p***@gmail.com
2018-04-12 05:26:12 UTC
I have an allegation that my Dickinsons (well off merchants of Hull,
Yorkshire, who intermarried with the De la Pole's) are "generally assumed"
to be descended from Walter de Caen, a descendant of Rollo the first Duke
of Normandy (and therefore of the kings of Norway), who came to England
with his kinsman, William the Conqueror. But the allegation says this
isn't proven. I am interested, but I question this, since Dickin or
Dickon is a very common name in Yorkshire, where the Dickinson's lived.
It seems as if Dickinson would be a common surname. Like Johnson and
Williamson and Richardson and Robertson.
My allegation says only that Walter de Caen was the grandson of Walter de
Caen son of Rollo, first Duke of Normandy, who got the Town and Castle of
Caen for an inheritance. Nathaniel Dickinson's lineage is traced only to
the 13th century (a few generations before the De la Pole marriages).
It doesn't even say where he settled in England.
As to the Dickinsons, it says, and proceeds to prove on a generation by
generation basis, that "There is ample evidence that over the ensuing
generations the Dickinsons were well to do builders, merchants, landowners
and men of importance in their communities. They married into well
established and affluent families. Some of the descendants held highp
ositions in government and the church.Others were scholars and writers of
record."
The implication is that this is the sort of family that could be of royal
blood. But Yorkshire was never fully incorporated into the feudal system
that was in its most well developed form brought to England by the Normans
who were able to force it on people closer to London; I don't know
Yorkshire ever knew serfdom, the ordinary man owned land that had been in
his family since it was parcelled out by the Danish Viking rulers of the
area, I think. Ownership of land was the basis of wealth, and became a
reason why people of Yorkshire helped spearhead the Industrial Revolution.
Success as a merchant depended on the means to outfit oneself to begin
with, but it seems as if it was largely a matter of luck, and it was a
path to upward mobility. Not taht every peasant was likely to be a
successful merchant, but many successful merchants had common backgrounds.
There was actually a sizable, thriving class of tradesmen and merchants,
as well as doctors and lawyers, all through medieval times, and this was
one of that economic system's fundamental contradictions. Quite a few of
my ancestors have been established to have belonged to this class in late
medieval times.
What I would like to know is, more about Walter de Caen. Where did he hold
lands, who were his children and who did they marry, and what happened to
them? Is there any known connection to Yorkshire or to the vicinity of
Hull, where it seems the Dickinsons always lived, atleast by 1260,
century, and any of the family of Walter de Caen? They would have had 200
years, about six generations, from 1066 to find their way to Hull.
Yours,
Dora Smith
As a Dickinson, I have been interested in the De Caen story for awhile. I have been able to trace my line back only to a George Dickinson of St. Kitts (1800-1842). However, I also am intrigued by the 20% Scandinavian (Viking/Norman?) result in my DNA test. Although I do have other English lines on my mother's side (Nunley/Cooper/Whiteman/Cobley et al), I have no direct Scandinavian ancestors in the past 200+ years. So, there seems to be a strong possibility that my Dickinson line has some Scandinavian roots.Yorkshire, who intermarried with the De la Pole's) are "generally assumed"
to be descended from Walter de Caen, a descendant of Rollo the first Duke
of Normandy (and therefore of the kings of Norway), who came to England
with his kinsman, William the Conqueror. But the allegation says this
isn't proven. I am interested, but I question this, since Dickin or
Dickon is a very common name in Yorkshire, where the Dickinson's lived.
It seems as if Dickinson would be a common surname. Like Johnson and
Williamson and Richardson and Robertson.
My allegation says only that Walter de Caen was the grandson of Walter de
Caen son of Rollo, first Duke of Normandy, who got the Town and Castle of
Caen for an inheritance. Nathaniel Dickinson's lineage is traced only to
the 13th century (a few generations before the De la Pole marriages).
It doesn't even say where he settled in England.
As to the Dickinsons, it says, and proceeds to prove on a generation by
generation basis, that "There is ample evidence that over the ensuing
generations the Dickinsons were well to do builders, merchants, landowners
and men of importance in their communities. They married into well
established and affluent families. Some of the descendants held highp
ositions in government and the church.Others were scholars and writers of
record."
The implication is that this is the sort of family that could be of royal
blood. But Yorkshire was never fully incorporated into the feudal system
that was in its most well developed form brought to England by the Normans
who were able to force it on people closer to London; I don't know
Yorkshire ever knew serfdom, the ordinary man owned land that had been in
his family since it was parcelled out by the Danish Viking rulers of the
area, I think. Ownership of land was the basis of wealth, and became a
reason why people of Yorkshire helped spearhead the Industrial Revolution.
Success as a merchant depended on the means to outfit oneself to begin
with, but it seems as if it was largely a matter of luck, and it was a
path to upward mobility. Not taht every peasant was likely to be a
successful merchant, but many successful merchants had common backgrounds.
There was actually a sizable, thriving class of tradesmen and merchants,
as well as doctors and lawyers, all through medieval times, and this was
one of that economic system's fundamental contradictions. Quite a few of
my ancestors have been established to have belonged to this class in late
medieval times.
What I would like to know is, more about Walter de Caen. Where did he hold
lands, who were his children and who did they marry, and what happened to
them? Is there any known connection to Yorkshire or to the vicinity of
Hull, where it seems the Dickinsons always lived, atleast by 1260,
century, and any of the family of Walter de Caen? They would have had 200
years, about six generations, from 1066 to find their way to Hull.
Yours,
Dora Smith