Macrium Reflect Free offline installer

Is an offline installer available and where please? Thank you!

Good Guy

2018-03-11 01:03:47 UTC

Post by JBI
Is an offline installer available and where please? Thank you!

No you have to buy a business version from this link:

<https://www.macrium.com/products/business/standalone/workstation>

The free version is now restricted to people who can show initiatives to
research products for themselves.

I have noticed that you have been abusing the generosity of people who
want to help in these newsgroups. You have been changing your names
several times. You are watched so show some respect to these newsgroups.

Path: aioe.org!eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: JBI <***@ez1.net>
Newsgroups: alt.windows7.general
Subject: Macrium Reflect Free offline installer
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--
With over 600 million devices now running Windows 10, customer
satisfaction is higher than any previous version of windows.

JBI

2018-03-11 01:17:10 UTC

Post by Good Guy

Is an offline installer available and where please? Thank you!

<https://www.macrium.com/products/business/standalone/workstation>
The free version is now restricted to people who can show initiatives to
research products for themselves.
I have noticed that you have been abusing the generosity of people who
want to help in these newsgroups. You have been changing your names
several times. You are watched so show some respect to these newsgroups.

So, tell me, how do I "abuse" it by changing my name? Is that a crime?
And what does it have to do with what I'm asking?

You seem to like provoking controversy for some reason, even when it is
benevolent and peaceful. As a result, since you have now brought things
up at least twice, this time I AM adding you to the filter list.

If you don't like what I'm saying or doing, either filter it or don't
respond at all. This is the last time I will respond to you, name
changed or not!

Good Guy

2018-03-11 01:50:01 UTC

Post by JBI
You seem to like provoking controversy for some reason, even when it
is benevolent and peaceful. As a result, since you have now brought
things up at least twice, this time I AM adding you to the filter list.

OOH. I'm very disappointed. Now who's going to read my posts? You'll
miss my insults to idiots like you.

/--- This email has been checked for viruses by Windows Defender
software.
//https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/windows/comprehensive-security/

--
With over 600 million devices now running Windows 10, customer
satisfaction is higher than any previous version of windows.

VanguardLH

2018-03-11 01:18:38 UTC

Post by JBI
Is an offline installer available and where please? Thank you!

A search on:

https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&q=macium%20reflect%20install

found an image showing the web installer's screen. It is on the
following web page describing how to install Macrium Reflect.

http://www.intowindows.com/how-to-install-macrium-reflect/

You use the web installer to download the full installer. Then you
decide whether or not to run the full installer. If not, store it
wherever you want.

JBI

2018-03-11 01:20:09 UTC

Post by VanguardLH

Post by JBI
Is an offline installer available and where please? Thank you!

https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&q=macium%20reflect%20install
found an image showing the web installer's screen. It is on the
following web page describing how to install Macrium Reflect.
http://www.intowindows.com/how-to-install-macrium-reflect/
You use the web installer to download the full installer. Then you
decide whether or not to run the full installer. If not, store it
wherever you want.

Thank you!

Paul

2018-03-11 12:46:23 UTC

Post by VanguardLH

Post by JBI
Is an offline installer available and where please? Thank you!

Thank you!

It's a two-stage process.

http://updates.macrium.com/reflect/v6/ReflectDLv6.exe <=== stub installer

gives downloader 6.0.553.0, select a 32 bit or 64 bit version,
plus WinPE5 or WinPE10 to make emergency boot CDs.

v6.3.1849_reflect_setup_free_x86.exe 44,303,520 bytes

SHA1: A11293417C4A48972D104B94B5C2B530C375774A

v6.3.1849_reflect_setup_free_x64.exe 46,645,904 bytes

SHA1: 2AFF03BD9AFD677F65647F890026F4D239C70005

You have to be careful of the "install after download" tick box,
which keeps turning itself ON. If you just want to download
the EXE plus a flavor of WINPE for carriage to a second computer,
then you want to untick the install button in the stub.

The actual install is the second stage of the process.

Once the installed program is running, you can then get it to make
you an emergency boot CD.

The Version 7 program, has a running service which wastes CPU
cycles. I suspect it listens to USN Change Journal activity
in the name of being prepared to make differential or
incremental backups later. The older versions of the program,
the running service on them is "quiet". The one above
should be a "quiet" one.

Paul

J. P. Gilliver (John)

2018-03-11 13:50:38 UTC

In message <p838et$rah$***@dont-email.me>, Paul <***@needed.invalid>
writes:
[]

Post by Paul
It's a two-stage process.
http://updates.macrium.com/reflect/v6/ReflectDLv6.exe
<=== stub installer

Thanks for this. Downloaded it, sort of out of curiosity, though I don't
know what the improvements (if they are genuine improvements) are over
the v5 that I've been using.

Post by Paul
gives downloader 6.0.553.0, select a 32 bit or 64 bit version,

I know (from experience with 5) that the 64 bit version won't run on 32
bit hardware; I presume the 32 bit version will run on either. Is there
actually any advantage to the 64 bit version (on 64 bit hardware,
obviously)? I presume there must be _some_, as otherwise they wouldn't
make the two versions.

Post by Paul
plus WinPE5 or WinPE10 to make emergency boot CDs.

Running the stub now. It says it'll download whatever's best for my
machine, plus give me the option to select more.

It has selected 32 bit, presumably as I'm running 7-32 (I think this is
a 64-bit system - it's an i3 I think). The option of 32 or 64 are radio
buttons, so I don't think _that_ is offering the option for _additional_
download, despite what it said.

As for the PE bit: It's offering a drop-down offering
Reflect Installer and PE Components <- defaulting to this
Reflect Installer Only
PE 3 (WAIK) Rescue Components Only
PE 4 (WADK) Rescue Components Only
PE 5 (WADK) Rescue Components Only
PE 10 (WADK) Rescue Components only (Release 1607)

I take it from what you say above that maybe the 10 might be needed for
people with Windows 10, and that the 3 and 4 aren't really worth
bothering with. But it looks as if any but the first option involve two
runs of the stub, whereas the first option (to which it is defaulting)
gets both (but doesn't show which PE). Can you give any insights?

Post by Paul
v6.3.1849_reflect_setup_free_x86.exe 44,303,520 bytes
SHA1: A11293417C4A48972D104B94B5C2B530C375774A
v6.3.1849_reflect_setup_free_x64.exe 46,645,904 bytes
SHA1: 2AFF03BD9AFD677F65647F890026F4D239C70005

I went for the defaults: 32 bit, and the installer-and-PE. It says it's
downloading 184.9 MB.

Post by Paul
You have to be careful of the "install after download" tick box,
which keeps turning itself ON. If you just want to download

You're not kidding! I turned it off initially, then selected the options
box to choose what I was downloading, and it had turned itself back on.

Post by Paul
the EXE plus a flavor of WINPE for carriage to a second computer,

Or to make CDs.

Post by Paul
then you want to untick the install button in the stub.
The actual install is the second stage of the process.

(I presume you mean you run the downloaded file, and it then installs,
rather than being directly runnable.)

Post by Paul
Once the installed program is running, you can then get it to make
you an emergency boot CD.
The Version 7 program, has a running service which wastes CPU
cycles. I suspect it listens to USN Change Journal activity
in the name of being prepared to make differential or
incremental backups later. The older versions of the program,
the running service on them is "quiet". The one above
should be a "quiet" one.
Paul

Thanks for that latter tip/snippet. Since I don't make differential or
incremental (I'd feel uneasy about them for my OS-and-software images,
and I use SyncToy rather than Macrium for my data backups), I won't
bother with 7. (I'll _probably_ not bother with 6, but thought I maybe
ought to have it while it's still available, in case it _does_ have some
advantage over 5.)

Ah, download finished: it briefly said something like "creating .zip
file", then said Done. But hang on: there's no big file in the folder I
specified (I did specify one, the same one I'd put the stub in). Hang on
while I fire up Everything: Oh, it _is_ there, just not one 14x M file:
it's just created a subfolder called Macrium, which has
v6.3.1852_reflect_setup_free_x86.exe (44,303,520 bytes - same as the one
you show, though a different name) and pe3x86.zip (122,729,917 bytes) in
it. (Sorry, I don't have a SHA1 utility installed yet.) I presume the
former (or maybe just what it installs) uses the latter, at least if you
tell it to make CDs, since the CDs (well v5 did anyway) say something
like "loading Windows" when you boot from them.

--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

My mission in life is not merely to survive, but to thrive, and to do so with
some passion, some compassion, some humour, and some style. - Maya Angelou,
quoted by Annabel Nnochiri, in RT 2017/5/13-19

J. P. Gilliver (John)

2018-03-11 14:08:02 UTC

In message <***@255soft.uk>, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
<G6JPG-***@255soft.uk> writes:
[]
Some of the questions I asked are answered if you click the Help button
in the stub installer window, which takes you to
https://knowledgebase.macrium.com/display/KNOW7/Installing+Macrium+Reflect
(though that is headed Macrium Reflect 7 Knowledgebase, it seems to
cover what you see when you run the 6 stub).

--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Whoever decided to limit tagline length to 68 characters can kiss my

Paul

2018-03-11 14:43:38 UTC

Post by Paul
It's a two-stage process.
http://updates.macrium.com/reflect/v6/ReflectDLv6.exe
<=== stub installer

Thanks for this. Downloaded it, sort of out of curiosity, though I don't
know what the improvements (if they are genuine improvements) are over
the v5 that I've been using.

Post by Paul
gives downloader 6.0.553.0, select a 32 bit or 64 bit version,

Post by Paul
plus WinPE5 or WinPE10 to make emergency boot CDs.

Running the stub now. It says it'll download whatever's best for my
machine, plus give me the option to select more.
It has selected 32 bit, presumably as I'm running 7-32 (I think this is
a 64-bit system - it's an i3 I think). The option of 32 or 64 are radio
buttons, so I don't think _that_ is offering the option for _additional_
download, despite what it said.
As for the PE bit: It's offering a drop-down offering
Reflect Installer and PE Components <- defaulting to this
Reflect Installer Only
PE 3 (WAIK) Rescue Components Only
PE 4 (WADK) Rescue Components Only
PE 5 (WADK) Rescue Components Only
PE 10 (WADK) Rescue Components only (Release 1607)
I take it from what you say above that maybe the 10 might be needed for
people with Windows 10, and that the 3 and 4 aren't really worth
bothering with. But it looks as if any but the first option involve two
runs of the stub, whereas the first option (to which it is defaulting)
gets both (but doesn't show which PE). Can you give any insights?

I went for the defaults: 32 bit, and the installer-and-PE. It says it's
downloading 184.9 MB.

Post by Paul
You have to be careful of the "install after download" tick box,
which keeps turning itself ON. If you just want to download

You're not kidding! I turned it off initially, then selected the options
box to choose what I was downloading, and it had turned itself back on.

Post by Paul
the EXE plus a flavor of WINPE for carriage to a second computer,

Or to make CDs.

Post by Paul
then you want to untick the install button in the stub.
The actual install is the second stage of the process.

(I presume you mean you run the downloaded file, and it then installs,
rather than being directly runnable.)

Thanks for that latter tip/snippet. Since I don't make differential or
incremental (I'd feel uneasy about them for my OS-and-software images,
and I use SyncToy rather than Macrium for my data backups), I won't
bother with 7. (I'll _probably_ not bother with 6, but thought I maybe
ought to have it while it's still available, in case it _does_ have some
advantage over 5.)
Ah, download finished: it briefly said something like "creating .zip
file", then said Done. But hang on: there's no big file in the folder I
specified (I did specify one, the same one I'd put the stub in). Hang on
it's just created a subfolder called Macrium, which has
v6.3.1852_reflect_setup_free_x86.exe (44,303,520 bytes - same as the one
you show, though a different name) and pe3x86.zip (122,729,917 bytes) in
it. (Sorry, I don't have a SHA1 utility installed yet.) I presume the
former (or maybe just what it installs) uses the latter, at least if you
tell it to make CDs, since the CDs (well v5 did anyway) say something
like "loading Windows" when you boot from them.

I recommend WinPE5 or WinPE10, because each of those has USB3
chip support.

I don't really know if the WinPE10 has any "disadvantages" or not.
The differences should be driver related.

For one thing, I've noticed that since using WinPE5 or WinPE10, that
file sharing always seems to work when I boot the emergency CD. I
have at least one older emergency CD, where the NIC doesn't work,
so my backup drive is limited to being local.

I didn't really think through the x86 versus x64 issue all that much.

Macrium computes checksums for some internal steps, and a good developer
might get a speed advantage for something in that category.

Or perhaps the compression might run faster. Again, I don't have any
anecdotes to hand, that address how much difference a x64 compressor
would give. Some of the run length compressors (RLE), they get
zero benefit from x64, because the code is basically just an integer
thing with flow control. And the "width" of the register used
makes no difference at all. Whereas, the high-power compressors with
the 600MB dictionary per CPU core, those are pumping data like crazy,
and anything which "pumps up the bandwidth" helps a little bit.
The CPU cache size, compared to a high end compressor memory
foot print, the CPU cache has limited benefit (because the
entire dictionary doesn't fit). Some of the less effective
compressors can almost fit right into the CPU cache.

Paul

FredW

2018-03-11 19:11:01 UTC

Post by VanguardLH

Post by JBI
Is an offline installer available and where please? Thank you!

Thank you!

???
The Macrium Reflect V6 downloader downloads the latest V6,
which is 6.3.1852 - 18th January 2018:
http://updates.macrium.com/reflect/v6/v6.3.1852/details6.3.1852.htm

--
Fred W. (nld)

Paul

2018-03-12 03:03:46 UTC

Post by JBI
Is an offline installer available and where please? Thank you!

Thank you!

???
The Macrium Reflect V6 downloader downloads the latest V6,
http://updates.macrium.com/reflect/v6/v6.3.1852/details6.3.1852.htm

The objective is to give people a copy of a 6.3 stream
version.

When I tested version 7, I was seeing too much CPU usage
from the Macrium service that is running. It uses CPU, even if
you weren't doing backups at the time.

By presenting that link, I'm controlling to a small
extent, what version they get.

I can't answer for how Macrium sets up their server,
and whether a "ReflectDLv6.exe" file returns Version 7
materials. Macrium can replace anything on their end,
when I give dated information like this.

I don't sit around testing server content there on
a daily basis. So obviously, a user should use common
sense about whether links like this are going to work
or not.

Take yesterday. I did around 17GB of downloads to
answer a question. Do you think I'm going to
repeat that 17GB download, every time that question
comes up ? No. I'll present the links I have, and
let people decide for themselves.

I only record these sorts of details, based on when
I needed the files myself. And the above link was
actually some info I found elsewhere, when I needed
to track down a version 6 download. If you went to the
web site, and used the GUI on the ReflectFree page,
they're going to offer you a Version 7 stub installer.
But someone noticed that the V6 Stub was still available,
and that it returns V6 files (of some version).

When I present size information, sometimes it helps
the dude who is still on dialup. And then he won't
try to download that one (until he gets to Starbucks
and their Wifi).

Paul

PeterC

2018-03-12 08:26:37 UTC

Post by Paul
When I tested version 7, I was seeing too much CPU usage
from the Macrium service that is running. It uses CPU, even if
you weren't doing backups at the time.

Is there any disadvantage to setting the service to Manual or Disabled?
I use MR just for clones, so a monitoring service is of no use to me.

Also, does v7 have any benefits over v6?

--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway

Paul

2018-03-12 10:15:53 UTC

Post by Paul
When I tested version 7, I was seeing too much CPU usage
from the Macrium service that is running. It uses CPU, even if
you weren't doing backups at the time.

Is there any disadvantage to setting the service to Manual or Disabled?
I use MR just for clones, so a monitoring service is of no use to me.
Also, does v7 have any benefits over v6?

Well, I'm funny that way. If you write software
that pisses me off, I uninstall it in the blink
of an eye. And that's what happened with V7.
I took one look at Task Manager, and didn't even
have a chance to look for "Features".

A certain printer driver and a webcam driver, got
the same kind of express service here. Burn up my
CPU for nothing, out the door you go :-)

As it is, I occasionally have to switch off Windows Defender
in Windows 10, because it'll cut the performance of
some application in half. If I want to run hashdeep
on a partition, I turn off WD (realtime) first.

Paul

Rene Lamontagne

2018-03-12 13:36:37 UTC

Post by Paul
When I tested version 7, I was seeing too much CPU usage
from the Macrium service that is running. It uses CPU, even if
you weren't doing backups at the time.

Is there any disadvantage to setting the service to Manual or Disabled?
I use MR just for clones, so a monitoring service is of no use to me.
Also, does v7 have any benefits over v6?

Well, I'm funny that way. If you write software
that pisses me off, I uninstall it in the blink
of an eye. And that's what happened with V7.
I took one look at Task Manager, and didn't even
have a chance to look for "Features".
A certain printer driver and a webcam driver, got
the same kind of express service here. Burn up my
CPU for nothing, out the door you go :-)
As it is, I occasionally have to switch off Windows Defender
in Windows 10, because it'll cut the performance of
some application in half. If I want to run hashdeep
on a partition, I turn off WD (realtime) first.
Paul

That's odd Paul, I am running Macrium reflect Version 7.1.2917 sitting
open on the desktop at Idle and it is using 0% on all 3 items in task
manager. The only thing using CPU cycles is Task manager, Less than 1%.

Rene

J. P. Gilliver (John)

2018-03-12 15:31:20 UTC

In message <***@mid.individual.net>, Rene Lamontagne
<***@shaw.ca> writes:
[]

Post by Rene Lamontagne
That's odd Paul, I am running Macrium reflect Version 7.1.2917 sitting
open on the desktop at Idle and it is using 0% on all 3 items in task
manager. The only thing using CPU cycles is Task manager, Less than 1%.
Rene

Presumably if it's listed at all in task manager (let alone three
times!), it must be using _some_ cycles, even if negligible.

--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

WANTED, Dead AND Alive: Schrodinger's Cat

Rene Lamontagne

2018-03-12 16:06:35 UTC

Presumably if it's listed at all in task manager (let alone three
times!), it must be using _some_ cycles, even if negligible.

Listed in processes

Macrium Reflect Disk Imaging and Backup 0%
Macrium Reflect UI Watcher 0%
Macrium Reflect Utility Service 0%

With Macrium running on the desktop idling.

Rene

J. P. Gilliver (John)

2018-03-12 16:32:22 UTC

Post by Rene Lamontagne
That's odd Paul, I am running Macrium reflect Version 7.1.2917
sitting open on the desktop at Idle and it is using 0% on all 3
items in task manager. The only thing using CPU cycles is Task
manager, Less than 1%.
Rene

Presumably if it's listed at all in task manager (let alone three
times!), it must be using _some_ cycles, even if negligible.

Listed in processes
Macrium Reflect Disk Imaging and Backup 0%
Macrium Reflect UI Watcher 0%
Macrium Reflect Utility Service 0%
With Macrium running on the desktop idling.
Rene

I saw the 0% the first time you said it! But, presumably, for them to
appear in Task Manager _at all_, they (all three of them) must be using
_some_ cycles - even if it's one a fortnight. Or some memory. If they
weren't, they wouldn't be listed. (Task Manager rounds to nearest %, and
I think K, so will show 0.)

Whether that actually _matters_, is another matter (-:

--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

As individuals, politicians are usually quite charming, so it is quite hard to
dislike them, but in most cases, it is worth making the effort.
- Mark Williams (UMRA), 2013-4-26

Rene Lamontagne

2018-03-12 17:50:13 UTC

Post by Rene Lamontagne
That's odd Paul, I am running Macrium reflect Version 7.1.2917
sitting open on the desktop at Idle and it is using 0% on all 3
items in task manager. The only thing using CPU cycles is Task
manager, Less than 1%.
Rene

Presumably if it's listed at all in task manager (let alone three
times!), it must be using _some_ cycles, even if negligible.

Listed in processes
Macrium Reflect Disk Imaging and Backup                0%
Macrium Reflect UI Watcher                     0%
Macrium Reflect Utility Service                        0%
With Macrium running on the desktop idling.
Rene

There are dozens of items listed in task manager that are *Not* using
cyles at all, so your presumptions would be incorrect.

Rene

Paul

2018-03-12 19:18:52 UTC

Post by Rene Lamontagne
That's odd Paul, I am running Macrium reflect Version 7.1.2917
sitting open on the desktop at Idle and it is using 0% on all 3
items in task manager. The only thing using CPU cycles is Task
manager, Less than 1%.
Rene

Presumably if it's listed at all in task manager (let alone three
times!), it must be using _some_ cycles, even if negligible.

Listed in processes
Macrium Reflect Disk Imaging and Backup 0%
Macrium Reflect UI Watcher 0%
Macrium Reflect Utility Service 0%
With Macrium running on the desktop idling.
Rene

I saw the 0% the first time you said it! But, presumably, for them to
appear in Task Manager _at all_, they (all three of them) must be
using _some_ cycles - even if it's one a fortnight. Or some memory. If
they weren't, they wouldn't be listed. (Task Manager rounds to nearest
%, and I think K, so will show 0.)

There are dozens of items listed in task manager that are *Not* using
cyles at all, so your presumptions would be incorrect.
Rene

Nothing stops them from fixing it.

But you see, this is how the QA game works.
"You only get one chance to get it right."

Say you go to a restaurant and are served a
bad meal. How many times will you go back and
repeat the experience ?

Paul

Rene Lamontagne

2018-03-12 23:31:27 UTC

Post by Rene Lamontagne
That's odd Paul, I am running Macrium reflect Version 7.1.2917
sitting open on the desktop at Idle and it is using 0% on all 3
items in task manager. The only thing using CPU cycles is Task
manager, Less than 1%.
Rene

Presumably if it's listed at all in task manager (let alone three
times!), it must be using _some_ cycles, even if negligible.

I saw the 0% the first time you said it! But, presumably, for them to
appear in Task Manager _at all_, they (all three of them) must be
using _some_ cycles - even if it's one a fortnight. Or some memory.
If they weren't, they wouldn't be listed. (Task Manager rounds to
nearest %, and I think K, so will show 0.)

There are dozens of items listed in task manager that are *Not* using
cyles at all, so your presumptions would be incorrect.
Rene

Nothing stops them from fixing it.
But you see, this is how the QA game works.
"You only get one chance to get it right."
Say you go to a restaurant and are served a
bad meal. How many times will you go back and
repeat the experience ?
Paul

I agree with that, I have tossed many pieces of software because they
were poorly tested and put on the market.
But in this case 7.1 is working fine on my system and so was 6.3, so I
continue with it unless it proves unsatisfactory.

Rene

J. P. Gilliver (John)

2018-03-13 06:16:26 UTC

[]

Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
I saw the 0% the first time you said it! But, presumably, for them
to appear in Task Manager _at all_, they (all three of them) must be
using _some_ cycles - even if it's one a fortnight. Or some memory.
If they weren't, they wouldn't be listed. (Task Manager rounds to
nearest %, and I think K, so will show 0.)

There are dozens of items listed in task manager that are *Not* using
cyles at all, so your presumptions would be incorrect.
Rene

{How did they get into}/{Why are they still in} the list of items in
Task Manager, then? (Not just the Macrium ones, but all the other
"dozens".)

--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

_____
___ |[]|_n_n_I_c
|___||__|###|____)
O-O--O-O+++--O-O

Rene Lamontagne

2018-03-13 13:55:34 UTC

I saw the 0% the first time you said it! But, presumably, for them
to appear in Task Manager _at all_, they (all three of them) must be
using _some_ cycles - even if it's one a fortnight. Or some memory.
If they weren't, they wouldn't be listed. (Task Manager rounds to
nearest %, and I think K, so will show 0.)

There are dozens of items listed in task manager that are *Not* using
cyles at all, so your presumptions would be incorrect.
Rene

{How did they get into}/{Why are they still in} the list of items in
Task Manager, then? (Not just the Macrium ones, but all the other
"dozens".)

Don't Know, Someone with more knowledge of task manager might know.

Rene

Paul

2018-03-13 15:20:57 UTC

Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
I saw the 0% the first time you said it! But, presumably, for them
to appear in Task Manager _at all_, they (all three of them) must
be using _some_ cycles - even if it's one a fortnight. Or some
memory. If they weren't, they wouldn't be listed. (Task Manager
rounds to nearest %, and I think K, so will show 0.)

There are dozens of items listed in task manager that are *Not* using
cyles at all, so your presumptions would be incorrect.
Rene

{How did they get into}/{Why are they still in} the list of items in
Task Manager, then? (Not just the Macrium ones, but all the other
"dozens".)

Don't Know, Someone with more knowledge of task manager might know.
Rene

When something is railed in Task Manager, you have the
option of studying it in Process Explorer (sysinternals.com).

Loading Image...

A "svchost" is, as the name implies, a "host for services".
A service "takes requests" and "delivers results". Multiple
services can live inside one SVCHOST.

In older Windows OSes, like WinXP, one of the SVCHOSTs had
15 services in it, and they were all "network oriented".
On Windows 10, by comparison, for reasons unknown, Microsoft
has implemented a "one service one SVCHOST" policy, but, it
didn't do it for everything. The result is, the Task Manager
list in Windows 10 is *huge*, but it's huge for two reasons.
There are more services. The services have been given their
own SVCHOST to hide it.

A well-written service, doesn't use any cycles unless you
"talk to it". Services should not be like proper "processes"
and should be lighter in weight, and also lighter in
intent. They're not like a copy of Excel or Word, and don't
use up nearly the same amount of resources. They don't
put a window on the screen AFAIK.

Think for a moment, of a hypothetical "spooler service".
The user wants to print. The printer isn't ready. What
better way to handle it, then have a queue where the
print can be saved, and dribbled out as the printer
is ready for it. I "call" the spooler service with my
print file, and between the spooler service and some printer
service, they dribble out stuff until it is done. As a program,
I can disconnect from the spooler service, while the spooler
service handles the whole print job for me. It means my program
doesn't "jam" until the entire document is printed. The
program doing the printing, is responsive almost immediately
after the print operation happens. And it's all because a
spooler service could be designed to offload individual
programs, and prevent them from "jamming up".

In the picture above, RpcSs service appears to be
doing garbage collection (recovery of unused RAM) for
the desktop display process (the entire desktop is
some kind of program). It had something to do with
the thing that MSEdge was doing, and MSEdge needed a lot
of RAM to do it, then later, MSEdge gave the RAM back.
That RpcSs service for some reason, seemed to be making
RAM freeing calls for about 20 seconds continuously. Which
smacks of bad design. It's like your mom has left for
a three week vacation, and you decide to do 50 loads of
wash an hour before she arrives back from vacation. And
it's too little too late. That garbage collection should
have been done in much smaller time segments. Not left
until the last minute.

In the old days with Unix, you had daemons. The "inetd"
process was a daemon for dispatching things. One of the
things reporting to it was "telnetd", a telnet support
daemon. If the user telnetted remotely to the
computer with an 80x24 terminal, inetd would see the
activity on some control port, and would wake telnetd up
to respond to the login attempt and session. The concept
of services has existed with other names for it, for
some time.

For me, the worst part of the Windows scheme, is it's
so hard to use debugging tools to compare "inside" and
"outside" activities. Some of the tools I use would tell
me "svchost 1156 is doing something", but then I couldn't
peer inside to see any details. And that sucks. I like it
when each service has a unique name (i.e. viewable at the
Task Manager level), and just the name alone hints at what
job it's doing, and why it might be railed.

Paul

Rene Lamontagne

2018-03-13 15:43:57 UTC

I saw the 0% the first time you said it! But, presumably, for them
to appear in Task Manager _at all_, they (all three of them) must
be using _some_ cycles - even if it's one a fortnight. Or some
memory. If they weren't, they wouldn't be listed. (Task Manager
rounds to nearest %, and I think K, so will show 0.)

There are dozens of items listed in task manager that are *Not*
using cyles at all, so your presumptions would be incorrect.
Rene

{How did they get into}/{Why are they still in} the list of items in
Task Manager, then? (Not just the Macrium ones, but all the other
"dozens".)

Don't Know, Someone with more knowledge of task manager might know.
Rene

When something is railed in Task Manager, you have the
option of studying it in Process Explorer (sysinternals.com).
https://s14.postimg.org/6ba7eypc1/Rpc_Ss_busy_loop.gif
A "svchost" is, as the name implies, a "host for services".
A service "takes requests" and "delivers results". Multiple
services can live inside one SVCHOST.
In older Windows OSes, like WinXP, one of the SVCHOSTs had
15 services in it, and they were all "network oriented".
On Windows 10, by comparison, for reasons unknown, Microsoft
has implemented a "one service one SVCHOST" policy, but, it
didn't do it for everything. The result is, the Task Manager
list in Windows 10 is *huge*, but it's huge for two reasons.
There are more services. The services have been given their
own SVCHOST to hide it.
A well-written service, doesn't use any cycles unless you
"talk to it". Services should not be like proper "processes"
and should be lighter in weight, and also lighter in
intent. They're not like a copy of Excel or Word, and don't
use up nearly the same amount of resources. They don't
put a window on the screen AFAIK.
Think for a moment, of a hypothetical "spooler service".
The user wants to print. The printer isn't ready. What
better way to handle it, then have a queue where the
print can be saved, and dribbled out as the printer
is ready for it. I "call" the spooler service with my
print file, and between the spooler service and some printer
service, they dribble out stuff until it is done. As a program,
I can disconnect from the spooler service, while the spooler
service handles the whole print job for me. It means my program
doesn't "jam" until the entire document is printed. The
program doing the printing, is responsive almost immediately
after the print operation happens. And it's all because a
spooler service could be designed to offload individual
programs, and prevent them from "jamming up".
In the picture above, RpcSs service appears to be
doing garbage collection (recovery of unused RAM) for
the desktop display process (the entire desktop is
some kind of program). It had something to do with
the thing that MSEdge was doing, and MSEdge needed a lot
of RAM to do it, then later, MSEdge gave the RAM back.
That RpcSs service for some reason, seemed to be making
RAM freeing calls for about 20 seconds continuously. Which
smacks of bad design. It's like your mom has left for
a three week vacation, and you decide to do 50 loads of
wash an hour before she arrives back from vacation. And
it's too little too late. That garbage collection should
have been done in much smaller time segments. Not left
until the last minute.
In the old days with Unix, you had daemons. The "inetd"
process was a daemon for dispatching things. One of the
things reporting to it was "telnetd", a telnet support
daemon. If the user telnetted remotely to the
computer with an 80x24 terminal, inetd would see the
activity on some control port, and would wake telnetd up
to respond to the login attempt and session. The concept
of services has existed with other names for it, for
some time.
For me, the worst part of the Windows scheme, is it's
so hard to use debugging tools to compare "inside" and
"outside" activities. Some of the tools I use would tell
me "svchost 1156 is doing something", but then I couldn't
peer inside to see any details. And that sucks. I like it
when each service has a unique name (i.e. viewable at the
Task Manager level), and just the name alone hints at what
job it's doing, and why it might be railed.
Paul

Thanks Paul, Task manager is so complicated that I cannot follow what
all it does.
It seems to work (most of the time) so I just let it do what it does.
I just did a backup using Macrium and this is some info I gathered.

The CPU speed varied between 2.6 GHz to 3.06 GHz.
CPU load ran from 11% to 16.5%.
6 cores seemed to be the most active, 2 cores were not used as much.
just as an aside I have 168 items listed under processes.

Rene

J. P. Gilliver (John)

2018-03-13 16:17:09 UTC

Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
I saw the 0% the first time you said it! But, presumably, for
them to appear in Task Manager _at all_, they (all three of them)
must be using _some_ cycles - even if it's one a fortnight. Or
some memory. If they weren't, they wouldn't be listed. (Task
Manager rounds to nearest %, and I think K, so will show 0.)

There are dozens of items listed in task manager that are *Not*
using cyles at all, so your presumptions would be incorrect.
Rene

{How did they get into}/{Why are they still in} the list of items in
Task Manager, then? (Not just the Macrium ones, but all the other
"dozens".)

Don't Know, Someone with more knowledge of task manager might know.
Rene

When something is railed in Task Manager, you have the

[]
Nothing is railed; on the contrary, Rene is saying that these three (!)
Macrium processes are using 0% (which I'm saying means they're using
less than 1%, probably less than half a percent, depending whether it
rounds or truncates). I was just saying that, if they appear in the list
at all, they must be using _some_ resources - though probably not a
significant amount.

(FWIW, I have 94 processes showing, _all_ but the System Idle Process
_showing_ as 0%. In fact the total usage figure at the bottom is
bouncing around between mostly 2 and 7% - and while I've been typing
this paragraph, I've even seen it show 1 and 0%, though also 9. [And
that's with both Firefox26 and Chrome open, each with lots of tabs!
_Memory_ is showing as 70%, which I expect _is_ those two mostly.])

--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Veni Vidi Vacuum [I came, I saw, It sucked] - ***@saslimited.demon.co.uk, 1998

Paul

2018-03-13 22:40:21 UTC

Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
I saw the 0% the first time you said it! But, presumably, for
them to appear in Task Manager _at all_, they (all three of
them) must be using _some_ cycles - even if it's one a
fortnight. Or some memory. If they weren't, they wouldn't be
listed. (Task Manager rounds to nearest %, and I think K, so
will show 0.)

There are dozens of items listed in task manager that are *Not*
using cyles at all, so your presumptions would be incorrect.
Rene

{How did they get into}/{Why are they still in} the list of items in
Task Manager, then? (Not just the Macrium ones, but all the other
"dozens".)

Don't Know, Someone with more knowledge of task manager might know.
Rene

When something is railed in Task Manager, you have the

[]
Nothing is railed; on the contrary, Rene is saying that these three (!)
Macrium processes are using 0% (which I'm saying means they're using
less than 1%, probably less than half a percent, depending whether it
rounds or truncates). I was just saying that, if they appear in the list
at all, they must be using _some_ resources - though probably not a
significant amount.
(FWIW, I have 94 processes showing, _all_ but the System Idle Process
_showing_ as 0%. In fact the total usage figure at the bottom is
bouncing around between mostly 2 and 7% - and while I've been typing
this paragraph, I've even seen it show 1 and 0%, though also 9. [And
that's with both Firefox26 and Chrome open, each with lots of tabs!
_Memory_ is showing as 70%, which I expect _is_ those two mostly.])

The version of Macrium 7 I tested, there was a service that was
using cycles when Macrium wasn't running. That's verboten at
my house... It's like if some yutz decides to run a coin
miner on a web page - how long do you think I'm going to
stay on that web page ? About a microsecond :-)

I don't have a reason to keep testing Version 7, when I
have copies of 6.3 on the computers running just fine.

If this was a program for which I had no working copy,
I might put more effort into it. But as it is, there's
really no incentive for me personally, to be pursuing 7.

It's good that other people are still testing it
and have noted an improvement.

The Macrium staff seem to be pretty good at what they
do. They're better than Acronis. It isn't often that
you catch the Macrium people on an off-day.

Task Manager shows processes. Process Explorer can show
some information for Threads. A process can have hundreds
of threads inside. I don't know if Microsoft keeps a nice
web page with a taxonomy or not. It would be handy if
they did. I could use a refresher.

Paul

PeterC

2018-03-12 17:21:24 UTC

Post by Paul
When I tested version 7, I was seeing too much CPU usage
from the Macrium service that is running. It uses CPU, even if
you weren't doing backups at the time.

Is there any disadvantage to setting the service to Manual or Disabled?
I use MR just for clones, so a monitoring service is of no use to me.
Also, does v7 have any benefits over v6?

Well, I'm funny that way. If you write software
that pisses me off, I uninstall it in the blink
of an eye. And that's what happened with V7.
I took one look at Task Manager, and didn't even
have a chance to look for "Features".
A certain printer driver and a webcam driver, got
the same kind of express service here. Burn up my
CPU for nothing, out the door you go :-)
As it is, I occasionally have to switch off Windows Defender
in Windows 10, because it'll cut the performance of
some application in half. If I want to run hashdeep
on a partition, I turn off WD (realtime) first.
Paul

Same here - I've been trying 'portable' s/w, it wants to do something like
chane the Reg. and it's out.

--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway

Monty

2018-03-12 21:00:35 UTC

Post by Paul
When I tested version 7, I was seeing too much CPU usage
from the Macrium service that is running. It uses CPU, even if
you weren't doing backups at the time.

Is there any disadvantage to setting the service to Manual or Disabled?
I use MR just for clones, so a monitoring service is of no use to me.
Also, does v7 have any benefits over v6?

There was a problem with Macrium Reflect v7 when running on Windows 10
version 1607.
Windows 10 version 1607 introduced a new registry entry to block
legacy drivers - IoBlockLegacyFsFilters, and this registry entry had
to be explicitly set to exclude legacy drivers from loading. However,
the default value for this new registry entry has been changed from
'0' (Not blocked) to '1' (blocked) in the Insider Preview 17063 build
of Windows 10. This means that that no 'Legacy' kernel drivers,
except for Microsoft's own legacy drivers, are loaded at boot time.

Macrium averted this "problem" in v7.1.2917.

FredW

2018-03-12 13:47:10 UTC

On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 08:26:37 +0000, PeterC

Post by Paul
When I tested version 7, I was seeing too much CPU usage
from the Macrium service that is running. It uses CPU, even if
you weren't doing backups at the time.

Is there any disadvantage to setting the service to Manual or Disabled?
I use MR just for clones, so a monitoring service is of no use to me.

I have set the service to Manual.
No problems when I start making an image.

Post by PeterC
Also, does v7 have any benefits over v6?

New in Version 7
https://knowledgebase.macrium.com/display/KNOW7/New+in+Version+7

Release notes V7:
http://updates.macrium.com/reflect/v7/v7.1.2917/details7.1.2917.htm

At the bottom (Initial Release) you can see the improvements

As I am on Windows 7 and version 6 did all I wanted , I decided to stay
with Version 6 (proven in practice).

--
Fred W. (nld)

J. P. Gilliver (John)

2018-03-12 15:30:03 UTC

In message <***@7ax.com>, FredW
<***@ninmule.invalid> writes:
[]

Post by FredW

Post by PeterC
Also, does v7 have any benefits over v6?

New in Version 7

Thanks for these.

Post by FredW
https://knowledgebase.macrium.com/display/KNOW7/New+in+Version+7

Seems to be mainly 3 things:
1. Improvement that makes differential/incremental images faster (not
available for XP). No benefit if you don't make differential/incremental
images.
2. (I think) ability to run a certain kind of virtual machine directly
from a Macrium image.
3. Improvement (and bugfix for W10Ann users) to the task scheduler.

Post by FredW
http://updates.macrium.com/reflect/v7/v7.1.2917/details7.1.2917.htm
At the bottom (Initial Release) you can see the improvements

Same three, I think.

Post by FredW
As I am on Windows 7 and version 6 did all I wanted , I decided to stay
with Version 6 (proven in practice).

Ditto (I don't do scheduled or incremental/differential backups). (I'll
probably stay with 5!)

--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

WANTED, Dead AND Alive: Schrodinger's Cat

Ant

2018-03-12 23:07:56 UTC

Post by FredW

Post by PeterC
Also, does v7 have any benefits over v6?

New in Version 7

Thanks for these.

Post by FredW
https://knowledgebase.macrium.com/display/KNOW7/New+in+Version+7

1. Improvement that makes differential/incremental images faster (not
available for XP). No benefit if you don't make differential/incremental
images.
2. (I think) ability to run a certain kind of virtual machine directly
from a Macrium image.
3. Improvement (and bugfix for W10Ann users) to the task scheduler.

Post by FredW
http://updates.macrium.com/reflect/v7/v7.1.2917/details7.1.2917.htm
At the bottom (Initial Release) you can see the improvements

Same three, I think.

Post by FredW
As I am on Windows 7 and version 6 did all I wanted , I decided to stay
with Version 6 (proven in practice).

Ditto (I don't do scheduled or incremental/differential backups). (I'll
probably stay with 5!)

Same here, but I never got v5 so I have v6. ;)

--
Quote of the Week: "Ants never sleep." --Ralph Waldo Emerson, poet
Note: A fixed width font (Courier, Monospace, etc.) is required to see this signature correctly.
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/ /\ /\ \ Please nuke ANT if replying by e-mail privately. If credit-
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PeterC

2018-03-12 17:19:32 UTC

Post by FredW
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 08:26:37 +0000, PeterC

Post by Paul
When I tested version 7, I was seeing too much CPU usage
from the Macrium service that is running. It uses CPU, even if
you weren't doing backups at the time.

Is there any disadvantage to setting the service to Manual or Disabled?
I use MR just for clones, so a monitoring service is of no use to me.

I have set the service to Manual.
No problems when I start making an image.

Post by PeterC
Also, does v7 have any benefits over v6?

New in Version 7
https://knowledgebase.macrium.com/display/KNOW7/New+in+Version+7
http://updates.macrium.com/reflect/v7/v7.1.2917/details7.1.2917.htm
At the bottom (Initial Release) you can see the improvements

Ah, thanks for the links.

Post by FredW
As I am on Windows 7 and version 6 did all I wanted , I decided to stay
with Version 6 (proven in practice).

Yes, the better can be the enemy of the good.
Or, if it ain't broke...
More importantly, if you can't fix it, don't break it.

--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway

FredW

2018-03-12 13:36:44 UTC