bit processor" vs. the C-128's
8-bit, had a faster clock speed, had 5x as many voices (15) and the
superior Ensoniq sound chip, later versions of the IIgs came with the
double the RAM (256 KB), had a 4096 color palette vs. the C-128's 16
colors, and let's not forget the 7 slots. The IIgs also provide a
factory-installed hard drive option and even shipped with a mouse.

I've played around with a IIgs. It was kinda neat. But frankly I have
never seen the appeal of older apple machines. The IIgs was "like a mac",
only crappier. So all the incentive is to just get a better Apple and toss
your IIgs at first financial opportunity. Whereas with the C64/128 even
though perhaps technically inferior, there is nothing else like them. I
wouldn't ever toss a c64 to replace it with an amiga.

Greg.

[Sam Gillett]

Post by mikec
I believe you are mistaken. The C-128's main competition was the Apple
IIc. If you look at the timing of release and the specs on both
systems, the C-128 was a response to the IIc.

[snip]

Post by mikec
I vaguely recall these ads...are you sure they weren't comparing the
C-128 to the Apple IIe or IIc? If they did compare it to the IIGS, it
would have been a mistake to compare a technically inferior C-128 to
the IIgs.

IIRC, the Commodore ads gave the specs of several other computers, Apple IIe,
and IIGS, Atari 800, and IBM PC. They pointed out that evgen though the IIGS
had more colors, the C128 was only about a third of the price, and had the
added advantage of being able to run C64 and CP/M applications, as well as
128 specific software.

The current incarnation of the IBM PC at that time shipped with 256kb RAM
standard (more RAM was optional, or could be added later). Commodore's
marketing people took great glee in pointing out that by the time DOS and
Basic were loaded, the IBM PC had less free RAM than the C128 in it's powerup
state.

Don't remember what they listed as the C128's advantage over the Atari.
;-)

[Joseph Fenn]

Well one advantage of the C128 over the Atari was its dual mode
capability. I remember it was a bitter fight between the C128
and that Atari 1300 or was it 1500 series (the last one they
produced)? I am useing a C128 on the internet exclusively due
to its absolute immunity to any type of virus. I have 3 pc
laptops here 2 (486's) and a Pentium 1 Toshiba. What do I use
them for. Mostely to play Solitaire while backing up my 16meg
ramlink stuff at regular intervals. Now that is a hoot!!!
Kokomo Joe


****************************************************
* Ham KH6JF AARS/MARS ABM6JF QCWA WW2 VET WD RADIO *
****************************************************

Post by Sam Gillett

Post by mikec
I believe you are mistaken. The C-128's main competition was the Apple
IIc. If you look at the timing of release and the specs on both
systems, the C-128 was a response to the IIc.

[snip]

Post by mikec
I vaguely recall these ads...are you sure they weren't comparing the
C-128 to the Apple IIe or IIc? If they did compare it to the IIGS, it
would have been a mistake to compare a technically inferior C-128 to
the IIgs.

IIRC, the Commodore ads gave the specs of several other computers, Apple IIe,
and IIGS, Atari 800, and IBM PC. They pointed out that evgen though the IIGS
had more colors, the C128 was only about a third of the price, and had the
added advantage of being able to run C64 and CP/M applications, as well as
128 specific software.
The current incarnation of the IBM PC at that time shipped with 256kb RAM
standard (more RAM was optional, or could be added later). Commodore's
marketing people took great glee in pointing out that by the time DOS and
Basic were loaded, the IBM PC had less free RAM than the C128 in it's powerup
state.
Don't remember what they listed as the C128's advantage over the Atari.
;-)
--
Best regards,
Sam Gillett
Change is inevitable,
except from vending machines!

[mikec]

Hi Joseph,

Post by Joseph Fenn
and that Atari 1300 or was it 1500 series (the last one they

Do you mean the Atari 130 XE? It's funny that Atari also released the
520 ST the same year. Needless to say, the XE's didn't last very long
on the market.

Post by Joseph Fenn
I am useing a C128 on the internet exclusively due
to its absolute immunity to any type of virus.

I've been using PC's for 10-15 years and I've never had a virus or
worm or anything like that. The key is to always run a virus scanner
(I use McAfee and update the SuperDAT on a weekly basis), don't use MS
IE or Outlook (I've always used Netscape and now Mozilla) and never
open attachments unless you're expecting one from a specific person.
If I receive an unexpected attachment from someone I know, I always
call or e-mail them back asking if they sent me an attachment and what
it is. Otherwise, I delete the e-mail.

I find that most people are either stupid or careless, which is why
they get viruses. I have a friend that reads every single e-mail he
receives. I was over at his house one day when he received one of
those "You've got to see this!" e-mails, which he promptly opened and
clicked the attachment. I didn't really have a chance to stop him but
I guess I was also waiting to see if he was actually stupid enough to
the click the attachment from a stranger named "Bubbles." A few days
later, he called to inform me that his computer was infected by a
virus. "Hey, no kidding." was my response.

MikeC

[silverdr]

Post by mikec

Post by Joseph Fenn
I am useing a C128 on the internet exclusively due
to its absolute immunity to any type of virus.

I've been using PC's for 10-15 years and I've never had a virus or
worm or anything like that. The key is to always run a virus scanner
(I use McAfee and update [...]
I find that most people are either stupid or careless, which is why
they get viruses.

The key to not get viruses while still being stupid or careless is to
run something, which is immune to (or neglected by) the virii ;-)

[Rick Balkins]

Actually that is impressively intellegent because - 1. Why should be people
be forced to deal with this. This wasn't part of computer reality. People
didn't make viruses and distribute them in anyform. Anyway - putting a virus
code even on a webpage or transfer in ANY means is distribution and these
people who write them - KEEP them on your OWN computer or disks and give it
to no-one.

Only if the world can follow any principle anymore. Better, don't write it
at all. Use the creativity to do something good for a change. I am sure a
few may ponder this NG as with any other.

Now, I find it annoying of these "a$$hole$".

Post by silverdr
The key to not get viruses while still being stupid or careless is to
run something, which is immune to (or neglected by) the virii ;-)

[Joseph Fenn]

Mike,
Yes its true with PC's virus concious users with firewalls,
Nortins, and everything else they can install to bar virus may
go for a lifetime and not get a virus, however theres always
the one exception that seems to get thru everything includeing
GOVT networks etc. Remember the Phillipino guy that wrecked
nearly half the worlds PC's in all countries.
I love to just open attachments of all kinds on my C128
to see what drivel is on there. Most of it is unreadable or
foreign language or big5 or stuff the C128 just dont understand.
so with Impunity I continue with the old faithful C128
Kokomo Joe


****************************************************
* Ham KH6JF AARS/MARS ABM6JF QCWA WW2 VET WD RADIO *
****************************************************

[Jack]

Post by Joseph Fenn
Mike,
Yes its true with PC's virus concious users with firewalls,
Nortins, and everything else they can install to bar virus may
go for a lifetime and not get a virus, however theres always
the one exception that seems to get thru everything includeing
GOVT networks etc. Remember the Phillipino guy that wrecked
nearly half the worlds PC's in all countries.
I love to just open attachments of all kinds on my C128
to see what drivel is on there. Most of it is unreadable or
foreign language or big5 or stuff the C128 just dont understand.
so with Impunity I continue with the old faithful C128
Kokomo Joe

Hihi.. True, Joe. A ROM based OS is inherently immune from most
malware, especially email-based viruses. There were a few trojans
targetting C-64 C-128 back in the old 78-bit days, though. (E.g. run
a supposed game, and it would scratch "*" on any/all disks connected.

I open Email up on my PC without any fear of damage. I don't even need
fancy firewalls or antivirus stuff running. How do I do it? Simple...

My email reader doesn't understand HTML, doesn't do Micro$oft OLE or
other embedded stuff and it doesn't call in other applications to
process or execute what's supposed to be plain text. It just reads
whats there and sends the ASCII to the screen. If somebody sends
something executible, I know it after reading the first line or two,
as most attachments begin with a file name and/or are in a specific
format. If unsure, I'll open the mail in a hex reader and look at the
dump for clues.

If, after looking at it, I determine it's something safe to execute, I
save the attachment and run it manually under my control.

Many Windows users don't realise they can do things safely (read:
"manually, under user control"), rather than simply click on any Icon
they see, hoping their add-on anti-virus product (if they are even
smart enough to use one) will prevent their computer from getting
infected.

Smart, safe computing begins with the user. :-)

73,

jack
--
Email replies to:
n2hqc ((AT)) earthlink ((DOT)) net

CompTIA Certifications: A+ Technician, Network+, iNet+
3-year Cancer Survivor, and still cancer-free.
URL: http://home.comcast.net/~n2hqc
PGP-Key-ID: 0x08D960D3

[Joseph Fenn]

Jack, I dont recall the virus you referred to a game that
creams any attached disk drives. I dont see how that could
happen. In order for it to overtake files on an attached
1541 or 1571 drive or for that matter a ramlink or HD20,
I cant see how it could happen. You mean you were playing
the game while on a bbs or something and it erased files on
any drive on the serial buss???? Or were you trying a
supposedly a legitimate game (not on line) but just playing
it on your own machine at home and it was written in such
a way with cmds imbeded to s0: on any drive on the serial buss??
Kokomo Joe


****************************************************
* Ham KH6JF AARS/MARS ABM6JF QCWA WW2 VET WD RADIO *
****************************************************

Post by Jack

Post by Joseph Fenn
Mike,
Yes its true with PC's virus concious users with firewalls,
Nortins, and everything else they can install to bar virus may
go for a lifetime and not get a virus, however theres always
the one exception that seems to get thru everything includeing
GOVT networks etc. Remember the Phillipino guy that wrecked
nearly half the worlds PC's in all countries.
I love to just open attachments of all kinds on my C128
to see what drivel is on there. Most of it is unreadable or
foreign language or big5 or stuff the C128 just dont understand.
so with Impunity I continue with the old faithful C128
Kokomo Joe

Hihi.. True, Joe. A ROM based OS is inherently immune from most
malware, especially email-based viruses. There were a few trojans
targetting C-64 C-128 back in the old 78-bit days, though. (E.g. run
a supposed game, and it would scratch "*" on any/all disks connected.
I open Email up on my PC without any fear of damage. I don't even need
fancy firewalls or antivirus stuff running. How do I do it? Simple...
My email reader doesn't understand HTML, doesn't do Micro$oft OLE or
other embedded stuff and it doesn't call in other applications to
process or execute what's supposed to be plain text. It just reads
whats there and sends the ASCII to the screen. If somebody sends
something executible, I know it after reading the first line or two,
as most attachments begin with a file name and/or are in a specific
format. If unsure, I'll open the mail in a hex reader and look at the
dump for clues.
If, after looking at it, I determine it's something safe to execute, I
save the attachment and run it manually under my control.
"manually, under user control"), rather than simply click on any Icon
they see, hoping their add-on anti-virus product (if they are even
smart enough to use one) will prevent their computer from getting
infected.
Smart, safe computing begins with the user. :-)
73,
jack
--
n2hqc ((AT)) earthlink ((DOT)) net
CompTIA Certifications: A+ Technician, Network+, iNet+
3-year Cancer Survivor, and still cancer-free.
URL: http://home.comcast.net/~n2hqc
PGP-Key-ID: 0x08D960D3

[Sam Gillett]

Post by Joseph Fenn
Jack, I dont recall the virus you referred to a game that
creams any attached disk drives. I dont see how that could
happen. In order for it to overtake files on an attached
1541 or 1571 drive or for that matter a ramlink or HD20,
I cant see how it could happen. You mean you were playing
the game while on a bbs or something and it erased files on
any drive on the serial buss???? Or were you trying a
supposedly a legitimate game (not on line) but just playing
it on your own machine at home and it was written in such
a way with cmds imbeded to s0: on any drive on the serial buss??

I think what Jack was talking about was a game, either downloaded, or passed
hand to hand. Not a virus, but a trojan. Back in "the day" there were
plenty of BBSes that kept the latest games up for download. Rather than
compete with them, I kept the latest term programs and utilities on my BBS.
So, I never saw a trojan game personally. But, I did see three trojan
utilities.

They were all hacked versions of popular utilities, so they looked and felt
like the real thing. That way the unsuspecting user was not surprised to see
disk activity start after giving a command that should cause disk activity.

And, as I said, they were popular utilities, all the better to fool people.
The ones I saw personally were Lynx, Disk Doctor, and Velvetta. They were
nastier than a simple "S0:"*", after all utilities exist to recover scratched
files. The trojan version of Lynx would overwrite every sector of the
directory track, BAM included, with derogatory remarks about the author of
Lynx.

Although the Commodore OS was safe, being, as it is, in ROM, data and
programs on disk were not entirely safe from the evil side of hacking. Lets
face it, there are both bad and good hackers. That is the way it always has
been, and probably the way it always will be.

[Jack]

On Fri, 07 May 2004 00:29:18 GMT, "Sam Gillett"

Post by Sam Gillett

Post by Joseph Fenn
Jack, I dont recall the virus you referred to a game that
creams any attached disk drives. I dont see how that could
happen. In order for it to overtake files on an attached
1541 or 1571 drive or for that matter a ramlink or HD20,
I cant see how it could happen. You mean you were playing
the game while on a bbs or something and it erased files on
any drive on the serial buss???? Or were you trying a
supposedly a legitimate game (not on line) but just playing
it on your own machine at home and it was written in such
a way with cmds imbeded to s0: on any drive on the serial buss??

I think what Jack was talking about was a game, either downloaded, or passed
hand to hand. Not a virus, but a trojan. Back in "the day" there were
plenty of BBSes that kept the latest games up for download. Rather than
compete with them, I kept the latest term programs and utilities on my BBS.
So, I never saw a trojan game personally. But, I did see three trojan
utilities.
They were all hacked versions of popular utilities, so they looked and felt
like the real thing. That way the unsuspecting user was not surprised to see
disk activity start after giving a command that should cause disk activity.
And, as I said, they were popular utilities, all the better to fool people.
The ones I saw personally were Lynx, Disk Doctor, and Velvetta. They were
nastier than a simple "S0:"*", after all utilities exist to recover scratched files. The trojan version of Lynx would overwrite every sector of the
directory track, BAM included, with derogatory remarks about the author of
Lynx.

I recall warnings from other sysops about some of the utilities you
mentioned. There was also a guy in my area that used to make trojans
that looked like hacked games. The opening screen would load up, and
instead of loading the program, track 18 would be wiped out.

Post by Sam Gillett
Although the Commodore OS was safe, being, as it is, in ROM, data and
programs on disk were not entirely safe from the evil side of hacking. Lets
face it, there are both bad and good hackers. That is the way it always has
been, and probably the way it always will be.

<sigh...>

Regards

Jack


--
Email replies to:
n2hqc ((AT)) earthlink ((DOT)) net

CompTIA Certifications: A+ Technician, Network+, iNet+
3-year Cancer Survivor, and still cancer-free.
URL: http://home.comcast.net/~n2hqc
PGP-Key-ID: 0x08D960D3

[Jack]

Post by Joseph Fenn
Jack, I dont recall the virus you referred to a game that
creams any attached disk drives.

RE-Read my reply, Joe. I said "trojan," not "virus." There's quite a
difference.

Post by Joseph Fenn
I dont see how that could
happen. In order for it to overtake files on an attached
1541 or 1571 drive or for that matter a ramlink or HD20,
I cant see how it could happen.

Trojans don't need to attach themselves to files on your disk drive.
They don't replicate. Recall the story of the Trojan Horse. It has
nothiing to do with breeding (replicating) horses.

During the Trojan war, what looked like a giant statue of a horse was
left outside the city gates. The people inside assumed that it was a
peace offering from the enemy. When they took it inside, a secret door
opened up, and enemy soldiers came out and overtook the city.

A trojan horse program is, similarly, a destructive program disguised
to look like something good and interesting.

Post by Joseph Fenn
You mean you were playing
the game while on a bbs or something and it erased files on
any drive on the serial buss????

No, but I used to run a BBS. :-)

Post by Joseph Fenn
Or were you trying a
supposedly a legitimate game (not on line) but just playing
it on your own machine at home and it was written in such
a way with cmds imbeded to s0: on any drive on the serial buss??

There is no rule that says that a program that claims to be a game
really is a game. A person may download a program that purports to be
a game, then load and run it... The program displays a neat opening
screen, then issues commands to overwrite the track 18, effectively
erasing the disk it was downloaded to. I encountered a few programs
like that in my commodore days, but dirty tricks like trojans and
ASCII bombs were more prevalent in the IBM/DOS world.

73

Jack



--
My name is Inigo Montoya. You spammed my mailer. Prepare to die.
My name is Inigo Montoya. YOU SPAMMED my MAILER. Prepare to die...
MY NAME IS INIGO MONTOYA! YOU SPAMMED MY MAILER! PREPARE TO DIE!!!

[Rick Balkins]

For example a trojan horse maybe a neat little video game that secretly
destroys data on the hard drive or floppy disk while you think it may be
loading stuff and saving stuff but in fact it is loading and saving but it
isn't just that.

The above can be described as a trojan horse because it is clearly sneaky
and your attention is on the game play and not on what it is doing in a
sneaky manner.

I hope this gives a little pictorial use of a trojan horse. Actually a
classic use.

Post by Jack
Trojans don't need to attach themselves to files on your disk drive.
They don't replicate. Recall the story of the Trojan Horse. It has
nothiing to do with breeding (replicating) horses.
During the Trojan war, what looked like a giant statue of a horse was
left outside the city gates. The people inside assumed that it was a
peace offering from the enemy. When they took it inside, a secret door
opened up, and enemy soldiers came out and overtook the city.
A trojan horse program is, similarly, a destructive program disguised
to look like something good and interesting.

[Joseph Fenn]

Okay I get the idea of how a TRPJAM works now. I guess reas on I
missed out since first started with CBM in 85, I never enjoyed
nor had the time to play games. In fact hated wasteing time on
that. Hence never encountered a TROJAN. When the Amigas first
came out, the "bouncing" ball caught my eye and thought gee thats
weird and interesting to watch. But never got into games.
Kokomo Joe


****************************************************
* Ham KH6JF AARS/MARS ABM6JF QCWA WW2 VET WD RADIO *
****************************************************

[mikec]

Hi Sam,

Post by Sam Gillett
had more colors, the C128 was only about a third of the price, and had the
added advantage of being able to run C64 and CP/M applications, as well as

I wonder if this hurt them when they tried to push 8-bit owners
towards the Amiga? After reading ads like that, people probably used
the same logic not to buy a much more expensive Amiga.

MikeC

[Sam Gillett]

Post by mikec

Post by Sam Gillett
had more colors, the C128 was only about a third of the price, and had
the added advantage of being able to run C64 and CP/M applications, as
well as

I wonder if this hurt them when they tried to push 8-bit owners
towards the Amiga? After reading ads like that, people probably used
the same logic not to buy a much more expensive Amiga.

It might have. I always thought that was the real reason Commodore
discontinued the C128, but kept building the C64 for several years
afterwards.

Discontinuing the C128 when they did may have backfired on them though. I
was saving my "hobby money" fror an Amiga when CBM announced that the C128
would be discontinued. Thinking that the management at Commodore had more
than a few "loose screws" in their collective brain pans, I bought a PC
instead. Several other C128 users that I knew back then did the same thing,
and a couple went with a Mac instead of a PC.

If they had discontinued _all_ 8-bit machines, I might have understood the
logic behind that a little better, and gone ahead with my plans to buy an
Amiga.

In the later years of Commodore, their management seemed to be quite
proficient at shooting themselves in the foot.

[Nick Coplin]

Post by mikec

You can get an Apple //gs on eBay for $10 USD and pull the 65c816 chip

You can get a IIGS for $10? Wow! With all due respect, the IIGS is a
fantastic system. I certainly wouldn't cannibalize parts for the sake
of building a SuperCPU. If I could get a working IIGS for $10, I'd
definitely grab one (I'd pay more for a Woz Edition).

I've done this too, and its ok for preliminary hacking... but the
65816 in the IIGS is 1) only a 4MHz chip; 2) PDIP rather then PLCC;
and so can't be used in SuperCPU.

- Nick

[Rick Balkins]

First off, since the SuperCPU contains only one WDC part and that he would
have to have a minimum order of $100 in parts. It means that there has to be
17 SuperCPU orders. Since it would require him to order 17 65c816s to make
the minimum order. There has to be a minimum number of 65c816s ordered. Of
course if you order some of the other CMD products that have WDC parts then
the figures would be adjusted. Since if there is 7 FD-2000 and 7 SuperCPU
and one CMD HD ordered by customers then there is a go. Basically, there
needs to be a certain level of orders before he can move forward.

Post by mikec
Hi Alan,

Perhaps Maurice should look for some additional partners/investors

This would probably be a "Band-Aid" solution.
I assume that CMD products, such as a SuperCPU, require a certain
level of technical expertise to build, test, troubleshoot, etc. Adding
more people to build them might prove to be problematic in terms of
quality control. Throwing additional money isn't going to have an
impact in terms of production speed, although it might help bring the
costs down by enabling Maurice to buy components in bulk.

<<< snip >>>

[Peter Karlsson]

the point is that Maurice isn't delivering ANYTHING.

I got the 1581 JiffyDOS ROM chip I ordered after a few months (my VISA was
charged when the chip was shipped). So he is delivering, even though he
seems to have quite a backlog (which is understandable).

[l***@news.vcsweb.com]

Subject: Re: Alls Well at CMD-key

Hoi No-One :

On 29 Apr'04, at 03:40, in a message to All , you Scribed:


NO> No-one more then those who have already
NO> been waiting for nearly a year.

So Nu!, I'am on close to two years for my Smart Mouse Repair and
plugs for the PS. I haven't given up on Maurice and haven't bugged him
<well not too often -G->

BCNU

Lord Ronin from Q-Link {Sensei} David O.E. Mohr
SysOp of "The Village" BBS 24/7 multiplatform 503-325-2905
Chancellor of Amiga & Commodore Users Group #447

... I have no Quarrel with you. I have a lot of Quarrels for you!
-=- QWKRR128 V5.10 [R]

[l***@news.vcsweb.com]

Subject: Re: Alls Well at CMD-key NOT

Hoi Jack :

On 01 May'04, at 10:36, in a message to All , you Scribed:


SB> Oh lord! That the treadmill was torture.
SB> When they cranked it up to
SB> a moderate pace, the chest cramps hit hard and I was in agony...

I couldn't breath and was hacking up phlem. ALmost passed out. This
was after two days in ICU from the heart attack.


SB> That was in my second day in ER. They
SB> moved me into a critical room so
SB> they could monitor me. After the blood
SB> work came back ( BAD!) and they
SB> did the CAT scan on my arteries, I was
SB> scheduled for surgery at 9AM on
SB> my 3rd day in the hospital. Everything
SB> happened so fast that it was a
SB> truly frightening experience!

Man I hear ya on the "frightening experience" part. Didn't have to
have surgery <yet>. Just have to take better care of myself and there
is this drenn growing around my heart sack. Can't remember the fancy
word they used. Better diet, more exercise and a drink a day. Stress
related heart attack. Hmm.. they didn't say how large that drink was to
be {BG}

BCNU

Lord Ronin from Q-Link {Sensei} David O.E. Mohr
SysOp of "The Village" BBS 24/7 multiplatform 503-325-2905
Chancellor of Amiga & Commodore Users Group #447
Member Scene World and People of Liberty

... The four Cat food groups. Dry, Canned, Natural, Yours!
-=- QWKRR128 V5.10 [R]